Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans

1154155157159160224

Comments

  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,238
    If one can't appreciate the difference between a BMW and DC minivan drivetrain, I have no doubt they would notice little difference between an Ody and a GC. The fact one is a minivan and one is a sports sedan has nothing to do with drivetrain feel. If somethings noisy and thrashy, it's noisy and thrashy regardless of whether it's a minivan, sports sedan, or freightliner. It seems every one of your performance, features, etc. discussions ends up with the DC winning because of price anyway so buy the cheaper vehicle. Anyone that doesn't notice a difference between the two would certainly want to save a buck. Anyone concerned with performance and luxury might not be thinking as diligently with their wallet.
  • hansiennahansienna Posts: 2,312
    And a person has to be joking to say the Odyssey powertrain isn't much different from a Lexus or Audi. :sick:
    The Odyssey interior noise level more resembles a Yugo than a Lexus. ;)
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Sorry but I didn't say I couldn't appreciate the difference between my BMW and Minivan, I do, but I realize they're totally different vehicles with different purposes. For their intended marketplace, they fit right in.

    Having driven both minivan, the DCX is not thrashy or noisy, and actually, noise level on the DCX vans are quieter I believe? or rated the same per CR. We're talking the difference between a Pontiac vs. Chevy here...not a BMW vs. Yugo. The DCX vans have a nice sporty "gurgle" at idle and acceleration.

    I'd personally would rather spend $20k on a minivan, not upwards of $40k for a minivan, then put that money towards a true luxury vehicle. But not everyone desires or needs two vehicles.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    The Odyssey interior noise level more resembles a Yugo than a Lexus.

    For the record, I wrote my YUGO comment before seeing your's :)

    I remember seeing postings on other Honda Odyssey chat site, before I purchased my DCX, of people sound proofing the previous generation of Odyssey. They were ripping out the carpets, adding insulation etc..... funny what people will do.
  • artgpoartgpo Posts: 483
    I know we have a separate area for posting gas mileage but an erroneous comment was made concerning the 2006 Odyssey's EPA rating. The ERA rating for the VCM engine is 20/28 which I believe to be the best of any minivan its size.

    People jump on other people for voicing opinions but please do not misrepresent the facts when attacking those people.
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,238
    Are you talking noise level or powertrain performance? I'm not sure you get it. The Ody has a very smooth, silky engine much like an Audi or Lexus. I didn't say it was THE SAME as an Audi/Lexus I said it was much closer than the DC motors. I can appreciate the Honda 3.5L as being a well engineered, smooth, quiet, powerful motor. Can't say that for the DC, it's just noisier, slower, and less responsive. It's not terrible, it's just average.

    Now, if you want to talk interior noise levels (i.e. wind/road noise), actually an Audi isn't the quietest vehicle on the planet anyway. I don't hear any offensive noise levels from the Ody. The motor is fairly muted even at WOT, the tires get a little noisy on certain concrete roads, and wind noise is pretty low. I'm sure someone can dig up some stats from the mags.

    And I think mostly we're talking new vans here. I have no clue how noisy the old Ody's were as I didn't want one and didn't buy one. The '05 Ody is the first minivan I found with enough features/performance to get my $$.
  • aaron_taaron_t Posts: 301
    I don't believe DCX's 3.5L is that much better than the 3.8L for this vehicle. I also don't think the Ody's 3.5L is that great. 240lb-ft of torque for the 3.8L and Honda 3.5L. Horsepower is lower, but that is related to torque and engine speed. At most minivan driver's usable engine speeds (below 3k, maybe 4k rpm for "spirited driving) the Ody and 3.8L DCX motor have about the same power. Honda's acceleration advantage is the extra cog in the transmission.

    DCX's 3.5L has 10 more lb-ft, but breathes better at high engine speeds (45hp) than the 3.8L. I had a Pacifica 3.5L for 12k miles and now the T&C w/ 3.8L and 9k miles. Very similar power <4krpm. And it recommends mid-grade fuel for that power rating compared to the 3.8L's 87 octane. So, how often are minivan drivers driving over 4000rpm to notice the power differences? My guess, <1% of the time for all drivers. So, peak horsepower comparisons are quite irrelevent for this discussion IMO.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    . The ERA rating for the VCM engine is 20/28 which I believe to be the best of any minivan its size.

    I don't think anyone is disputing the EPA stated numbers are 20/28, but many Ody owners aren't getting close to these number. Same can be said of DCX's HEMI and all the hyped Hybrid vehicles too.

    Technology can be beneficial but that's not always the case. Look at the Millions GM spent in Automating their plants in the 80s and 90s. Quality was still dependent on actual workers.
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    I'd personally would rather spend $20k on a minivan, not upwards of $40k for a minivan, then put that money towards a true luxury vehicle. But not everyone desires or needs two vehicles.

    Nice compare a wholesale price stripped SE Grand Caravan to the MSRP top of the line Touring(They aren't getting close to that!) It's more like 23K for the SXT and 27K for the EX on average. Better deals for both are out there but you gotta look! With the EX you get standard side airbags, VSC and 6 CD changer. The SXT has stow and go. Still the Ody has alot more room behind the third seat for storage and the 40/60 split folding rear seats.
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    Technology can be beneficial but that's not always the case. Look at the Millions GM spent in Automating their plants in the 80s and 90s. Quality was still dependent on actual workers.

    Some of GM's products have very high quaility. Buick for one! They have lots more problems than workers. Design, same model with deferant badging, High overhead, and over production of big SUV's. This list could go on for a long time. If you don't have a product that someone wants you are certainly in trouble!
  • aaron_taaron_t Posts: 301
    SXT also has trip computer, knee air bags, and some stand-alone optional equipment that is not availible on the Odyssey without accepting lot of other equipment.
  • hansiennahansienna Posts: 2,312
    Real world pricing of 2 comparable vehicles:
    Odd EX: $ 28,206
    GC SXT: $ 24,400

    That, my friends is a $ 3,806 difference. With the GC SXT there is a complete overhead console with outside temperature/compass and trip computer plus the very convenient Stow 'N Go. You can also get a power liftgate as a $400 option on the GC SXT which is NOT Available on the Odd EX.
    With the Odd EX you also get a removeable padded armrest with shoulder and seat belts for an 8th person in the 2nd row. ;)
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    What always baffles me is...you have DCX selling at least 2 times the minivans as Honda but half the problems/complaints online. If DCX quality was as horrific as you state, this should never be the case or at least you'd think they'd be more even?

    What baffles me is if you don't know how many DCX vs Honda owners spend time in forums or post. Most people never post then you have just a few that post 100's of posts, plus you have no idea who anyone is they could post under 50 names and make things look really bad! That makes this one of the most unscientific ways to tell waht's really going on!!! Ok so you got the 2005+ DCX forum with 1015 posts(This is just for people talking about there van)and you have 4496 on the 2005+ Odyssey page(not problem prices paid and any of that stuff) So the sales for DCX in the last year are 2.37 to 1 yet the 2005+ Odyssey has 4.4 times the amount of posts. Also look at this one DCX vs Ody 5264 DCX vs Sienna 25 posts. We get 25 posts in a day on this forum because of about 5 people who are habitual posters really dosen't give you a WIDE view of anything. So if you want to count posts that might be fun but it's far from being anything meaningful! The Ody is the most researched minivan number 11 overall. None of the DCX vans are in the top 50. So it leads me to believe that more Ody buyers spend time online. As for the fact that the DCX is a mature design and people wouldn't look here or other places for the information. I would be hard pressed to make a car purchase without at least getting a idea of the car I'm buying online!
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    And a person has to be joking to say the Odyssey powertrain isn't much different from a Lexus or Audi.

    I've never owner ethier of those vehicles but it's the nicest I ever owned! ;)

    The Odyssey interior noise level more resembles a Yugo than a Lexus.

    No it's not Lexus like but I have no wind noise and only some tire drone on really bad freeways. Mostly I have 3 kids (4YO twins and a 11 YO boy)and they would make a any car sound like the circus! Yesterday was the first time I drove the car by myself with noone else in it. My subie was getting new tires!!
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Posts: 1,565
    DCX Stow and Go has 60/40 third seat also, or are you splitting hairs and finding an additional contrived ODY feature?

    Ody is 40/60 and DCX is 60/40, is that the difference in the third rows?
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    Ody is 40/60 and DCX is 60/40, is that the difference in the third rows?

    Previous to the 2005 the ody rear seat was not split! Just pointing that out since it is new!
  • The sliding door has a plastic chain that could easily be broken off. Hondas, or Japanese cars are much better in quality, and reliability than American made cars

    Actually, the plastic chain that you are refering to is not a chain at all. It houses all the wires for the power doors and helps to prevent the wires from being damaged from opening and closing the doors. As for the engine, I believe the engine block is steel, which is much stronger then an aluminum block engine, and the internal parts are aluminum. I looked at our engine last night and the rust is visible, which wasn't that much, but doesn't look bad either. :)
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    As for the engine, I believe the engine block is steel, which is much stronger then an aluminum block engine, and the internal parts are aluminum. I looked at our engine last night and the rust is visible, which wasn't that much, but doesn't look bad either.

    Ok here is the 3.8L info. Cast iron is heavier!

    the 3.3/3.8L series features a traditional cast-iron block, aluminum head, overhead-valve design while also incorporating newer technologies such as sequential, multiple-port fuel injection (SMPI) and an integrated electronic ignition system supplanting the mechanical distributor, rotor and coil systems of the past.

    But what is steel but mostly iron with some amounts different metals(alloys)mostly chrome and nickel. Of course there are different grades of steel some more weldable, less corrosive and more hardened. Iron has a higher carbon content I belive of more than 2% by wieght. BTW whats a little rust on a engine! You gonna be licking the block???
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Nice compare a wholesale price stripped SE Grand Caravan to the MSRP top of the line Touring(They aren't getting close to that!) It's more like 23K for the SXT and 27K for the EX on average. Better deals for both are out there but you gotta look! With the EX you get standard side airbags, VSC and 6 CD changer. The SXT has stow and go. Still the Ody has alot more room behind the third seat for storage and the 40/60 split folding rear seats.

    What a mind reader you are! I didn't specify any makes or models, i was speaking generally about "minivans". But I did see a post where some Ody Touring owner was thrilled to not pay $41k, getting a deal at $37k something!! Woo Hoo!!!! At the price there are many luxury models you can buy in place of a minivan, including Acura's MDX!

    The GC SE model now comes with folding 3rd row seating and second row storage standard. Folding 2nd row buckets are an option or 2nd row bench with integrated child seats.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    I think I just discovered a new feature on my 2005 GC SXT with power hatch! I was shopping and loaded up the back with packages. The packages were leaning against the back hatch and it wouldn't automatically open, preventing my packages from falling out!! Good thinking!

    Also...we're getting 3 inches of the white fluffy stuff!! One trip to Sam's today and my white van is gray, making my power hatch indispensible!

    Happy Thanksgiving all! (even you turkey Ody owners!)
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    What a mind reader you are! I didn't specify any makes or models, i was speaking generally about "minivans". But I did see a post where some Ody Touring owner was thrilled to not pay $41k, getting a deal at $37k something!! Woo Hoo!!!! At the price there are many luxury models you can buy in place of a minivan, including Acura's MDX!

    Oh of course you didn't then you couldn't make it look like the it's 20K more for the Ody! More like about a 3K difference. Not much for me when I got what I wanted. I've done the dodge thing before I just wanted something nicer. ;)
  • master1master1 Posts: 340
    No, I would not lick the block. The rust SPREADS, and in Dodges dealership and the auto show, there are Caravans with engines that are ALREADY RUSTED, AND THEY ARE BRAND NEW. All I'm saying is that engines are not supposed to rust so quickly, and so much. Over time, the rust spreads, and rust IS NOT GOOD to have on an engine.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 19,602
    Sorry, but you are making yourself look silly when you talk about rusty engine blocks.

    I too, think the Odysseys are far superior to the DC vans for many reasons but a engine block that has surface rust is nothing to worry about.

    I suppose they could paint them better to minimize this but it's nothing.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    No, I would not lick the block. The rust SPREADS, and in Dodges dealership and the auto show, there are Caravans with engines that are ALREADY RUSTED, AND THEY ARE BRAND NEW. All I'm saying is that engines are not supposed to rust so quickly, and so much. Over time, the rust spreads, and rust IS NOT GOOD to have on an engine.

    I'd like you to show me ONE engine that failed due to rust!!! Or one instance of rust spreading to the body!! Rust is no more damaging then dirt on an engine.

    Unpainted metal rusts, therefore unpainted engines rust. Go check with a few dealers, you'll give em chuckles!
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Oh of course you didn't then you couldn't make it look like the it's 20K more for the Ody! More like about a 3K difference. Not much for me when I got what I wanted. I've done the dodge thing before I just wanted something nicer.

    In my original post, did I even mention any brands? No I did not. My whole point being that a $40k minivan is ridiculous to me PERSONALLY! You want to argue the price difference thing again, go right ahead. There are many DCX owners that paid well under sticker but there are very few who paid sticker, anyone can check the post section. Just the opposite is true for Ody buyers, and that's fine as long as they believe they got their money worth. $40k buys many nicer vehicles than a minivan - I don't care if it's a Toyota, Honda or Town & Country.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    What baffles me is if you don't know how many DCX vs Honda owners spend time in forums or post.

    And I'm sure you do!!!!
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    And I'm sure you do!!!!

    I didn't say I did, you implied by the number of posts you can tell whats going on. I said only if you know what the true number of differant owners for each that looks and posts, you are great at trying to turn your argument around!
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    Nah but I'm not going to counts posts like you, trying to justify all the problems Honda Ody owners are posting. I also see CR ratings for 2004 and 2005 DCX vans showing vast improvements in quality - maybe proving there's no problems to post on Edmunds.

    For someone to say DCX quality is Horrific without any supporting data is stupid. I'd be more correct making the same stupid statement about Odysseys instead....as I tried to sarcastically point out in a previous post.


    You can look at my posts I don't doubt the reliability is very close! I'm happy that DCX is doing much better in the CR ratings it will help sales. As for the Honda it had all the features I wanted for my family, and I think it's almost as much fun to drive as my legacy! You have to admit there's lots of Ody traffic on here buying experienece/2005+/12th most researched vehicle which is now in it's second year! There is plenty to post it's a car but you have to have the right audience!
  • jipsterjipster Louisville, KentuckyPosts: 5,441
    Don't know to what extent master1 is saying DCX engines rust. Do know that I wouldn't want to be showing my brand new ride to someone, then pop open the hood and have a bunch (or any) of rust on the engine. Doesn't hurt the engine, but not nice to look at.
  • master1master1 Posts: 340
    Finally! Somebody who understands my point! THANK YOU JIPSTER. You're right, a NEW car should not rust whether it does anything to the car or not.
This discussion has been closed.