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BMW 5-Series Sedans

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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    I'm not a big fan of after-market wheels.. I'd rather get genuine OEM BMW wheels used from someone else, rather than cheaper aftermarket.. Those might be okay for winter driving, but if I'm upgrading, I want the real thing.

    regards,
    kyfdx

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  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    "Still, I would bet you that I can lose my licence just as quickly in my LS as you can in a 540i6 in this land of 55 and jumbo coffee cup holders and cellphone yappers!"

    Yes, and there are people driving 10 year old Hyundais that can lose their license even faster! The car you have has nothing to do with the fine you get for speeding.
  • kleemittkleemitt Member Posts: 9
    I am thinking about buying a 1999 528i with 70K miles on it. I am visiting the dealership for a test drive tomorrow morning. This is not a CPO, but it's cheaper than a CPO. I will take it to a machenic for an inspection. But, what I am worried about is its repair costs down the road. I've only owned Hondas and Acuras and they are so reliable that I never need to spend much money on repairs. Are BMW parts that expensive? And, is it really better to get repairs done at the dealership? (One more thing, it does not have a CD player on it and I am thinking about installing a CD changer. That would be a good option, right?)
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    On a car out of warranty, you should be able to find better and cheaper places than the dealer... But, it will likely be very expensive to maintain. Nothing like an Acura or Honda.. At least in my experience. It isn't so much the reliability factor as just the maintenance costs.. Then, if you do need a repair, it is expensive. But, the car can last a long time, if you put the money into it.

    regards,

    kyfdx

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  • kleemittkleemitt Member Posts: 9
    Thank you so much for a quick reply. I will offer a drive-out price of $17,500 CASH... would that be a good deal? The reason why I'm interested in BMW after years with trouble-free Hondas and Acuras is that.. simply I want to drive a Beemer. Speaking of maintenance costs, how much do I need to expect to spend yearly? And, the oil changes really need to be done at dealership? or just a corner express oil change shops are ok too? Thank you!
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    You might check with Terry on the Smart Shopper board.. In: Real world trade in values. He can give you an idea of what the car might be worth. I don't really follow 5-series that close. Someone else on this board may have an idea.

    If you are really want a BMW, I would look at '99 and '00 323i. I think you might be able to find one of those for your target price with much lower mileage. I've seen those locally with 40K to 60K miles for asking prices of under $20K. Lower miles will be your friend when it comes to repair/maintenance costs.

    regards,
    kyfdx

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  • riezriez Member Posts: 2,361
    kleemitt... Pay for a THOROUGH INDEPENDENT inspection. And run a CARFAX report!

    1. Don't buy unless you can see all the repair and service invoices proving what was done when. Then only buy if all the necessary work was done on time and schedule. Brake fluid should have been changed at least once every 2 years. No more than 3 years on the coolant. Was the transmissiona and differential fluid changed? Etc.

    2. I would NOT recommend buying a BMW out of warranty unless you know a GOOD INDEPENDENT service shop that SPECIALIZES in BMWs. Most BMW dealers don't do much repair work on big things like transmissions and differentials. They just replace. And that is hideously expensive. You'll save a ton on repair and maintenance work using an independent shop. Find one that also gives a BMW CCA discount and then join BMW CCA.

    3. You seem worried about service, maintenance, and repairs. If so, buy CPO or don't buy a non-warrantied BMW. (Really sounds like you'd be better off with a CPO Lexus GS300.)
  • kleemittkleemitt Member Posts: 9
    riez, thank you for your advice! Maybe I should take more time to think about buying a used BMW. I did run a CARFAX report and it shows the vehicle has been serviced pretty regularly.

    And, thank you for your tip on going to an independent repair shop rather than dealership. Now, what is BMW CCA???

    I don't think I can afford a CPO. 1999 or 2000 CPOs usually cost over 20K. However, I will check out CPO Lexus GS300s. Thanks!
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    BMWCCA = BMW Car Club of America

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  • riezriez Member Posts: 2,361
    Check out the August 2004 issue of European Car. Is their annual Grand Prix, "The Most Significant New Car of the Year". They tested both 545i6 and 645i SMG. They much prefered the 645i. They panned the 54i6's exterior & interior, the price (MSRP was "just under $63,000"), and iDrive.

    Excepts:

    "We considered the previous [E39] 5 Series to be the almost perfect car, so it's natural we might have felt a bit cold toward this new version, and we're willing to wait a while before making a final judgement. ... Will 'like' ever turn to 'love'?"

    "Not the improved 5er I wanted."
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Member Posts: 5,495
    have come to believe that BMW's are only for people who lease. They would rather be skinned alive than actually own one outright past the warranty period.

    What does this mean, long-term, for the brand? . . for this or any other vehicle that can barely live past the warranty?

    There are those who lease. . .and those who buy. Those of us who buy look for vehicles that cost a reasonable amount to keep on the road, for a long, long time.

    The BMW's & Audi's that can barely make it to the end of the lease may have an interesting long-term future. Someone, somewhere is expected to acquire all those off-lease vehicles, for prices that may give one pause to consider.

    Edmunds is full of people who only care about first cost, but the long-term thing will eventually have an effect on the brand. What is happening to all the older vehicles?

    Enquiring minds. . .
    '08 Acura TSX, '17 Subaru Forester
  • saugataksaugatak Member Posts: 488
    My bro is a mechanic and he fixes all types of cars so I can give you the benefit of HIS experiences with BMW.

    In my bro's opinion:

    1. BMW's are not worse in terms of overall reliability than other cars. They're not as reliable as Japanese cars, but they're not bad.

    2. Lots of BMW's get abused by their owners, more so than say a Lexus. So you have to be careful with a used BMW.

    3. BMW's do have weird electrical problems which can be difficult to diagnose, which means more mechanic time spent figuring out what to do, which translates into bigger repair bills.

    4. BMW parts are EXPENSIVE.

    But if you buy a used BMW which was well taken care of, and you do regular maintenance on it, they can last you a long time and be pretty reliable. Problem is, when repairs need to be done they're so expensive that you have to ask yourself, at what point do I want to stop putting money into a used car?
  • manybmwsmanybmws Member Posts: 347
    You might try $16,000. I sold my car last year (same as what your buying) for $17,500.
  • qsaddleqsaddle Member Posts: 3
    many of those older vehicles are being driven by the original owners. I am on my third. BMW #1 was sold to an ecstatic kid at 160,000 miles. BMW #2 was donated to a charity at 260,000 miles, and we expect to insist that our children rid themselves of our current 530 at 360,000 miles. #1 and #2 were mechanically fine at separation, indeed, even with the accumulated miles, I would not hesitate to drive either of the cars at triple digits.

    Had my dad's Honda reached 260k, I would not even contemplate driving it at 100+. Sure, we pay more to maintain these cars, but those of us who love cars know that it is well worth it.

    On another note, I am feeling some engine vibration on the clutch pedal of #3 when depressed, throw out bearing? (#2and #3 never needed a clutch replacement, and I even let the wife drive them!)
  • designmandesignman Member Posts: 2,129
    Good post. It's refreshing to hear about longevity around here and the determination to stick with cars for the long haul.
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Member Posts: 5,495
    Amen.
    '08 Acura TSX, '17 Subaru Forester
  • riezriez Member Posts: 2,361
    qsaddle... What were the models and years for the 3 cars you listed above? Were they automatics or manual transmissions? What sort of maintenance schedule(s) did you maintain? For example, how often did you change the engine oil and filter? Transmission and differential fluid? Brake fluid and coolant?
  • sdg380sdg380 Member Posts: 109
    I was a little surprised to see that incentives are in play for the E60's this month (525, $1200; 530, $1000; 545, $1500). Anybody perceive any significance, or just moving merchandise as new model year grows nearer?
  • 530ir1150r530ir1150r Member Posts: 263
    We went to Nashville this weekend. Total miles there and back and in town was 423.4, total time 5 hours and 43 minutes, 14.648 gallons of gas. The odometer recorded 36 miles in 35 miles, last year it was 33 miles in 32.

    Adjusted trip figures: 411.6 miles, 28.10 MPG, 72.0 MPH.

    OBC Readings: 29616 miles, 26.7 MPG, 52.3 MPH
    Adjusted: 28719 miles, 25.9 MPG, 50.7 MPH
  • tam2ktam2k Member Posts: 16
    I am trying to purchase my 1st BMW. I'm looking for a Silver 525i 2001 or newer with 30K miles or less. I have a couple of cars that I'd like to get opinions on, please.

    I'm looking at a 2003 Silver 525i with 6K miles on it. It is being sold at CarMax for $38,599. Does anyone have experience dealing with them or would advise against it? I've done a CarFax search and didn't find anything.

    The 2nd car that I'm reviewing is a 2001 Silver 525i with 21K miles CPO. I am located in Atlanta and this car is at a BMW dealership in NC. They want around $33K for it. They say that they'd bring it to me for a $500 deposit that is refundable. I'm concerned about a couple of things. #1 the car isn't local so I can't test drive it and review it w/out any obligation. #2 the car will be out of warranty w/in 9 months before the CPO warranty and I'm not sure exactly what the CPO warranty will cover.

    Does anyone have any experience with either of these types of sales? I really don't want to spend more than $34.5K for the car that I buy.

    Thanks for any advice!
  • riezriez Member Posts: 2,361
    tam2k...

    - Make sure to get a CarFax report. If you can't on the car, doublecheck the VIN number. I wouldn't buy one that I couldn't get info on.

    - Get the maintenance, service, and repair history. This is esp. true for the 2001. BMWs should have brake fluid changed every 2 years. New coolant every 3. Find out when the next Sch I or II major service maintenance is. Is one due now? Also, how are the tires holding up? Does the 2001 need a new set?

    - Try to talk to the original owners. Why are they selling?

    - I would NOT buy unless I could BOTH (1) test drive and (2) have an independent mechanic inspect, esp. for the 2001.

    - Check out BMW NA's web site to learn more about CPO program. You can also get info from your local BMW dealer. Essentially, the CPO warranty adds 2 years or 50,000 miles of additional, though different, coverage on top of the original 4/50 b-to-b new car warranty. CPO warranty is NOT as extensive; there are many things not covered. CPO warranty also has a $50 deductible.

    - We'd need to know a lot more about both cars. What were their original MSRPs? What options do they have? Automatic? Premium Pkg? Sport Pkg? Cold Weather Pkg? Upgraded stereo? Navigation system? Etc?

    - I would NEVER pay $33,000 for a MY2001 525i. People were buying MY2003 525i for about $35-40,000 last year!

    - What do Edmunds, NADA, etc. say about the book values of these cars?

    - Have you considered a CPO 3 Series? The 325i has the same engine and transmissions as the 525i in a smaller, lighter platform.
  • qsaddleqsaddle Member Posts: 3
    Riez, as requested:

    1980 320 5 spd/ 1986 325 5 spd
       valvoline or castrol every 3k with filter
       tranny and differential fluid every 30k
       brake fluid/clutch slave cylinder 2 years
       coolant 2 years with water pump lubricant every 6 months
      
       other than the usual maintenance items (brake pads, rotors, tune-up parts), I recall replacing 1 battery each, water pumps, clutch slave cylinders (change that fluid!), fuel pump on the 320, drive shaft on the 325, shifter linkage bushings on the 325 and rear transmission seals on both. The a/c compressor gave out on the 325 shortly before we parted. Note no starters, no alternators, and no plug wires.

    2002 530 sp/pp 5 spd
      Mobil 1 every 7500. Will follow Bimmer Magazines suggestions of 30k on the tranny and rear axle though I may not use Redline products
  • ajroseajrose Member Posts: 29
    "The odometer recorded 36 miles in 35 miles, last year it was 33 miles in 32."

    I have often thought that the speedometer and odometer in my 540i6 was off - reading higher speed and thus more miles than actual.

    Is this a common occurrence?
  • riezriez Member Posts: 2,361
    BMWs are historically renown for their speedometer error. They read fast. So if it shows 75 mph, you might actually be doing 72 mph. Is mainly due to European laws that mandate speedometers never read slow (e.g., speedo shows 75 mph when you are actually doing 78 mph).

    But there is no relationship between the speedometer reading and the odometer reading. The odometer is accurate.

    People often use the trip computer function to calculate actual speed vs speedometer reading.
  • tam2ktam2k Member Posts: 16
    I purchased a 1 month CARFAX registration so I've run the VIN on both cars. I'm actually concerned about CARFAX's accuracy though. I ran my own car's VIN and several things weren't listed on the site.

    I've decided against the 2001 since I couldn't see and at least test drive the car before it's delivered to me here. I also want to stick with a 2002 or 2003 so that I'll have at least 2 years left on the warranty. Carmax won't negotiate and 38.6 is about 4K more than I would spend as a max. Both cars were Silver, automatic with performance package. I've looked at both Kelley and Edmunds to price the cars. I believe that the dealer price for both cars were similar.

    The 325 is smaller than I would like.

    My optimal car would be a 525i, Silver, automatic, performance package w/ 20 - 25K miles. There's a car that meets all of that except it has 46K miles. I currently have several dealerships looking at cars for me. I looked at a 2001 530i, steel Blue, automatic, performance and cold weather package w/ 6 disc CD changer and 36K miles. It's priced at 33.8 if I recall correctly. Obviously high price, but more miles than I want. It isn't CPO because it isn't from a dealer. Does anyone know the procedure to get an extended warranty from an authorized BMW dealer when you haven't bought the car from them?
  • 530ir1150r530ir1150r Member Posts: 263
    My odometer and speedometer are off by about the same amount. I check the odometer against mileposts and the speedometer against the roadside radar trailers. Both off about 3%. I know neither are precise, but the error is the same.
  • 530ir1150r530ir1150r Member Posts: 263
    Forgot to mention I saw a 2005 silver Corvette on the way home from Bowling Green today. I think it is a big improvement from the 2004, especially the profile.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    Mine is as described in the other post.. About 3% high on the speedometer, but the odometer is correct.. Or at least a lot closer than 3%.

    regards,
    kyfdx

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  • tlmmhowelltlmmhowell Member Posts: 48
    Does anyone know if you can use any other ATF fluid besides the stuff BMW uses? I understand it is made by Esso and is very expensive. I believe the dealer quoted me $400 just to drop pan, clean magnets and add 3-4 liters. I have 40K miles on it and am wondering if it is worth the $$ to do it. I like Amzoil ATF and was thinking about replacing it or mixing it, but I am not sure if it is OK to do so. Any input would be appreciated.
  • kudy843kudy843 Member Posts: 26
    Just thought I share this with you... about a week ago I saw and add on the AutoMart car adds that there was an 04 530i with about 8k of milege asking for 41G.
  • tam2ktam2k Member Posts: 16
    On Sat, I test drove a 525i 2002 32K miles, $32.8. It has premium and cold weather package. On the fact sheet on the window, it said that it had vinyl seats. I asked the dealer (not a BMW dealership) about this and got mixed answers so I'm not sure that I believed them at the end when they said "yes, it's leather not vinyl." Is it possible that this car could have vinyl seats?
  • srfastsrfast Member Posts: 138
    seats were included as part of the Premium Package in 2003. Though this is a list of 2003 options, you might find it of some use: http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/new/reviews/full/index.cfm/id/- - 23155

    Good luck....JL
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    According to the 2002 price list that I have, the Premium Package included the Montana Leather Upholstery. So, if it is a 2002 or 2003 E39, it most likely has leather. IIRC in 2001 the packages were a little different and the PP may not have included the Leather.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • srfastsrfast Member Posts: 138
    I hope they haven't disappointed you.

    Regards...JL
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    So far so good. ;-)

    I just washed off the (unplanned for but never-the-less interesting) evidence of just how clean these pads keep your wheels. About 600 miles before I mounted the new pads, I washed/waxed my wheels to almost showroom condition only to see them completely covered in black dust on the first drive (New Hampshire to Long Island). During the change of the pads, I got several finger marks where I essentially wiped the 600 miles of accumulated dust off, and yesterday, after 2,000+ more miles without a wash, said finger marks showed just as clearly as they did when I first changed the pads!

    Now that I have clean wheels again, it will be interesting to see how long they will stay clean.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    But of course.... you should make sure it actually has the premium package before assuming it is also leather...

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  • ny540i6ny540i6 Member Posts: 518
    Shipo,

    In addition, can you share a bit on the pads' feel, bite performance etc? One of the ironies of being a tinkerer and having several cars that I've done upgrades on (brakes, suspension etc) is that I am totally satisfied with the performance of the 5... either that, or the limits are higher than places I am comfortable going! In the 34K miles that I have had this car I have changed nothing, and am only looking at moving to a different tire because I want to see what else is out there.
  • shiposhipo Member Posts: 9,148
    At this point, I have a little over 3,000 miles on the new pads, most of which has been tooling the roads between NH and the NYC area. Said traffic conditions have been such that I have ranged in speeds from 0-100+ and needless to say given the roads that I've been driving, there have been times where quick de-acceleration/full stops have been required due to cresting a hill at high speed only to find traffic stopped just ahead. Through it all, I have yet to feel any difference. I've been trying; it's just that these pads feel so close to the OEM pads that I simply cannot tell.

    In the end, I like the new front pads so much that I'm probably going to pop for a new set of rears when my next assignment is over in early August. ;-)

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • dzubadzuba Member Posts: 159
    I have an 02 530 - Sport, Premium, CWP w/30K miles on it.

    Before I bought the car I thought I read somewhere on here of this very strange thing that happened before to someone else.

    It happened a year ago to me as I was pulling into my garage at 3-4MPH, and again yesterday as I was backing up at 2-3MPH. Basically - in both instances as I was applying light pressure to the brake, the car lurched forward (in the first instance) and lurched backward (in the second as I was in reverse). No kidding - it felt like someone jammed on the accelerator. Scared the you know what out of me.

    Happened to anyone else, or anyone remember reading about this strange happening?

    Thanks
  • tam2ktam2k Member Posts: 16
    Thanks shipo and srfast. I'm now looking at the purchase of a 2001 525i Silver with sports package. It has 28K miles and the "retail price" is 35,600 but the internet special price is 30, 500! The car has a couple of noticeable dings about 1/2 the size of a dime on the door that probably can't be repaired. It is supposed to have a sport package yet it doesn't have the sport steering wheel or the sport seat. I'm going to try to find out if this was possible on a 2001. The car doesn't appear to have premium package though I need to research a bit what was included in a 2001 premium. It's a pretty plain car. I'm thinking of offering them $29K if I make an offer at all. Any opinions??? Thanks!
  • srfastsrfast Member Posts: 138
    search for an E39: http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/used/reviews/full/index.cfm/id- /2258

    I am not sure about the sport seats, but I am sure the sport steering wheel was part of the SP.

    Good luck...JL
  • mtv65mtv65 Member Posts: 45
    Take your time tam2k! My wife and I are about to pick up a 2001 530i with the Sport Premium pkg for $27k (private). Ran the vin# thru Carfax although I question it's validity and called the dealership that the car was purchased from for maintenance records and all seem to check out ok. As I recall, there are quite a bit of good deals at your side of the pond. Make sure you do the pre-purchase inspection which could possibly offset the selling price depending on what they find. Check autotrader, cars.com, carsdirect, local papers.....

    Here's an example of a low mileage 530i CPO in Conn -http://used-cars.autos.yahoo.com/usedcars/detail/index.html?cid=- a573cd66bb9c44b8e18503a71864310b

    Good Luck!!
  • riezriez Member Posts: 2,361
    Run a CarFax. Have an independent mechanic look at it. The original selling dealer may still have info on file showing what was original and optional equipment on the specific car. Use the VIN #. If dealer doesn't, try BMW NA. Contact the primary servicing dealer to see the service, repair, and maintenance history.

    Thinking the Sport steering wheel was standard and mandatory for MY01 Sport Pkg. But the Sport Seats could be exchanged for optional Comfort Seats. The Sport Seats are to be much preferred. The Comfort Seats are expensive pieces of garbage! [Unfortunately, my '98 540i6 had the optional Comfort Seats.]
  • tam2ktam2k Member Posts: 16
    Hi Mtv65. How many miles does the car have that you're buying? The cars that I'm looking at are all at BMW dealerships or dealerships that specialize in BMW or luxury cars.
  • mtv65mtv65 Member Posts: 45
    The car has ~40k miles so 10k left on the manuf warr or June '05. I've noticed cars that were advertised with a lower price a month ago going for more now (same dealership/same car/~3k more than original asking price). What gives? My only conclusion is that people are so turned off with the new body style that they would rather have a preowned E39 for less money. Not sure if the link I posted above worked but here it is again -Fully loaded 01 530i with 24k miles
  • tam2ktam2k Member Posts: 16
    Thanks for the link. I decided against the Silver 525i. I'm pretty sure that it wasn't a Sports Package. It wasn't even a premium package car. I didn't have a good feeling about that dealership anyway so I'm moving on from them.

    I have a car that I saw tonight which seems promising. It's a 525i 2001 Steel Blue with premium package and tan interior. It has 33.7K miles and the sticker price is $31.85. It seems very similar to another car though that I saw at another local Atlanta dealership a couple of weeks ago. That car was sold at auction last Wed. The salesperson at the other dealership told me that he had to send it back to service so I never drove it or got the VIN #.

    When I look at the CARFax, this car was sold at auction in April of 04 in GA. Somehow it is still in the system 3 months later. It makes me wonder about the car. It was serviced based on Carfax at 26K miles in 10/03 and had front brake rotors replaced and blower motor resistor replace. Does anyone know what the blower motor is?

    Any thoughts for concern? I'm going to negotiate to have it examined independently before I purchase. I did notice a louder sound of the car than what I've heard with other cars that I've test driven. It also didn't drive as smoothly.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    These seem like pretty stiff prices for '01 525i's... I see '00 528i's going for about $25K with miles in the low 40s. I can't see paying over $30K for a lower powered '01 525i, unless it had every single option, miles under 20K, and looked like it was still in the wrapper.

    I understand that they may have 6 months to a year of warranty left, but that seems way too stiff a price. You could buy an '03 525i last fall, brand new, for around $39K-$40K.

    regards,
    kyfdx

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  • professordjfprofessordjf Member Posts: 2
    For the new 5 series, BMW got this idea that they should add humidity in the air conditioner because otherwise it tends to dry the air out. Well this may make sense in some climates but where I live in Texas, it is too humid already! I've test driven several BMW 5 series models on different days and in each case the A/C was damp and clammy and I felt very uncomfortable in the car. What a shame, because in other respects it is a marvelous vehicle. I can afford to buy one but until they fix this problem, I'll pass.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Member Posts: 5,751
    How can you add humidity? Adding humidity would require water or outside air which to me defeats the purpose of a/c drying out the air?
  • cmnottcmnott Member Posts: 200
    I have read on C&D forums of a new 3.0L I6 for the 630i, good for 258bhp and 221 lb.ft. I think this will make the 530i sportier, although the torque figures still pale in comparison to the E350. I think this engine will definitely make better use of what it has to offer.
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