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Pontiac GTO



  • The 17" wheels look better and have more detail in the casting but the 18"s have a softer and lower profile performance tire on them. I have the 17"s and those tires suck for hookup. I am going to put Mickey Thompson street radials on mine so I can launch and not get beat off the line:
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    '06 GTO's will arrive starting in December. This is later than your average '06 GM model, due to the long boat, train, and truck trip the vehicles need to make to get here from Australia. '06 production did not start until mid-to-late August IIRC.

    Regarding wheels, the 18's are nicer-looking than the 17's, but they come with Bridgestone Potenza RE040 summer-only tires that don't have nearly the lifetime of the KDWS that come with the 17's (think 10k miles). The chassis was engineered for 18" rims and tires, but GM dropped to 17's due to concerns about the survivability of the rims, and the harshness of the ride, on the 18's on the average American road... I am leaning towards buying new 18" (CV8-R) rims when my tires are shot (not for another year), but will test-drive similar rims and tires before buying.

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Just be careful driving in the rain on those MT drags. An infamous Catholic priest GTO owner clicky wiped out and went mud drifting trying to drive with them on the freeway in a rainstorm. Those with Nittos don't have as many issues with rain...

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Sorry to hear about your crash.

    I have seen a number of other GTO crash pictures. The car has always done extremely well in protecting the occupant by crumpling up. In very few cases, the airbags have gone off. According to the Aussies, this is by design - the airbag is engineered to only go off when it needs to, when it is more likely to help rather than hurt the front passengers. Of course, the Aussies get side airbags, which didn't meet U.S. spec so they were pulled from the GTO. I believe the Monaro and its Commodore-based brethren (Ute, Statesman, Caprice, et. al.) crash-test very well.

    If anything were to happen to my GTO I would probably take it to a body shop where they specialize in high-end (BMW, Mercedes, et. al.) work.

    I have heard of one case where the basic floor pan of the car was damaged in a rear impact, and it took three months - yes, months - to get one here. If you run into something like this, drop me an email (address in my profile) and I can put you in contact with some Pontiac folks that might help expedite the parts (probably won't do anything until you've waited a month, though)...

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Very good advice from elias. Get yourself checked out, repeatedly. I was in a rollover accident thirteen years ago (on vacation, on the Florida turnpike - not my fault, semi driver fell asleep and drove into my lane as I was passing him - swerved onto the (non-existent) shoulder (i.e. grass), lost control @ 70 mph, hit the semi, he rolled over the back half of my car and I flipped six times). I walked away from the accident, but my neck has never been the same (gets stiff frequently, have to roll it like a wrestler until it "cracks" into place), do physical therapy exercises daily) and now I have arthritis in it.

    Again, get yourself checked repeatedly.

    Also, I'm no expert, but, in addition to paying for your car's repair, I believe the DUI's insurance company is responsible for the "diminished value" - even if your car is fixed, you'd still get $2k or more less for it were you to trade-it in (since it's been damaged and it's worth that much less than an undamaged car).

    Hope this helps,

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Hmmm. I had to get my gas cap replaced - would just sit there and spin and spin and spin. Called the dealer, they had one in stock, I went over on my lunch hour and had it replaced in 20 minutes. Fastest repair ever!

    I've heard of others having problems with the rear cubby door falling off, the rattling shifter knob, and the lumpy/rides like there are rocks in the rails of the front seats (there is a TSB out for this, for both '04's and at least the first few months of '05's - I haven't tried to get this done yet, as the parts were terribly back-ordered). Also, water leaks, either from the underside of the door, or from the air vent piece, are not uncommon... check your floor/mats if your car's been sitting in the rain.

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    There is a door lock TSB for the '04' (my first '04 had the "sticking door lock" assembly problem). I'm seeing lots of posts on another site of people having this problem... let me look for the TSB... here it is:

    Front Door Lock Will Not Unlock or Will Lock Intermittently (Install New Door Lock Assembly) #04-08-64-018 - (Aug 24, 2004)
    Front Door Lock Will Not Unlock or Will Lock Intermittently (Install New Door Lock Assembly)
    2004 Pontiac GTO

    Built Prior to VIN Breakpoint 4L225024

    Some customers may comment that the front door lock will not unlock or will lock intermittently.

    This condition may be due to internal friction within the door lock mechanism at the rivet which attaches the door external handle lever to the lock base. The lever is returned to the rest position by the return (or torsion) spring. The door lock will not release unless the lever returns fully to the rest position.

    Install a new door lock assembly. Refer to Lock Replacement-Door (SI Document ID #1340736).

    Parts Information
    Part Number

    Front Side Door Lock (LH)

    Front Side Door Lock (RH)

    Parts are currently available from GMSPO.

    Warranty Information
    For vehicles repaired under warranty, use:

    Labor Operation

    Lock, Front Door-Right - R&R or Replace
    Use Published Labor Operation Time

    Lock, Front Door-Left - R&R or Replace
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Well, right now there's $2k additional off 2005 GTO's. Many dealers are selling at or near the Employee Price... meaning $27k + ttl. (Long Island, NY dealership).

    Besides the LS2 engine (with electronic throttle control - no throttle cable), hood scoops, and the revised rear fascia (both cars have dual exhaust, the '05's are just seperated versus one-side exit on the '04's), the '05's also get significantly better brakes and optional 18" wheels. The auto tranny is also beefed up/re-worked on the '05's as well (not sure what you're looking at). And, the '05's have the benefits of having virtually no TSB's/few known issues.

    Having said that, the '04's represent a tremendous bargain for $20-$21k (I wouldn't pay more than that for one). Look at the VIN - last 6 digits will vary between 176xxx and 317xxx - look for a higher VIN, which has more rolling changes/fewer TSB's). If you find an older one at a good price, I wouldn't avoid it, but would take the VIN in to a friendly Pontiac dealer and have them run it through SI to get the service history of the vehicle (will tell you which TSB's and repairs have been done).

    If you end up with an '05 in a color common to the '04's, you can probably find someone to swap hoods if you want the unscooped version. I've been seeing people pay $300-$400 to do the swap, FYI.

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    I believe GM made changes to the 5.7L engines (both truck and LS1) after MY2002 to reduce the likelihood of piston slap... only know of one person claiming to have it on their '04 (but he has heads and a cam, so all bets are off in my book).

    Had the Cosmos Purple color stayed on for '05, I would have waited and bought one, but it didn't, so I didn't wait. Don't regret my purchase at all, even though I went through hell with GTO #1 before getting it exchanged...

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    I'm still trying to figure out how its a 10 speaker system. Presuming there are tweeters in the dash, that's two. Two 6.5" in the doors, two more in the rear side panels, that's six. The two subs in the deck, I get eight total. What am I missing?

    As kevm14 guessed, the rears are coaxial. The tweeters are between the A-pillar and the dash. I left them alone - it wasn't highs that were the problem, it was lows (and the distortion present due to the cheap @#$@#$ paper-cone speakers).

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    I wonder if Holden is strapped with the same sort of labor union and related expenses the American builders have. My guess is if it was built domestically to the same standard the GTO would be a $45,000 car.

    Well, I do know that Holden has to deal with the Australian Manufacturing Workers Union. I do not know if Australia has nationalized healthcare or retirement benefits, though. I do know that Holden is pretty progressive about their flexible assembly processes and procedures - they deal with a lot of Japanese companies for their assembly automation - they DON'T use GMNA assembly methods, which is one reason why the Aussie Zeta platform died (couldn't be built here). They are also starting to use non-Australian suppliers (the Zeta-based next-gen Commodore will supposedly be 50-55% non-Aussie content - things like glass from Thailand, for example). Holden did just announce that they're letting go 1400 employees next August when the GTO ceases production, mainly because they're killing the third shift they added when they started to build the GTO back in fall of 2003.

    My guess is if it was built domestically to the same standard the GTO would be a $45,000 car.

    You know what's funny, if you were to buy a Monaro, and convert the sale price to $USD, you'd be around $45k. We get a bargain as far as the Aussies are concerned. The business case for the Monaro was for 4k-5k cars per year for 3 years. Figure 40k GTO's, plus a few thousand Lumina SS's (Middle East) and Vauxhall Monaros (UK), not to mention the HSV cars, and I think Holden (and GM) did make some money on the GTO... but, like so many folks here, I am beginning to question whether GM will build a next-gen, given their financial problems. There are rumors of a GTO show car at NAIAS in January... if you don't see one there, that may speak volumes about the GTO's future...

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    American stuff starts falling apart at 50k, maybe 75k if properly nursed. By 100k it's a crap shoot

    I kinda dispute that... got my winter car out of storage ('98 Aurora) a month ago, but it's been sitting in the driveway. Finally got home today to wash it and take it for a spin. It's amazingly solid and whisper-quiet on the highway, with 95k on the odo. No rattles, and it's black, with a black interior, no tint, and it's been pretty much stored since late April... needs struts and rear shocks badly, though (OEMs still on the car). That's my next project, 'cause the GTO goes away to storage in two weeks, not to emerge until April 1 at the earliest :-(

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    can anyone tell me what kind of power the drive train can safely handle

    BMR fabrication used to have a website where they went through all the steps they did to get a 9-second GTO. I believe that when they exceeded 450 rwhp the driveshaft went, so they designed a replacement, which they sell along with other parts, here:

    BTW, BMR was auctioning their project GTO on eBay (auction over, I'm not spamming on their behalf, don't know them and never bought anything from them): ategoryZ7244QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Robert if you are reading this I was wondering if you have had any problems with the trunk release buttons. Sometimes mine works but most of the time I have to get out and hold the lid up and press the remote button at the same time. Fricken annoying cos I dont want to have to turn the car off every time I want to open the boot. I know the Aussie Monaro's dont have this problem I think this is just my car. The dealership does not have a clue how to fix it.!!

    My keyfob doesn't work so great (I've learned to keep it above the spoiler, key pointed towards the dash of the car, and it tends to work better but still not great). I've had no problems using the trunk release glovebox button - does that still cause a problem? You may need to adjust the rubber "stoppers" on the trunk - I think they just screw in and out. I seem to remember that my trunk on car #2 did not pop up either, until I did so...

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    on the aussie rear lower bumper/cover. the part i got is unfinished black. in photos of the aussie version they seem to be similar/dark grey to what it has on the GM USA part. i'm not sure i'm going to like the black lower bumper. i think i want it painted body color. maybe i'll try it in the flat black for a while and get it painted later. dunno. what are your thoughts on the whole thang ya bottler !

    Gee, I thought it was dark grey like the '05 "GTO" one. I'll email Geoff at JHP and see what he has to say. I would consider getting it painted body color. I saw a Cosmos car with the SAP rear end and liked it alot - thinking about buying the SAP front and rear, for when I get my '05 hood painted and installed next spring (it's been sitting in an unused office at work since March :-(

  • Thanks "Guru" - I'll head to dealer next week to take care of this.
  • kbobe67kbobe67 Posts: 23
    There are certainly exceptions. I'm not a GM expert but if I recall the Aurora was a shot by GM at competing with Lexus and Infiniti in the near-luxury sedan segment, and quite a bit of additional attention was focused on the build quality. Sounds like you probably take above average care of your vehicles, and the Aurora was a pretty decent car to start out with, but pound for pound American cars have a much shorter half-life than their foreign counterparts. An Accord with 75k miles is only halfway home. A Lumina with the same mileage has one tire in the grave.

    Sorry to hear about the GTO's pending hibernation. I live in Florida, so we GTO all year long. Actually the weather finally cooled off enough for some windows-down motoring.
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Mechanically my Aurora's had some issues (A/C compressor, engine oil leak) but I bought an extended warranty which paid for itself, and the car's never stranded me. IIRC the interior on the Aurora used some pretty solid fasteners which have helped against rattling.

    Funny you should mention Lumina... had a '96 LS before my Aurora - drove it for 5 years, put 70k miles on it and put tires, brakes, gas, oil changes, and a water pump on it. My wife's aunt's had it since the end of 2001 and she's put another 40-50k on it and done tires again, an alternator, and a battery. The Oshawa plant that built the Luminas/Monte Carlos (and now the Impala, Grand Prix, and LaCrosse) is one of GM's best, and the vehicles they produce have some of the highest JD Power IQS scores in the industry.

    How does this have anything to do with the GTO? Oshawa #2 is where the Zeta-based GTO and G8 was to be built... expect RWD vehicles from this plant at some point in the future (2009-2010?).

  • cccompsoncccompson Posts: 2,388
    Robert, are you talking about the $2000 rebate or an additional $2000 cash (dealer) or otherwise on top of the $2000 rebate? The best price I've seen of late is about $29,350 for a manual ($2000 under invoice).
  • kbobe67kbobe67 Posts: 23
    JD Power is a marketing firm. I'll leave to your imagination who it is they do marketing for. Just for fun, run a comparison on a 2002 C Class Mercedes Benz and a 2002 Chevy Monte Carlo. Whadda ya know, the Monte Carlo bests Benz in initial quality! The marketplace settles the issue of reliability by virtue of depreciation and resale value, and the GM products take a huge hit relative to Japanese and European brands. Try trading in a used Monte Carlo and see how much the dealer is willing to add for the "JD Power Factor".

    My best friend is a lemon lawyer in Michigan. I'm not sure what happens to those GM owners that has them so giddy in the first 90 days, but I can tell you he built a $1,000,000 a year business helping those same folks out of those cars (as well as Chryslers and Fords) a few short months later. The number of Nissan, Honda and Toyota cases since 1996: a handfull. The reason is two-fold. First, they build better cars. Second, when they screw up, they fix it before he has a chance to get involved.

    I'm certain history is peppered with folks who got great reliable use out of their GM vehicles. My brother is a GM mechanic and gets incredible results from his two Chevy Cavaliers. Both have gone over 200,000 miles, and all he's had to do is simply fix everything that ever breaks on them. I suspect he'll eventually have a million miles on them, after replacing the bodies and drivetrains a couple more times.

    Agree none of this has to do with the GTO, however I believe you posted in response to my post to the Aussie guy asking about the long term reliability of the Holden vehicles, in which I remarked that most American cars have a shorter useful life than their foreign counterparts.
  • kbobe67kbobe67 Posts: 23
    Just realized your question re: what the topic had to do with the GTO was rhetorical...
  • eliaselias Posts: 2,120
    thanks Robert. i emailed with jhp about it - apparently the aussie car does have flat black lower bumper cover. he had emailed me a photo of it on the cyclone grey monaro but it is tough to tell the difference between dark gray and black in a digital photo.
    anyway it looks fine with the flat black, nice and mean and generic.
    speaking of piston slap, my 2000 LS1 Z28 didn't have it nearly as bad as did my 96 LT1. had to take it real easy on the gas after startup on those -10F new england mornings.
  • My GTO will never see rain,I will average about 500 miles a year and only in nice weather, plus I live in OHIO and the car is stored 5 months out of the year.
  • podpod Posts: 176
    I test drove a GTO (2004 and 2005) a few weeks ago during a rain storm and found that the windshield and particularly the side windows would not clear the condensation on the inside of the vehicle (which moisture was apparently evaporating from my cloths and those of the car salesman). I had to wipe the surfaces with a cloth to clear them for visibility. I have since read that this is an issue with the climate control system in these cars. The AC was working and I directed the vents as much as possible but the side windows required manual clearing. Is this a problem with 2004 and 2005 GTOPs and, if so, how do you solve it?
  • It's a design problem. The vent is split into two different air holes and the one that directs air at the side windows is way too small for this country. Maybe it works down under. The only solution is to use the a/c and blast it to dehumidify the air.

    There is also a window/door seal design problem on the car that allows water to enter the interior. Quite a few owners are reporting wet carpet and seats. That can't help the fogging situation either.
  • ausstarausstar Posts: 21
    For Robert or anyone who may know, I notice that on the dash next to and below the computer adjust buttons, is what looks like a mic... its about 6- 8 holes lined up in a square on the silver plastic trim. The reason why I wonder is because I am trying to find out if the car is bluetooth compatible. Seeing as its hard to have fun driving a 6 speed when your on the bloody phone.
    On another note, I have had my B&M ripper shifter in for about 3 weeks now and have not had any problems. It was not easy to get in because the 2 screws holding the base in strip almost the second they start to tighten, so I had to rplace the screws with slightly longer ones. The shifting into reverse is harder and in whole it feels heavier but when gliding down the road each gear feels like they're right next to each other , its made a huge difference. Im glad I got it in the end, as much of a pain in the [non-permissible content removed] it was to install.
  • kbobe67kbobe67 Posts: 23
    Watershed event today. I've leased every car I've had for the last twelve years. I figure it keeps the payment low, and invariably after four years I'm bored and ready to dump the thing. Plus, the car is typically in warranty for most if not all of those four years.

    In September I leased a 2005 GTO. Then the weirdest thing happened to me. The thought of eventually turning it in bummed me out. Plus the idea of sending GMAC all that money for 48 months to walk away at the end with nothing bugged me. So before the first payment was due I stroked a huge-[non-permissible content removed] check and paid the thing off.

    I'd like to end the post there, with everyone thinking I'm rich, but it was actually a check on my home equity line of credit. Still it was a huge-[non-permissible content removed] check, but at least now it won't feel like I'm Zainoing someone else's car every three days.
  • I thought those holes were for the speaker for the "beeps" that the computer makes when you press the buttons... correct me if i am wrong, i have no supporting docs, just my hunch....
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    You need to turn on the AC, and set the temperature cold-ish, to defog the windows. Pontiac got so many complaints about this that they actually changed the AC button to say AC/DEFOG on later cars (not sure if mid-'05 or '06).

    Yes, there are some cars with leaks, though I'm not as cynical about it as midwesttrader. As much as I've washed and Zaino'd my car, if it leaked, I'd know it. Principle areas to check would be around where the defrost vent is (in the front window corners), and the bottom door seal.

  • I've had my 05 GTO since July. The only problem I have encountered so far is I had to have the battery replaced a week ago. Funny thing, I had no indication the battery was bad as the car started ok, lights etc.seemed up to par. I was checking the oil and glanced at the battery and noticed the "eye" on the battery showed dark instead of green. Took the car to the dealer where they checked the battery and it showed only 50% of charge. The alternator checked out ok so they replaced the battery with another new one. Keep on eye on that "eye" It works!
    Thing is the replacement battery, an AC Delco "professional series", does not have the "eye"....and has more cranking amps. Wonder if the OE battery has been a problem??
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