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Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall



  • popsavalonpopsavalon Posts: 231
    andres3, your statements reflect how little most of the population really know about the electronics that CONTROL the driveability of my Avalon, or any current vehicle. The real problem is that if there is a computer glitch that goes to UA, you may not have time to sort out which of the potentially lifesaving functions are not working.....and which, if any, are.

    I will guarantee you thing, if my Avalon goes into UA unexpectedly, it will be getting to dangerous speeds VERY QUICKLY, and that is a big deal to me!
  • PMOPMO Posts: 278
    edited March 2010
    Yes taking into account you include the 20,000,000 on drugs. The 10,000,000 in gangs that drive around 4 in a car and the Dealers that GM and Chrysler let go (gm reinstated 600 dealers) and you are correct in you can not count the kids unless you figure in the 11 year olds that drive now and then. I would think you are close to a trend down. Toyota taking 8,000,000 cars off the road for recall you could not count them because the rotation of that 8,000,000 could be 16,000,000. then most would get rentals ?
  • PMOPMO Posts: 278
    Guess in your state there are jobs in what may I ask? Then how many in your state want to work at the golden arches?
  • PMOPMO Posts: 278
    How would it be if Toyota built in an ejection seat? This would eliminate fixing anything it is Toyotas Dealers need to understand Fix or it will return .
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,112
    Preposterous to think they are hiding things at this point. Totally ridiculous.

    Thanks for the good laugh larsb.

    I don't believe Toyota is any more honest today than they were 10 years ago. It is a culture of secrecy and deception that runs to the very core of the company. They are not going to change because they are on the carpet in Congress. That should have been more than clear from the hearings. "I DON'T KNOW" was their stock answer for most of the questions.
  • houdini1houdini1 Kansas City areaPosts: 7,480
    You really need to start making your posts a little more coherent !

    2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460

  • I can't help you with that. Good bye.
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204


    'Nuff Said.
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,211
    Guess in your state there are jobs in what may I ask? Then how many in your state want to work at the golden arches?

    There are NO jobs in my state of California. The only jobs that still exist are the ones at "BAILOUT" worthy companies as deemed by our crooked government. For people at non bailout companies, they probably got laid off.

    Golden arches... all depends how many Big Macs your gonna buy in the next few years.
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,211
    edited March 2010
    Many people here have determined that at average human speed, you can shift into neutral, hit the brake, and turn off the ignition all within and under 3 seconds.

    It doesn't take long to do these things.
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 11,864
    considering the pedal/mat interference started the whole unfortunate incident, the responsibility falls back on the designers and testers.
    2017 Ford Fusion SE 2014 Ford F-150 FX4
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    No, the pedal/mat interference and the CTS pedal recall was just a HUGE smoke screen, magic trick to get us to look elsewhere.
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    So if Toyota has been hiding information in the past, you think that there is no problem for Toyota if they decide to tell the truth now and just restart building their reputation? You don't think there would be years of class-action lawsuits brought against Toyota, from people who want to be compensated for their vehicles, injuries and deaths.

    The cost of those lawsuits would severely hurt Toyota, and it certainly would do their image no good to be in court all around the country for years.

    Because of our legal system, you will never see a company admit guilt about products that cause injury and death.
  • tomjavatomjava Posts: 136
    There is and always be some that think the Words is flat, we never landed on the moon, the government is behind 911, Elvis and MJ are alive, and Homer Simpson is real. We will never change them thats what the live for .If the world had no problems it would be a boring place for them.

    The best post ever! :)
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 31,112
    This pretty much sums up and clears Sikes of any wrong doing.

    After the press conference, however, a Toyota representative confirmed to ABC News that the electronic data did not show how hard the brake was being pressed. "The level of brake application is not recorded," said Toyota spokesman Brian Lyons, "only that the brakes were completely released and applied."

    Lyons also clarified Michels statement about the number of times Sikes must have hit the brakes and the accelerator. He said that the data showed that Sikes pressed and released the brakes 254 times, and did not show Sikes pressing on the accelerator, only that the throttle remained open throughout the incident. ory?id=10114198&page=2
  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    Medicine is not affected by down market. And medicine has not been bailed out by government. Health Care Reform is being considered, but this bill is to help keep costs down for consumers, etc. Is not a bailout.
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 9,211
    He said that the data showed that Sikes pressed and released the brakes 254 times,

    Sounds like wrongdoing to me.
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6 Turbo FWD, Wife's '17 VW Golf All-Track SE 4-Motion AWD
  • oparroparr Posts: 74
    This pretty much sums up and clears Sikes of any wrong doing.

    I disagree!

    only that the throttle remained open throughout the incident.

    This is new information for me at least but now his pressing/releasing of the brakes makes even more sense if BO kicked in everytime he pressed the brakes with his left foot while keeping his right foot on the accelerator. I'm assuming that releasing the brakes during BO effectively allows the car to resume where it left off.

    All indications are that while throttle position is monitored, the actual accelerator pedal position is not. Hence Lyons' clarification. In other words, they cannot prove that Sikes used his foot to hold the throttle open. Nevertheless, no doubt that is their belief.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America I70 & I75 Posts: 21,320
    edited March 2010
    >Health Care Reform is being considered, but this bill is to help keep costs down for consumers

    Actually that's not the purpose at all. It will raise costs for most working tax payers and it will mean more of them will not have insurance through the employer.
    It's a takeover, not a bailout.

    If the government had been as determined to effect auto safety through its agencies as it has been to push healthcare bills, we wouldn't be having this topic about toyota-lexus.

    2015 Cruze 2LT, 2014 Malibu 2LT, 2008 Cobalt 2LT

  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    What you posted is reality of US legal system.

    These investigations are questionable, though, The corporation being investigated is conducting the engineering investigation with sole proprietary legal rights to the information. And only they can do at present it seems. NHTSA engineers are present, but am not sure they can actually do/did the EDR readouts & vehicle system analysis. Toyota had stated they were providing readers to NHTSA at hearings the end of February. Training must have been done. Am not sure training was done.

    Laws have not been passed/ or implemented to date - where it would be NHTSA conducting test, and with Toyota or the other auto manufacturer being investigated observing and being present to protect their own interests. Corporation has every right to legally protect their own interests.

    Now we wait for the final determination from NHTSA to come out. So far I haven't heard anything.

    Toyota's past actions, problems, use of Exponent, corporate strategies, current laws create some obstacles for me at present. Still waiting for this all to unfold.

  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    Smile - politics. Big hot topic as we all know. And I will leave it at that. .

    Do agree - need some new laws - auto safety requirements and more legal authority for NHTSA so they can act more like a watchdog than a lapdog. NHTSA does have a promise for more staff, but budget has been stagnant/possibly decreased over the years. Many aspects are good - but problems do exist and need to be corrected. My hope is public pressure with this issue will be win/win for all involved.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America I70 & I75 Posts: 21,320

    I know. Couldn't let it pass.

    NHTSA: will get lots of attention for a while and then become a political patronage job again. Also follow the money trail as to what happens to NHTSA and other related automotive agencies.

    2015 Cruze 2LT, 2014 Malibu 2LT, 2008 Cobalt 2LT

  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    I realize this 250 brake pedal applications was a corporate strategy point they wanted public to remember. Approaches like this are done all the time. I do congratulate them, as they "hit homerun." And that is ok, but they didn't explain.

    Would be nice if Toyota explained this system analysis more. Explain when, over what period of times, etc. If system only stores the number, and no other info - problems.

    Not doing just creates/leads to confusion and more suspicion among all of us. Pieces of puzzle still missing it seems.
  • obyoneobyone Posts: 8,054
    The problem with NHTSA is that they have way too many letters. Everyone knows for a federal agency to be worth anything it has to have three and only three alphabets. ;)
  • carbuff1171carbuff1171 Posts: 77
    edited March 2010
    Agreed. The following evaluation indicates that Toyota EDRs hold 150ms of data. That would certainly be convicting information. The only thing that could record 256 brake presses that fast would be something like, say... a faulty Engine Control Module?
  • PMOPMO Posts: 278
    How win win NHTSA is .10% of Auto safety ? so throw more man power at WHAT? it is obvious this was not an investigation in the field done by NHTSA unless I missed the News Flash. Their is more construtive work done here than any investigation by NHTSA?
  • kyllekylle Posts: 4
    You're absolutely right bro! secrets are meant to be revealed, too bad it has caused a lot of trouble before it was totally revealed. :(
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    I don't know if this was already posted, but here it is from me:

    Driver did not hit the brakes at all

    The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration is leaving a cryptic message with reporters that points to driver error, not unintended acceleration, in a key case involving the Prius. Specifically, this is regarding the housekeeper who ran a 2005 Toyota Prius down a driveway and crashed into a wall across the street from the house, saying she was the victim of unintended acceleration last week. The e-mail reads:

    Attributable to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration regarding the recent Harrison, NY crash involving a Toyota Prius:

    "Information retrieved from the vehicle's onboard computer systems indicated there was no application of the brakes and the throttle was fully open."

    No further explanation. Sounds like the implication is this is another case of driver error, a case in which the accelerator pedal was mistaken for the brake pedal. Toyota's John Hanson says the investigation is officially being handled by the Harrison Police Department and he won't comment until then.

    On Monday, Toyota held a San Diego press conference to dispute the claims of James Sikes, driver of the runaway Prius that sped up to 90 miles an hour on a San Diego freeway. Toyota attempted to show how his claims didn't match the capabilities of the car.
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    " application of the brakes..."

    Does that mean the brake pedal was never depressed or does it mean the skid control computer never allowed the frictional brakes to come "on line".

    Care, extra care, must now be taken about anything that comes out of the "mouths" of Toyota.

    In the Sikes San Diego runaway case we were first informed that both the brake pedal and gas pedal had been "cycled" more than 250 times. The latest correction says that while the brake pedal was cycled 250 times the throttle remained fully open the entire time.

    "..the throttle remained fully open the entire time.."

    Note: No report as to the status/state of the gas pedal.

    Was Toyota forced to tell the RAW thruth due to the more detailed report of the CHP officer..??
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    Like I posted yesterday:

    At this juncture, it's ridiculous and preposterous to think that Toyota would STILL be trying to hide things.

    They have no face to save. The hiding days are OVER.
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