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Synthetic motor oil

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Comments

  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    Yeah when Gore flew in Air Force One (747) it was getting better gas mileage than a Buick 3800? Or he drives around in cars that are all Prius' at 38 mpg? NOT.

    Interestingly enough, you are correct - Mr. Gore does not own a Prius - he drives a Black Lexus 430 around - with synthetic oil I'm sure, preaching his Global Warming religion. No hypocracy there :surprise:

    However, I do find it curious that my Lexus dealer doesn't seem to use Synthetic oil when he changes my oil - the invoice specifies Shell 5W-30..... I find that odd...
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Not to rain on a higher end oems parade... but Shell probably gave the (your) dealership a better 55 gal barrel price (aka bulk) than probably anyone else. Each dealer has the option to use whatever vendors. This is not to say that Shell is NOT a good product. Shell is the brand of choice for Ferrarri type applications. I also know that Rotella T and also Rotella T synthetic test very very well for 10,000 mile OCI's; even if it is a cheaper priced oil and is sold 24/7 at WALLY MART :)

    The other is Toyota/Lexus has not even gone to longer OCI's, let alone engineer and/or specify synthetic as has its competitors, i.e., BMW, MB, etc, etc, so in that sense, no real surprises.

    As a heads up, Toyota/Lexus V8's seems to really run well on Mobil One. I have been using Mobil One 5w30 for a long time and mileage, but that is/has been in I6 applications.
  • richardsonrichardson Member Posts: 92
    If Americans were really serious about lessening oil use, they would stop unnecessarily idling engines. I see it all the time especially workmen driving a vehicle paid for by somebody else.
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    "As a heads up, Toyota/Lexus V8's seems to really run well on Mobil One."

    What doesn't run well on a good synthetic? Nobody can ever tell whats in the sump.
  • avalon02whavalon02wh Member Posts: 785
    We had two 3.0L Toyota engines that also did well with Mobil One. Cold starting at -34 F is amazing.

    I wonder if the reason Toyota has not gone to longer OCIs is the SLUDGE issue.

    "Sludge free for 47,000 miles" :)
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Yeah, how could you tell the difference by how an engine is running as to what's in the crankcase? Seems near impossible to me.

    If you mean by "running" that the Lexus V8 "tolerates" synthetic very well, .....well....er....I'M SURE! Most engines would (except maybe a rotary).
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    Cold starting at -34F? I hope you're using the Mobil1 0w-20 for that. Its the best at minimizing oil thickness cold. If someone out there knows of a lower viscosity oil (with a warm 20 weight) at -34F, please tell me; I'll switch to it. Must be a 20 at 100 degC to qualify.
  • blufz1blufz1 Member Posts: 2,045
    Gas mileage increased slightly when I switched to synthetic.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    It might increase if you live in a cold climate because you'll definitly get faster warm ups on synthetic. In a temperate climate though, where I live, I've plotted three cars on synthetic, then off again, and none of them registered better fuel mileage....there were spikes here and there, but those all averaged out over the course of the oil change, and when I went back to regular oil, the fuel mileage didn't drop.
  • avalon02whavalon02wh Member Posts: 785
    I am using the 5w-30 weight. The car has a block heater that gets plugged in if the temps are likely to drop below zero. It comes on a few hours before I go to work.

    The pour point on Mobil one 5w30 is -54 C according to Mobil.
    http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENPVLMOMobil1_5W-30.asp

    Amsoil thinks they are better at -54 C compared to Mobil 1 at - 48 C, but that number is higher than what is listed on the Mobil site.
    http://www.synthetic-oil-online.com/amsoil_vs_mobil1_supersyn_synthetic_motor_oi- l.htm

    The Mobil 1 0w20 has a pour point of -57 C
    http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSENPVLMOMobil1_0W-20.asp

    All three oils have about the same pour point. I would go with whatever the manufacturer says to put in the motor. Keep in mind that the flash point of gasoline is about -40 to -43 degrees C. It is unlikely your car will start at those temps without help (heat) and a really good battery. :)
  • blufz1blufz1 Member Posts: 2,045
    Just my experience. Mpg increase .5 to 1 mpg. I believe some other posters saw increases just as some did not.
  • avalon02whavalon02wh Member Posts: 785
    I would agree. Most of my cars over the last 20 some years have used Mobil 1. I switch after the first oil change. If there is an improvement in MPG, it is small, maybe less than 2-3%. If it was higher OEM manufacturers would likely use synthetic oil to gain an advantage in the CAFE tests.

    Another big plus for synthetics is the reduced wear on starters and batteries in those sub zero temps. The engine is very easy to turn over in the cold. Battery life is also great. I was able to go 5.5 years on my last battery. It was still doing well, but I knew the sub 20 something degree days were coming, so in went a new battery. I just hate getting stranded when it is that cold. No fun at all :)
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I would think that even if it were 3% manufacturers would jump on it. Increasing your CAFE fleet standards by 3% by adding oil? They'd be delirious with joy. Prius could tack another 1.5 MPG on their EPA sticker for a $5 investment per car!!

    Probably what happens is a slight benefit in cold weather, certainly. Less warm-up time, less time on "enrichment"....and, as you say, less cranking---all good things. I could believe 3% gas mileage increase for a car that sits outside below freezing for 4 months a year or more. (But only for those 4 months).

    Have you read the famous CU report on oil? (see link) It seems to both endorse and undercut synthetics....endorses the longer interval oil changes but undercuts the claim that it prolongs engine life. Unfortunately, they didn't address fuel mileage---too bad!

    http://articles.mbz.org/oil/cu/
  • altair4altair4 Member Posts: 1,469
    Like our moderator, I haven't seen any proof of higher mileage with the use of synthetic oil, or lower mileage with dino juice.
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    Synthetic oil has no MPG fuel economy benefits over conventional dino, except when you use a lower-viscosity oil like 0w-20 or 5w-20. The "20" in there is good for about a 1 MPG advantage over a "30" weight. Its not the synthetic components doing that, its merely the viscosity (running thickness) of the oil that allows an MPG gain. The lower viscosity actually produces less heat between internal parts, as the 30 (or greater) weights lose MPG and the extra gasoline energy is driving the heat higher.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    That is a very seductive argument but I'm not biting on it just yet. ;)
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    "All three oils have about the same pour point. "

    Actually, the 0w-20 will be much thinner at zero degrees F than anything. I tried this myself, and also obtained some data on it from www.bobistheoilguy.com. The 0w-20 was much thinner at zero deg F than: Mobil1 0w-40, German Castrol Syntec 0w-30; and was only slightly thinner than Mobil1 5w-20.

    The pour point figure doesn't really tell us how well the oil will flow near zero deg F, surprisingly. The 0w-40 and 0w-30 were thick, while the 0w-20 looked like it would flow quickly, very runny. That should reduce how long the engine runs at startup with no oil.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Theoretically that MIGHT be true, but the real world (conditions) are probably not so kind. Very simply, good quality synthetic oil stays in viscosity longer. So in effect to quote you- your concept is really at work, ..."The lower viscosity (my sic-specified viscosity) actually produces less heat between internal parts, as the 30 (or greater) weights lose MPG and the extra gasoline energy is driving the heat higher."...

    So for example using the 5w20 conventional oil I changed it at 10,000 and a series of 3 tank full averages (right after fresh oil) and 3 tankfull averages (right before a 10,000 mile OCI) indicates virtually no mpg AVG change(variance, of course. Synthetic Ow20 Mobil One (same protocol) average of 2 mpg better (range of 1-3 mpg) and at 10,000 miles AND at 30,000 mile mark (20,000 miles on an OCI) virtually similar. Would anyone care to run conventional oil 5w20 to 20,000 miles to document the differences?

    It also needs to be said the 5w20 Ford/Honda specification (conventional) oil has been putting down some very nice numbers indicating how robust both the oil is and how well it works together with Honda engines.

    On the engines that run 5w30, I have run each of them on Mobil One right after oem (conventional) fill and have for a lot of years (20) and a lot of miles (800,000) or so. I have one that oem fill IS Mobil One 5w30. While it does NOT say you MUST use synthetic oil it does say whatever oil MUST meet the GM 4178 M standard. Since I have not much to prove to myself, I have not conducted A/B tests other than to swap out the conventional oem fill, when the manual calls for it. Then as indicated, I use Mobil One (in the specified viscosity) So since I run 15,000 mile OCI's. I'd be very interested to hear from forks who run their conventional oil at 15,000 mile OCI's. That to me would be a truer test. :)

    I do have another I run for 25,000 mile OCI's Mobil One Truck and SUV 5w40, aka Delvac One 5w40. Probably the same test would be interesting?! This one happens to be a TDI aka diesel, which is theoretically harder on oil. As an aside I am a bit jazzed in considering 30,000 mile OCI as the fuel is now ULSD.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,151
    > The lower viscosity actually produces less heat between internal parts,

    I don't think so.

    >as the 30 (or greater) weights lose MPG

    I disagree that's measurable, if true, for most drivers in the US.

    >and the extra gasoline energy is driving the heat higher.

    I don't think so.

    What is the temperature of the cylinder wall in a normally operating engine? 900 degrees F.? At that temperature the viscosity difference wouldn't be noticeable without proper equipment for measuring it. In the region of the main bearings what's the temperature? 400 degrees Fahrenheit? Same comment.

    You might find a difference while the sump is cold in a cold climate like Greenlane and the oil pump is sucking harder to access oil from the sump and finds more work energy is needed to draw up the oil and push it to the oil relief valve at 60 psi.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    "Synthetic oil has no MPG fuel economy benefits over conventional dino, except when you use a lower-viscosity oil like 0w-20 or 5w-20. The "20" in there is good for about a 1 MPG advantage over a "30" weight. Its not the synthetic components doing that, its merely the viscosity (running thickness) of the oil that allows an MPG gain. The lower viscosity actually produces less heat between internal parts, as the 30 (or greater) weights lose MPG and the extra gasoline energy is driving the heat higher."

    I have seen this on TV, have seen it demonstrated in person and also have seen this on my own equipment and that is synthetic oil runs at a lower temperature overall than same viscosity conventional oil.

    I am also aware that very few cars have engine oil temperature gauges anymore. Th one engine oil temp gauge I do have has never run conventional oil so the variances I have seen in the operation ban range is solely on synthetic. However it is pretty easy to either buy or borrow one of those laser type point and shoot pistol looking remote temp gauges.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I'm also very skeptical that this is true, on a fully warmed up engine under normal conditions.

    But, if you showed me a good oil temp gauge registering one temperature on conventional oil, then drained it, and ran the same engine the same speed for the same amount of time on synthetic, and the same gauge read lower...and if you did this for me on say 3 to 5 separate cars....I'd believe it then.

    As for what's on TV, well....hey....
  • blufz1blufz1 Member Posts: 2,045
    Going to try Mobil 1 EP now that it is available in 5-20. It's got 50% more supersyn so maybe I can pick up another .5 mpg. Just waiting 4 it 2 show up at wm in the 5q jug. Should be about $28.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Well for sure. I have long since ceased to really even want to overcome folks skeptism and inertia, when it comes to the benefits of synthetic oil. I just really find it amazing how folks will in effect point to synthetic oil users and think/claim: snake oil salesperson. Yet when one asks most folks to go the longer OCI route on their conventional oil they suddenly get cold feet, or root canal now seems like a FUN event to schedule. :)

    In the greater macro environment (call it what one will). It is Very hard to use less oil (oxymoronic actually) when you continue to use the same amount or MORE (compared to a 15,000 mile OCI. i.e., lessen dependence on foreign oil.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Well you could show them the CU report or similar to let them know that they don't have to dump their oil every 3,000 miles.....but....there is nothing much available to show the common layperson that using synthetic is going to make their engine last any longer than it would on a 6K OCI with regular oil.

    So we'd do more good just getting people to a longer OCI with regular oil than we would trying to twist their arm to use synthetic.

    I really don't think most people think synthetic boosters are "snake oil salesman". Sure, if you solely read AMSOIL websites you might resent that they read like ads.

    But I think synthetic oil is well respected and has plenty of street cred. It sure does among my friends who race, and that impresses me a lot.

    So....the problem might be that people who espouse it could possibly be 75% evangelical and only 25% scientific and this makes people skeptical.

    So it's not the product, it's the pitch.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Give me a break!!! :)

    Peoples' eyes glaze over in 1.25 seconds when you mention science!!! :) Most like the apocalytic approach!! Can I get an AMEN here? Free coupons for the rapture, if you use A...oil! :)

    For sure it has never been my intention to put a quicky lube out of business!, Nor even lambast any MLM product sales folks!? :) In truth, synthetic use is in a minority position. There are some populations who use 3k OCI knowing it is SYNTHETIC! i.e., Corvette enthusiasts. (I feel you starting to get very very sleepy...)

    I have also read in passing that the COST of synthetic and convention is roughly about the same. Pricing is however a WAY different story. This is probably the major stumbling block. As is well known oil companies make the majority of their monies in VOLUME, pure and simple. So anything they do to decrease that is disengenuos. On the other side of the ledger probably one of the reasons for the greater price is an attempt to make up for the volume lost selling less conventional oil. Indeed less than a dollar for 5w20 conventional oil for ExxonMobil Superflo with an OEM recommendation of 10,000 miles OCI's is probably in anyones book, a good deal. But most folks are even loathed to go 10,000 miles! The other side of the issue is there are any number of oems that ARE going to specific specification, so called synthetic oils!!! Also to get a quart oil conventional oil has its component ratio of barrels of oil that HAVE to processes. So indeed a quart of synthetic does not = a quart of conventional if you know what that means in the ratio of products to a barrel of oil.

    In regards to LASTING longer, even FEWER folks are curious enough to actually measure the differences, either by an extrapolation of the wear factors shown in analysized oil or actual micrometer measurement for confirmation. I happened to get it done at the 75k mile cycles because a valve adjustment (couple hundred dollars) is due at those intervals.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,151
    but I believe it still has meaning to be gleaned from the results. I can recall when they published that... The taxis are always running. Despite idling being hot in summer the car is still not producing contaminants like a car started cold and drive 3 miles and cooled and restarted, e.g.

    I'm on the edge about trying synthetic or at least a synthetic blend. Cold starts would be one reason here in Ohio. It's rare for my cars to be at the outside temperature long enough to have a true cold start. My 150K mile car has started using a little oil maybe 1/3 qt. in 1000 miles. It's hard to tell because of accumulating condensates and then purging them when driven longer trips.

    I am tempted to put in a blend to see if it cleans up any left over sediments and precipitates.

    My newer car may get Mobile 1 for a spring/summer/fall run on miles. Is there any reason not to use a PureOne filter?

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    ..."Well you could show them the CU report or similar to let them know that they don't have to dump their oil every 3,000 miles....."...

    Since that comparo there has been some very interesting changes. Rather than explain what they are, the bar has been raised considerably for certain oils; i.e.,

    for oems, Ford/Honda

    ILSAC GF-4 energy conserving viscosity that flows quickly during cold starts.

    API SM/CF

    Chrysler MS-6395

    Ford WSS-M2C930-A
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I'd LOVE for them to do the same test again. That would be great!
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    "So....the problem might be that people who espouse it could possibly be 75% evangelical and only 25% scientific and this makes people skeptical.

    So it's not the product, it's the pitch. "

    For my .02 cents, a resounding NOT!!! For those with insomnia:

    Here is some science. There will be a test Monday. :)

    "Composition and Oxidational Stability of SAE 5w40 Engine Oils" by....

    http://www.oetg.at/website/wtc2001cd/html/M-21-P58-614-CERNY.pdf

    As an aside, it is easy to see the study also refutes Coldcranker's assertions. :)

    And we were waxing what about science? :)
  • pulgopulgo Member Posts: 400
    I do not think that that particular test is of any value to the general user. Unless you work as a Courier the test provides no real world information for the typical commuter.
  • blufz1blufz1 Member Posts: 2,045
    Agree w ruking. Coldcranker is refuted. He was discovered mixing his oils on the "Slippery subject" thread and should be dunked. :)
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    As I said before: "Synthetic oil has no MPG fuel economy benefits over conventional dino.." Its true, based on reading the results of tribological engineering studies over the past several years. In reality, most of the friction from oil in hydrodynamic lubrication is due to simple viscosity, or, you could say its really due to dynamic HTHS viscosity. Period. Also remember that both synthetic and conventional oils use friction modifiers which help a little, but thats not a function of synthetic vs. conventional, only what additive packages an oil maker puts in there.

    And the comments I made about a "30" oil generating more internal engine heat than a "20" oil is absolutely true, and can be explained easily by merely noting the conservation of energy, since the higher friction of a higher viscosity engine oil uses energy, reducing MPG overall, and the wasted energy is converted into heat. Is it significant heat? I think it is significant, since many studies have shown a loss of MPG of about 1 MPG going from a 20 to a 30 weight oil, and that represents a significant number of joules (or BTUs, calories) released inside journal bearings, camshaft bearings, etc., which must be conducted or convected away. Therefore, you run cooler oil with a 0w-20 vs. a 0w-30 weight oil.

    Synthetic is really only valuable because you can leave it in for more time or miles before a change and it will flow much better at cold temps, reducing engine wear. Also add to those reasons that it probably won't coat the inside of your engine with varnish like conventional oil will.
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    "refutes Coldcranker's assertions..."
    The article says that PAO-based oils are generally more oxidatively stable than conventional (implying longer oil change intervals are possible). How does that contradict anything I've stated? Remember, my comments are based on engineering analysis results, not anecdotal, emotional, "wish-it-were-so" skewed logic like many who approach this subject without an engineering background.
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    Interesting, the paper says not some semi-synthetics are better than some synthetics:

    ...fully synthetic engine oils mostly showed better oxidation stability than semisynthetic oils. It can be thus understood that synthetic oils have a higher potential for prolongation of the oil drain interval. This proposition, however, cannot be generalised. There were some semisynthetic oils in the analysed set of oils that were oxidatively very stable and at least comparable to fully synthetic oils. ... On the other hand, oxidation stability of some synthetic oils...was lower than that of semisynthetic oils.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    I have already said it and you have already answered your own question/s! :)
  • waiwai Member Posts: 325
    Is it true that an older car should use a higher weight oil than a newer car due to their engine parts are worn more, and thicker oil will lubricate and protect through the parts better.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    My take of his post: no. Especially if lower viscosity gives better fuel mileage.
  • blufz1blufz1 Member Posts: 2,045
    Sorry, my 02 v6exl can't read so it inadvertently gained .5 to 1.0 mpg when I started using synthetic oil. I correctly check my mileage w/ every tank so I know.
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    blufz1, You don't know that. The 0.5 to 1.0 mpg is in your head. Its within the normal variability of MPG per driving style. It takes controlled conditions to determine that. Get real.
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    ruking1, I'll ask again: What do you disagree with? And what do you back up your opinion with? You're not clear.

    I can answer one of yours: "I'd be very interested to hear from forks who run their conventional oil at 15,000 mile OCI's. That to me would be a truer test."
    Answer: I don't know about "forks" or spoons, but there are some folks at www.mobiloil.com that ran 15,000 mile OCIs in a taxi fleet (see the Las Vegas test) with conventional oil and they noticed a lot of muck collecting inside the engine compared to using Mobil1 EP.
  • coldcrankercoldcranker Member Posts: 877
    imidazol97, "Is there any reason not to use a PureOne filter? "
    One reason: I saw some test data a while back that noted the PureOne filters very well, but restricts flow (higher pressure drop than other filters). Its probably OK to use a PureOne in the summer when the oil is thinner at startup, but the high flow restriction of a PureOne means less cold, thick oil gets into the engine at startup compared to other filters. I'd use the Amsoil EAO or Mobil1 EP oil filters, as they use smaller fibers to trap dirt with less flow restriction.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Obviously a typo! The results you cite are what I would have predicted. I am sure you know what that would mean in a comparo.
  • blufz1blufz1 Member Posts: 2,045
    No...... it's in my calcs and it repeats. Ask ruking if you don't believe me. Btw are you still mixing your oils?
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Yes. Upshot 1-3 mpg range with an average of 2 mpg gain due to Mobil One. In my case the plan was very simple. NO thought to either prove or disprove.

    1. Run the 10,000 mile OCI (per Honda recommendation) ON oem fill CONVENTIONAL oil.

    2. change the oem fill @10,000 miles, fill with Mobil One

    3. change the oil FILTER AT 20,000 miles, (again oem recommendation) again Mobil One and change the oil AND filter at 20,000 miles.

    Again a 1-3 mpg range gain with the average of 2 mpg. 3 avg tank fulls were calculated when oils were FRESH and the last three tankfulls right before the oil was changed out. Same for the 2nd 10,000 miles (synthetic) NO average differences due to fresh or so called "old" oil. The same was done for the 3rd, 10,000 miles. The only "glitch" is the 20,000 mile OCI started at the 20,000 mile mark. Oil and filter were changed out at 40,000 miles and so far the mileage is the same as before I changed the oil and (and if it is of interest) the oil FILTER.

    So in effect, this is an historical look back, as I did not set out to do an "experiment". Oil consumption whether with or without conventional/synthetic has been app 1/4-1/2 qt per 10,000 miles.
  • blufz1blufz1 Member Posts: 2,045
    I was also not trying to prove anything. I just wanted a better quality oil for my car. I noticed my slight gain in mpg only because I check the mpg each time I fill up. I figure the increase in mpg pays for the increase in oil price and my car is the beneficiary.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Yes, mine is an after thought given historical data which I can't change at all. The fore thought was that I switched to synthetic AFTER the recommended oem fill.

    Again as you will probably attest, numbers are pretty powerful per 10,000 miles and in my case 20,000 miles.

    I DIY app once a year. This is of course enough time to forget how to do the oil change. :(:) So 3.4 qt of Mobil One oil (@ 4 per qt ) = 14.28 + 2.07 (for a WallyMart oil filter) and .20 cents for the crush washer and the cost is 16.55 for 20,000 miles or .0008275 per mile lubricated.

    So say I get 39 vs 37 mpg (-2 mpg) . Over 20,000 miles that is 513/541 gals respectively or 28 gals saved. Today's unleaded regular price was 2.68 per gal = $75.04 SAVED

    So if I DIY @5000 miles or 4 times that is 3.4 qt @1 per =3.40 + 2.07 + .20 =5.67 per oil change x 4= 22.68, or over 20,000 miles =.001134 per mile lubricated.

    Funny, the conventional oil change cost 27% more not counting the fuel saved (75.04) and I have to get under the car 4 x instead of 1.

    I seem to be in the minority of folks who do 10,000 miles OCI's on conventional oil on a Civic, but here are the numbers anyway 11.34/20,000= .000567 per mile lubricated (= 3.40+2.07+ .2 x2=) add in the fuel saved 75.04 and running conventional oil is 86.38 per 20,000 miles or .004319 per mile lubricated.

    I do have to confess that changing oil ceased really being "FUN" for me app 1.5 M miles ago. :)
  • avalon02whavalon02wh Member Posts: 785
    I might have read it. It is hard to remember back 11 years. :) Oil tech has probably advanced a bit since then.

    I agree that they would use it if the could capitalize on the MPG increase. All this is a bit odd because racers use it to gain a few hp or at least that is what I hear. I wonder if there is something in the CAFE test. EPA would not make them all run the same oil would they? Kind of like NASCAR, everybody must be exactly the same ;)
  • blufz1blufz1 Member Posts: 2,045
    Check w/your dealer. Mine will change my oil for $10 labor. I provide the filter and oil,of course.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Oh yes, labor (18) plus disposal fees (2) put it in at app 20. I think I can live with my once per year brain fart. :)

    Part of the deal for the water sewer garbage bill is waste oil disposal.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,151
    The PureOnes seem to filter out smaller particles better and I hope they have a larger surface area to increase total flow if the flow/sq in at a given pressure is reduced with the better filtration.

    But I disagree that less oil gets to the motor. When the filter has a high back pressure due to cold oil, the relief valve opens and allows oil to bypass the media -- if the engine's own bypass valve hasn't already opened _more_ to allow more oil to go through to the motor bypassing the filter.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

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