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Chrysler Allies With Fiat

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Comments

  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Manson, WAPosts: 7,057
    the only Fiatsler I am interested in is the Fiat 500 Abarth. With a manual tranny! If ever there was a car that needed a manual tranny it would have to be this little squirtplug! ;)

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,131
    I could get interested in one of these with the 1.4L diesel. Should get an easy 60 MPG combined and 70 MPG out cruising the back roads.

    image

    iluv you really need to talk to these people in Tuscon about a free NEV for your trips to work and around Wilcox. Leave the Mitsu in the garage for longer trips. Get in on the government handouts.

    http://www.freeelectriccar.com/default.asp
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    I dunno gagrice, cars this small aren't exactly your style. But what about a new Wrangler and Grand Cherokee, both with a 4-cylinder diesel instead of the monster 6-cylinder diesels the German automakers insist in putting in their North American models?

    Imagine getting 40 mpg on the highway in a Wrangler! That sure would change the beast. And with auto stop-start for city driving, the thing would do pretty well around town too.

    As for me, I will take a diesel-powered 500 for my commute car, and an Abarth for fun weekend driving! ;-)

    iluv: Yeah, they will ruin the Abarth for me if they offer it only with their new automated manual, but that's definitely a possibility.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,131
    A small car like a Fiat 500c would replace the 20 year old Lexus for our around town car. Though I cannot justify buying new as long as the LS400 keeps running well. The radio antenna quit working so it may not be long for this world. I have always liked the Wrangler. With a 4 cylinder diesel it would be a great ride for our winter trips to the desert. Really better than the Sequoia. I looked at the Grand Cherokee with the V6 diesel and it is crowded in the second row. The new Wrangler 4 door has more leg room than the GC. And a lot more leg room than the FJ Cruiser.

    Chrysler has a long uphill battle to be viable for me to consider. Though Jeep is the bright star in the company.
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Manson, WAPosts: 7,057
    first gagrice. I looked at that link and man, the tax refund could not exceed your Fed. tax liability. If not for that, I would maybe interested in one. So I'd be paying considerably out-of-pocket for that baby.

    There's several older dudes around Willcox that drive these little golf cart electrical vehicles around town. I don't think they need to be licensed, but I have only just looked at the guy's cart who takes his to visit his wife at the nursing home that's attached to the hospital I work at.

    I will look in to it further. It might be a potential answer to going "green" earlier than waiting for my silver blue 2011 BYD e6. The e6 that is going to get 250 miles on one charge. I'll believe that when I see it, though.

    nippon...yep, they only make the 500 in 2-door hatch style, right? No 4-door versions of the 500? Is there really room for 4-doors? I would want a 4-door version but I don't think such a monster exists. But you're right, the CVT found in my 2008 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS will work for me in that car, but not in a 500 Abarth or any Fiat 500 model.

    I must have a stick shift for me to buy one. I really like it's tiny curvy body style with those awesome bug-eyed headlights. Reminds me of a bugeye Sprite with it's headlights. Love 'em! No, I would have to say that this would be the first Chrysler I'd ever be interested in. Except, of course, the 1973 Plymouth Duster we bought from my Dad in '85! :) Pretty decent American car, that Duster. Slant 6 automatic and reliable from day one for Mom and Dad and us. The only problem with it when we sold it for $200 in 1992 was it's suspension parts were badly worn and the car would "float" while driving it on I-5! Not a good thing. But I digress.

    I would hope that Fiatsler would price this pup reasonably. If they do they'll literally sell thousands upon tens of thousands of these in the States.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,131
    I am wondering if the tax credit can be taken in more than one year if it exceeds your tax liability.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,040
    The company also will launch its new Pentastar V6 engine on the 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee in the second quarter next year, said Paolo Ferrero, Chrysler's powertrain chief.

    The Pentastar will replace all Chrysler's V6 engines, from 2.7 liters to 4.0 liters in displacement.


    I think this is good news, as Chrysler has had too many V-6 engines, IMO, for quite some time now. Right now, they have the 2.7 DOHC, 3.5/4.0 SOHC, 3.3/3.8 pushrod, and 3.7 SOHC.

    That's just too many. And the 2.7 DOHC is an extremely expensive engine to build. Its market could probably be served just as well by a reduced-displacement version of the 3.5/4.0. In fact, Chrysler used to have just that, a 3.2 version offered from 1998-01. Every vehicle that offers the 2.7 currently also offers the 3.5, so making it fit shouldn't be a problem.

    The 3.3/3.8 are minivan engines, although the 3.8 also finds its way into the Jeep Wrangler. They're durable, inexpensive, cheap engines, but they're also a bit on the crude side. And the 3.7 is probably only around because it's a V-8 with two cylinders chopped off, so it works well in truck applications, as most everything else just bolts right up, like it would on the V-8.
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Manson, WAPosts: 7,057
    yeah, they have a question and answer section on that website and that may be a possibility. Willcox is the perfect size town to "motor" around in golf cart like that. To get one for free would be quite the score, though.

    Really, no one drives fast in this podunk cowboy town. Those electric carts would be like the cat's meow here. It's like we're all on atmosphericly-inspired quaaludes of some sort. When I turn on my Foghat and Guess Who in my Lancer, with it's 650-watt Rockford Fosgate stereo, it helps bring some of the Seattle angst to flavor the little sleepy town. Some of the kids in town are making up their own rock bands, but I wonder sometimes if any other adults like to rock at all around here. Unfortunately the cowboy culture flavors everyone to go towards country music here. Oh well.

    I "plug in" and blast out the 70's rock on a regular basis, though. I'd have to wire in some kind of nice stereo system in my golf cart or it just wouldn't be the same. :shades:

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,726
    No, I would have to say that this would be the first Chrysler I'd ever be interested in.

    Well remember, the 500 may be sold from Chrysler dealers, but it will have a Fiat badge, not a Chrysler badge. So you won't really be buying a Chrysler. :-)

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Manson, WAPosts: 7,057
    I read that the Fiat 500 will have a Chrysler badge in the U.S. when going up for sale here.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,131
    That's a good thing. I still am stinging from all the repair bills on the Fiat Spyder I bought my son while he was in HS. A cool looking little car that was horribly engineered. I wonder how Chrysler is making out with the GEM car they build. The big fat tax credit has to be moving their little NEVs by the 1000s.

    http://www.gemcar.com/
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Manson, WAPosts: 7,057
    that I had not yet heard of. Their brochure is well-thought out and presents the little cars in a good light. The e2 would be the one I would pick to drive around Willcox in. A little 2-seater with a top speed of 35mph and a range of "up to 30 miles."

    Perfect. It would fit our pocked-up streets just fine. Actually, the City of Willcox is finally paving over the potholes of one of the north-south streets right by our home. They've done the curb-outs on the intersections and then dispappeared to some other project for now, the whole street needs to be re-paved when they get back. I can't wait-it's like running over little logs strewn about the street in order to navigate some of the streets in this town.

    One of these electric carts would bump right over them easier, though.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,131
    The GEM car NEVs may be the oldest. It looks like Daimler bought them in 2000.

    Over eleven years ago, Global Electric Motorcars introduced its first electric vehicle, and today, still strives to design the most innovative line of vehicles that are versatile, efficient and affordable. With more than 40,000 vehicles on the road, we pride ourselves in manufacturing the world's best electric vehicle.

    http://www.gemcar.com/models/details.asp?MID=3&ID=309

    I like the eS with a box on back for shopping. There are also companies that offer power upgrades to kick them up to about 40 MPH. I don't think I would want one any faster than that. Here is a company that has the upgrades for the GEM Cars. Steve posted it somewhere before.

    http://www.gonev.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1

    These GEM cars are sold by Chrysler dealers here in San Diego. This is where you will find them in AZ.

    http://www.hornergroup.com/

    Better hurry the tax credit may end Dec 31st 2009.
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Manson, WAPosts: 7,057
    yeah, I'm thinkin' on it. I have to decide if it'll cost me more money or save me any money to get one of these little pups or just drive the Lancer GTS around Willcox. It seems to be almost like an extra toy at this point.

    Why not drive the Lancer GTS until BYD's e6 comes out in 2011 sometime, then I can take it further on down the road, to Tucson, and still have more than enough charge to get back home to Willcox.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • berriberri Posts: 7,858
    You can have the NEV, I'll take the Italian baby dolls in the pix!
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,131
    I am looking at what the used GEM Cars are selling for. They really seem to hold their value well. I would bet you could buy one with the big tax credit and drive it 2 years. When the real EVs become available sell the NEV for just about what you have invested. Here is an 8 year old one for $7500. That is crazy. Probably wants to buy new with the Tax Credit.

    http://sandiego.craigslist.org/nsd/cto/1450048141.html
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Manson, WAPosts: 7,057
    yeah I noticed 'em, too! Whewee!

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • steverstever Posts: 52,683
    A different look from a car company. Bunch of big names riding around in the Chrysler 300 in the commercial.

    Chrysler Gets Political (AutoObserver)

    image
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    I think it would have been more appropriate if Chrysler had revived a Dodge Diplomat for that commercial. Or maybe a Chrysler Concorde? ;)

    A 300, makes me think that's the type of car they'll use in the remake of The Big Lubowski. :D
  • stephen987stephen987 Posts: 1,994
    Good one, kernick. Perhaps a Honda Accord (or Civic)? A GMC Envoy?
  • steverstever Posts: 52,683
    "The Chapter 11 bankruptcy reorganization plan filed Tuesday by the company comprised of the remnants of the former Chrysler, Old Carco LLC, effectively leaves the U.S. taxpayer on the hook for about $4 billion loaned to the company through the U.S. Department of Treasury's infamous Troubled Assets Relief Program, Reuters reported."

    It's (Mostly) Official: $4 Billion of Chrysler TARP Loans a Writeoff (AutoObserver)

    Good background story at the Detroit News today:

    Rattner on GM, Chrysler turnaround plans: 'They were delusional'
  • stephen987stephen987 Posts: 1,994
    There was very little equity in place, so no way out. The "loans" were destined to be a writeoff from day one. Fiat basically got the salvage rights, and the taxpayers got to spend a few billion to keep a few thousand workers working for a few more months.

    GM, on the other hand, appears to be paying back the TARP money. Whether they'll eventually be able to launch the IPO necessary to redeem the equity stake that the taxpayers hold is another matter.
  • delthekingdeltheking Posts: 1,152
    Waste of tax money.I guess everyone knew that. I think even the customers are at fault here by still buying Chrysler cars. If they stop buying,automatically they will have to shut down. :sick:
    Now they will promise a recovery which of course will never ever happen. ;)
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    Well the U.S. taxpayer could get a little of its $ back, if we retook control and sold off the few good parts of Chrysler like Jeep, the Ram truck, and the Viper factory. I'm not sure if the Charger ( alot of police sales) and Challenger sell enough to be profitable. maybe they could get close to $1B total for the factories, parts, and brands? Shut down the rest, and liquidate whatever's left.

    Tell Fiat if they want to sell cars here they can give some of the ex-Chrysler dealers a new sign and to wait for the Fiats to be shipped here.
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    This is still up on Cerberus's website.

    http://www.cerberuscapital.com/news_press_release_07132007.html

    Most amusing are the statements from:

    Dr. Dieter Zetsche, Chairman of the Board of Management of DaimlerChrysler AG and Head of the Mercedes Car Group: "We're confident that we've found the solution that will create the greatest overall value - both for Daimler and Chrysler. With this transaction, we have created the right conditions for a new start for Chrysler and Daimler."

    Ron Gettelfinger, President of the United Autoworkers (UAW): "The transaction with Cerberus is in the best interests of our UAW members, the Chrysler Group and Daimler. We are pleased that this decision has been made, because our members and the management can now focus entirely on the development and manufacture of quality products for the future of the Chrysler Group."

    John W. Snow, Chairman of Cerberus Capital Management, L.P.: "We welcome Chrysler into the Cerberus family of companies and believe Cerberus will be a good home for Chrysler. Cerberus believes in the inherent strength of U.S. manufacturing and of the U.S. auto industry. Most importantly, we believe in Chrysler."

    Snow continued: "We would like to thank DaimlerChrysler for their good stewardship of this American icon over the last decade. We are aware that Chrysler faces significant challenges, but we are confident that they can and will be overcome. A private investment firm like Cerberus will provide management with the opportunity to focus on their long-term plans rather than the pressures of short-term earnings expectations."

    IDIOTS and FOOLS are leading us!!!
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    "Founded in 1992, Cerberus currently has significant investments in more than 50 companies that, in aggregate, generate more than $60 billion in annual revenues worldwide."

    Why was it that the U.S. government didn't require Cerberus to use its other revenues to make up for Chrysler's losses? Hmm? Why did TARP give them $4B instead of Cerberus? Maybe someone wrote a law that said Cerberus could just walk away? - how convenient! :mad:
  • fintailfintail Posts: 42,185
    Former VP involved with Cerberus...maybe it's no coincidence :shades:
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,131
    Didn't Cerberus keep control of GMAC? They were given TARP money with the other lenders. On the other hand, did not the government discount the Cerberus ownership in favor of the UAW and Fiat? I don't think if I was on the board of Cerberus I would have thrown good money after bad with Chrysler. You buy a company and it goes broke, you sell off the pieces and take your losses. Unless the Feds poke their noses into your business, then it becomes a bigger mess. I don't see Cerberus as the bad guys in the Chrysler demise. Chrysler was on the ropes when they bought it in 2007. The economy just provided the knockout punch.

    And Yes Dan Quayle is a player in the Cerberus conglomerate.
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    Unless the Feds poke their noses into your business, then it becomes a bigger mess. I don't see Cerberus as the bad guys in the Chrysler demise.

    Yes the feds stuck their noses into Chrysler either unwillingly (if you believe your Congressmen when they know they're being taped), or willingly - help their wealthy friends and donors in Cerberus.

    The problem with Cerberus is that they knew they screwed up buying Chrysler, and were using corporate law to limit their losses, thus sticking the U.S. taxpayer with the bill if they thought it important to keep Chrysler going.

    This is like living in a neighborhood of 2nd homes, and some of the owners saying we made a mistake buying this, we're not going to keep our property, and you and the other decent neighbors saying "Don't worry we'll pick up the bill for you".

    That's my problem with this whole thing.
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