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Pontiac GTO



  • nick02nick02 Posts: 1
    Hello, I am looking for a 2005 GTO, and was wondering if it would be a better choice to look for a used one to get a better price or not? Thanks
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    ...upon your tolerance for cars that might _possibly_ have been abused. This is far more likely in a performance car like the GTO, than in something like a Cobalt. If I were looking used, I would probably try to buy from a private seller, rather than a dealer, and hope the "gut feeling" from meeting the owner/seeing maintenance records, would overcome the concerns.

    The '05 GTO is not currently offered on the GMS-for-everyone promo (sales were TOO well last month). GMS price was "around" $30,300 for the stick, and $300-$500 more for the auto. You should be able to get one for the "GM In the Driveway" price, if you can get a GMS certificate - that's GMS + 4.5%.

    I've only seen ads from a couple of dealers with '05's who wanted $28-$29k for their cars. Not a significant savings. There are a handful of new automatic '04's on dealer lots - should be in the $24-$25k range. Used '04's are in the $21-$23k range, with under 10k miles...

    Oh, unless you are paying cash, part of the affordability of a car, used or new, is the finance rate. I am a credit union member and I "always" get pre-approved for a loan through my credit union BEFORE walking into a dealer. Then, I use a calculator like the one at to estimate the payments - never rely on the dealer's math.

    Hope this helps,

  • coresellercoreseller Posts: 40
    :confuse: Ok, let's see if Hammen can answer me this: It has happened more than once now, but not regularly, maybe a total of 3 or 4 times. I will be driving down the road and the horn will honk very briefly, like I touched the lock button (which I'm sure I didn't) on the key. It has occurred driving through our subdivision at 20 to 25 MPH, it has happened on 2 lane backroads going 50 to 60 MPH, on the highway also. It happens completely out of the blue, no message or idiot light appears on the dash either, any ideas on what's going on?
  • 05midblue05midblue Posts: 20
    I've seen this issue on much older cars (pre-airbag) and learned that the contacts for the horn are a little more archaic than I expected. The contacts can relax after time causing a false trip, however it sounds like yours were just installed wrong. Robert probably has a more accurate description for this, but it sounds like you should pay your service person a visit. If the problem is by the airbag, I'd recommend against the DIY job. Come to thing of it, maybe you have a bad ground somewhere between your horn and your steering wheel. Good luck with that one.
  • gxpgtodanmangxpgtodanman Posts: 210
    I had this problem happen on a previous GTP I owned, only once in a while, every 4 months and never bothered with it. It kiind of went away.
  • tolenashtolenash Posts: 52
    You are not alone.... I have the mysterious beep also. every few weeks, at random speeds and driving conditions (day/night, wipers on/off, radio/cd). Nothing makes a difference.

    Secondly, if it were a "bad ground", wouldn't the horn sound continuously? (which it doesn't).
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    I noticed you closed down the discussion regarding GTO prices and purchasing.


    Many other vehicles have seperate "Prices Paid and Buying Experience" discussion; why not the GTO?
  • 05midblue05midblue Posts: 20
    If a ground wire is pinched, or an isolating groment is cracked such that a connection is made only on a hot day when going around a sharp corner and hitting a bump... well then I certainly wouldn't clasify the intermittent gorund as a good one (unless you like the sound of your horn)! Just a thought. I'd start at your horn and work your way back. Loosen the horn mount and wiggle it to see if that sets it off.
  • ClairesClaires Chicago areaPosts: 1,221
    Hi, rorr,

    We already have a prices discussion for new GTOs here:
    Pontiac GTO: Prices Paid & Buying Experience, and it's a pretty active topic :-)

    Since this question was about new vs. used, I moved the post to this discussion, but the question would probably get decent feedback in the Smart Shopper Forum too.


    Need help getting around? - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "We already have a prices discussion for new GTOs here:
    Pontiac GTO: Prices Paid & Buying Experience..."

    DOH!!! :blush:

    "...and it's a pretty active topic."

    No posts since 7/05? Doesn't sound like it's all THAT active... :confuse:
  • dat2dat2 Posts: 251
    Hammen2 (and anyone else than wants to comment)...
    Tomorrow I will take my '04 M6 GTO in for service, it is getting close to 13,000 miles. I am planning to do an oil change, not sure if I am supposed to use synthetic or not, original service writer said at first it came with regular oil, then on the second visit said it came with mobil1, so i think it has switched at least once between the two. I will also be having the flash done for the freaky gages, and the bright MPH. Am also having some steering shimmy looked into, the idle seems a little too high, and the key fob barely works. These are all mainly minor things, are there any other things I should have them check at this point, since I should still be within the new car free adjustment period. The power windows are also slow. Does anyone know if the Pontiac dealer in downtown Frederick MD is any good? THANKS!
  • 05midblue05midblue Posts: 20
    I'm working on installing an aftermarket car alarm/remote start and things were going smooth until I was prompted to find the tach sensor wire. This is also the wire you need to locate for an aftermarket tach ( a little obvious from the name, sorry). Before cutting any wires, I'm labeling everything and am stumped at this one. Some corvette guys say that you can find it either at the PCM or under the dash. Does anyone have pictures of this, or a good description? Thanks,

  • coresellercoreseller Posts: 40
    Hey Hammen, ain't it great to be the Guru? Just kidding, Mr. Hammen is THE source. I thought I'd throw in a couple of things since I've just been through a couple of issues you've brought up. Steering shimmy, balanced and rotated all 4 tires and it is gone. First few oil changes were done with dino (regular) oil, last one just performed and went with synthetic, beleive it or not I actually notice a little difference in idle and overall smoothness in the motor. Good luck, 22k miles and no problems (honk) thus far, knock on wood.....Mark. :shades:
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Sorry guys, I've been swamped both at work and personally... have only had time to "hit and run" the board, and am at least 20 messages behind in replies.

    For your '04: it came with dino oil, but other LS1's (Vette) come with synthetic. So do the '05's. I had my dealer change the oil over to synthetic before picking up my car (though, due to its replacement status, and the fact that it was the middle of January, it went right into storage).

    Other things I would have them check out: if they have to remove the tires to balance them, have them double-check the struts and the inside of the tirewall to make sure there's no contact taking place. If there is, have them call TAC to get the special, revised alignment specs and to do an alignment on the car. I posted the specs a few messages back.

    Balancing the tires: if they're not using a Hunter GSP 9700, don't even bother - the Hunter machine can do a road-force balance, as opposed to a regular "spinning" balance, which is less precise and less effective.

    Rear axle bolts... there were some issues with these coming loose. A couple of folks have dropped the bolts/had the car just die while driving down the street. While this is not a TSB, there is a procedure that TAC knows about, with recommended torque specs and application of Loc-Tite. All '04 owners should have these checked periodically at service.

    Not sure of the build date on your '04 but there were some issues with the driveline hitting the chassis on hard bumps or acceleration... there is a "thunk in the trunk" TSB which rectifies this. I think cars built after April are supposed to have this fix done already from the factory. BTW, the VIN tells the tale of when your car was built... the lowest '04 VIN I've seen is 176xxx, the highest 317xxx, and there were tons of rolling changes/fixes, most complete by VIN 260xxx...

    Also, have them check the freeze plug on the engine - many '04's were leaking. Speaking of leaking, the batteries tend to leak/weep from the top - if yours is doing this, time to get it changed out.

    BTW, if your power driver's or passenger seat movement seems jerky, there is a TSB for this procedure... dealer needs to order a part (I forget the details) to resolve this.

    Double-check the paint on your front and rear fascias... some issues with peeling. Paint overall is an issue on the car (water-based paints are new to Holden and they're having issues with paint chipping, dirt in the paint, and white spots appearing).

    I know others have posted questions... I've unfortunately got to run (get to drive the GTO 250+ miles today up to the EAA fly-in, oh darn!). I'll catch up later tonight...

    Some GTO schematics and specs at (not my site - one from someone who is now a former '04 owner).

    Hope this helps,

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    OK, I've known this for over a month, and was trying to hint at this earlier, but here's the official confirmation:

    The 2006 GTO (which will have an extended production run) will be the last model on the current platform. There will be no 2007 GTO.

    There WILL be a 2008 or 2009 model year GTO, with more retro styling touches, on the Zeta platform, still built in Australia:

  • elkiiielkiii Posts: 50
    Just goes to show how psycho GM is. No NA rear wheel drive on Zeta. No wait, we really didn't mean it. Well, maybe we did. No, we didn't. Arrrrrrgh!
  • danf1danf1 Posts: 935
    I know your busy, and I could probably ask my service reps here but I don't think I'd get an honest answer. Have you heard of any problems with the ebrakes? A buddy of mine just had his totalled. He had it sitting in front of his house running with the brake on while he ran into his house to give his wife a pack of cigarettes, and the brake let go. His car hit two other cars, rolled down the hillside, smashed a few trees in the process.

    Now I know that he should have parked it and put it in gear, especially when parked on any hill, but he isn't the brightest guy out there. Just curious, not trying to start any potential litigation. Being a GM employee, I would guess that there would be some negative connotations if he were to try to take it to court.
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    No I haven't heard of a widespread problem. I did have an experience the other night, though - applied the e-brake when I parked the car (auto, force of habit from the old early 90's W-body days, where applying the e-brake was a necessity to prolong rear brake life). When I got out of the concert, wanted out of there ASAP, so I backed the car out of the spot, put it into D and noticed I wasn't going anywhere... until my passenger pointed out the e-brake was still set (normally, the GTO plays a little tune if you try to put the car into gear with the e-brake set). Interesting that I could put it into reverse no problem, but the e-brake only stopped the car from rolling forward. What direction did your buddy's car roll?

  • danf1danf1 Posts: 935
    It rolled forward. Right now he isn't a fan of Sir Isaac Newton and his whole gravity idea. I think he mentioned Fred Flintstone and the wheel too, but I'm not so sure he's right about that one.

    His biggest problem is that he got it when they were giving them away. A 2 year one pay lease for 205/month. I'm guessing that will go up if he gets another one.
  • According to motortrend:

    Spied: 2008 Pontiac GTO
    All-new all-American Mustang fighter

    By Editors of Motor Trend
    Photography by Marc Cook
    Motor Trend, May 2005

    This one's a winner -- The design for the new GTO coming to Pontiac showrooms in 2007 as a 2008 model. The big, rear-drive sport coupe will be designed and built in the U.S., possibly at GM's Hamtramck or Wilmington plants, and it's likely to show up in concept form at a 2006 auto show, probably Detroit in January.

  • kevm14kevm14 Posts: 423
    I think they're trying to get their stock price up!
  • dat2dat2 Posts: 251
    Hey Hammen and Coreseller--
    They did a free wheel balance but they didn't have the machine that Hammen talked about, and it helped little in the shimmy department. The shimmy isn't very bad and it's most noticeable when the tires are cold. They reflashed the gages and MPH and that seems fine. They decided the car came wth dino oil, so I went back. The mobil1 oil change was like 65 which seemed a bit high.

    My drivers seat has the jumpy problem, will have them check that next time. I already had the thunk in the trunk fixed. I'll look at the inside tires myself, and I'll have them check the bolts and freeze plugs next time too. Thanks for the tips! :)
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    they didn't have the machine that Hammen talked about, and it helped little in the shimmy department

    Call and speak with the service manager. Explain to him that the balance they did didn't fix the problem. Ask them to refer you to a shop with the Hunter GSP9700 so that they can do a road-force balance, and to have GM reimburse you for that (or have the shop bill them, either way). This is the only way to fix shimmy/vibration issues on newer cars with a very stiff body structure (my Aurora, and all of the other G-body FWD vehicles, have this issue as well). GM normally doesn't pay for alignments or balancing past 12k miles, and I think you said you were close or over that, so I wouldn't wait/would call them on this right away.

    Re: the oil change, I've been buying the oil and filters myself (5 qt. jug of M1, $20 at Wal-Mart plus $5 for a 6th qt, and then either an M1 or NAPA gold filter for $6-$7). I keep meaning to do my own oil change on the GTO (have to remove 3 of the 4 bolts holding the huge skidplate on, and swing it out of the way), but never have time. My dealer will do it for $20 or so - makes the change about $51.

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Yep, the description of the original Zeta GTO I received sounded like the front end of that car looks.

    Check out the '99 concept (which they supposedly based the design from) here:


    Personally not a huge fan of it, but understand how it, and the retro-inspired hood, could interest people. The illustrations posted make it look like a recent (pre-'05) Mustang from the side, IMHO.

  • elkiiielkiii Posts: 50
    Hammen, does the GSP9700 balance the wheel/brake assembly on the car? The reason I ask is that I've also encountered a situation where a replacement rotor was just slightly out of balance. I replaced the rotor and solved the problem because I couldn't find a shop that could balance the entire assembly. Knowing what to ask for in the future would be helpful.

    Also, I had a problem in the past where the tire has a defect that caused a squriming between the tread and belts. This occured after about 25K miles. Since the problem seems worse when cold I'd make certain the problem isn't with the tire itself. The road-force balance may help determine this but I'm not certain.
  • elkiiielkiii Posts: 50
    Meant to get back to you on this. Check Sharrett in Hargerstown or Burdette in Hyattstown. One of them might have the machine hammen describes.
  • elkiiielkiii Posts: 50
    Geez, this almost looks like an update to the firebird to me.
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Info, and a shop locator, can be found at

    Basically, this machine applies a counter-force to the tire (and rim), simulating the force of the road against the tire. It is able to measure whether the rim and or tire are round when rolling. It may be necessary to rotate the tire on the rim to reduce the amount of wobble. It may also be that the tires themselves are out of round, requiring replacement.

    By the way, the KWDS on the GTO WILL flat-spot when sitting overnight. This will result in some vibration/annoyance, at least for the first minute or two of travel. It's this tendency to flat-spot which is the reason why the tire pressure gets pumped up to 60 psi before shipping - this eliminates the flat-spotting, but makes for an awfully uncomfortable ride and handling (not to mention, diminished suspension performance).

    Hope this helps,

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    do you know what performance mods I can make to my 05 that will not void the warranty. I would assume a ram air kit would be ok but what about headers? I know tweaking the computer is out of the question unless you are able to change the settings back to factory specs before being serviced.

    You can install a K&N cone filter (they have kits for the '04's and '05's) without voiding your warranty. GM does have a TSB out for all their cars, warning that they may not cover a dead MAF sensor if the car's owner used a heavily-oiled third-party air filter, but that's about the worst thing you can do by installing the K&N. Lingenfelter and New Era also make intake kits for the GTO.

    Regarding headers, this depends on your dealer. You should make friends with your service manager and ask them how far you can go. I'm sure headers and a cam wouldn't preclude them from warrantying, say, a battery, an ABS problem, et. al., but if you had driveline problems, that might be a problem. Depends on the dealer.

    Regarding tweaking the computer, using a handheld tuner like a DiabloSport Predator
    makes it very easy to tweak settings. The first thing this tuner does is back up your stock tune, so it's very easy (as long as your PCM is working) to restore the default settings back before bringing the car in for service.

    Sorry for the delay in responding, hope this helps,

  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Made in Germany Castrol Syntec 0W-30 is also a very excellent oil for the Gen-III small block (actually, all of them). You have to make sure the bottle says made in germany on the back though. The USA blend stuff isn't the same! And the label has to be red, not yellow.

    I have heard the same from another GTO enthusiast. But, didn't Castrol change the formulation on this stuff? Previously was green, MY04, the new 05 stuff is brown. He's not happy, switched to M1 but is also considering Amsoil. Is doing a UOA on all three...

    needs to change his oil in another 1k miles
This discussion has been closed.