2009 GRAND CARAVAN/T&C FEED BACK

etp

Just bought two of these (a Grand for me and T&C for my daughter). We both got the 4.0 with 6 speed and they drive perfect. I was a mechanic until 911 and these seem to be tight well built vehicles. Just wondered how eveyone else was doing with their 2009 GC and TC.

huffy

I was wondering how different the 4.0L felt (power, pep, noise, vibration, etc.) compared to the 3.8L. I am leaning toward getting a 09 Touring with the 4.0L option, but I didn't know if I should bother spending the extra $$ on it. Would I notice that big a difference?

etp

The 4.0 had less noise and it comes with the sports suspension (anti lift/dive and sway bars both front and rear) as well as the 17" wheels. The 3.8 is a Jeep engine and the design looked a little dated. The plugs were in plain view as well as the plug wires. I suggest you drive them both at highway speeds. Do not just go around the block, and be sure to take a passenger in the second seat to listen and feel.. Make sure it shifts perfect with no noise and drives exactly the way you like. :shades:

My only regret is that I did not get a back up warning system.

PS// the Town and Country has different options so check it out before before you buy.
Whatever you want make sure the vehicle has it. Doing this stuff afterwards is not practical.

huffy

Does the Touring model with the 4.0L option also come with the sport suspension / anti sway bars? I didn't know if the "sports" suspension came as part of the 4.0L engine option or if it was an extra option (like part of the towing package).

shipo

Please understand that the 3.8 is NOT a Jeep engine in any way, shape or form. The 3.8 was a purpose built engine for minivans that dates back to the mid 1990s, and while it has been used in a few other applications (most recently in some Jeeps), well over 95% of the 3.8's ever built have been installed in minivans.

A few other items of note:
1) The 3.8 has a long-long history of reliability with many engines reaching into the three and four hundred thousand mile range.
2) The two 3.8s in our two minivans (a 1998 and a 2003) have amassed a combined 290,000 miles without even a single engine related repair. Not so much as even a small oil leak from the valve covers.
3) The 3.8 design, while a bit "dated", uses a timing chain to actuate the cam and valve train. This timing chain arrangement is in most cases, good to go for the life of the vehicle.
4) The new 4.0 engine is as of yet an unproven engine from a reliability stand point (although I have little doubt that it will ultimately be regarded as a very good engine).
5) The new 4.0 engine uses a timing belt to actuate the overhead cams, and the belt needs to be replace on a periodic basis (not all that often, but I'm betting it isn't all that cheap when replacement time comes).

Were it that we were in the market for yet another minivan, we would think long and hard over whether to opt for the tried-and-true 3.8, or go with the more powerful 4.0.

Best regards,
Shipo

xwesx

I will toss in my two pennies for the 3.8's reliability. I have 195,000 miles on my 1998 DGC; the engine runs perfectly. It purrs, leaks no oil, and remains plenty powerful while giving us an average of 18.3 mpg with an AWD platform. Were winters (constant temps below 32 degrees F) not six months long, I suspect the average would be a solid 2 mpg higher.

etp

Thanks all on the engine feedback. Very good news. Yes I love the chains man.

etp

Does the Touring model with the 4.0L option also come with the sport suspension / anti sway bars? I didn't know if the "sports" suspension came as part of the 4.0L engine option or if it was an extra option (like part of the towing package).

(SXTL)The 4.0 with leather has the sport suspension and 17' wheels in the Dodge. My daughters does not have that option in a more loaded Town and Country with a 4.0/6 speed. I highly suggest you cherry pick one with a sport suspension off the lot. It sounds like the 3.8 and 4.0 will be fine by the feed back I have seen so far. But again, be sure to drive it and decide for your self with your wife in the back seat. I drove 8 units before I bought the 4.0/6 speed with leather. I was just plain quiet and shifted all 6 times like a clock.
BTW// all the vans drove fine for me, we just like a quiet vehicle. If you need a cheap van the 3.3 base units drove fine. They just had more cabin noise.

Also the 3.8 looked easier for a mechanic to work on/maybe!

We have 7 units in our family and have sold 5 over the years. Not a single one had a bad engine and three had transmission problems (two of those had a 100K plus). Nothing since 2001 has had any problems to speak of. I consider the Dodge vans one of the highest quality products on the road.

Important note for me. I do not or any member of my family work for Dodge or have ever worked for Dodge in any capacity. I am just a consumer who has ejoyed this product as well as my Chevy trucks and Honda Civics. .

etp

5) The new 4.0 engine uses a timing belt to actuate the overhead cams, and the belt needs to be replace on a periodic basis (not all that often, but I'm betting it isn't all that cheap when replacement time comes).

Good points, but my Mitsubishi 3.0 1994 Dodge Caravan with a timing belt was the most solid engine I have ever owned. I replaced the belt myself at the shop at 70K as well as the water pump, oil seals and all tensioner pulleys. Quality engine in every way. Do not let the timing belt run you off even though I prefer a chain myself. Most newer designed engines except the Honda Hybrid have timing belts.

huffy

We currently have a 2005 Honda Odyssey. I am considering the Chrysler because of all the new features (2 DVDs, swivel seats, MyGig hard drive, in floor storage, etc.) Plus, I was thinking I could get a good deal on one right now. We have 5 kids and having all of those entertainment features and storage is a HUGE plus for trips, etc. My wife likes the Odyssey because it drives very much like a car, almost spritely. I wonder if the T&C will handle more "heavy" (sway / lean in curves, not have as peppy an engine, etc.) The Odyssey is very easy to drive and park. The Dodge GC might handle more similarly to the Odyssey than the T&C, but we like the luxury trimmings and overall appearance of the Chrysler better.

I was wondering if the 4.0L engine would make any difference or should I just save extra money and stick with the 3.8L (if the overall handling is the same between the 3.8 and the 4.0).

etp

I would get the (SXTL) GC with leather as they will no longer make that model as well as 17" wheels and sport suspension. The SXTL comes with the sport suspension/4.0/6 speed and 17" wheels. Now is the time to make deals on loaded GCs as the leather ones are getting hard to find without a full load. You can easily beat the deals online by several hundred dollars and maybe over a thousand or two. If all the have left is a 35K van, make them an offer and still get the 0%. My daughter did that and drove off the lot a 35K list GC for 30K. 30K as in not a penny more out the door for anything (tax tags and all fees included). If you don't want leather then the 3.8 would do you fine.
The 3.3 was a little slow and a little noisy in the cabin, but ok.

PS/ My daughter basically bought the vehicle you are describing. She wanted the DVD system and leather. However the TC did not have 17" wheels or sport suspension. But she loves it and was driving a Honda Civic hybrid until she out grew it.

etp

Just for grins.

102,000 Miles (170,000 km) or

102 Months Maintenance

Service Schedule

❏ Change the engine oil and engine oil

filter.

❏ Rotate tires.

❏ Flush and replace the engine coolant.

❏ Replace the ignition cables (3.3L and

3.8L engines).

❏ Replace the spark plugs (3.3L, 3.8L,

and 4.0L engines).

❏ Replace the timing belt (4.0L engine).

etp

Still trying to get my homelink to work. ARGH! Had the service manager out to my house as well as the sales woman. The homelink passes all tests but will not program with my garage door opener. My Overhead Garage Door (4060L) opener seems to be fine as well as compatible with homelink. It is only 16 months old and a high end unit. Needless to say the service department is perfect. The service manager is scheduling my van to adjust the drivers door so it shuts easier and center the steering wheel by adjusting the toe. So far everything works as advertised.

BTW// I noticed most of the vehicles on the lot had a 3.8 engine. So in answer to all those questions the 3.8 and 4.0 should be perfect. The manager really liked the 4.0 and 6 speed combo and it is the first year for this engine and is a design effort with another large company. He could not remember which one.

So if you don't trust your own judgment on this one item, then get the 3.8. With a full lifetime warranty and the Democrats not willing to let any of the big 3 go completely out of business, I think you are safe. Remember in chapter 11 your warranties are still good.

etp

Update.
Road trip to Disney world went fine. 26.7 MPG at 70MPH.
24.9 at 80 MPH. I think this beast would get great MPG at 50MPH. 19 MPG to work and back.
It used a little oil the first 1000 miles but seems to have stopped once the rings set. This engine and tranny rock folks. I found out that Mercedes Benz designed the drive train and this is the first year it made production.

drdavidbowman

I'm looking at buying a 2009 Doge Grand Caravan and unsure as to which engine to get. I have a question for any one who owns a 2008/2009 Grand Caravan about the engine options and real world fuel economy. According to Dodge the 3.8 liter with the 6 speed gets 17/24 and the 4.0 gets 17/25. Can any one tell me what sort of fuel economy they get City/Highway with either engine and the 6 speed transmission and any thoughts on why the fuel economy would be better for the 4.0 liter? I am happy to stick with the 3.8 liter and the 6 speed but if the 4.0 would for some reason truely be more fuel efficient I would be willing to consider it.

Also had a talk with the dealer and was told all their engine options have timing chains designed to last the life of the engine without maintenance or adjustment. He made a big point of telling me that. There was a post here that was talking about the 4.0 liter having a timing belt? Just wondering about that reference or clarification.

Thanks.

etp

I am getting 25.9 at 65, 25 at 70MPH, 23.8 at 80 and 19.7 going to work with the 4.0. I suspect if you ran 42 PSI in the tires, used synthetic oil, and drove 48-56 MPH you will get 28-30 MPG.
The 4.0 and 6 speed are a good combo but this is a brand new engine designed by Mercedes Benz. It runs like it is a balanced engine. My daughter has the same vehicle and loves it. The 3.8 has been around a long time and has a proven track record. But with the lifetime warranty who cares. Government backed too.

shipo

I've seen any number of claims that Mercedes-Benz designed the engine and transmission of the Gen 5 minivans, however, I've yet to see a shred of evidence to support those claims. As far as I know, the 4.0 V6 is quite simply an enhanced and upgraded 3.5 V6; in fact, they're both built on the same assembly line and use the same tooling.

As for the new 62TE 6-Speed automatic, it also traces its roots back to earlier Chrysler automatic transmissions (from the 4-Speed units of the 1990s and 2000s in this case). Yes, its supposed to be greatly upgraded, stronger, more reliable, and offer much improved performance and fuel economy, but no, it was NOT designed by Mercedes-Benz (and given the automatic transmission issues they've had starting in the mid to late 1990s, I'm not sure you'd want it to be).

Best regards,
Shipo

drdavidbowman

Hi and thanks to etp and shipo for your responses. I had to ask my dealer's mechanic about the timing chain vs belt question (all engines in question have timing chains) he linked me to this website which has a very informative piece on the 3.3 3.8 and 3.5 4.0 engines. apparently the 3.5 to 4.0 is viewed as a stop gap development to be phased out by 2015 once the Trenton engine plant renovations are completed.

http://www.allpar.com/mopar/38-40.html

It is somewhat comforting to know there is a history of longevity and proven performance behind the 4.0 derived from the 3.5. Given the information about the improvements in the design and its performance data to date I think I will go for the 4.0. Its only $630. for the upgrade in the SXT. that's about the same as the towing prep package and with that you don't even get the trailer hitch out of them. I'm sure the difference will be well worth it especially once I'm towing something and the MPG info looks very promising so far.

Regards, Dave

shipo

"I had to ask my dealer's mechanic about the timing chain vs belt question (all engines in question have timing chains)."

Just to be clear about this; the 4.0 liter engine has a Timing Belt, not a Timing Chain.

An excerpt from a Town & Country Owner's Manual:

Page 494
Chapter 8 - Maintenance Schedules

Replace the timing belt on 4.0L engines. -- 102,000 miles -- 170,000 KM -- 102 months

I hope this helps.

Best regards,
Shipo

drdavidbowman

That is interesting news. I wonder what acounts (other than confusion) for the conflicting information I have gotten from the Doge dealer? I'll have to look in to this, if I learn anything of interest I'll let you know.

Regards,
Dave

etp

My dealer said it was a joint design with a major manufacturer and my daughters dealer said it was a Benz designed engine. The manual says it has a timing belt ( manuals and mechanics can be wrong). Also this is the first year for the 4.0. I was surprised how little the dealers know about the transmission and engine this year. So if the experts on this thread have some real links for us with the real truth, please help us. I can only repeat what I was told and tell you it is a quality product so far. Time will tell for sure. With the government now backing your warranty if GM or Dodge goes out of business, I say go make a deal on a 4.0 SXTL with sport suspension.

PS/ I ordered all the service manuals so that should settle the matter when they get here unless someone has built this engine on this thread. If so please speak up.

PS/2 On fit and finish I consider the paint job and interior perfect and better than my Honda. As far as body parts fit they are not as good as a Toyota or Honda but good enough for me and I am picky. Also with all the sliding doors I bet it is a night mare to align up everything perfect.

shipo

Dealerships are notorious for being, ummm, less than accurate (giving them the benefit of the doubt), or outright liars, especially when it serves their purpose. When it comes to things I've heard from dealerships, regardless of whether it came from a sales doink or from a service advisor, I always use the "Trust but verify" approach. Nine times out of ten, if what they say doesn't smell right, it turns out to be either a self-serving / convenient embroidery of the truth or a 100% died-in-the-wool fabrication.

As for reference points, the AllPar web site is always a fount of information regarding all things Chrysler. In this case, please check out the following two links:
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/38-40.html
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/transmissions/62TE.html

Best regards,
Shipo

etp

You da man.
Thanks shipo

PS/ I hope Fiat and Dodge make a deal thats good for all of us.

PS2// I noticed some minor mileage errors in one of my posts. All I can say is that the 17/25 is a conservative number. I am running 40 PSI and will be putting in synthetic oil the next earl change. lol

drdavidbowman

I emailed the Dodge customer service people today to make sure its a belt just for my own edification. I am not as enthusiastic about the belt only because the last timing belt I had was on a 2.2L in my dodge shadow, replaced it myself 3 times every 80.000 as scheduled, it was sort of a nuisance, but I did get over 200.000 miles out of that engine with no issues whatsoever. To have to dig through the front end of this V6 looks like it will require pulling it out of the engine compartment. Still, your MPG info is very encouraging and I feel the 4.0L is the best choice for my needs. Its also good to know you're satisfied with yours. JD Powers has given Dodge an unfortunately low reliability rating so real world feed back becomes just that much more important.

Thanks again for your input.

Dave

shipo

In addition to all of the other evidence that indicates the 4.0 liter engine uses belt driven cams, Napa is already stocking new timing belts for this engine.

http://www.napaonline.com/MasterPages/NOLMaster.aspx?PageId=430&Keyword=timing+b- elt&KeywordCat=Belt+-+Camshaft%2fTiming&VehCode=Y

Best regards,
Shipo

etp

I don't know if this means anything or not. But it was reported that warranty claims were down 30% for this model year. That could mean anything, but the sites above did say that the 6 speed and 4.0 were to be a major quality improvement over previous designs.

drdavidbowman

That seems to Jive with the info I have found online in driver reviews of the 08/09 model years. Roughly 40% of the reviews from 08 were dissatisfied frequently siting a brake rotor issue as well as marked steering pull to the right and other issues ranging from minor nuisance points to major mechanical failures. Then in 09 it all seems to vanish as though the quality controls were really stepped up in a hurry. Out of 23 reviews I was able to find I didn't find one negative one for the 09 model year. That the 09s have only been out for about 7 months may also factor in to the sorts of reviews I'm seeing. I was also surprise to see that the direct consumer satisfaction and reliability rating of Chrysler products was an 8.5 out of 10 the same as Honda, much higher than the rating assigned by JD Powers or Edmunds.

Regards,

Dave

etp

I was hoping that some 2009 TC and GC owners would chime in. Not that I don't enjoy this conversation, but there has to be more people out there that own these and would like to give us feedback. You know I may have the only good two in the whole nation. LOL

drdavidbowman

Yes, any one out there with millage information for your 2008/2009 Chrysler Town and Country or Dodge Grand Caravan with the 4.0L please chime in and let us know what your getting.

I had a reply from Dodge today about my question regarding the 4.0L timing chain or timing belt. (I'm sure it is a timing belt) They basically said ask your dealer. I was a bit put off by the reply but perhaps the person answering emails doesn't pay attention to whats in them or what I was asking. there all so busy trying to dodge (no pun intended) bankruptcy and partner with Fiat they probably don't have time for pesky emails from customers.

Regards,

Dave

etp

We need to keep this thread to 2009 TC and GC only. The brake issue for 2008 will kill this thread. Also I believe this is the first year for the 4.0.
So sorry guys/ 2009 only.

shipo

The 4.0 was available in 2008 for the minivans and in the latter half of 2007 in the Pacifica.

Best regards,
Shipo

desi1

Morning Everyone,

While we would have not thought of looking at GC and TC (were set on Sienna and Odyssey), you cannot ignore the deals being offered, so we did this past weekend.

We looked at both 2009 GC and TC 25th anniversary editions and both were really nice.

Can someone elaborate on which one is better? I could not see any difference in the leather interior or the options but GC seemed to have the 4.0 Lit engine by default as well as the price about 2K less than TC.

I am scratching my head over why the TC is more expensive. Any help you can offer would be appreciated.

Thank you.

etp

TC should have different colors on the interior with a perforated leather and softer. The GC MAY HAVE sport suspension with stiffer leather. Other than some minor trim stuff and the antennae that is all we noticed. Drive them both and pick the one that drives the best.

nursekev

ETP,

My wife and I just bought a 2009 TC touring with the 4.0 engine last week. Took it to Pennsylvania Dutch country for a little 2 day getaway with the kids and am really enjoying the satellite radio for us and the TV/DVD for the kids. The trip was a little over 200 miles and we averaged only about 23 mpg, mostly at highway speeds of 60-70mph. That was with 2 adults, 3 small kids and all our luggage. There were a few times when we did some city driving and had the car parked and ran the engine longer than we should have, so those things could have affected the mpg. I'm not worried about it, we'll see how it does for the next road trip soon enough.

Kevin

etp

My 3000 mile oil change is this Friday. I am going to risk the synthetic oil since you should wait until the rings set. But engine wear is a concern if the warranty winds up in federal hands and I want to stop that before it starts.
Everyone, the 4 wheel disk breaks are awesome, so check the rotors with your fingers on the front every 3000 miles for roughness and report back. thanks all!

djmopar

My 2008 GC SXT just turned over 25k miles and I still love it. I can't deny there is evidence of brake wear at the front end but the brakes do perform extremely well. General driving, to and from work and such I'm getting 19.5 to 21 mpg through the winter. Highway trips I'm averaging 24mpg + and believe me I'm no feather-foot. I love the way this thing almost leaps from a standing start effortlessly. I think it almost annoys people in other cars seeing a minivan...with balls. I'm obviously Mopar mesmerized but hey, it's not my fault they're products are awesome. (BTW this is my 5th Mopar Minivan since my first one in 84 and this is hands down, the best vehicle I have ever owned - design, quality, ergonomics, functionality, features, reliability, durability, it has it all.

drdavidbowman

Thanks so much for the mpg info and your thoughts about vehicle quality and performance. We are scheduled for a test drive with both Dodge and Honda this Saturday and it will be the first time I actually get to see how the 4.0 performs. If all goes well we hope to hammer out a deal on one of the two this weekend. although I like the Honda's lay out and looks I must admit the lack of stow and go on the second row seating is a bit off putting as I do manage to haul some large things now and then, also I find that big rubber H staring up from the steering wheel to be unattractive.

Dave

etp

Thanks man, just turned over 6K and had my toe set for free as well as the drivers door adjusted. The touring package is definitely a firmer ride than the non touring. Get the leather if you are a new buyer and can foot the cost. Honda would not quote me over the phone even though I was a repeat customer. So I dumped them. I am a happy buyer so far but drive it before you buy and make an offer and walk away if you are not satisfied. They will call back. Trust me.

PS/ My stable is Honda 2007 Hybrid Civic and a Prius 2009 touring package 6. Dodge pulls all that weight with speed and economy that is amazing to say the least.

drdavidbowman

I love this quote,

"make an offer and walk away if you are not satisfied. They will call back. Trust me."

I'm going to have that framed for my office.

Dave

etp

Thanks Dave.

PS// I still don't have my service CDs. Even though you can order them online they are not available. ARGH!

drdavidbowman

Just finished up with the dealer on our Grand caravan Monday. after spending 3 days going back and forth on price with the first Dodge dealer and getting no place I called 2 other Dodge dealers in the area and both immediately met my price no question. The one who find us the van we were asking for got our business. went to pay for it that evening and in less than 4 hours we had what we wanted. the lesson to me was if you don't feel your getting what you should be from a dealer call around don't wait like I did. some one will want your business and meet your price. Our buying strategy was to find the van in the trim color and interior we wanted with the options we wanted then research average price paid for it and offer that, asking them to cover the tax. it worked well and we even got free Auto Armor soundproof and rust undercoating with it as an incentive to buy. Paid 24 for a van with a list price of 32 and can still deduct the sales tax next January.

We are very happy with this van and althow it may not have the luxury car drivers seat apeal of the Honda it also dose not have the recall history of the Oddisy platforam. It is a more servicabul van with the stow and go, better fuel economy, larger engine, increased towing capacity and better warenty. It is just as qwiet as the Honda inside and out and we feel lookes better. we also paid 2 grand less than the best price we could get on the Honda.

All in all this is the best time to buy the Dodge Grand Caravan. (Chrysler wows not with standing) We have every confidence in this car. If your looking to buy go for the SXT with the 4.0L you will not regret it. Considering all you can get with the SXT package and the price you can get it for there is little incentive to go with the base models.

Dave

etp

So you did the deed Dave! LOL

Yep! Me and my daughter are happy so far with our vans. Mine seems to not use oil anymore and I am running full synthetic. The dealer adjusted the toe and drivers door to my satisfaction.

Good luck Dave getting your wife to let go of it. LOL
I have yet to drive it to work.

drdavidbowman

At least I got to drive it home.

It was an agonizing decision to chose between the Honda and the Dodge, the bankruptcy issue had to be considered, and the Honda Odyssey is no slouch in the minivan market. But after the 3rd day I went back to Dodge and sat in the back seat of a van with my 3 and 1 year old boys, looked around a bit and could feel it was the right thing to do. The Honda just didn't have the design features that were important to us, it would cost us more and with its meager warranty and less than ironclad track record wasn't going to do it for us.

The thing to consider about Chrysler is that if there design team and the people on the factory floor can forward a winning van like this while being cramped and downsized at every turn by the poorest of corporate management (Cerberus) Imagine what they could accomplished with the proper support. They deserve to have that chance. I'm crossing my fingers Dodge will have that opportunity and be around for a long time to come.

Dave

etp

I read an article about Fiat being interested in buying the Van plants, select truck and Jeep plants as well as Saturn to have a full market spread in the US. All at fire sale prices May 1 2009. Also saw some sort of deal between the unions and the federal government on benefits if they reorganize. All very confusing to say the least. Also our federal extended warranty/how will that work?
Hope mine lasts for 200K and never needs warranty work.

etp

PS// JD Powers best van today on the news. What a shame people would buy a higher priced van with less quality and let this asset slip away for our country. I have a Chevy truck, two Dodge Vans, Civic hybrid and Prius hybrid with outstanding quality by all of those units. Of them all it amazes me Dodge can build a vehicle that large and heavy with great performance and great gas mileage. This says alot for American engineering at its best.

drdavidbowman

I would like to hear from any one with solid information about how the government administered warranties would actually work. I cannot find any specific information about it online. Warranty or no I have every confidence in this Van and do expect it is capable of going at least 200.000 with out much problem. I put a bit over 212.000 on my 89 Dodge shadow, had it for 13 years and it never needed any mechanical repairs. Just belts, plugs and filters that was it.

Dave

drdavidbowman

This is the most explicit description of the warranty buyout I can find.

Dave

From the Baltimore News2 website

Automakers and the government will set up an account and contribute funds totaling 125 percent of the expected cost of servicing warranty claims. The automakers will put in 15 percent of the anticipated cost and the Treasury Department will put up 110 percent as a loan.

If an automaker failed, the program would appoint an administrator who will "identify an auto service provider to supply warranty services." The fund would pay for covered repairs.

It's not clear whether consumers would have a choice of repair shops. "It might be something like a health care plan where you have to go to an in-network provider," says Jeff Schuster, executive director of forecasting with J.D. Power and Associates.

etp

I think we will need this. The Unions and the banks have not made a deal yet that will result in a successful chapter 11. Looks like chapter 7 so the bond holders and health funds can be dumped and fire sale on all the plants. Evidently everyone knows this but us and the administration has already made a deal to back up the health care fund with government funds. What a crying shame with all the million dollar paid brains they can not figure this all out. I am pissed we may lose GM and Dodge for the most part. I have never owed a Ford as all my dead uncles worked in the Chevy plant and would kill me if they were alive and I bought anything but a full size Chevy. Good men and I miss them.

etp

One of my uncles was a chief final inspector and he would only buy a vehicle that his plant made and he sure was the main inspector and brought the hammer down on quality. Oh the stories he would tell to us young children and later adults. Pride in his work and he could drive any Chevy and tell you exactly what it needed. I know there were some rats in the pile too. Too bad the unions and management did not uniformly enforce quality 50 years ago across the entire industry and have a plan to make safe, fuel efficient cars and trucks and the government enforce universal standards on everyone all the time.

fmichael

I would like to buy "American", and help out Chrysler since I like the looks/layout of the T&C - however the past quality woes (per Consumer Reports), and possible bankruptcy kinda scares me away from Chrysler, and more towards Honda/Toyota (whom by the way aren't chastised by CR for their respective faulty transmissions/faulty sliding doors).

Looks as though some here have had good luck with the 2009 line-up; this gives me some confidence about giving the T&C some more thought.....The offers/deals right now are also a big bonus, and a good reason to buy a T&C; hopefully they'll continue to have good rebates/financing this May when I'm ready to buy.

drdavidbowman

If your interested in the Chrysler you should definitely think long and hard about getting one in preference to Honda or Toyota. One thing to consider, no matter what may happen to Chrysler the VW Routan is the exact same van without the stow and go seating. Its made on the same assembly line in the Chrysler plant. so parts supply should be good on this van for some time to come and warranty should also be fully backed. The decision is as usual weighing all the factors and determining whats the best fit for you and your family.

Best of luck to you.

Dave