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Lexus LS 400/LS 430

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Comments

  • 1stavy1stavy Member Posts: 18
    I appreciate your replies. At this time the 98 and 99 at auction are within my budget. I regret that the 01 and 02 aren't just yet. I'm strongly considering the 98 or 99 at 45-70k miles and keeping it for 5-6 yrs with a plan for snagging a newer body styled '05 LS 430 in the year 2009 when my 45,000 mile yearly commute will be nearing an end. I love highway driving and look forward to doing it in a high-quality car. Early on (5-6 yrs ago)I quizzed my car dealer/mechanic friends about the Benz 350S TD 94-97 relative to it's ability to last 400,000+ and they told me I was thinking the right way however the maintenance costs associated with the S-class and turbos at that time where prohibitive and they steered me to Lexus products. Although the old Big Benzes are still alluring to me, from a practical standpoint I think I was given good advice. Thanks again.
  • jamesfletcher2jamesfletcher2 Member Posts: 127
    1stavy,

    I have not really seen gasoline engine S-Calss cars with over 400K but I have seen S-Calss diesels with over 400K. However, I did see a '92 LS400 at the Lexus dealer in Austin with 485K on it (and that was three years ago). The only serious work had been the alternator, air compressor and a transmission rebuild. The owner said that these all had been after 300K or 400K.

    The only thing that was noteworthy was that he had used Mobil1 since the car was new (like I do with all of mine). He had also switched to Mobil1 synthetic transmission fluid. With the use of synthetics I believe that an LS can exceed 500K and more.

    JF
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    My 95 LS which a friend bought out at my lease end also has high mileage (in the high 2's) and is still going on maintenance. It doesn't even rattle according to my friend. This guy also uses mobil 1. He lets Lexus change the oil but he brings the mobil 1 to them.
  • jamesfletcher2jamesfletcher2 Member Posts: 127
    ljflx,

    That is exactly what I do. We (typically my wife or son) bring them the Mobil1 motor oil plus the Mobil1 transmission fluid. I just started with the Mobil1 transmission fluid in the last year.

    I am trying to get the Lexus dealer I am using to switch to Mobil1 from Castrol. Castrol cheapened their synthetic oil over a year ago where it is not a true synthetic anymore. Interestingly, they cheapened their synthetic but did not lower the price.

    Mobil, Amsoil and other manufacturers have been fighting Castrol through their petroleum industry engineering organization. What Porsche, AMG and GM have done is adopt a true synthetic oil specification from the SAE that is meet by Mobil, Amsoil, Texaco and the other manufacturers that meet the true synthetic specification.

    Unfortunately, Castrol seems to have a real beach head established in new car dealerships.

    JF
  • 1stavy1stavy Member Posts: 18
    jamesfletcher2& Ijklx. If I purchase an LS 400 with 60 or 70k miles am I at a great disadvantage in my attempt to achieve great longevity with the car due to my inability to bottlefeed it with Mobil 1 earlier?
  • jbianco12jbianco12 Member Posts: 125
    The answers to these questions were addressed a while ago, but I'd have to spend 1/2 the day going over thousands of posts to find them. So...
    1. When does the next navigation DVD come out? (I have an 02 version) I think the last one was in the Fall where they added a bunch of preset locations, but wanted to wait until they added street addresses.
    2. What is the website that has good deals on lexus parts?
    Thanks everyone!
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    The only thing I can tell you is I had about 40k miles on the car when the lease was up. I hadn't used mobil 1 on it but my friend switched immediately. He's been a mobil 1 user since it came out. He also uses Mobil gas whenever he can (93 octane only) and has always felt it was the best. He thinks the car will go another 200k miles so maybe JF is right about that 500k mileage point. Lexus cars (and the the way they are built) are awesome. I haven't had a problem in nine years on 4 LS cars, an LX truck or on a TLC (practically a Lexus). My new GX is fabulous and I expect it and the 2004 LS I'll take in two months to run letter perfect as well.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Most use recycled oil.
  • 1stavy1stavy Member Posts: 18
    Thanks, for sharing your experience.I'll be much better prepared to take care of an LS 400.
  • rgswrgsw Member Posts: 333
    I believe the date on my 2004 LS430 Nav DVD is 3/03. They upgraded from around 700,000 points to something like 5.3 Million points. I saw a lot of posts on this point about two or three months back on this forum.
  • stevesteinstevestein Member Posts: 263
    Were you thinking of Irontoad.com ? I think it's a PA Lexus dealer but I'm not sure. I remember it being mentioned quite a while ago.
  • niceputtniceputt Member Posts: 23
    I am about to pick up my new LS430, was waiting for the SAT Radio to be installed. Then learned the antenna is an ugly black box about 5" long and 2" high, installed on top of the trunk lid.
    Can ANYONE relate whether they know of a better way that has evolved for mounting that? Would be very grateful for a solution.
  • wbwynnwbwynn Member Posts: 246
    Lexus has to get this integated as an option now...no excuse. Even GM and Ford have had this for some time...everyone wants it. Come on Lexus.
  • wbwynnwbwynn Member Posts: 246
    I have had a great Lexus experience with an 01' 430 for the past few years. My first recent contact with the salesman (who I like) re: purchase of a new LS or GX resulted in him telling all about the new features that I already new about...and all he he told me was what the MSRP was...I replied that I knew every thing about the vehicles, the changes and problems (if any), the invoice price, the going prices, etc.

    There is no question in my mind that I will use this local sale rep for my test drives and then put my business out to bid with 10 dealers within a 100 miles. I expect to buy a GX for $2500 over invoice or an LS for $3000 over..or better. It can be done.

    My point is that the one thing I find negative about Lexus sale reps is the arrogance on pricing. When push comes to shove, the local dealer will almost always match any other verified dealer price to do the deal...if you get the "these are in short supply" or "we sell every one we get", just tell them you will take you business elsewhere....then the cars magically become available real fast. And yes, I will buy another Lexus soon...no question at all about that.

    Sorry to rant, but I really support the folks on the Lexus boards who take the time to shop their business. It's worth it and doable.
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    My lexus sales rep (internet sales rep) has been an absolute doll. Reminder - I'm getting a car that we had to wait for two allocations for, it is so in demand/rare (Ultra Pkg, Moonlight Pearl/Ecru). She came down $4k from MSRP ($4,900 over invoice) with little negotiation AND I am picking up a loaner from her tomorrow until mine gets here (target date - March 5, 2004) because my '01 STS has to go back on Saturday and she "feels bad that the car isn't here yet" (we just ordered it the 30th of January.

    Overall, for a luxury brand, these people are the most courteous and NON-ARROGANT I have ever come across.
  • rgswrgsw Member Posts: 333
    The XM Radio Antenna is a small square ugly black box that was installed on the left side of the trunk lid. It measures about 3 inches square and 3/4 inch thick. I sent the following to Lexus Customer Satisfaction Department:

    I want to provide some feedback on my recently installed XM Radio that controls through the LS 430 Nav/Audio system. I am very pleased with the display, controls, and performance of the Lexus XM Radio. The sound fidelity is impressive. The only concern that I want to share with you is the "antenna" installation. The little "black" blob sitting on the left side of my trunk lid on the "Crystal White" paint looks very much out of place, very prominant, and unsymetrical on a $62,000 luxury automobile. Further, the install tech wound the wire from the antenna around the retracting wires that feed the electrical components in the trunk lid area, thus restricting the movement of the wire cable in and out of its retract area. I believe I would have been more pleased if the "black" antenna had been mounted in the center of the trunk lid. However; this may have impeded the operation of the antenna. I can also understand that to paint the antenna in a color coordinated color to match the car might also impede the antenna's reception abiltiy. I just wanted to share my views and thoughts with you.

    Their response is quoted below:

    ....."I apologize for the dissatisfaction with some of the features in your vehicle. I have documented your concerns at our national headquarters.

    We appreciate the feedback on your vehicle so that we may consider these concerns when designing future models"......
      
    PS: I find it interesting that they are not using the little black verticle antenna near the top of the rear window (formerly used for Lexus Link, and no longer offered). I agree they should come up with a better place for the antenna and possibly color code it to match the vehicle.
  • edspider1edspider1 Member Posts: 195
    I read an earlier post where the dealer painted the antenna to match the car. The author was very pleased and did not mention any reception impact. I doubt the paint will last long, though. I'll be suprised if Lexus doesn't fix in the next MY. I didn't order it because it was ugly, but otherwise would have. I did write to XM and told them it was a pretty sloppy implementation and priced at $800 not a very good value since it has to stay with the car.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Why not on a bracket mounted near/at the inside front of the sunroof?
  • rcf8000rcf8000 Member Posts: 619
    The satellite antenna for a Honda Accord is body color and mounted above the center of the rear window. You'd think that Lexus could do as well.
  • twinsdad99twinsdad99 Member Posts: 9
    I too have an 04 LS430 and wanted to get satellite radio. I did some research on pricing and installation and came up with $414 for the unit prior to install and did check out the Kit which is a Pioneer(Thailand) brand unit that does require install of the antenna outside the left side of the trunk.

    This is the sickness of Toyota/Lexus- for some reason it takes them some time, compared to the germans (BMW/MB) to integrate new features/options to their mainstream cars.For example, my 2000 LX never had HID lights or autolock doors while my 2000 540 had it as standard.My LX, just to get autodim rear view mirror, had to have a wire sticking out from the ceiling to the mirror unlike the flush install of the bimmer.Granted, the 2 are not in the same segment, it goes to show you the issue. Look at the Smart Access they use on the O4-you twist the starter "wedge" when everybody else is implementing the more "cool" push button start.

    Anyway, the XM seems overpriced and a rushed implementation and will only get "fixed" in 05 or 06,in usual Toyota/Lexus fashion.
  • mheni1mheni1 Member Posts: 41
    Alternator has been replaced twice on my 2001 LS 430. Battery also replaced. Am thinking that issue(s) may be something causing alternator to go bad. Does anyone have any experience with this issue? Thanks
  • jamesfletcher2jamesfletcher2 Member Posts: 127
    1stavy,

    Basically, as long as the engine in your LS is "tight" and in not leaking any oil if is fine and advisable to switch for long ownership. The only thing you need to do is change out the Mobil1 in short intervals of 5K or so for about 2 - 3 oil changes so that your engine can clean out the conventional oil build-up.

    I would also suggest that you convert to Mobil1 transmission fluid. My fact gathering suggest that in an LS the transmission will actually need rebuilding before the engine ever would (although I believe that Lexus read-wheel drive transmissions are as bullet-proof as any other).

    My extensive business travel means that I will never really put the kind of miles on a LS like some of the others I have seem or heard about before I trade on a new car every few years. Also, I drive a few other vehicles in addition to our LS which also keeps my LS mileage down.

    Also, some time in 2001, I talked to a gentlemen at JM Lexus in South Florida that had around 390K on his 1994 or 95 LS. He also used synthetics and the assistant manager in the service department told me that that was one of the highest mileage Lexus they had and that the owner and his wife drove all over the country visiting their children and were putting an additional 40K - 50K a year on it.

    JM actually has placards that are in the service department that show the number of cars they service that crossover each 100K mile mark. I believe that each displayed the model (only LS and GS were over 200K), name of the owner and year of the vehicles. Although, the service department told me that they are slow to add new cars to the placards they already listed a large number that were over 200K and quite a few over 300K with a small number over 400K. It appeared that a number of the retired couples who used JM Lexus really valued the longevity of the LS/GS and were determined to see just how long they could run. From what I have seen no high number of miles on an LS would surprise me. I suspect that there are already early LS400s that are over 600K.

    I actually believe that the V8 in the LS and GS is so well built that with synthetic oils for most of it's life these engines could actually run 1 million miles and effectively out last the car - transmission, suspension, etc. When very well maintained, their ability to stay tight and powerful is truly amazing.

    I apologies for being so lengthy, but given the number of high mileage LS400/430s I have seen or heard of coupled with the feedback from ljflx, wwest and others, the LS build quality, dependability and durability will never cease to amaze me.

    And, of course, typical of Lexus they just keep raising the bar with each new model revision.

    JF
  • 1stavy1stavy Member Posts: 18
    Fear not, you can't be too lengthy when imparting welcome and valuable informtion. It will serve me well when I make the purchase. Thanks again to you, wbwynn,Ijflx,wwest and abfisch for the sage and thorough advice and perspectives.
  • rd1411rd1411 Member Posts: 18
    what is that parts web site
  • sploguesplogue Member Posts: 53
    Try www.lexus-parts.com for parts, including the nav update DVD.

    Does anyone know when the next DVD update is coming out? I'm holding out until the next one.
  • cheapownercheapowner Member Posts: 47
    Wonder why '04's transmission (A761E) is a 6 speed version of A750E/F (Landcruiser's) instead of A650E from '03's?
  • chicagoedchicagoed Member Posts: 69
    I see you're switching from an '01 STS to an '04 LS. I switched from an '01 DHS to the '04 LS three weeks ago. While the LS is just great, I miss a few Cadillac features.
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    I actually puchased my '04 LS430 (Ultra Luxury/Moonlight Pearl/Ecru) on Saturday but it's not here yet so they put me in a GS300 until it comes in.

    What does your LS not have the the Caddy had?
  • rgswrgsw Member Posts: 333
    I checked out the after market XM Radios last year and they wanted to put a "Y" connector on my FM radio feed and place a channel selector somewhere on the dash panel. The 2004 LS430 Lexus XM receiver is a "Toyota" receiver (mounted in the trunk) and integrated with the Nav/Audio system (no little channel selector stuck on the dash). I don't think writing to XM Radio will do any good in regards to the price and installation of the "Toyota" Receiver. I believe the reason Lexus put the antenna on the trunk lid was to simplify the wiring. This way they don't have to remove a lot of material to run the antenna wire. I agree, Lexus will probably catch up next year or so and have a great installation. See " http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/RGSW/XM%20Antenna%202%20SM.JPG" for picture,
  • chicagoedchicagoed Member Posts: 69
    As I said, I love my new LS, but am irked by the omission of some nice features that my Cadillac had, namely:

    No very useful "cruise-engaged" indicator light, only a "cruise system turned on" light.

    Lack of the convenience of retained accessory power.

    Cannot step forward or backward in a CD track randomization sequence, only to the next higher or lower track number. If you've passed a nice song and want to replay it, you have no clue where it is unless you memorized the disc and track number it was.

    Inability to recall or save seat memory settings with car in motion.

    Inability to recall or save seat memory settings with driver's door closed and ignition switch OFF. Think that one through - it works if you open the door!

    Less extensive driver information and control center.

    Headlight timeout after ignition off not adjustable to any time between 0 and 30 seconds.

    No sophisticated oil life monitor system.

    Poor tire pressure monitor system doesn't even tell which tire is turning faster than the rest.

    I have four "pleasure" features where the LS is better than the Cadillac (for a future post if anyone is interested in my nit-picking).

    mfullmer: Did you buy in Macon?
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    >>Lack of the convenience of retained accessory power.

    <<The LS doesn't have RAP? The GS300 I have as a loaner does and the brochure states that it does have it for the windows and and moonroof.

    >>No very useful "cruise-engaged" indicator light, only a "cruise system turned on" light.

    <Ok, I have to say that doesn't concern me as I never get to use my cruise control here in Atlanta.

    <<Cannot step forward or backward in a CD track randomization sequence, only to the next higher or lower track number. If you've passed a nice song and want to replay it, you have no clue where it is unless you memorized the disc and track number it was.

    < Hmm, can't say that I used the randomizer much with my CD's.

    >>Inability to recall or save seat memory settings with car in motion.

    < I don't recall being able to do that in the STS, I thought the gear selector had to be in neutral or park.

    >>Inability to recall or save seat memory settings with driver's door closed and ignition switch OFF. Think that one through - it works if you open the door!

    < Hmm, Interesting.

    >>Less extensive driver information and control center.

    < Yes, Cadillac DIC was very, very useful.

    >>Headlight timeout after ignition off not adjustable to any time between 0 and 30 seconds.

    < I hear that, I usually left my Twilight Sentinal at the very minimum so I didnt have people telling me I left my lights on!>

    >>No sophisticated oil life monitor system.

    < For some reason my STS never got below 40% even the one time I let 8k miles pass. Needless to say, I never used it.

    >>Poor tire pressure monitor system doesn't even tell which tire is turning faster than the rest.

    < I can't say that I'll miss the Caddy system. I found out at 26,400 miles that when they replaced my instrument cluster at 7,200 miles they didn't even hook the tire monitor back up. It didn't even show in the DIC at all! Once they hooked it back up the rest of the 3.5k miles I had it I couldn't use it anyway. I even had to turn it off because it would read between 20-22 psi when the actual pressure was around 28.

    One thing I noticed in the GS, you can tell me if it's the same in the LS, is the memory system:

    1. The system doesn't respond to the key fob, you have to manually push 1 or 2.

    2. The system doesn't memorize the stereo and HVAC settings.

    3. The system doesn't have an exit setting for the seat (only the steering wheel).
  • jbianco12jbianco12 Member Posts: 125
    Mfullmer - I hear you on missing a few of the Caddy features. I had a 1994 Fleetwood. I miss the retained assessory power, headlight timeout and the trunk used to pop open more easily. For me, they are nits. But all in all, I've gotten used to the LS and am more satisfied with it.
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    Does it have or not have RAP?

    The brochure says it does, the GS they gave me until mine comes in does.
  • stevesteinstevestein Member Posts: 263
    Is one of several features that are dealer programmable (Lexus term is C-Best)I believe the choices are 0-30(default)-60-90 secs. If you are interested I can send you the full list (too big to post here). Many people change the door locking choices. Full disclosure - IThis list was for my 2001 LS and may have changed some.

    P.S. I liked the little trash bin in my caddy (about 15 yes ago)..still have them?
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Power remains on until you open the driver's door.

    I would have chosen to turn it off as the door is closed but does anyone understand the Japanese mind?

    Speaking of opening the driver's door.....

    Suppose your wife is 5'2" and slim and you're 6'2" and not. If you're seated and press her memory button with the door open you have an escape route...
  • ljflxljflx Member Posts: 4,690
    I know what you mean though I'm not quite 6'2" and I'd like to think I'm still reasonably slim. But if I hit that wrong memory button I start to feel like Indiana Jones must have felt when the walls closed in.

    By the way - being able to adjust your seat electronically while the car is in motion is a bit dangerous. Also while I haven't tried recently - hitting repeat while a song to repeat is playing has always worked fine. I never did try to go back to a song in random after it had played though.
  • chicagoedchicagoed Member Posts: 69
    Let me respond:

    Yes, the LS does have RAP, just not for the audio system which was the first way I missed it.

    Re seat memory: In the Cadillac, a momentary press of the memory button initiated the entire seat and steering wheel adjustment sequence when the car was stopped. When the car was in motion you could still make a recall by keeping your finger on the button until it finished the adjustment. That was how they made it "safe". You could also fine-tune your position, and re-memorize it while under way.

    Headlights timing: The dealer cannot make any setting between 0 and 30 sec.

    Key fob recognition: Each fob or SmartKey can be associated with one of the memory presets - check the owner's manual. But I still am unsure what happens to the seat positioning when two people, each carrying their own SmartKey, approach the car at the same time from both sides??? More testing required.

    Stereo and HVAC memorization: The LS DOES NOT memorize these, and that is good. One of my big annoyances with the Cadillac when changing drivers on a long trip, screwed up the CD or radio we were listening to, and changed the temperature setting that we were happy with.

    Exit setting: Correct, only the steering wheel, but you could set up MEM 3 for your seat exit preference, and manually push 3 to exit, but be sure to push it BEFORE you turn the ignition off, or AFTER you have opened the door!

    Re Indiana Jones: A second momentary press of any button will stop the adjustment sequence.

    Re repeat song: Yes it will go back to the beginning of the song currently playing if you catch it before it finishes. After that, it's gone.
  • edspider1edspider1 Member Posts: 195
    Since no one else mentioned it... If you press lock a second time, the lights go out. I do that out of habit. However, with Smart key I wouldn't have the key in hand. I wonder if you press the lock button on the door handle twice if it would kill the lights.

    Another missing option is a Heated Steering wheel. I think BMW started that one.
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    Heated steering wheels and wood steering wheels are not [generally] compatible (except for Jaguar, somehow they have this option.). On every other car, if you get a heated steering wheel you cannot get the wood steering wheel (just about every car out there, except the LS430, comes standard with the leather with the wood optional.).

    I'd rather have the standard wood than have to pay for either that or a heated steering wheel. Plus, I can't even imagine when that would be necessary, even in the coldest climate.
  • chicagoedchicagoed Member Posts: 69
    Pressing the button on the exterior door handle twice doesn't turn the lights off.
  • wbwynnwbwynn Member Posts: 246
    I am sorry folks, but if you think a GM caddy compares in anyway to a LS, you would still be in the caddy. Yes, there are somethings that GM may be first to add (albeit minor), the LS incorporates all of the "proven" best in a great, reliable vehicle....even after 4,5,6 years of use. No GM caddy after 3 years is worth it's salt or resale....look at the numbers compared to an LS.

    I will say that the lack of XM radio is a big minus for Lexus right now (across it's whole line)....hope I have stirred things up a bit for you C owners looking to spend a little more for a true lux car.
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    >I am sorry folks, but if you think a GM caddy compares in anyway to a LS, you would still be in the caddy.<

    What? How would one ever switch vehicles if one didn't compare them? What a strange comment.

    Yes, the Cadillac (both Deville and Seville) compares to the LS - they are all Full Size Luxury vehicles. Comparing similar vehicles is natural when you have people going from one make to another.

    Yes, the LS is a far better vehicle that Cadillac, hence my decision to switch. That said, there are things that the Cadillac had that I wish the LS had. NO the LS does not have all of the "Proven things" (????) that the Cadillac has. I like the fact that the Cadillac memorized the stereo and hvac settings for each driver. I listen to totally different stations and have totally different hvac settings than the other driver of my vehicles. Is this a negative of the LS? No. Is this a positive of the Cadillac? Sure.
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    Ok, I'm reading a bit more of my brochure now and I'm concerned about the dealer controlled settings. Remember, I'm coming from a Cadillac STS where I could set a huge number of settings from my DIC.

    How does this work? Do they go over the car with me and set them right then, to my preference? What if I want them changed? I'm confused!

    My '04 Ultra/Moonlight/Ecru comes in in about two weeks and I don't live that close to the dealer.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    For some strange reason Lexus is quite secretive about disclosing the complete list of C-best settings. In order to know about them all you will need to browse around the internet and read the various sources.

    I discovered, completely by accident, that the A/C in my RX could be "un-linked" from operating automatically in "auto" mode, one setting, and defrost mode, 2nd setting.

    I had the dealer unlink both but even though I asked they would not show me the other c-best settings/capabilities.
  • stevesteinstevestein Member Posts: 263
    I'll repeat my offer from #5378. Email me and I'll send you the complete list for the 2001 LS. I can't warrant it is 100% accurate for the later model years, but it should be close.
    Mfullmer - The dealer hooks up their computer and it takes just a few minutes to make the changes. It can be done at any service or (at my dealership) while you wait w/o an appointment.
  • chicagoedchicagoed Member Posts: 69
    Before taking delivery of my LS I was aware that there were settings of options that only the dealer could make, and I expected that there would be an effort made to advise me of my choices, like maybe as a part of the delivery process. Didn't happen. All I know is what I can read in the owner's manual, and even then when I asked, they did not know how to make one of the changes that the manual describes; said the manual must be for a "future model"??
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Apparently the dealers have been coached to tell you that c-best options do not exist. I had to return to the dealer with one of the lists in hand in order to get them to admit it existed. After we got over that "hump" they were very willing to accommodate the change.
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    About these in hopes that we could make our choices and have them there and set when our comes in and is prepped.

    While not evasive at all, she wasn't real specific but said we would go over them at the time of delivery and I could have them change any of the default settings at that time.
  • animationguyanimationguy Member Posts: 12
    Anybody heard of anyway to disable the annoying
    Lexus Link audio message when you first start-up?
    ... really sucks if you're doing multiple errands.

    2001 LS430 w/ Nav/Levinson/Lexus Link
  • vchengvcheng Member Posts: 1,284
    ...disabled by snipping a wire in the right rear of the trunk, but it means disabling it. To my knowledge, you cannot make is hut up and still be working. Perhaps someone else will have better information.
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