BMW 5-Series Sedans

cmybimmergo · March 2005

Nonono! You can't have it...I want it! LOL (Can you say bidding war?)

cmybimmergo · March 2005

So on Tuesday night at, say, 8:30, do you want to have a wake, a candlelight vigil, or a memorial service? Or maybe we can observe a moment of silence.

shipo · March 2005

Sigh!

Hmmm, that sounds good. I'll check in after I get the kids to bed that night. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

kyfdx · March 2005

530ir1150r · March 2005

I always reset my trip odometer after refilling and I always get better than 25 MPG. 2.5 x Gal x 10.

cmybimmergo · March 2005

Not to beat a dead horse or anything...oh hell, let's beat it anyway...

"2) The 325i (I'm assuming it's a manual) has "Shorter" gearing than either the 330i or the 530i. As such, even the EPA rates it lower than our cars on the highway segment."

Yes, it's a manual and this was my point--that I should be getting better mileage than my friend.

"your "Indy" mechanic may just be under the impression that BMWs are still operating under the same rules of "Good performance at the expense of fuel economy.""

I suppose this is a valid consideration when I think about what he said to me, but he's so up to date on everything else you can be forgiven for thinking that he's current on this, too.

As to your trip records, I can't imagine anyone fudging downwards on an expense report, so it's credible as far as I am concerned.

Now, FWIW, today I talked to the dealer from whom I bought the car. The consensus was that my mileage is too low, but they don't believe I'll ever get 30. And they posited that it might have something to do with the oxygenated gas used all winter. Which hypothesis, interestingly enough, my indy rejected when I proposed it to him yesterday.

And I wonder whether the fact that my right side tires are wearing waaaaaaaaaay too fast has anything to do with it. (Yes, I will be having this excessive wear checked out at the first opportunity.)

ABTW, say hi to New Hyde Park/Searingtown/Roslyn for me next time you visit Mineola...or any Nassau County town. I grew up there.

shipo · March 2005

Hmmm, a couple of points:

1) I don't believe that I'm the only one who sees north of 30 mpg on long trips in a 5-Speed 530i. Does my car get 30 on every long trip? Nope, however, I've never gotten less than 29; it just seems to depend on wind, traffic, position of the moon, tidal fluctuations and maybe the formation of tea leaves that I threw in the trash that morning. ;-)

2) Oxygenated fuel? Interestingly enough, I get my best mileage in the winter (maybe one mpg or so more), I've just attributed that to the narrower winter tires that I have mounted in the colder months. I have however heard that oxygenated fuel can reduce gas mileage from more than one reputable source, so I don't think that that possibility can be so easily discarded.

3) Tires wearing too fast on one side of the car? RED FLAG! Big time! I'd have it looked over for signs of an accident. I'm not saying that it was in one; just that you might want to have it looked over, as that can certainly be a cause of your uneven tire wear. As to how the tire wear relates to mileage, if the car is not tracking straight (and clearly it isn't), you can burn lots of extra gas pushing the car down the road as it scrubs off both speed and rubber.

4) I'll be headed back to Mineola within the next few weeks, so I'll certainly say "Hi". ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

cmybimmergo · March 2005

1) Don't forget whether you are wearing your lucky socks (or is it lucky underwear?).

2) Thank you. Especially since the gas pumps state that mileage might decrease, this seems kind of like a no-brainer to me, although I wouldn't say it's a four to five mpg difference.

3) Completely agree, although I don't understand why you and I are the only persons to catch this. BTW, I've seen the repair records for the car (they're clean--provided they were accurate), and the dealer handpicks his stock, so I'm hoping this is not the case. But first thing Monday I am calling BMW. (I noticed the wear only in the past week or so or I would have done it sooner.)

rich545 · March 2005

Right there with you guys. So there you have it, 4 OWNERS of E60's saying that iDrive is easy to use and not distracting. We MUST be out of our minds!

jim53 · March 2005

Shipo, what are you replacing it with?

div2 · March 2005

How many E60 owners have or plan to take their car to a drivers school?

saowin1 · March 2005

hey guys
who's got any detailed info on the 2006 545i?
new engine, but what else, and when?
thanks

kyfdx · March 2005

If it is just your rear tire wearing faster on the right side, that is not really abnormal.. The right tire is the main drive wheel, and I've noticed that mine wears faster than the left...

But, if both right side tires are wearing faster, you either have a problem... Or, you need to start taking the right-hand turns as fast as the left-hand turns... ;-)

cmybimmergo · March 2005

The right rear tire shows significant wear, more so than either of the left, which still look new. But the right front tire is wearing much faster than any of the others. The tires are Michelin Pilot A/S, I've put only 3000 miles on them, and the wear is on the outside edge only.

At this point, I'm not taking any turns fast because I no longer feel that the tires grip well enough to do that--which was what prompted me to look at the tires in the first place.

ddlovebmw · March 2005

I just bought a new 2005 BMW 525i. I loved it. Because I don't know BMW car that much (first time owner), I would like to ask some questions I ran into when I bought my car.

The dealer tried to sell me several maintenance package options:
Scotchguard protection($845)
Clear Mask ($985)
Maintenance upgrade ($1295) for up to 6 year/100,000 miles service

Did someone have good experience with these options? Is it worthy pay the prices to get them?

I am most interested in Scotchguard protection. Will that really protect my car body?

Could someone provide me with some ideas? I really appreciate it.

Thanks,

(Please let me know if I should post my questions to the most appropriate one.)

red_dog_gonnit · March 2005

The scotchguard protection is pretty much a spray that is used to make your interior stain resistant. A can costs $5 at wal-mart, so I'd say nay to the scotchguard.

Not sure what the clear mask is, but I'd bet that it's another dealer tack-on to put the squeeze on buyers. I'd steer clear of that one too.

The only one I'd look into is the maintenance upgrade. If it's unlimited, bumper-to-bumper, go for it. But read the fine print. I bought a minivan that had an extended maintenance upgrade. It covered alot of stuff, but didn't cover others. When my computer chip blew, the dealer said it caused a bunch of other stuff to go bad. The chip wasn't covered, so all the damage it did made all the other covered parts void. Short story, I was ripped off for $700 due to fine print (and a sheister dealer).

If it's any indicator, the most I've seen for scotchguard at a dealer is $300. Anyone who would have the gall to ask for $845 should be watched.

-Red

kyfdx · March 2005

1) Scotchguard.. interior protection.. As stated above, worth about $5.

2) Clear mask.. this is a clear plastic product applied to the bumper, spoiler and front of the hood.. To repel rock chips.. It has value, but not everyone likes it.. You CAN see it, if you look closely.. I'll save my money and live with the rock chips.

3) Maintenance upgrade.. This extends the "free" maintenance period.. It is NOT an extended warranty.. You can buy it at any time before your 4yr/50K maintenance plan expires.. No need to buy it now.

Basically, if buying a new car, I'd say NO to all three..

regards,
kyfdx

hpowders · March 2005

And the BMW dealers who emote on these boards wonder why I have no sympathy for them.
For shame!

shipo · March 2005

For the time being, nothing, I'm going to drive our spare car (a 1998 Dodge Grand Caravan Sport 3.8) for the next year or so (long story). At this point, Mrs. Shipo and I are planning on taking our two children to Germany in April of 2006 and do another ED vacation, this time with a new E90 330i as our ride. ;-)

Best Regards,
Shipo

big_jim · March 2005

Hello:

Hopefully I am only days away from ordering my 530i, but I have a quick question. Up to this point, I have summarily dismissed the sport package because I live in the Midwest. But if I am resigned to swapping out for snow tires in the winter anyway, does this negate the fact that the sport tires are useless on snow and ice? Mostly I am intrigued by active roll stabilization. This will be primarily a commuting car, but since I am shelling out so much $$, I'd hate to leave something worthwhile on the plate. Any comments would be appreciated.

cmybimmergo · March 2005

Drive one with and one without. Pay attention to how each handles, as well as whether you prefer one seat over the other, because they are very different. Then go with your gut.

530ir1150r · March 2005

Went to Nashville Saturday, nothing to do with UL.
Filled up on the way down; 404.1 miles,16.308 g., 24.779 MPG. Filled up yesterday; 371.1 miles,13.778 g., 26.934 MPG.

cmybimmergo · March 2005

This is great for you and annoying for me. How leaden is your foot?

BTW, I took a good long look at my tires this AM. I noticed that the wear overall is worse than I thought (they must have been more worn than all that when I bought the car, but they passed inspection so I didn't pay any attention to them), but I'm wondering about the wear pattern, especially as regards the inside vs the outside of the tires. On the left side of the car, the outside treads are still acceptable, but the insides are pretty much smooth. On the right side, both inside and outside are worn down, and the right front is worse than the rear. Before I talk to BMW, is there anything I should know? I know there previously have been postings about tires, but I really don't feel like wading through 10000+ messages to find them.

Thanks

shipo · March 2005

The only thing that I might add is that (if I remember correctly), you have Michelin Pilot Sport A/S tires (which have a much longer lasting rubber compound than the OEM tires had). Those tires should be capable of an easy 50K miles, even with spirited driving. If they have worn as fast as your posts seem to indicate, then you REALLY have a problem with at the very least, you alignment.

Best Regards,
Shipo

cmybimmergo · March 2005

Exactly. So here's a stupid rookie question: If the car I bought is CPO, and the dealer proudly avers that they do a 250 point inspection to certify those cars, wouldn't it be safe to presume that the alignment was one of those 250 points and was fine at the time of purchase? (Especially as the car drives true with no hands on the wheel.) And if the answer to that is yes, how in the world did it get so out of whack in only 3000 miles of normally bumpy (ie no major potholes, and I avoid manhole covers and whatever) driving?

erickpl · March 2005

I got 50,000+ out of my Goodyear RSA's on my xi. I have the Michelins Pilot Sport A/S's on there now. I have only gotten about 31,000 from them and they are ready to be replaced. Since the Pilot Sports are unidirectional, I haven't been able to rotate them like I could the Eagles...

-Paul

dl7265 · March 2005

As I recall (unless its changed ) BMW recommends that you DO NOT rotate tires on their vehicles. Then again they want you to go 15k on a oil service too...

DL

shipo · March 2005

Checking/doing an alignment prior to certifying a car as CPO? One would certainly think/hope that that BMW would do that. Have I heard of dealers cutting corners? Yes. Does that mean that yours did? Not exactly.

At this point, given how fast the tires have worn, it sounds like the problem existed when you bought the car. That said, the sooner you raise the issue with your dealer the better. I'm interested to hear what they have to say about this.

Best Regards,
Shipo

kyfdx · March 2005

BMWs have a reputation for suspension components wearing out around 50K miles... BMW considers control arms and similar parts to be "wear items".

It is entirely possible that is what is going on with your car.. If you are still under the original "free" maintenance plan, those parts would be covered....

regards,
kyfdx

shipo · March 2005

"Since the Pilot Sports are unidirectional, I haven't been able to rotate them like I could the Eagles..."

Why not? The Michelin Arctic-Alpins that I run in the winter time are unidirectional as well, and I've rotated them, same side, front to back.

I calculated that the Pilot Sport A/S tires were good for 50K plus because they have the same Treadwear rating as did my Michelin Energy MXV4 Plus tires that were on my 1999 328i. Those tires would probably have gone an easy 60K if I had rotated them. I didn't, and so it looked like the rears were going to need to be replaced at about 50K miles, while the fronts still looked new at 40K when I turned the car in at lease end.

Best Regards,
Shipo

shipo · March 2005

True, they don't recommend rotating the tires. That said, I have rotated both sets of tires that I have for my 530i. Not only has rotation allowed the tires to wear more evenly, in the case of the summer rubber, it has completely eliminated the tread noise that was starting to get rather annoying after about 10K miles. By 15k (when I rotated the summer tires), the tire noise was so bad that I was about to replace the tires with nearly half of the original tread depth still intact. I figured that since the tires were "throw-aways" anyway, what did I have to lose. The good news is that I didn't suffer any ill-handling effects from the rotation, and the tire noise, which was still slightly evident after the rotation, went completely away after a couple thousand miles.

"Then again they want you to go 15k on a oil service too..."

Assuming proper oil, I don't have any problem with the 15,000 mile OCI.

Best Regards,
Shipo

cmybimmergo · March 2005

Joy to the world. The 02 has a 36K maintenance plan, but I bought it at 45.

I called the dealer from whom I bought the car, and they are going to take a look at it. They state on their website that "Our mechanical reconditioning philosophy is predicated on the premise that within the first year of your ownership of an Advantage Certified BMW, under normal use, that you should not have to spend any money on brakes, tires, minor or major inspection, etc." I guess I'm going to find out whether they mean what they say.

shipo · March 2005

Well, that philosophy is certainly a good starting point. ;-)

Keep us posted.

Best Regards,
Shipo

cmybimmergo · March 2005

The other claim on the website is that every bimmer they sell undergoes a four-wheel alignment. This should be interesting.

I'm taking it in Thursday (provided I don't slip off the road before then). Hopefully I'll have an answer by the weekend. Any longer than two days without my bimmer and I'll go into withdrawal...

And thanks for everyone's two cents' worth. It always helps to know a little before calling the dealer.

kyfdx · March 2005

"It always helps to know a little before calling the dealer"

Well... if you want to know a little, this is the place to come....

dl7265 · March 2005

Let u sknow how your lease return goes, whats checked ect...

DL

shipo · March 2005

Will do, however, I don't anticipate any trouble as I have already had the car "Inspected" by BMW-FS. According to said inspection, my car meets or exceeds all minimums for wear (ie. it hasn't reached them yet) and has zero squwaks.

Best Regards,
Shipo

pjt · March 2005

Shipo:
I've decided to pass on the '02 530i (CPO) about which I sought some pricing advise from you last week. (I'm in the Boston area). I'm looking at a private party 2000 528i 5-speed with Sport Package instead (<24,000 miles). I'm also considering a 21,000-mile 2000 540iA (CPO'd to 08/2006), but repair and maintenance horror stories re: the 8 cylinder engine have me a little concerned. Should I be concerned? Given the choice, and a price differential of around $4,500, what do you think? I drive about 15,000 miles/year. Finally, what do you plan to do with your mounted winter tires after you return the 530i? I may be in the market. Thanks for your time; I appreciate your informed perspective. Regards,
pjt

pat · March 2005

Careful, it is against the Membership Agreement to use our Forums to buy or sell stuff ...

shipo · March 2005

Hmmm, needless to say, given a choice of a 528i SP 5-Speed, a 530i SP 5-Speed or a 540iA non-SP, I'd have to say that I'm partial to the 530i 5-Speed myself. Gee, what a surprise. ;-)

A 530i 5-Speed should be nearly as quick as a 540iA, with less maintenance (in theory) and much better gas mileage (in reality). Also, given that all E39s with V8 engines have a Recirculating Ball type of steering instead of the Rack and Pinion of the I6 models, they are alledgely not as quick on their feet when the road gets a little twisty. So, were I you, I'd hold out for a 530i SP 5-Speed (like maybe the one that's going to show up at Tulley tomorrow night), or go for the 528i (which I drove a few times, but I felt it was just too slow).

Regarding my winter wheel set, per the "Membership Agreement" (thanks Pat), no comment.

Best Regards,
Shipo

cmybimmergo · March 2005

"A 530i 5-Speed should be nearly as quick as a 540iA, with less maintenance (in theory) and much better gas mileage (in reality)."

That is, as long as it's not mine we're talking about.

"I'd hold out for a 530i SP 5-Speed (like maybe the one that's going to show up at Tulley tomorrow night)"

I guess this means you didn't win the lottery.

Does anyone besides me hear that music playing in the background? Sounds like..."Funeral for a Friend"...

gogglespiasano · March 2005

Shipo (or others with opinions on the matter),

I want to buy a new car in the next 6 months. I have been doing my research (have considered BMW 3 and 5 series, Infiniti M and several others such as Acura RL which I felt was disappointing and ruled out). I might even consider TL especially if they added AWD.

However, I think for discussion purposes I have narrowed it to BMW 330 or BMW 530 or the Infiniti M (probably the M35). Several questions:

1. The 2006 BMW 330 seems like a great package in terms of acceleration, handling but also has a bit more backseat and trunk space. I am not in love with the styling but still prefer it to the 5. Do you think the 5 is really worth the preumium in the 2006 models.

2. The SP 530 will get a new engine (255 horses). What is the SP designation you mention and what would be the principal advantage -- will it be able to out accelerate the 3? Also, you mention that the 530 is more nimble than the 540 -- why is this and will it outhandle the new 3 based upon what we know (or your educated guess).

3. Not really a question but a comment -- I was getting excited about the M35/M45 (and still am). However, I don't like the fuel efficiency (I know the additional cost is not that great but the idea of high efficiency and also environmentally sensitive v6's which Mercedes, BMW and Acura have been able to produce (TL) really appeal to me.

What would you buy and if I lean towards the new 3 or 5 do you think I can buy 2,000-3,000 off MSRP by the end of the summer.

Thanks.

shipo · March 2005

Hmmm, lots of ground to cover here:

1) Personally, unless you need the extra space and/or love the look of the 5er, then I personally don't think that the E60 (latest generation 5-Series) is worth the premium over the E90 (soon to be released 3-Series).

2) Pretty much as of now, all six cylinder engines that BMW will be sending to the U.S.A. will have two different designations x25 and x30 (as in 325i, 525i, 330i and 530i). The 3.0 liter engine in all of the x25 cars will produce 215 hp at 6,250 rpms and 185 lb-ft of torque at 2,750 rpms. The same displacement engine in the x30 cars will produce 255 hp at 6,600 rpms and 220 lb-ft of torque at 2,750. Basically that means that the nominally lighter 3-Series should out-accelerate a 5-Series with the same engine, but not by much. The SP that people refer to means Sport Package, a factory package that usually means nicer seats with better bolsters to keep you in place during aggressive cornering, a nicer grippier steering wheel, and larger/wider wheels shod with lower profile/wider/stickier summer tires (as opposed to the All-Season rubber that the non-SP cars are equipped with from the factory). Regarding the 530i being more nimble that the 540i, I was discussing the previous generation 5-Series dubbed the E39, which was imported to the U.S.A. from the spring of 1996 through about September of 2003. The new E60 5-Series is now able to be built with both the V8 engine and Rack and Pinion steering, so my comment doesn't apply in this case. As for the 5-Series out handling the 3-Series, hmmm, I doubt it. My guess is that in every case except the M5, a 3-Series equipped with the SP will out handle a similarly equipped 5-Series car.

3) Unlike virtually every other manufacturer around the world, BMW does not produce a V6 engine. All of the six cylinder mills that BMW produces are of the inline variety, hence their designation of "I6". The main advantage if the I6 is that it is naturally mechanically balanced with all reciprocating forces perfectly offsetting themselves. The only other engines that I am aware of that share that property are V12s and even cylinder count horizontally (boxer type) opposed engines with four or more cylinders (although a four cycle four cylinder boxer engine still feels rough due to torque reversals).

Personally, I'm most likely getting an E90 330i as my next BMW due to the fact that (as many folks around here know) I'm not really a fan of the 5-Series (to put it mildly). Regarding getting $2,000 to $3,000 off MSRP on either the E60 or the E90; I don't think that it's very likely that you will find that kind of a discount unless you wait until either of those two are no longer in production and there are just the cars in the pipeline remaining to be sold (as with the previous generation E46 3-Series right now). If you REALLY want to take $3,000 or more off the MSRP on a BMW, then you need to consider a trip to Munich to pick up a car via the European Delivery (ED) program.

Best Regards,
Shipo

dl7265 · March 2005

see if I got this right please,

Msrp $43345.00
sales $40740
sec dep$450.00
o down
36/15k 60% residual.
.00125 MF
Payment $505.75 pre tax

Thanks,
DL

ponytrekker · March 2005

The issue is whether you need the extra back seat space of the 5. The 3 is, and will always be, more tossable.

cpeterson3 · March 2005

Close... but if none of the below numbers are included in your sales price then...

True $0 down would result in a much, much higher payment. At delivery, you'll need to cut a check to include:

(using my state as an example)

- 1st month's payment ($505 + tax 6% = $535)
- lease aquisition fee ($625)
- dealer's conveyance fee ($199)
- state reg ($200)
- security deposit rounded up to the next $50 increment over your monthly ($550.)

So your likely writing a check for around $2,100

530ir1150r · March 2005

The second tank is Elizabethtown to Nashville to Georgetown. The last leg is 225 miles +/- and I wanted to see the UK game on something besides my wife's 2" portable TV. It took around 3 hours, including getting out of Nashville (I-65 is always under construction) and the last 35 minutes is not Interstate.

Half the first leg (it felt) was behind a tractor trailer passing a U-Haul. I have the speed warning set on 90 and my wife can discern 90 MPH from 37 degrees from 31 miles to empty.

dl7265 · March 2005

Thanks, Tx charges :
2 years reg $125.55
document fee $50.00
and the aformentioned sec deposit.
They charge sales tax on the trade difference as well at 6.25%, if your trading.

DL

kyfdx · March 2005

1) We'll add in an acq.fee of $625, instead of the security deposit.. CAP cost of $41,365

Payment $511/mo. + tax

Due at signing: 1st payment (approx.$570/mo.,TX right?), Security deposit ($600), title/registration fees. ($1400-$1500 total?).

cmybimmergo · March 2005

That sound you hear is me scratching my head. Everything I read posted here might contradict what the so-called experts tell me, but you have the actual numbers and they don't. Consequently, I have to believe that there's something screwy about my mileage. (Or do I have to get it up to 90 to achieve good numbers? I thought 80 was enough.)

ABTW, to clarify about my tires, the deep treads are still deep; it's the shallow ones which are gone. I compared them to the ones on my Lexus, which are not Pilots but are MXV4 Plus, and the MXV4s look brand new. I check the pressure level about as often in the bimmer as I do in the Lexus.

It was not fun to skid around a right turn yesterday at all of 15-20 mph.

BMW 5-Series Sedans

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles