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Ford Five Hundred/Mercury Montego

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Comments

  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    After driving the new Edge, the 6 speed is unbelieveablely smooth. Almost CVT smooth. And you don't have to pay for a fluid change every 60k

    Mark.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    The 6A was needed to handle the power/torque of the new D35. But aside from that, it's a very sophisticated and advance transmission engineered jointly with GM. What differs are the computer related modules which are programmed independently for specific use on certain vehicles depending on the nature the vehicle aims for.
  • slider7slider7 Posts: 33
    If you do away with all of the attention-deficit gizmo's that distract you from the reality you're really buying, the 2008 will be faster and perhaps smoother in the tranny/engine dept. The candy-striped rear tail lights look silly. The new rear wheels don't appear to have the wider visual stance that the current Limited design has. The front end looks like a cross between the 80's L T D stationwagon/Ford Topaz meets HID. The front looks high and econobox instead of low and sophisticated, and squarish for a rounded/circular body/wheelwell shape and kinda reminiscent of the 87 88 89 Escort GT. The rear valance has a cutout for two little exhaust pipes not even centered within, on the left side. The only interior that looks sporty and rich is the all black leather option. The pebble, gray, or two tone looks cheap and plasticky. The new albino instrument cluster lacks contrast and the tiny plastic accents on top of the steering wheel and shifter won't impress the Cadillac folks out on the road. The original Five Hundred that was put down, kicked, and laughed at by critics has remodeled itself into more muscles, skin-deep chrome flash, lots of mental jewelry, and multiple personality disorder to boot. I recommend you run out and grab that 2006-2007 black, red, blue, white or merlot Five Hundred Limited with moonroof and black leather. I just hope you can still get 0.0 and $1000 cash in your pocket before the dealers find out. Mine has 6690 miles and only one synthetic oil change from Jiffy Lube at 3148 miles. I won't drop it off at some dealer and risk secret remapping of the onboard computers in order to cause "service engine" lights or other "mechanic engineered" troubles under factory warranty. Happy New Year!
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
  • After driving the new Edge, the 6 speed is unbelieveablely smooth. Almost CVT smooth. And you don't have to pay for a fluid change every 60k

    Hard to believe it can be as smooth as a CVT.

    How often DO you have to change the transmission fluid? I can't imagine going more than 60k miles. I can't imagine even going THAT long, really.
  • when will the 08's be available for a test drive?will it be that much better than the 07's?
  • samnoesamnoe Posts: 731
    I hate to criticize, but this time I am getting really upset. What's up with that boring dated interior Ford is already using for the last couple of years? Both, the stereo system and temperature controls, needs to be drastically revised. Can't they just copy their own upcoming Focus?

    Looking over the photos of the auto show, I couldn't help but thinking that maybe the critics are right? Just look at the Hyundai Veracruz, and see the interior. It's a pleasure to look at! And so are other vehicles.

    It's time to wake up, Ford!
  • I have to agree. It's not just the 500 either; Ford is getting left behind in interior design and quality of materials all over the place. I just had the chance to see a Saturn Outlook interior (Saturn!), and I was stunned at the quality of design and materials; far and away better than the Edge. Ford supposedly tripled their investment in interior designs a while back, but other then the F-150 and maybe the new Expedition, they seem behind in every segment interior design-wise. I've heard excuses that those investments won't take hold right away for about 5 years now. I've also heard rumors that Ford is stuck in some contracts with sub standard suppliers, but whatever the reason, the current crop of Ford interiors isn't cutting it. I had a '98 VW Passat and the interior on that car is still better than any car Ford has out right now. It's too bad, because GM has woken up on interior design, and their new offerings have improved unbelievably in that regard.

    And please, let's not go off on the tangent of "who cares about the quality of materials?" If you don't that's great, but I assure you most people do. Just as an example, I have a sister in law who was dead set on the Freestyle, until she actually sat in one. She said "it just felt cheap and cheesy." Now she's looking at a Subaru Tribecca, mainly because it "looks so luxurious inside." Who would have thought a few years back that Ford would be losing sales to the Korean makes, Saturn, Subaru and others, because of the quality of their interiors?
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    The Edge interior looks better in person than in photos. Ford is moving away from the "brick" style interiors. Check out the new Escape and the new Focus.

    The MKX and MKZ have great looking interiors with real wood. The Fusion interior is very nice as well.

    (If i had to choose between a Top of Dash display and a storage compartment as in the Fusion, I would rather have the storage.)

    Mark.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Let's take note, we are comparing a vehicle that was imagined in 2001, using 1990's/2000 administration decisions/mindset, to debut in 2004 as a 2005, and we are comparing it to a 2008 vehicle?

    IN this regard, every vehicle being introduced each and every year will start to outdo one another, as they are redesigned. And it's very unlikely that a manufacturer will improve certain materials on the 2-3 year refresh cycle.

    Suppliers build to spec that the manufacturer has, and within all that legalities the only leverage they might have is IF a vehicle is released, and people critic materials for example, the contract might NOT allow for a change till it's renewed 4-5 years after, unless a hefty penalty is paid. Those are the little things that can slow things up.

    Also, VW/Audi are known for having some of the best interior materials in the industry. They actually are rated as having the highest "Perceived quality" index, but reality is, it's one of the most unreliable brands out there.

    Having known 12 friends that HAD (and will never own) another VW, I can tell you how well (or lack thereof) those materials held up 4-5 years after the fact. The rubbery door interior grab handles which fade. The door surround felt trim pieces that sags. Airbag cover corners starting to lift. Cupholders that broke earlier on. Footwell panels that won't clip into place correctly and pop out with slight kick. Turn signal stalk which looses it's texture and fades. Headliner starting to drop.

    And my personal favorite "The A/C doesn't smell mildewy Sir, it's just the outside air", next to the "I dont understand why you think the Jettas interior smell like burnt crayons, they smell perfectly fine to us".

    But anyhow, moving on...that is a sore topic for me being I was USED each time they needed my help at the dealership ever other week.
  • pnewbypnewby Posts: 277
    On another note, beauty(and quality) is in the eye of the beholder.
    In my case, an in-law called recently to ask what my Freestyle was, she had looked at similar cars recently, and couldn't find any she thought were even close to the interior of my '05LTD. And her family isn't Ford oriented.
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    I wonder if Ford ever looked into applying a soft rubber to the switch surfaces similar to what is used on the soft grip pens.

    I just don't think that symbols printed on this type of material would resist fading.

    Mark.
  • samnoesamnoe Posts: 731
    Let me explain, step by step:

    The stereo controls and LCD are so dated, all the competitions have way better and more intuitive controls. This stereo system (from the Five Hundred), with some tiny uncomfortable controls was first used in the F150 (if I remember correctly), which was praised all over for the beautiful cockpit (a first for Ford in recent years), and so was the climate controls. Since then, Ford applied the same controls into most new Ford, Mercury and Lincoln vehicles.

    While the overall appearance in the F150 was very good and light years ahead of the previous generation, if you look part by part, you can see that not everything is perfect. The LCD on the radio with old kind of green clock-like letters is so outdated compared to other vehicles. And just adding an AUX/IN plug will not help much for the design. The controls itself is also not so clever.

    And so are the temperature controls. Especially the automatic, which is needlessly overly complicated. Of course it's nice & organized, and looks good when you see it first, the Fusion, for example, looks very nice with the analog clock and other gadgets, but start using the controls and you see it's not easy, and not well designed. The new 2007 Camry is much better designed (despite their quality problems recently).

    Every vehicle needs a change after many years, and especially if all brands are using the same parts (OK, Lincoln have it in silver instead of black). It's not a good idea to have just one kind of stereo system or temperature controls and using them across the board. There should be different for the trucks, vans and cars. The new Focus looks much more promising, and shows that Fords know how to build a nice executed interior.

    And what's about the gauges? Most competitors using already the optitron which is beautiful. The white-background also must go. It's not practical for day driving, and not adding anything tonight, and are just distracting at evening hours. I also don't like the rotated letters (numbers) on the gauges, and the way-too tiny dials for the fuel and engine temperature.

    The steering wheel controls is very nice, but also too much in such a small space. It could be designed better. Just look at other manufacturers how they do it. They are all easier to use than Fords.

    I’m sorry for the long post; I just wanted to clarify myself.
  • The stereo controls and LCD are so dated, all the competitions have way better and more intuitive controls

    They seem pretty intuitive to me. Can't imagine how anybody would have any problem figuring them out.

    The LCD on the radio with old kind of green clock-like letters is so outdated compared to other vehicles

    Works for me.

    And so are the temperature controls. Especially the automatic, which is needlessly overly complicated.

    I have the automatic. And it's extremely simple to use. At least until you want to use it in MANUAL mode . . then it's a bit more difficult to locate the correct knobs (while you're driving, anyway).

    And what's about the gauges? Most competitors using already the optitron which is beautiful. The white-background also must go. It's not practical for day driving, and not adding anything tonight, and are just distracting at evening hours.

    I find the gauges on my LTD version just fine. It's the standard BLACK background versions (on anything but the LTD) that I can't stand.
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    other than being more expensive to repair..

    Please keep in mind that a Ford Fusion AWD fully equipped with every option but navigation has an MSRP of $27,500. The similarly equipped Nissan Altima has an MSRP of $29,500. For the extra $2,000, you get "intelligent key", bluetooth, 50hp, and a more expensive to maintain CVT. but you loose AWD and give up substantial ride quality.

    The 500 is not suppose to aToyotas, Nissans, or Honda, its a Ford and it is competitive and will be more so when stability control and the 3.5L is added this spring.

    Personally, I know for a fact that people have purchased Fords from my dealer over supposedly "better competitors" BECAUSE of the way they were treated!

    There are many reasons to buy a specific care over another and I don't believe to may people make that decision based on "optitron" gauges.

    Mark
  • The 500 is not suppose to aToyotas, Nissans, or Honda, its a Ford

    Actually, it's more Volvo than Ford. ;)
  • When can we expect to see 2008's on the dealer lots?

    What is the EPA on the 3.5L engine?

    Does the the 3.5L engine use hydraulic or mechanical lifters?

    Were any changes made to the rear seat?

    What is towing capacity with the new engine and tranny?

    Did Ford put the courtesy lights back in the cabin.
  • "The 500 is not suppose to aToyotas, Nissans, or Honda, its a Ford and it is competitive and will be more so when stability control and the 3.5L is added this spring. "

    Judging by the sales numbers, the 500 is somewhat less than competitive.

    I think the new additions will help, but there was a large missed opportunity with the 500's styling. You may not be able to out Toyota Toyota or out Honda Honda, but you can certainly beat them on styling. The Camry and Accord have never been styling standouts. With so much ground to make up in consumer perception (even though we know Ford's latest efforts have matched the Japanese on quality) the 500 really needs to be a knockout to get people to step out of the Toyota/Honda comfort zone.

    Part of the reason I run my mouth about this is that I think there's a really good car somewhere in there. The 500 is well built, now has a competitive engine, has amazing rear seat and trunk room, is very safe, etc. But I think by missing the styling boat Ford coughed up a bunch of sales, and the 500 already has somewhat of a stodgy reputation if people know about it at all.

    Ford seems to be getting incrementally better with each new car launch, hopefully when a major refresh of the 500 comes along it will be restyled from the ground up.
  • Interestingly enough climate controls in Edge feel more substantial and made from better material than in 500 or Fusion even though design is the same. Why not replace ACC in 500/Fusion with new one from Edge? And there is new a center stack seen in Mariner/Focus. I did not touch it so cannot say how good it is.

    As for gauges – I personally do not like how it is done in Camry/Lexus – too garish and bright for my taste and I do not want gauges to be too big and glare during day. I like more understated design of Lincoln/Mercury/Ford. I do not know is upcoming ice-blue gauges in Fords are good or bad. I certainly do not like it in Acura. Green color is okay, may be red for performance brand like Mazda/Pontiac. Green gauges in Skoda Octavia are beautiful, but red in Golf may be too irritating. And as Ant correctly pointed out VW interior may look nice but after couple of years look pretty worn out and there is a smell also. I like Ford interiors for their sturdiness and common sence.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,437
    That may be some people's experience with VW, but not mine. Both my Golf and Passat interior parts and surfaces have held up superbly over the years, and both interiors still look better than most anything Ford is putting out now, years and years later. And that is a shame. I suspect though that Ford has now gotten the message and is dancing as fast as it can to make those important peerceptual changes.
  • Regardless of quality of materials modern Ford interiors do not look as stylish as interiors from Honda, Toyota and GM. Somehow they manage it look down-market.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Posts: 2,697
    ???

    Why even try to hide and camouflage the Montego at this point when the Five Hundred has official photos all over.
  • Front looks like MIlan though. I think it looks better than updated 500.
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    "I think there's a really good car somewhere in there. The 500 is well built, now has a competitive engine, has amazing rear seat and trunk room, is very safe, etc. But I think by missing the styling boat Ford coughed up a bunch of sales"

    Oh man did u hit it here. The 500/ Montego are so boring one could fall asleep looking at them. Such a shame because like you say they have the potential to be great sellers now that they FINALLY have the engines and drivetrain they needed all along. And the "redesign" is geez its practically a joke. They took the grilles from their little cars that are selling better and put them on the big cars that are DOA and now people are going to buy the big ones too? I for one doubt it very much. If they sell 3 more 500s this year it'll be becasue of the 3.5 L, not the 3 bar grille.
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    "With so much ground to make up in consumer perception (even though we know Ford's latest efforts have matched the Japanese on quality) "

    Dont know what you're talking about here though. Reliability after one year does not mean much. The things are under warrantee for 3 or 4 years. THAT's when reliability begins to matter. You cant say anything about Fusion/500 reliability compared to Japanese for another 3 years at least, IMHO.
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    Hope you don't have one of the 500,000+ Toyota trucks that just got recalled.

    BTW, check out the annual auto iss of Consumer Reports. The Camry 4 cylinder was WORESE THAN AVERAGE for reliability while the FUSION WAS ABOVE AVERAGE!

    Why is it so hard to believe that Ford could build a quality car? Its almost like you people are HOPING it will prove to be unreliable.

    Mark.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,437
    Well, I'm not one of them. I'm just realistic. Why did it take such a long and hard fall for this formerly powerful company to get a clue? For the Fusion to make big inroads on the Camry bandwagon, it would almost take a miracle now. It sits in the showroom next to and between two of the most mediocre designs out there (Focus and 500). The 2008 tweaks of these two won't change that mediocrity much.

    Yes, Fusion is quality, but this company still needs incentives to move them in big numbers. There's a long history of missteps that cannot be blamed on disgruntled people like me. And when I see the Saturn Aura and 2008 Malibu and 2008 CTS, I wonder why Ford thinks the Fusion is so bold. It's a darn nice car, but in a field where there are a lot of darn nice cars. What is needed are some bold moves.
  • bamacarbamacar Posts: 749
    The Saturn Aura looks good in a Opel way, but not too cutting edge (when compared to other brands not the recent stale Saturn look). The Malibu looks like a great improvement over the past models, but the CTS looks like a rehash. If anything it appears less bold than the 500 and Focus revisions.
  • garandmangarandman Posts: 524
    Getting back to the topic, when will the 3.5l cars be available in showrooms?
This discussion has been closed.