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Older Acura TLs

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Comments

  • darballman1darballman1 Member Posts: 55
    No damgage whatsoever. That was for ANY TL w/o Nav. on the lot. And, I received a quote of $ 30,150 from a 2nd dealer. That was at the end of June. Here in So. CA there are over 10 Acura dealers within an hours and a half drive.
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    But I thought I read somewhere that the Accord Hybrid sales are very low for some reason.

    Here's the reason the Hybrid sales are low:

    "Data from independent product-testing organization Consumer Reports indicates that hybrid cars get less than 60 percent of EPA estimates while navigating city streets."

    http://www.wired.com/news/autotech/0,2554,63413,00.html

    Why bother to incur the not insubstantial cost and complexity for no real gains?
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    300hp in a FWD car is ridiculous and outright dangerous, I will keep on saying it untill the manufacturers get it right.

    This is an absurd, emotional and unsupportable position.

    The Chevy Impala SS with 303 hp and 323 ft.-lb. of torque and FWD is neither dangerous nor fraught with torque steer in any reasonable driving situation. If you are juvenile enough to try to drive it like a maniac or a race car driver at the track then you should not be attempting driving on public streets and highways in this manner anyway.

    I rather think it is the manufacturers who already have it right and you who do not.
  • samsonite99samsonite99 Member Posts: 6
    Call me suspicious, but I'm still not convinced that at this time of year that Invoice - holdback is dealer cost. It still seems a bit early for dealers to start selling cars at cost or even below it.

    The Internet is great tool for consumers that gives us a large amount of information, but there still is not a perfect flow of information on the costs of dealers and I'm not sure there ever will be.

    Beyond all that, $30K for a 2006 TL seems like a pretty sweet deal.
  • z71billz71bill Member Posts: 1,986
    Competition is always a good thing. Plus you never know what is going on with a dealership - maybe the cash is needed more than an inventory of unsold cars -like when payroll or taxes are due - or maybe Acura has some new secret dealer cash. But in general if you can buy a new car that people actually want - for less that dealer cost (invoice - holdback) it is a good deal.

    I was happy to find the exact car I wanted for a few hundred under invoice - but I know there will always be someone who gets a better deal / lower price. Hard to really tell sometimes - dealers do funny things with trade in values - or bump the interest rate on the loan a few points - or add in a bunch of fees - NOT that this is the case here - but you never see a post that says - GUESS WHAT the dealer gave me $3,000 less than KBB for my trade plus wrote the loan at only 19% with a $450 doc fee!
  • boe_dboe_d Member Posts: 66
    I have no issue with the report about 60 percent of EPA hybrid estimates provided they state what non hybrid cars get. I would guess that non hybrid cars also only get about 60% of claimed MPG by that same driver. The MPG is completely dependent on the type of driver. I have a lead foot so I probably get crap for MPG compared to what I should be getting. The article may be spot on but it is completely useless as a quote out of context.
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    The article may be spot on but it is completely useless as a quote out of context.

    Out of context? I think not.

    The fact is that hybrid cars presently available make no economic sense. Apart from placating a few environmental crackpots and zealots, they are a losing proposition.

    http://www.omninerd.com/2005/11/11/articles/41
  • boe_dboe_d Member Posts: 66
    I'm not saying the article is wrong - what I'm saying is unless the study shows what a hybrid car gets in reality compared to the sticker MPG and what a regular car gets in reality compared to sticker MPG it has little value as an article. It would be like saying "many protestants are murderers" - I'm sure many murderers are also catholic, muslim and so on - if you don't do a blind study, a statistic is of no value.

    If they said the prius has a sticker of appromately 50mpg but real tests show it actually gets 35mpg but then again a standard corolla has a sticker of 40 but actually gets 30 MPG and a cadillac has a sticker of 20 but actually gets 10 - then there is some comparison information so that the "study" has some context. And I use the term "study" loosely as the article has very little info about their statistical sampling. Very little info is given on the number of vehicles tested, the controls used to validate the data etc.
  • samsonite99samsonite99 Member Posts: 6
    I agree with Boe here. While I have no interest in a hybrid car at this point, studies out of context mean nothing and this is exactly what this study is.

    And as if it isn't obvious enough already by simple observation, the "environmental crackpots and zealots" may be on to something with their stances on "clean air" and "lower carbon emission".
  • alana106alana106 Member Posts: 11
    FWIW... I seem to remember consumer reports doing a test on the Accord. The overall mileage between the 4, V6, and V6 Hybrid were all only 1 mpg apart. If I remember correctly.

    V6 23 MPG
    4 24 MPG
    Hybrid 25 MPG
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    I'm not saying the article is wrong - what I'm saying is unless the study shows what a hybrid car gets in reality compared to the sticker MPG and what a regular car gets in reality compared to sticker MPG it has little value as an article.

    Your interpretation is a classic case of missing the forest for the trees. The point is less the methodology of the study and whether it meets all the technical points of same than the fact that hybrid cars are being touted for their superior gas mileage, viz. economic advantage, when in reality that increase is more than negated by their high initial price, complexity, unknown resale value, difficulty in disposing of old batteries, cost and difficulty in installing new batteries, and on and on. It is a given than NO car hits its EPA mileage numbers.

    http://www.autoblog.com/2005/10/02/do-hybrids-save-money
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    And as if it isn't obvious enough already by simple observation, the "environmental crackpots and zealots" may be on to something with their stances on "clean air" and "lower carbon emission".

    Oh, they're on to something alright: making your standard of living far lower by making your cost of living far higher. The question is less what they are on to than what they are on.

    http://www.oism.org/pproject/s33p36.htm

    http://www.sitewave.net/news/s49p1523.htm
  • jloweryjlowery Member Posts: 8
    Does anyone know where I can order on-line new wheel caps for my 2005 Acura TL, preferably ones that do not fade? I will settle for the original ones though (the caps with the A symbol on the four wheels).

    Thanks.
  • dmarcus48dmarcus48 Member Posts: 139
    try the bay, see them there all the time.

    why are we talking about accord hybrids on a tl forum?
  • daisy9daisy9 Member Posts: 9
    Just picked up my TL 2 days ago and having fun getting to know it. It has a fantastic sound system, but I am having trouble finding SACDs to use in the sound system. Actually, let me clarify, I can't seem to find 'pop' or 'modern' SACDs. Nothing against Beethoven or Bach, but they are not exactly my choice for driving music. Does anyone know if there will be more modern SACDs released, or where to find them if they are out there?
    Also for the 600 mile break-in period, should the car be driven on the interstate? At what speed? I'm already over driving like a grandma, but do not want to risk hurting the car.
  • boe_dboe_d Member Posts: 66
    "Your interpretation is a classic case of missing the forest for the trees. The point is less the methodology of the study and whether it meets all the technical points of same than the fact that hybrid cars are being touted for their superior gas mileage..."

    Who is missing the forest. It is the fact that there is no study that makes this article useless. ...my barber's daughter's teacher said that he heard eating a piece of bread before each meal will double your weight - I should publish an article about this and refer to it as a study.

    Again, I am not stating that I believe that hybrids reach their stated MPG, I am however stating that the article itself is useless as it has no basis of being a scientific study nor does it set the context by comparing vehicles with similar HP, torque, wind drag, and interior capacity but of different engines.

    What I am concerned with is the number of people that assume that people who buy hybrids do so just to save money. I don't yell at my friends who want to buy sports cars - assuming they aren't bright enough to know about the difference in insurance. Could it just be slightly conceivable to any of the naysayers that some people might want to put just a tiny bit of effort into trying to reduce dependence on oil? As for disposing of batteries - read up, articles are now pointing to new lithium cell batteries that can be recycled and last the lifetime of the vehicle. I don't think anyone KNOWS the resale vehicle of a hybrid or a nonhybrid at this point. Lastly - as to touting superior mileage - if a 2500lb car with a 150 HP standard combustion engine in reality (not sticker MPG) gets 24 mpg gallon under the same conditions that a 2500lb 150hp hybrid car gets 29mpg then the hybrid car should tout a higher mpg. The number is not night and day but percentage wise it is worth getting excited about - try thinking longer term than 5 years - try thinking about the country as a whole and of 100 years of automobiles.
  • dmarcus48dmarcus48 Member Posts: 139
    First break-in. You can drive on the hiway, just try and vary your speed, don't use the cruise control and you'll be fine.

    SACD's also known as dvd-audio, dvd-a, try online sites for tower records, barnes and noble, etc. There isn't a lot out there, seems like one of those things that started out looking good and is going to die a slow death. I've been able to pick up, Queen - night at the opera, a Robert Cray album, Santana - supernatural. Really not much.

    Dave
  • booyahcramerbooyahcramer Member Posts: 172
    Yea - DVD-audio sounds great, but there's no content to choose from.

    But XM radio is a beautiful thing. For the price of one DVD audio you get a month of service. And after what - 2,3 plays of a CD you're over it anyway.
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Member Posts: 692
    The usual advice to new car owners about a new car break-in period is not to drive at a constant speed for a long time--vary your speed. Don't use the cruise control for the first x hundred miles.

    However, if you look at the TL instruction manual, all it says about break-in is no fast acceleration for the first 600 miles. It says absolutely nothing about not driving at a constant speed. So what gives?
  • billyperks1billyperks1 Member Posts: 151
    What is absurd, emotional and unsupported about 300hp in a FWD car been dangerous?
    You acting as if you are Mr.Know It All.

    I own a 2003 TLS with 260hp going to the front wheels and I do encounter quiet a bit of torque steer when pulling away from a light or a dead stop.

    Also in the snow, a FWD car with all that power is absolutely garbage.I cannnot make it up a thirty degree incline with my TLS boasting all seasons Michelin and now with the Falkens tires.

    So adding forty more horses to the Acura is totally insane from MY point of view.I don't know what Chevy did and I dont care because I am not and never will be intrested in an Impala.

    Say what you want but, I am sticking to what I said based on MY experience with MY TLS.
  • ggesqggesq Member Posts: 701
    Hope I don't start a FWD vs. RWD in the snow debate....but a 300 hp FWD vehicle in the snow is no worse than a comparably powered 300 hp RWD sedan in the snow.

    Now, on a twisty curvy road...different story.

    Agree with ya about the torque steer issue but keep in mind- the new TL's as opposed to your 03 has a torque steer sensor which should minimize it from occurring.
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    You acting as if you are Mr.Know It All.

    And YOU are acting as if you can't bear to hear that there is a car that functions perfectly well with FWD without significant torque steer.

    Drive what you want but don't puff up that there is an alternative to your TL with a better drive train.
  • z71billz71bill Member Posts: 1,986
    I have never heard of such a thing - an engine with too much power.

    If there is snow and ice on the road can't you just press the gas pedal down a little bit? Don't need to mash the gas pedal all the way to the floor.
  • daisy9daisy9 Member Posts: 9
    Thanks to all about info regarding SACDs. I was wondering if I was on the wrong forum with all of the Accord Hybrid talk. But my ?s aren't problems, so I guess I am in the right place. I do have another question. I have 2 60 lb dogs that will be transported in the TL's backseat occasionally. I do not want the leather messed up. Is there a fitted seat protector available? I could of course throw a blanket back there, but that seems way too tacky. Thanks in advance
    Daisy
  • laurasdadalaurasdada Member Posts: 4,684
    Power isn't the danger, it's the application of power!

    My '05 TL is not so good in the snow, but I'm 99% sure it's the tires. Starting in 2nd gear,judicious application of power, TC, ABS, snow driving skill(?!) and luck have gotten me where I'm going. Although getting out of my mildly steep driveway/road has been a major challenge a couple of times. Never was before the TL/Brigestone Turanzas...

    Torque steer? Yes, but I'm aware of it so I try to be prepared and compensate. For me it's not a big deal as I enjoy the added snow traction (well, maybe when I get better tires...) and packaging advantages of FWD. And I just dig the TL!

    '21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)

  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    "...but a 300 hp FWD vehicle in the snow is no worse than a comparably powered 300 hp RWD sedan in the snow."

    That would be an understatement! I would take my chances in the snow with the FWD, any day. :P
  • ggurr54ggurr54 Member Posts: 30
    i own a 05 toyota prius. no it doesn't get 61 mpg in the city. it does consistently get 50 in city driving while cutting emisions. find me another car with the interior room of the prius that gets anywhere near the city mileage. and after two years the car has been bullet proof. with gas approaching 3 dollars i feel great every time i "boot it up".
  • jimmy81jimmy81 Member Posts: 170
    What's snow?

    Torque steer from pulling away from a stoplight? My 06TL doesn't have that. Just the normal minor tug if I'm flooring it.

    You're gonna pay a lot more for the RWD or AWD. $31K for a TL is why Acura sells a bunch of jthem ust as they are.
  • ggesqggesq Member Posts: 701
    Agreed! I was trying to be as generous as possible ;)
  • boikoboiko Member Posts: 82
    Acura invites you to experience Ahead, by previewing the all new, advanced 2007 Acura MDX, and the exciting and more powerful TL.

    http://www.acuraahead.com/index.cfm

    Enjoy..
    -mike-
  • billyperks1billyperks1 Member Posts: 151
    "Drive what you want but don't puff up that there is an alternative to your TL with a better drive train."

    Ha Ha Ha.
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    Ha Ha Ha.

    Drive what you want but don't puff up that there is an alternative to your TL with a better drive train.
  • billyperks1billyperks1 Member Posts: 151
    Yeah, I am huffing and puffing and crying buckets of tears because the Impala (a.k.a. The Love Boat) is far superior than the TL.
    Prig- come on man, I thought you were more knowlegable than that.
    How can you say that the Impala has a better drive train than the TL- (please let us not get into the a Impala TL debate).
    I did not test drive the car but, the reviews that I have read (since you mentioned the SS) all said the engine was powerfull but the supension and the overall drive of the car needs to be refined.
  • prigglypriggly Member Posts: 642
    I did not test drive the car

    If you haven't even test driven the car, your comments are unfounded.

    I have driven both the TL and the SS. The SS has more power than the TL, a smoother drive with far less torque steer, a smoother transmission, has a dealership on every corner, is quieter, does not pull to the right or left, has no harmonic vibration, no rattles, the leather does not crack and the dash does not fade. Plus, the price is better.

    What's not to like?

    Don't knock it till you've tried it.
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Member Posts: 692
    Owners of the '04-'06 TL's should thank Acura for increasing the value of their cars. What do I mean? If the '07 TL actually will have a more powerful engine, gas mileage will be reduced, and at the current price of gas, earlier, more economical models will be more desirable. The current TL is already one of the fastest cars on the road and the last thing the car needs is a bigger engine.
  • maximafanmaximafan Member Posts: 592
    I still wouldn't buy the Impala SS over the
    TL because the the TL is much, much prettier
    than the Impala!!! A little bit of torque
    steer is no big deal for me. Since I drive a
    Maxima, I'm familiar with the torque steer
    issue. If I'm in the mood to smoke someone
    at the stoplight, I just grab that steering
    wheel real tight and let 'em eat my dust!
    Hee-Hee! :shades:
  • maximafanmaximafan Member Posts: 592
    I definitely agree with you on the mpg part
    on the TL. I don't mind having a little less
    hp's, as long as the car still has lots of
    get up and go and still gets pretty decent
    gas mileage.
  • maximafanmaximafan Member Posts: 592
    This is one of a couple of reasons why I have
    wished for the split-fold rear seats on the
    TL. I have them on my Maxima. I have one
    60lb part-Chow and a Boston Terrier, and what
    I do in the Max is I get a bed sheet and tuck
    the ends behind the rear seat-back since I
    can fold the seat forward slightly and close
    it back and it holds the sheet in place. No
    problems with the sheet slipping off.

    I was trying to think on how to do this in
    the TL. The only thing I could think of is
    lifting the rear headrest, sliding the top of
    the sheet over that and then pressing all the
    way down on the headrest so that it holds the
    sheet in place. I'm not sure if this would
    work, but let me know if you find a better
    alternative.
  • maximafanmaximafan Member Posts: 592
    Okay. I must be losing my mind. Sorry,
    Laurasdada. I meant to reply to post #8617
    (daisy9) in the above post.
  • daisy9daisy9 Member Posts: 9
    Thank you for the suggestion. It is a problem- boys didn't go to park yesterday because I couldn't bear to put them in the car. Which is really sad when you find out I bought this car to replace my 2 seater 300zx specifically for my dogs. I will attempt the sheet idea. I wonder if there is a fitted seat cover made for acuras out there...if I find anything I'll let you know
    Daisy
  • laurasdadalaurasdada Member Posts: 4,684
    Actually Max, I have a 75lb Lab. My solution is to put her in the wife's car!

    '21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)

  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    I wonder if perhaps you shouldn't have gotten something like a Honda Element -- if you need a vehicle to transport your dogs? The TL has very little utilitarian merits, IMO.
    Sedan...leather...dogs...Not a good mix! :sick:
  • daisy9daisy9 Member Posts: 9
    You have a point. My hubby has a new Pathfinder and I was considering an Infiniti FX35, but decided that we could use a sedan to go out in and wanted something that gets better gas mileage (esp. with my leadfoot) than an SUV. I guess hubby will end up with TL and I will end up with Pathfinder to take our boys to their doggie daycare. I was just trying to figure out if there was a way around this. I do love quick cars.....oh well I can take the TL on the weekends I guess.
  • maximafanmaximafan Member Posts: 592
    LOL!! This is why I'm still keeping my
    options open as far as my next purchase or
    lease. There's a couple of cross-over SUV's
    I'm keeping an eye on because I wouldn't mind
    having that extra flexibility, but for my
    taste the pickings are a little slim. Right
    now the only SUV's I like are the Lexus RX,
    the new Mazda CX-7 and the Nissan Murano or
    the Infiniti FX(not too good on gas mileage,
    though) At least some of the new cross-over
    SUV's get better mpg's than the traditional
    SUV's. I like the MDX, but I think it might
    be a little too much truck/car for me. I'm
    still not sure about the new RDX. I really
    like the interior, I'm just not too sure
    about the exterior, particularly, the
    rear-end styling.
  • maximafanmaximafan Member Posts: 592
    Maybe you and the hubby can alternate on
    the weekends! LOL! For instance, you get
    the TL on weekdays and the Pathy on weekends
    and hubby does vice-versa. Pathfinder is
    a very reliable truck. I had a 1999 Pathy!
    Great truck also.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Sedan...leather...dogs...Not a good mix!

    Au contraire!

    I have two 60+ pound dogs who ride in the back seat of my car with leather seats on a regular basis. They have never damaged the leather in any way and whatever mud or debris they leave behind wipes right up. Not so with cloth seats - anything they leave behind become permanent instantly.
  • boe_dboe_d Member Posts: 66
    Too bad they don't have an easy way on their website to let them know. They mail you questionaires after you buy the car and don't have time to evaluate the car - probably gets thrown away by then. Once you own it for a while, it is too late to get in touch with them again.
  • saracsarac Member Posts: 2
    I was about to buy a 2006 Acura TL, but wasn't thrilled with the colors. Does anyone know if the 2007 series will have different colors available? Also, are there other upgrades planned for the 2007 that would be worth waiting for?
  • bartalk3bartalk3 Member Posts: 692
    They usually add a color or two every model year and delete others. Don't expect a lot. They must save money by limiting the number of colors offered. Not a big choice at all.

    Apparently there are reports of 300hp for '07, just what Exxon Mobil would love. Who needs it?
  • z71billz71bill Member Posts: 1,986
    I read about many cars (and trucks) where the HP & torque are increased and the MPG goes UP.

    Think of it this way - 300 HP TL with a nice new 6 speed automatic - it could get better MPG.
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