Older Acura TLs

liferules · October 2005

The difference is quite appreciable. I have never anyone add the front and back seat legroom as a "composite" number.

Have you actually compared the two in person and sat in the backseat?

bmwdoug · October 2005

Okay, there is ONLY ONE way to measure true backseat legroom. Total Front and Rear Legroom MUST be taken into consideration. Back seat measurements are taken with the front seat all the way back. Thus, if car A has more front legroom than car B, Car A may in fact have more rear legroom, even if Car B's rear legroom is listed as being longer, if the total of Car A's Front and Rear Legroom is greater than Car B's.

You may ask, how can that be? Well, remember that when a driver gets into the front seat and a passenger gets into the front seat, the seats are adjusted. So, if the Front Seat in Car A has more leg room than the Front Seat in Car B, then Car A's seats can be adjusted for more rear legroom. And, since Car A has more Front Leg Room, the Front Driver in car A will have just as much front leg room as he/she would have had in Car B. I will post some examples. Notice how the TL actually has more leg room than the BMW 5 Series and Mercedes E Series. Here are some real world examples:

Car Front Legroom Rear Legroom Total Leg Room
Acura TL 42.8 34.9 77.7
Acura RL 42.4 36.3 78.7
BMW 530 41.5 36 77.5
BMW 330 41.5 34.6 76.1
Toyota Avalon 41.3 40.9 82.2
Lexus GS 300 43.5 36.4 79.9
Infiniti M35 44.2 37.3 81.5
Mercedes E Class41.9 35.6 77.5
Honda Accord 42.6 36.8 79.4

habitat1 · October 2005

"Okay, there is ONLY ONE way to measure true backseat legroom. Total Front and Rear Legroom MUST be taken into consideration".

I agree with your statement - but not quite with your methodology of just looking at the numbers.

IMO, The ONLY way to really get a consistent measurment on back seat legroom is for the same driver to get into the front seat, adjust to his/her preferences and take a tape measure to the back seat. Do this for all cars being considered.

You would think that front seat legroom measurments by the manufacturers would be consistent enough to avoid this self measurement requirement. But I found that pedal placement and angle,seat height, even steering wheel adjustments varies enough that there can be a 1-2" difference in the fore/aft direction where I am comfortable having the front seat. This is even more true for me in maunual transmission cars.

So, although the total legreeom is usually a pretty good surrogate, I have found that my Stanley tape measure is a necessary tool when car shopping. Same by the way, goes for the width of the vehicle. Back when we had both of our kids in car seats, an extra inch or two in rear seat width was very critical.

"Passenger volume" can be deceiving. Our TL has 97 cubic feet, our old 1995 Maxima had 100. The difference is mostly in headroom, with the Maxima being a boxier shape, especially for the rear seat. In the dimensions of importance to us, the TL is a bit bigger. Volume is good for comparing how many ping pong balls will fit inside your car, but not how comfortable your passengers might be. Run through a trash compactor, the "volume" of a 165 lb human body is about 3 cubic feet (90% water). But try fitting 30 people - with arms and legs intact - inside your TL.

vrooommm · October 2005

thank you...I checked out the site, but it seems as though they don't have the adpter ready for the 05 TL yet.

bartalk3 · October 2005

Consumer Reports measures legroom, front and back, on all the cars they test. They measure it the same way for every car. For the best comparison of legroom in different cars, just check out the various issue of CR.

habitat1 · October 2005

Wrong again - Consumer reports information is going to be no different that the manufacturers. As a matter of fact, I've found more technical and specification errors in Consumer Reports than in most other sources like Road and Track. They screw up horsepower and EPA ratings a lot.

bmwdoug is absolutely right that the front and back legrooms need to be added together. A reported 34" of rear seat legroom doesn't mean much if you don't know what the front seat legroom is. If it's 40", it will barely accomodeate a 6' driver. If it's 44", it will accomodate a 6'6" driver, and in the case of an actual 6' driver, you will have 4" more legroom in the rear.

My point was, that if I "use" say 38" of front leg room in one car, that does not mean I will use exactly 38" of front legroom in another car to find a comfortable driving position. It could easily be 37-39". I don't grow or shrink, but whether or not the sttering wheel telescopes, the position and angle of the pedals, etc. all influence where I set the front seat. And that difference would translate into a potential 2" difference in rear seat legroom between one car and another.

I'm not trying to split hairs, but if you are out test driving cars (which you should always do before you buy anything) it's a simple task to check the rear seat legroom yourself. Trust me, you will find differences not fully explained by the manufacturers or CR's numbers.

branco327 · October 2005

I just sold my '04 BMW 330CI (beautiful car) and I'm just about ready to buy the TL (beautiful and practical) but can't decide on the nav. Is it worth it? I figure it would be no more than a toy that I would end up not using after a few weeks. Any thoughts on this?

BTW, I'm paying MSRP less $2500 (CDN) for an '06. I think I did well but it's a fantanstic value even at MSRP.

Has acura fixed these nagging rattling issues that so many people complained about on the '04 models??

bplayer · October 2005

You have managed to get around without nav so far, and you can most likely continue to do so in the future. It is a convenience/luxury item, and only you can determine if it is right for you.

The interior and functionality of the TL seems to have been designed around the nav unit, and the non-nav could be considered an after thought. If you subsequently decide that navigation is needed , a Garmin or other GPS unit could be purchased for a third of the cost, plus it could easily be moved it to another car. But an add on does not do justice to the interior.

MSRP less $2500 is a good deal for an 06 at this time, esp in Canada, as we tend not to get the same type of deals that US buyers get.

My 1 week old 06 is tight and no rattles or squeaks, but these tend to show up months after battering the car over rough roads. It is much too soon to tell if any improvements made to the 06 have solved the problem. There are owners with 05's and even some 04's that have no complaints.

bartalk3 · October 2005

CR does not just take the manufacturer's specs and reprint them. I'm quite sure they do independent measurements themselves. For example, their figures for turning circle are always higher than the manufacturer states; CR measures a different and more realistic way. Also, their headroom figures are not found in manufacturer's specs. I haven't found them to be any more inaccurate than any other publication.

bmwdoug · October 2005

I just read that Apple and Acura have teamed up for the 2006 Acura lineup. Acura is going to offer Ipod intergration with all 2006 models. A driver will be able to use his/her voice to give a command to search for a song from a playlist, genre, artist, etc.., and the song will play on the Acura Stereo. This is WAY COOL! Wow! I am sold on a TL now. My question is: Does anyone know if the 2006 TL's that are available now have this feature? If not, when will the models be available? I would wait for this feature.

habitat1 · October 2005

Look, I'm apparantly not going to convince you that CR isn't the bible of interior dimensions for cars and that such published measurements are all that matters. But for other shoppers out there, I still suggest making a point of setting the drivers seat in a position comfortable for you - and then check out the rear seat room.

P.S. If I went strictly by published measuremetns, it would not have been possible for my daughter to sit behind me in our new 911. But, after "test sitting" in the car ourselves, bingo, there was an extra 2" more than expected. The new 911 steering wheel telescopes (didn't before), I set it all the way "in" and can correspondingly slide the seat bottom in about 2" compared with the old model. It's my ideal seating position and it gives my daughter enough additional room that her knees aren't touching the back of the driver's seat. Nowhere - Porsche figures, CR figures, or elsewhere - would anyone have been able to figure out this significant difference between the 996 and 997 model 911's without doing a "test sit" themselves. Granted, this revelation cost me $40,000 when my family pleaded me to get the 911 over the Boxster S I had been considering, but it was the right decision only made possible by a "test sit".

habitat1 · October 2005

The Acura navigation sytem is the best factory installed nav system in the business, bar none. The integration of the nav system with the bluetooth phone and voice activation systems already in the car works exceptionally well. In addition to the standard trip routing and address locating features, I've more recently found myself using the nav system to scroll though restaurants, stores, etc.; call them directly by simply saying "send" and making reservations, checking hours, etc. All without my hands leaving the wheel.

I elected to get the nav system option on our Porsche 911 and, for $2,070 it is three rungs down the ladder form Acura in functionality and ease of use. Even a friend commented that the latest generation Lexus system he has in his GX470 isn't as good as the Acura system.

On the rattling front, we have a 2004 6-speed with 20,000 miles and not a single rattle or squeek. The 6-speed has a stiffer suspension than the automatic, so, if anything, you might expect more rattles over time. However, according to my service manager, the opposite appears true. Probably purely coincidental, but our TL still feels very tight.

One thing you should be prepared for, if you haven't already experienced it in test drives. The BMW 330i, being RWD, tracks like it's on rails. And it's steering precision is about the best there is in the small coupe/sedan segment. The FWD TL has more play in it's steering and will require more driver input and attention, whether it's turning under acceleration or just driving down the highway. I didn't really notice how much this is the case until began switching between our TL and 911 frequently. I can take my hands off the wheel of the 911 at 80 mph on the PA turnpike and it won't budge from the line it's set on. That would be a high risk maneuver on the TL. Small bumps affect the steering line. Throw in torque steer on the TL and you just need to be OK with this tradeoff. You are going to a decent handling FWD TL - but coming from one of the very best handling RWD sport coupes available.

delmar1 · October 2005

My 2 cents...I am with habitat1 in that measurements are great...but it doesn't tell the whole story. There is seat height and angle....compared to dash/steering wheel. Length of seat cushion. The configuration of the floor board and how the passenger leg in relationship to the glove compartment. Entry ease. Rear passengers and how their feet are to fit to the floor board and front seats. Etc.

I say that measurements are a start. Ultimately a test drive is in order.

finley4 · October 2005

I got my new 05 TL two days ago. I want to add a wing on the car. Does anyone know a good accessory store or internet site to get this from? Will it come in the color to match the car? Can you do the installation yourself?
Thanks.

bhelsdon · October 2005

Go to: Acura.com or just walk into any Acura dealer.

priggly · October 2005

BTW, I'm paying MSRP less $2500 (CDN) for an '06. I think I did well but it's a fantanstic value even at MSRP.

branco327 where are you getting this good a deal?

By the way, I'd highly recommend you go with the Navigation system.

nb06 · October 2005

Where did you get that deal - I'm in the Toronto area - looking for an 06.
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bartalk3 · October 2005

Oh, I'd certainly agree that it's better to see and test a car in person than to rely on published stats, magazine articles, etc. CR panned the Lexus GS300, but, after driving it, I think it's great. They did observe, however, that it lacked a lot of headroom and interior space, and I certainly confirmed that myself. CR also thought the TL ride was fine; many people, however, find it much too firm. Etc. There's no substitute for a test drive. People who buy cars sight unseen and just on the basis of reading about them are taking a big chance. My son bought an '06 Corvette without ever having driven it. He loves it though, since the only thing he was interested in was power. It didn't disappoint. The articles about it are right.

roar1 · October 2005

Are the fog lights inboard of the projector lamps ? ( I thought they were the hi-beams ).

Personally, I think the car would look good with fog lights mounted below the bumper ( in the black grille openings ).

taxesquire · October 2005

I love mt TLs navigation system - I wouldn't get the car without it!!! I went into detail a little while back how its features are so useful, even when I know when I am going. Rather than reprint it, I'll try to attach a link to post 722 on the Acura 2006+ TL forum. Please overlook the typos!

post 722 on the Acura 2006+ TL forum

PS - my '04 TL (6MT) has about 19000 squeak-free, vibration-free miles and counting!!!

aaargh · October 2005

Are the fog lights inboard of the projector lamps ?

Yes.

I agree, they would look better below.

branco327 · October 2005

A couple of key people at the local Acura dealership are clients of mine and were able to give me this discount.

My wife really likes the nav but one of the reasons I gave up my 330CI was because of that "toy factor" and hence did not want to waste anymore money on these "toys" but I see the the benefit (although seldom for me) of the nav.

I was settled on the non -nav but the demo car they gave us had the nav and now I'm trying to convince the wife we really don't need it......

or am I trying to talk myself back into the toys?

Geeez, I am about to purchase it tonight and don't know what to do now! :confuse:

BTW, yes, I realize this car handles no where near my 330CI with PP but for me the TL is a much more practical car.

branco327 · October 2005

BTW, silver or black?

I can get the silver non-nav now or have to wait for either black or silver with nav until december. Any thoughts?

bodble2 · October 2005

Go for the Nav, unless your budget dictates otherwise. It "makes" the interior. Almost lifts the car upscale by a notch! Even if you only occasionally use it, it would still be worth it, IMO.

Besides, nothing wrong with having some toys in your new ride. If you were to be completely practical, buy a Camry! :P

bodble2 · October 2005

Why the constant reference to your 911, and "new" 911 at that, and how much $$ it cost you, in a TL thread? :confuse:

You haven't passed up too many opportunities to inject your 911 into your discussions (here and on other threads too).

You looking for a round of applause, or for us to stand up and bow?

To paraphrase Shania Twain, "So what if you've got a Porsche, it don't impress us much".

kennyg8 · October 2005

Bodble2 and Habitat1, both of you are among my favorite posters, as I find your posts entertaining and informative. As you may recall, we go way back to the days when we frequently posted on the Maxima board. Let's continue to keep our posts friendly and entertaining.

Thank you.

I love the TL. Although I can afford it, I still have not parted with my money. I must be a cheapskate.

bartalk3 · October 2005

Yes, I have a 911 also, but it's my "other" car. I like the TL, but it's nothing like my 911. However, I do like the color of my red TL, and prefer the color to my red 911.

delmar1 · October 2005

Red must be the color of choice !

elvis4prez · October 2005

I'm planning on the nav for my pending 06 TL purchase.
The nav seems better integrated, appearing and comes with better Michelin tires (rather than the frequently criticized Bridgestones).
And I figured I'd like to try the toy

bplayer · October 2005

Another nice thing about the nav is even though you know where you are going, it provides an estimate of the travel time. Not sure how it does it, but the initial calculation is not too far off, and it adjust time remaining as you progress. It may be a toy, but I like it.

branco327 · October 2005

The nav seems better integrated, appearing and comes with better Michelin tires (rather than the frequently criticized Bridgestones).

I agree about it appearing better with the nav but I figured it still wasn't worth the $3000CDN with taxes. That's a whopping 7% of the car's whole value for basically a talking map I would hardly use!

As for the tires, the '06 non nav comes with Michelin Pilots up here in canada.

BTW, I puchased the silver non-nav tonight and the clincher for me was that I noticed a couple of used black '04's with nav on the lot that apparently weren't selling all that well. When I inquired with the manager he said it was because of the nav and therefore the higher asking price. The implication here was resale wise the non-nav is the better seller according to his experience....and I live in a oil rich city with lots of money. Go figure!

Anyways, thank you for your replies and suggestions. I am picking up the new family member tomorrow.

cheers!

bodble2 · October 2005

Wow, you have a good memory, my friend! :surprise: I haven't lurked on the Maxima threads for a long time.

bodble2 · October 2005

There you go, you see, I didn't know that you had one, until now. Reason? You never brought it up here. Reason you don't bring it up? It has no relevance in a TL discussion!

And I'd bet you didn't know my "other car" is a red Enzo. I've never mentioned it.

Well, ok, I haven't mentioned it 'cause I haven't bought it yet. :P

BUT, if I did have one, I wouldn't parade it around on this thread.

achenator · October 2005

If I had an Enzo I would parade it EVERYWHERE. I would wear head to toe Ferrari garb like Joey on Friends when he had a Porsche that he really didn't have.

habitat1 · October 2005

"Why the constant reference to your 911, and "new" 911 at that, and how much $$ it cost you, in a TL thread?"

Look, I've frequently made references to other cars I own or have owned for comparative purposes, including the TL, former Honda S2000, 1995 Maxima, former Trooper, MDX.... If you are suggesting I get off topic by doing so, then I'll take that as constructive criticism. But if you are singling out the 911, for the reasons you suggested, perhaps you need to ease up. I'm not trying to impress, let alone offend, anybody. I have never posted what I paid for it. And, for the record, I'm still the same guy that changes his own oil and filter in our 11 year old Maxima.

So, if I've somehow offended you (or others), I apologize.

All joking about Enzo's aside, I think we can all agree that although what you drive may make your commute more pleasant, it is pretty low in the overall meaning of life. So long as it is a stick shift.

bartalk3 · October 2005

What's an Enzo? Is that like the new Ford Aspire (love that name)?

giovanni1 · October 2005

Ferrari Enzo

bmwdoug · October 2005

Does anyone know if the 06 TL's currently on Dealer Lots will work with new Acura Ipod adapter? The adapter is supposed to be ready by mid December as an Acura Dealer Installed option. It will allow the Acura to control an Ipod with Voice Commands through the Navigation System. The Ipod will pay through the Stereo. I want to buy a TL, but I want to make sure that this feature will work on the Car. I think this is a GREAT innovation.

bodble2 · October 2005

To be fair, yes, I agree you have also given your 1995 Maxima, and the S2000 a good deal of press time. No, I wasn't singling out the 911 per se. Maybe I miscontrued your intention. If I did, then I apologize for coming down on you rather harshly. But I just thought your references to your 911 was somewhat gratuitous in the context of discussions on a model which bears no resemblance or purpose in life to a 911. I guess what set me off was your comment that the 911 cost you $40K more than a Boxster that you had wanted to buy.

But again, if your intention was not to impress, then let's just shake hands, and move on, and not bore the other fine folks here. :shades:

nb06 · October 2005

Good idea!

bmwdoug · October 2005

I want to buy a 06 TL with Nav. Are there any other Dealer Options that should be added? Or, is the car could to go?

Also, what color combination would you choose? Black on Black, Black on Grey, Black on Tan, or Silver on Grey, Silver on Black, or White on Tan?

vinceb81 · October 2005

Went back and read many messages discussing tires. I have 23K on original Bridgestone tires and hated them from the day I bought the car. Just want to get the best tires when it comes to tread wear, handling and more importantly - safety. Never felt safe in original Bridgestone tires driving in the rain. Car will not be driven in the snow. Thanks for the help.

bplayer · October 2005

Are you going to buy the car that we want or the one that you want? Go to the Aura web site and pick your selections.

The basic car is great as is. Common accessories are all season floor mat, wheel locks, and splash guards.

You also need to decide between manual (6MT) and automatic (5AT). The enthuasistic drivers all choose 6MT.

Exterior colours tend to be regional:
- Black (NBP) for those perfectionist who can spend a lot of time professionally cleaning and waxing
- White (WDP) for areas with little or no snow, also good for hot regions
- Anthracite (AM) great all round

Interior colour may drive the external colour. Parchment is beautiful, but is not available with all exteriors. Black on black, or silver on grey is too much of the same thing, no contrast.

I personally chose Silver (ASM) with ebony. Only you can decide what is right for you. Go search some forums that have pictures with custom mods, but be warned, you may end up spending more than you planned.

habitat1 · October 2005

I replaced the HPT tires (Bridgestone Potenza) on my 04 TL 6-speed with Avon Tech M500's recommended by Tire Rack. They were higher rated and less expensive than Michelins and had better treadwear ratings than Potenza S02's, which I was considering. the Tire Rack guys did a good job of talking me out of spending $220 per tire. The Avon's were $520 for a set of 4, including shipping.

So, far, with only about 2,000 miles on the Avon's, I'm very pleased with the ride and handling.

Also, I "upsized" to 245/45/17" tires from the 235's that came standard. The TL wheels are very wide - wider by at least 1" than our MDX wheels. As such, I got the slightly wider 245's hoping to cut down on the likelihood of scraping the wheels on curbs. That was actually a recommendation of my Acura service manager.

bmwdoug · October 2005

Bplayer, thanks for the advice. I want to hear opinions, so I can make a better decision. I always gather information and opinions from others before I make a decision. So, this forum is helpful in that regard. I was leaning toward Black, but I live in Central California where it is HOT. But, the TL has a wonderful climate system, so the Black most likely will not matter so much in that regard, it is probably more of a cleaning issue. I am also considering White, and Silver. Anthracite is a nice addition, I will try to find a TL in that color to look at in person for comparison and consideration. As far as interior colors, I think they are all nice. Again, as you mentioned, it does depend on the exterior color.

As for the options, Navigation is a must. Floor mats, wheel locks, and splash guards seem to be a reasonable addition as well. I believe this is the pro pack. Am I correct? I think the Standard Wheels are pretty nice. I know some people on the forum have gone with 18" wheels. What is the main reason for the 18" wheels? Is it for a sporty appearance, ride?

If anyone else has any opinions, please share.

Thank you.

taxesquire · October 2005

Regarding color, I always choose the interior color 1st. I figure that' where I spend most of my time, so that's my main concern. My preferred interior color is the "camel," or, as I usually call it, the medium tan. I think it's very classy-looking and different fromt he standard tan. I believe you can only get it with a red or black exterior. While I think a clean black ext with camel int would look the nicest of all combonations, I'd probably go with the red, for heat & maintenance reasons.

My TL is the discontinued green exterior with the camel interior. I love it!!!

bplayer · October 2005

18" wheels is appearance and stamping an individual personality on the car. It has been reported that you should not use them unless you also upgrade to the sport suspension. This will prevent your tires will wearing out quickly.

ggesq · October 2005

Just for clarification, regarding interior color combos with the Camel interior, for 06 you can only get camel w/ a red or black exterior. However, for 05's you can also get camel with Abyss Blue.
Hope this helps. :shades:

ggesq · October 2005

Actually, now that I think about it, I believe you can also get the Camel interior w/ the Anthracite exterior for 05 as well. There might be even more colors for 05 that come with the Camel interior but it is ALL irrelevant because the gentleman was looking to buy an 06 not an 05......I'll stop while I'm not ahead.

rodd · October 2005

Is premium gas required for the TL? I am thinking of buying a 2006 w/Nav. I currently drive a 2003 Honda Accord EX and have never owned an Acura. :confuse:

Older Acura TLs

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