Toyota Camry 2006 and earlier

moparbad · May 2003

I have the brochure for the 2003 Camry in front of me right now and it clearly states 8 speakers in 6 locations and does so on multiple pages.
There is no deception by Toyota if you take the time to read the descriptions in the brochure.

andrelaplume · May 2003

Ok die hard, loyal, Toyota-can-do-no-wrong enthusiasts, you win...Toyota was not deceptive, 8 speakers in 6 locations certainly implies that there are not really 6 speakers in 6 locations, ask anyone!

Personally the more speakers the merrier...wish they put one at ear level in the door pillars to drown out all the rattles! Perhaps Toyota can put a positive spin on them, call then Driver Alert Indicators, designed to keep the driver from nodding off in an otherwise quiet car!

Perhaps they can then parlay that into explaining why they slipped in the latest JD Power survey...didn't the Toyota Brand (w/out Lexus factored in) fall to about #10?

vcheng · May 2003

....facts are facts, as I see them. Perhaps the strength of emotions is clouding logical understanding of the number of speakers (non)issue. But that is okay too by me. Also, if perceptions of poor quality persist, then the buying public are free to vote with their checkbooks, are they not?

nippononly · May 2003

absolutely - best vote you have as a consumer!

BTW, that was the JDP initial quality survey, to me a somewhat bogus little study, and Toyota fell to 7th from 3rd. And yes, the survey was somewhat bogus when Toyota was third, too!

Lexus was number one.

When a car is brand new and under warranty, build issues can be addressed by the dealer for free, while you drive a loaner car, so the IQS seems less important to me than the five-year durability and reliability study, in which Toyota always rates top 5 among all nameplates (I think it was 3rd in that survey also, most recently, right behind Lexus).

jazd2 · May 2003

Has anyone noticed that all Toyota cars seem to have the ugliest, most unattractive and hideous exhaust system of any car manufacturer. Starting from the muffler and moving forward, the pipe hangs down and bends at a 45 degree angle and then continues on. What is up with that atrocious design? Is anyone worried you are going to hang your car up on something? Can anyone explain why they do this? Everytime i am behind a Toyota, my eyes are drawn to this most unfortunate detail. What was even more unbelieveable was I saw a brand new Lexus the other day and I was astounded to see that it had the same unsightly exhaust. Yuck!!!! and shame on Toyota for blemishing their vehicles in such an obscene way. Every time i point this out to someone, they are never the same and are also revolted by the design. I for one will never consider buying a Toyota until this is fixed!!!
Comments?

moparbad · May 2003

What are you doing crawling under all the cars and looking at the exhaust system? Is your question serious about the exhaust or in jest?
The importance of the cosmetic design of the exhaust system is inconsequential. The exhaust needs to be durable, control sound, have a minimum effect on performance, and direct emissions to the appropriate area. Toyota exhaust fulfills all of the needed requirements.

vcheng · May 2003

..to annoy people who are fixated by such a trivial thing

. You can't see it while you are driving the Camry!

Plus there are no reports of frequent instances of damaged exhausts on Toyota Camrys. Thus the ground clearance must be adequate for its designed environment.

O000h, isn't Toyota awful: poorly designed exhausts that are an eyesore, and misleading people about the number of speakers! Nevermind that the engines are smooth and reliable, and the sound systems are pretty good when optioned properly. And if these things are "fixed" I am sure I can still find something wrong like the angle of the wipers when parked or the goose neck hinges that detract 0.0001 % of the useful space from a larger than average trunk.

Like I said, people are free to vote with their checkbooks.

jazd2 · May 2003

Yes, you are right. It is such a minor detail that could be easily addressed on such a bland, vanilla, and reliable vehicle. I have never been under a Toyota but anytime I see one going down the road, I can see the exhaust hanging down at an angle and its an eyesore!

I think more people are paying attention to the cosmetics of a car since reliability is a given. I think that is why the market for aftermarket parts is growing so fast. It you want to see a beautiful rear end, just take a look at what the Germans are doing with Audi's and Bmw's or if you are stuck on Japenese cars, Nissan is producing cars that are not only reliable but actually exhilarating to drive and look at. Check out the pipes on the new Maxima. Performance wise, it will lay to waste most any other boring Japanese sedan on the road.

vcheng · May 2003

...at a beautiful rear end, it won't be a car for sure!

nemotok · May 2003

My friend heard that having the A/C ON when starting a car will reduce its life. Compared to having it shut off prior to turning the ignition off. If this True? Isn't new cars are more durable and does not matter if the A/C is on or off when starting a car.

talon95 · May 2003

"Ok die hard, loyal, Toyota-can-do-no-wrong enthusiasts, you win..."

Sorry, that description doesn't apply to me... I drive a 2003 Accord. I just saw the situation in a different light than you did.

jtbruin · May 2003

Any Toyota people know what changes will be made to the '04 Camry? I know they just released the '04 Corolla and it seems to be exactly the same as the '03. I wonder if they'll add a 5-spd auto to the I4's and add standard ABD/4discs?

petrnyc · May 2003

I heard Toyota will keep the price the same on its '04 Camry models while adding more rattles in places never heard before.

nippononly · May 2003

It's not about durability, I think the change now is that modern A/C systems are computer-controlled, so the compressor is disengaged when you turn the key to start...in the old days, it did make a difference if the A/C was engaged, because it made starting the engine harder for the starter. It could reduce the life of the starter if it was the driver's habit to leave the A/C on all the time. The "modern days" when this is no longer the case began around 1997 for the Camry.

petrnyc - I loved that rattles comment! I was rollin'

steveb84 · May 2003

..except, look for the 3.3 in the SE V6

giles · May 2003

2003 Camry XLE 4 cyl. At 30 mph going up hill under power or down hill on compression there is a loud whining noise coming from the trans. It's the same noise in 2nd or 3rd gear and is louder when the engine/trans is warmed up. I can't hear it while running on the level. I hope someone has heard the same thing and solved it. Please help me here...the next time you drive your 2002 or 2003 on a hill hold it at 30 mph and see if you can hear anything unusual. It might be unique to the 4 cyl. Thanks

dillon3499 · May 2003

I'm looking into buying a 03 or 04 camry. I want a white XLE,auto, 4 cyl, with sunroof (no leather) and side air bags. I've been looking at the inventories at different dealers and there are only a few white and they all have add-ons I don't want. Can I order the exact car thru a cars direct. If I do order how long should I expect to wait?

Does anyone know when/where I can find out if there will be any changes to the 04? I'll appreciate any info you can provide.

masspector · May 2003

Didn't know Mitsubishi was making camrys now, but....

Seriously, what you are looking for should not be too big a deal. Both of those options are available as stand alone options. You do not say what area of the country you are in. I am in the SE and we are ruled by SET distributorship. All of the SE dealers have very good inventory listings on line. I am not sure about other regions of the country. In the SE side airbags is a little rare. I have checked some Va area dealers and they seem to be more available in the NE and northern areas.

If you use carsdirect all they do is use a local dealer to try to find a car for you. They will do a search within a certain number of miles from your zip code. I have found carsdirect to be frustrating, especially with toyotas as CD allow you to configure cars that are not available anywhere.

As far as ordering, that is exactly what I am doing. The camry is made in Georgetown, Ky. I placed my order around the fourth week of april and my camry is currently scheduled for a mid june delivery. I ran into the same issue you did. I had certain options I wanted and did not want to pay for others that I did not want. My problem was similar to yours. I wanted leather, but no sunroof. There were plenty of xle's with the premium plus pkg (w/sunroof) but none with the premium pkg (w/o sunroof). I also wanted the side airbags, which are kinda rare in my area.

Hope this helps some.

dillon3499 · May 2003

Masspector - Thanks for the info. If I order thru a dealer what % of MSRP should I expect to pay? Can I be sure I will get the car once it arrives - or will it be sold to the highest bidder? Aren't you afraid that the 04 might have some improvements that you'd be interested in? Maybe together we can get the cars the way we want them - and not the way some distributor decides we want them.
How did you know I have a Mitsubishi?

dudleyr · May 2003

masspector · May 2003

It would help to know what area of the country you are in, as this effects availability and price. I can only speak for the SE. Let me try to answer each question one ata time.

I never price a car based on MSRP. I always start with edmunds or KBB invoice price. I am not sure what your area is like, but I know that in SE and Va, camry's are pretty heavily discounted. In my case I was able to get about $300 below edmunds invoice (this includes the dealer doc fee) and I will get the rebate if there is one once my car arrives. Recently the rebate has been $1000 in my area. I would look up what edmunds invoice price is for the car you want with all the options, start by offering about $500 below that and also minus any rebates in your area. All they can do is say no. I was very lucky in that I had a local dealer that had a third party web service they used to let you build the car and then offer a bid price. The invoice pricing tracked edmunds exactly (this can be a problem as toyota does their invoices funky and adds extra fees to them). The car I configured came to like $22,311 invoice price. I bid $22,000 and they accepted. After a few confirming emails we agreed to that price and I would get the rebate. As soon as I drive home I am going to post my final price in the How much did you pay thread.

You should be pretty sure of getting your ordered car. Remember no dealer has it in stock. How many people could really want a car like that? The way I did mine was I got a signed buyers order from the dealer listing the car I wanted with all of the correct options. I also left a $1000 deposit on a CC. My car is showing in the dealers online inventory with a mid june delivery date. i am going to call this week and verify everything.

Since the Camry had a mid 03 refresh, I doubt there will be too many changes for 04, at least nothing significant. You have to pull the trigger sometime. The xle I looked at was perfect for me. Another consideration is that 03 have a good rebate in my area and the 04 may not have one when it first comes out. Also they may change something and make it where I do not like it. This happened on my current sable. I have a 96 and loved the cupholder design and the premium jbl stereo. In subsequent years they went to a crappier cupholder design and a lesser stereo.

My car will be coming just as ordered. Probably the only camry xle in the SE w/premium pkg and heated seats and side airbags.

Your profile says you are looking for a mitsu.

Good luck

dillon3499 · May 2003

Thanks for sharing your experience. By the way I am located outside Philadelphia (Ambler). I guess your signed buyers order is what Toyota calls a "Preference Order". Toyota said there are no factory orders - so I'm wondering how you have a date to receive it? Is that when the dealer expects to find your car in someone's inventory? Sounds like you have a very nice price (I like the $1000 CC deposit). Where did you go to find the rebate for a particular area? They expect it will be the end of July before info on the 04 is available. Thanks!

rutger3 · May 2003

Okay, what's up with the timing belt change for a 1999 4 cyl. The manual from Toyota says change at 90,000 miles. Isn't the general rule 60,000? Is this like oil changes every 3000 mi versus 7500 mi in the Mfg. manual?

masspector · May 2003

Your welcome, glad to help

The toyota order process is a little funny. My salesman was kinda vague (not too reassuring to me), but he did admit he had only done 3 orders in 6 years. The way he explained it to me was that someone else(the guy that does the ordering) would put in my car as what they wanted in their inventory. Then in a day or two it would either "take" or be kicked out saying no such car was available. On the first attempt it was kicked out. The SE is run by a distributor called SouthEast Toyota (SET), so he was actually placing the order through them. What ended up happening was that my dealership needed a car further back in the order process, so the order guy called SET got a swap in the order process from another dealership for a camry xle that was far enough back so he could place the order for my car. My car is actually being made at the factory.

Because of SET all SE toyota dealer websites are similar and one feature of them is current and future new car inventory. As soon as my car was in the pipe to be delivered it showed up in my dealers future inventory. The expected date is around June 14. Just go to a SE dealer website through the toyota website and then click on new and then search inventory. Select camry, and then the trim level and then you will see what cars they have and have coming. Then if you select a car you will see pricing info and a list of the options on the car. Pretty cool. I called today and confirmed with the salesman. That is my car and it is marked in the system as sold to me so it cannot be sold to anyone else.

As far as rebates, you can check edmunds incentive page but it is not always accurate. Others I would suggest checking are kbb.com and autosite.com. They both list incentives too. In SET if you get to a SET dealer website, the rebates are also listed there, not sure about your area.

Since you are in Pa you may want to wander over to the smart shopper boards and seek out a guy named mackabee. He is a toyota internet salesman in Va. Not sure if that is in the same region, but since they are close, I would think it is. You can find him in inconsiderate buyers thread and others over there. He has been a great help to me and did not mind me emailing with questions.

nippononly · May 2003

nope, that one is for real...actually Toyota's timing belt change interval had been 90K for many models for several years by 1999. Many people leave them even longer than that without problems, and this is a non-interference engine, so if you leave it longer than 90K and it does break, there will be no extra damage, but you will need a tow.

dcmike · May 2003

Are these seats too short or do they just not adjust properly? I'm average height (5'9", more lower body) and I swear, after 15-20 minutes, my knees are killing me (especially the outer part of my right knee). I have the seat pushed all the way back, as well as slightly reclined. I love the ride of the vehicle (2002 XLE V6), but the comfort just isn't there. Any suggestions, or should I get ready to lose my shirt in a sale/trade?

gonkraz · June 2003

dcmike May 30, 2003 4:03pm

I'm with you. For the life of me I can't figure out how with 8-way power seats I can't get comfortable. The test drive didn't let this tidbit be known (too short plus you just figure you have to get "used" to a new feel). Knees and lower back. 2003 XLE. Love the ride, looks and amenities but am more comfortable in the 90 Camry seats. I know what you're feeling. It's a sad thing for us.

drmp · June 2003

I'm 5'8" with long legs and the most comfortable seat for was crown victoria, MB E and C-class, old explorer, sonata (surprise!) and even Elantra. Sonata is remarkable for its price having excellent range of adjustability plus four way adjustability for the head restraint (not found in many cars now).

I am currently driving a '99 Passport and it had inadequate thigh support for me, leading to back pains on long drives. Now, I am extremely comfortable after placing a custom seat cushion that raises and lengthen the front portion of the seat bottom. I can drive all day long and still feel comfortable.

gonkraz · June 2003

drmp Jun 3, 2003 6:48pm
Please give more info on this custom seat cushion. Name, where it can be purchased, whatever you can offer would be appreciated.

bronzemaxell · June 2003

http://www.toyota.co.th/thai/showroom/camry/camry24q.asp#5

i don't know how to read those words, but it does look like the asian version of camry has different feature than the US version

alpha01 · June 2003

Alright, I'd really like to know what changes, however subtle, to expect for the Camry for 04. The 04 Solara is going to have side airbags standard, something I'd like to see on the FAMILY oriented Camry (Curtains will be optional on the Solaras). Does anyone think the rumors about the 3.3L V6 going into the Camry SE are true? At first, I completely disputed the information... but upon thinking about it... the Solara will produced for the first time right alongside the Camrys in Kentunky starting NOW.

Thoughts/opinions?
~alpha

dudleyr · June 2003

I hope ABS is finally standard. It seems pretty hard to get right now unless you get a top end model. Of course many car makers don't feel those buying less fancy cars want safety. I am suprised they haven't gone back to bias ply tires and 4 wheel drum brakes for the base models - after all "nobody wants to pay for safety"

alpha01 · June 2003

What part of the country do you live in? Most of the basic LEs around here- NJ- have the $300 ABS option and sticker just under/over 21,000 depending on the other common options- floormats (CF), etc.

~alpha

dudleyr · June 2003

SD - and I have never seen (or heard of) a manual tranny LE (my prefrence) with ABS. Of course I am in truck country. There is one Toyota dealer in town and they generally have 2-3 Camrys - the next closest dealer is about 180 miles away.

alpha01 · June 2003

Sorry buddy. I cant imagine having a dealership that only has 2 or 3 Camrys on the lot. You may be able to special order one, though. Perhaps it will make you feel better to know that the manual LEs around here almost never have ABS, or at least I have never seen one. My previous post was referring to LE autos.

You may want to try an SE manual- perhaps those are more likely to have the ABS option.

~alpha

steveb84 · June 2003

Yes, 3.3L with 5 speed Auto.

coolguyky7 · June 2003

It doesn't make much sense for Toyota to be using three engines for the Camry at one time.

lok888 · June 2003

Yes. It is a Camry in Thailand. If you go to www.toyota.co.th and click on English version icon at the bottom of the screen. You will see everything in English. In addition to the HID, you will notice the dashboard which similar to those on the Lexus vehicles. BTW, HID is listed as a safety feature. You also see the tail lamps assembly are extended to the trunk lip area. Many nice stuffs are standard or options on Camry like power rear sunshade, back up sensor and built-in air purifier.

Like in most of the Asian market, Toyota offers two engines on Camry: 2.OL and 2.4L (both 4 cylinder engine) and V6 in some Asian countries. Many auto manufacturers offer 4 cylinder engine because of it has better gas mileage (average gas price is over USD$4.00 per gallon in most Asian countries and even higher in Europe). Most importantly, the owners pay less government tax and registration fee for cars with less engine displacement.

nippononly · June 2003

Do you mean to say they will still use the 3.0 in LE/XLE? And the 3.3 will only be for SE?

Makes sense from the point of view of making the SE a true sport model - having more power than the rest of the line - but it would be the first time Toyota has ever done 3 engines for Camry at the same time...I wonder if they will not just use the 3.3 Camry-wide for '04 (for the 6-cyl option).

lok888 · June 2003

I doubt Toyota will put a new engine on 2004 Camry. It properly gets some facelift, some minor interior improvements and add some standard features. For the last two generation of the Camry (1992-1996 and 1997-2001), Toyota is pretty much stick with 5 years cycle on Camry and their vehicles and with no change on the engine and drivetrain.

steveb84 · June 2003

Yes, there will be the current 4 cyl and V6, then the SE V6 gets the 3.3. There is a first time for everything.

alpha01 · June 2003

I appreciate your info. It makes sense to me at least, for Toyota to offer 3 engines- after all, all 3 are produced at TMMK facility anyway. I like the idea of the sporting model offering a hp/torque advantage over the more family oriented the LE and the upscale(ish) XLE.

~alpha

lok888 · June 2003

steveb84 - Thanks for the info. I am sure this is accurate since you work for Toyota. It will be the first time for Toyota. And I think it is a good idea they can share the same engine on different Toyota vehicles like RX300, Sienna, Solora or maybe the next Camry.

coolguyky7 · June 2003

Toyota just recently stopped making the Highlander engine in Georgetown, perhaps clearing room for the 3.3 liter engine.

scottdude · June 2003

One of the things I like about these Town Hall forums is reading about other peoples experiences in owning and test driving cars. This has really helped me narrow down my choices as I decide to buy a new car. Today I had the chance to test drive three cars at one of those credit union rental car sales: a Camry, Altima and Pontiac Vibe, all 2003 models with a/t and 4 cyl engines. I was able to take these cars out on my own (with no salesperson) for very extensive test drives (about 45 minutes each) on city streets (including some old brick ones) and the interstate. I thought Id post my impressions on the cars in their respective topics here in the Town Hall. I guess some might say that test driving a rental car may not be fair because it is not the same as brand new and may have been abused, but I look at it as a way to see what a car might be like after it has several thousand miles under it.

Camry
I test drove the LE version, but it still had a lot of features like power windows, cruise control, etc. I can see why Camrys are so popular. This is a very solidly built car that does all the basics right. It was amazingly quiet inside, had a comfortable ride and accelerated well. Inside it felt big and all the controls were easy to use. I dont have too much else to say about the car, except that although it was fine, there really wasnt anything that exciting about it. I could not see myself getting excited each day about going to work in this car. I guess I need to decide if that is something I can live with.

masspector · June 2003

I recenty toured TMMK. If anyone has any specific questions, let me know and I will try to answer them. It was a pretty cool tour and was well worth the effort to go. They are currently making the camry and avalon. They recently dropped the 03 sienna and are tooling up for the 04 solara.

coolguyky7 · June 2003

The Camry beat the crap out of the Accord in May in sales, considering the Accord's redesign although countered by Toyota's big sales push with incentives. Camry had 43,732 units sold versus Accord's 37,210. Year-to-date through May, Camry has 170,531 against Accord with 163,059. Camry's lead isn't that great, but May put Camry ahead of Accord...I think Accord was ahead in April. The Corolla nipped at the heels of Accord by 1,280 units in May.

alpha01 · June 2003

One of the reasons that my dad loves taking our 02 Camry to work is because it significantly reduces the stress of a long commute through New Jersey. The Camry is not a drivers car, even in SE form (though its handling is quite good with the stiffer suspension). It is, however, an excellent family car, and a car for those who dont want to attack a winding road, but instead prefer value, comfort, reliability, and tranquility.

~alpha

gonkraz · June 2003

drmp Jun 3, 2003 6:48pm

If anyone has any ideas as to what a custom seat cushion (referenced in above link) would be or how to obtain one please post information. My 03 XLE seat bottom stops a good four to five inches back from the bend in my knee and is causing me all kinds of ergonomic problems. For my husband the seat is just fine. But as luck would have it I am the primary driver. If anyone has any experience/advice that I could draw on I would REALLY appreciate it. I am willing to try anything. Car is great but selling it for any reason this soon would be bad financially this soon out. Thanks, Gonkraz

nippononly · June 2003

Camry for best-selling sedan this year. It has been selling strongly.

Toyota Camry 2006 and earlier

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