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Volvo S60

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  • volvomaxvolvomax Posts: 5,274
    Well, since the frame was bent, there was frame damage.
    They had to straighten the frame to install the new parts.
    According to Manheim, undamaged your car would wholesale for $8-9000.
    W/ the wreck, $5500 is a little low but understandable.
    Dealers hate dealing in cars w/ frame damage and bad Carfax's. It really limits their options.
    Personally, I would sell the car yourself.
  • voxboyvoxboy Posts: 30
    :confuse: I'm in the market for used s60, and wondering if the AWD's benefits outweight it's higher price, torque steer, weight and complexity. Anyone?
  • volvomaxvolvomax Posts: 5,274
    Only if you live in snow country.
  • Does anyone know reliabilty of volvo S60 vs the Accord V6 ? Has anyone owned both models ?
  • voxboyvoxboy Posts: 30
    I have owned an Accord V6 and have used both accords and volvos. Accords are generally considered more reliable and I had no problems with mine, but I plan to buy an s60 next time for the following three reasons: better traction, smaller dimensions, and whiplash protection.

    Both cars are good bets, although it seems that a higher percentage of volvo owners get unlucky with their particular car. That said, and while just about everyone would give the Accord higher reliability marks, they rank close enough that I would suggest going with the one that satisfies your other criteria.
  • The Camry is a reliable car - why not buy that? I drive an S60 primarily because I have always had safety at the top of my list. The S60 gives me safety and a sports car peformance and look etc etc. I would have thought a Honda was a pedestrian choice quite frankly and not on the same page as a Volvo.
  • voxboyvoxboy Posts: 30
    grantchstr - You're absolutely right. Aside from the fact that both the Accord V6 and the S60 are powerful mid-size sedans, your sportier and more prestigous S60 is rarely found on a potential Accord-buyer's shopping list. That said, since the top-of-the-line Accord is now pricier than the base model S60, and since according to iihs crash tests, the Accords with side/head air bags are actually a tad safer than the S60, a thoughtful response to picard12's question is warranted -- rather than calling him out on his "pedestrian" taste buds. Don't you agree?
  • voxboyvoxboy Posts: 30
    Thanks, volomax.
    Now that I'm reading good things about the 2007 Subaru Legacy GT, I'm thinking about taking a hard look at that choice before pulling the trigger on an S60. The Legacy's iihs safety ranking, its AWD and new stabiltiy control, and its nimble handling are what attracts me. I'm also thinking that the Subaru might be more reliable over time. What do you think about the S60 2.5T vs Legacy GT comparison? Anyone else care to comment?
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 7,599
    I will. Last year when I was shopping, I was very interested in the Volvo V50 and the Legacy GT wagon. I did consider the V70 as well but since it's almost impossible to get a manual V70, I shifted my goal. But I had plenty of seat time the the V70.

    Although I really liked the Subaru's styling, reliability, and AWD technology, I was disappointed in the interior. It wasn't up to the quality of the Volvo. IMHO, the Volvo has superior ergronimics, amazing seats, and an overall higher level of product in the interior. The Subaru just felt cheap to me and since I'm looking at and touching the interior every day, it was important to me.

    Now I did buy a Passat but keep in mind, I had to buy fast as my previous vehicle was totalled and I couldn't get the V50 as I wanted it.
  • volvomaxvolvomax Posts: 5,274
    Despite Subaru's wishes, their products aren't inthe same league as Volvo's or any other true luxury brands.
    Subaru makes a good car, but in terms of comfort, feel and safety it isn't a competitor for Volvo.
    The S60's seats are better, ergonomics are better. If you get rear ended in a Subaru you won't have the benefit of Volvo's WHIPS system, rollover protection in a Volvo is better.
  • voxboyvoxboy Posts: 30
    All true - but how do you reconcile the widely-held belief that Volvo is an all-around safer car when the iihs crash test results say otherwise? Are there other crash test results I should be looking at?
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 7,599
    The widely held belief is because Volvo has spent decades and millions of dollars being the safety leader - and telling us that. The other manufacturers have finally caught up due to IIHS testing. IMHO, that's a good thing.

    The Volvo S60 ranks Good for Frontal, Acceptable for Side and Good for rear impact/head restraint.

    The Subaru Legacy ranks Good for Frontal, Good for Side, and Acceptable for rear impact/head restraint.

    2 out 3 for both.

    Don't forget, the Volvo was introduced in 2001 and designed to meet those standards. The Subaru was introduced in 2005 and designed to meet those standards - which they didn't on the side impact until they improved the side airbags.

    A new S60 is coming out for 2008 - I'm guessing they'll ace all 3 tests the IIHS does. Additionally, Volvo has made stability control standard on the S60. AFAIK, it's not available on most Legacy models.
  • volvomaxvolvomax Posts: 5,274
    As has been mentioned, the S60 is an older design. One that was penned in the late 90's and it still exceeds the current standards.
    The japanese are late comers to the idea of building cars that exceed the gov'ts standards. Too often they skimp on safety devices, whiplash protection for example, or make their safety features optional. Volvo does neither.
  • voxboyvoxboy Posts: 30
    Lets say a particular Japanese model is awarded the same IIHS "good" rating as the Volvo in rear impact crash tests. Are you saying that the Volvo still wins because their WHIPS technology takes it to a whole new level?

    Maybe then I can justify moving forward with the S60 -- despite its modest side-impact rating. I just don't want to find out the hard way that the emperor has no clothes... you know what I mean?
  • volvomaxvolvomax Posts: 5,274
    Yes, NHTSA itself staes that the WHIPS system is good for an alomst 50% reduction in whiplash forces over a regular head restraint.

    Volvo has decades of real world safety experience, unmatched by every other auto maker except possibly Mercedes.
  • Hi Voxboy, I'm going to jump in here. I bought a 2006 S60 T5 (ex-service vehicle) this year, and a couple of months ago I got rear-ended. The head-rest was right there - my head hit the thing with a good thunk, but since there was so little - actually no space - between my head and the head-rest, I had no whiplash. By the way, WHIPS didn't engage - I wasn't hit that hard, but it is nice to know it's there.

    Because I like its handling, I was about to buy the Audi A4 but the IIHS didn't like the models (rear impact-wise) until later in 2006 and I wanted to get something slightly used - read: cheaper.

    I still feel vulnerable - a tad anyway - with S60's 'just ok' side impact ratings, and I don't know if Volvo has addressed this in the 2007 model. (Volvomax, you know anything about this?)

    But I really read the IIHS and the Govt crash tests, and I reasoned that: Subaru Foresters didn't have Stability Control, Saabs have terrible reliability records, and it was more likely that I'd be rear-ended than side-impacted, so I bought the S60.

    I like it - I have a few gripes - my right knee is too near the steering wheel shaft, the car makes no chirping sound when you lock it remotely, the true city mileage is around 19mpg, the T5 is bumpy and the turning radius is indeed pretty annoying...

    But it's a very sturdy car, the T5 at least has a lot of power, it looks nice and damn, the seats are comfortable and good for tall people.

    Hope this helps.
  • philmophilmo Posts: 77
    There is virtually no torque steer -- or turbo lag -- on the low-pressure turbo. The high-pressure turbo is another matter altogether. After having one since Feb/02 and putting 57,000 miles on it based in the Rockies in Colorado we can report no problems whatsoever. AWD is more than about driving in the snow. It's about wet roads, gravel roads, cornering and more. If you find a sweet deal on a used one go for it.
  • volvomaxvolvomax Posts: 5,274
    2007 model is unchanged. We just had a customer in an 05 get hit very hard in the side, totslled the car. No injury.
    Conversely, a brand new 06 Subaru WRX was hit in the side right in front of our dealership. Driver was carried away on a stretcher to the hospital. You cannot always place full faith in tests. They don't always replicate what happens in the real world.
  • voxboyvoxboy Posts: 30
    Hi Confused, volvomax, philmo, etc. Thanks so much for your responses. I'm right there with you.

    I pretty much resolved to get the S60 AWD with Dyanamic Stability, but decided to test drive the Legacy just to confirm my decision. Fyi, while I still find the '07 Legacy crash test results somewhat persuasive, it certainly doesn't feel like a safer car. It rides like a cheaper, insubstantial vehicle and I was surprised that it didn't instill much confidence. That may not be very scientific, but to echo volvomax's sentiments, I now believe more than ever that crash test results do not necessarily translate to real world conditions. And if that sounds like sour grapes, what supports that contention is the IIHS's "Injury, Collision and Theft loss" report which provides numerical ratings based on actual insurance claims filed over 2-3 years; despite the S60's modest side impact rating, the car has in fact proven supremely protective -- joining the ranks of the Passat, 9-3, and Quattro (recent awards not withstanding, the Legacys have resulted in about 25% more injuries).

    So here I go -- plunging into the used S60 market. Do any of you guys have advice on things to look out for? How important is it to pay extra for a "certified" car, and would you ever buy from an ebay vendor? Any and all recommendations are welcome.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 16,893
    while I don't feel it needs to be certified, I'd personally want an extended warranty. Since a certified car comes with one, its probably easiest just to stick to certified.

    It seems like you are looking for a recent model (let's say '04 and up?). If so, I can't think of anything in particluar you need to look for. Volvo seems to have the S60 pretty well ironed out by that year. Just be sure to try out several. Used cars, regardless of manufacturer, can vary greatly in the way they feel due to being abused by previous owners.

    I don't want to start a war, and this really may vary by region, but I also feel the need to point out that Volvo dealers (at least here in NJ) typically overprice their used volvos. If that's the case in your area, don't get discouraged. It could take a while to find the right one for you, and remember that there is plenty of room to negotiate.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '08 Town&Country

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