Hyundai Azera Transmission
First, the seat preset switches only work with the ignition turned on.The seats are substantially flat and are lacking in adjust ability.
Other issues I had include rough idling, lulls in RPM before shifting, inconsistent shifting.
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I agree with these issues. I would add that all electronics are disabled without the key. I don't like it. I like to run the radio without the key and be able to charge the cell phone via the 12 v outlets without the ignition on. These certainly ARE annoyances.
Also, I've noticed lulls before shifts - especially when the engine is cold. Usually I can control shifts with manipulation of the accelerator, but I haven't been able to do that well with the Azera. There seems to be some hesitation as if the transmission is trying to decide whether to shift or not. The shifts are, for me, too smooth and seem to take forever to glide into the next gear. If you push on the accelerator when this "glide" is happening, it's almost as if the engine and transmission can't decide what to do.
However, I haven't noticed rough idling when the engine is warm and I have no problem with the feel of the brakes.
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Comments
Ric...As for transmission "hesitation"...it is my understanding that the transmission "learns" somewhat from the way it has been drive over time. Did your car have some miles on it (showroom, transit etc.) where someone might have driven in a way to cause this "behavior." Mine is not hesitant at all....very smooth and downshifts decisively and upshifts almost un-noticeable, but not with any slush or hesitation. Have you tried to manu-shift? Perhaps using that for a while will "program" it for the kind of shifting you prefer? Again, this is something where it would be nice if Hyundai USA Marketing and Service had help orientation sessions for both sales, management and service people BEFORE the first sets of cars were on the road. Collectively on this board, we know a lot more than 99.9% of the Hyundai dealership personnel. We have read the technical service bulletins, but they seemingly have not. Most car manufacturers invite at least one salesperson and the manager, as well as a service manager or tech out to a proving ground to demo a new model and go through all features and "issues" from A to Z (sorry). I received a detailed questionnaire from Hyundai USA today about my 1/31 purchase and basically I gave the car an A and the sales experience an A, but the rest of the dealership and knowledge of car an F minus. Disgraceful.
As for transmission "hesitation"...it is my understanding that the transmission "learns" somewhat from the way it has been drive over time. Did your car have some miles on it (showroom, transit etc.) where someone might have driven in a way to cause this "behavior."
My car had over 400 miles on it when I purchased it. I haven't heard about the "learning" transmission. That's interesting. How is that supposed to work? I guess I can shift manually for a while and see if that helps "reprogram" the transmission to my liking.
I also noticed that the throttle response on the Azera is fairly tame for the first 20% but then snaps fairly sharply into a burst of power just beyond that. Has anybody else noticed that? So, when I'm pulling from a dead stop, I can either take it very slowly and smoothly, or, if I push it just a tad too much, it darts forward -- even spinning the wheels some and then I have to back off because I didn't intend to go THAT quickly. In other words, the "mid-ground" of acceleration is hard to find. Either its "slow as she goes" or it's "launch time."
I will get used to it and learn to adapt, but, right now, it is quite a bit different than my smooth V6 passat which had a much more predictable and controllable throttle response and gear shift.
According to the Service Manager at my local dealership, the memory seat function without key in ignition can be retro fixed. It probably will require a relay being installed to activate the computer without the ignition turned on. He informed me that he is a member of the Hyundai engineering committee, and that he will pursue the problem. More complaints to Hyundai US will generate more attention to owner concerns.
Hmmm. . . My owner's manuals states there IS NO formal "break-in" for the engine.
To assume that I've told anyone how to drive is perposterous! The quip about "driving Miss Daisy" wasn't to be meant literally, but then again, you may be one of those that live in a literal world...my apologies if you took offense. :shades:
The only thing I stated was that if you do drive easy in the beginning, and it's not your normal style, then you would maybe want to disconnect the battery so that the transmission can reset and then you can drive normal so that it may "learn".
So...sit back, take a deep breath, play some Yani and relax. Wait a minute...scratch that, you may think I'm "TELLING" you what to do again. I would also hate to think that I'm telling you that you even like Yani to begin with. Oh...what the heck, do it anyway! :P
As far as driving style, I live in the DC area and I drive in a manner that allows me to flow with traffic and not be the one holding it up. Simply put, I drive to survive!
Here's what the manual states:
During the First 1,200 miles (2,000 Km).
No formal "break-in" procedure is required with your new Hyundai. However, you can contribute to the economical operation and durability of your Hyundai by observing the following recommendations during the frist 1,200 miles (2,000 km).
* Don't drive faster than 55 MPH (88 km/h)
* While driving, keep your engine speed (rpm or revolutions per minute) between 2,000 rpm and 4,000 rpm)
* Use moderate acceleration. Don't start quickly or depress the accelerator pedal fully.
* For the first 200 miles (300 km) try to avoid hard stops.
* Whether doing fast or slow, vary your speed from time to time.
* Don't let the engine idle longer than 3 minutes at one time
* Don't tow a trailer during the first 1,200 miles (2,000 km) of operation.
I guess it's best to do what you can. A lot of those recommendations are unrealistic. If a deer jumps in front of your Azera, you're going to probably "hard brake". Keeping the rmp between 2,000 and 4,000 is almost impossible. Never letting the car idle for more than 3 minutes can be difficult in some situations. Keeping the speed under 55 can actually be dangerous on some freeways.
If anyone has been given different information, I would appreciate your sharing it.
My shifts on the transmission just don't "feel right." I disconnected the battery for 15 minutes and reconnected in hopes that the "learning points" were reset. I didn't notice any difference, however, afterward.
Shifts are mushy and inconsistent -- both down-shifting and up-shifting. RPMs surge up and down even within the same gear.
Example: I'm traveling up a hill at 40 MPH. In 5th gear it is at about 1300 RPM. I push on the gas more to keep it at 40MPH, I notice a definite down-shift and surge and the RPMs go up to about 2200 RPM. But then I put it in the "manual" shift position and I notice that I'm still in 5th gear. Odd, because I "felt" a definite down shift and surge.
So, then I DO down-shift manually to 4th. The RPMs jump to about 2500 and then fall drastically to about 1600, yet my speed hasn't changed. It's almost like the transmission slipped for a moment and then caught on.
I keep it manually in 4th gear and push on the gas to accelerate and then there is the "feel" of a down-shift" and the RPMs jump back up to about 2200, yet the instrumentation indicates I'm still in 4th gear. I then take my foot off the gas completely, and there's a "lag" feeling (almost like the engine's going to die) and the RPMS bounce way down to about 1200. I press on the gas again and I surge forward and the RPMs bounce up to 2200. All of this while still manually in 4th gear.
Then I shift to fifth gear manually and there's a definite shift down and the RPMs drop to about 1200.
But all of these "shifts" and "surges" and "lags" and RPM changes all within the SAME gear is odd to me. And I can do these things in ANY gear. It's like I have 20 total gears all going up and down all over the place while I'm driving.
I'm used to my Passat which was very predictable in shifting while in the automatic mode. I could easily manipulate the accelerator to precisely change the shift point. And in the manual mode was very crisp and clean when I up or down shifted. The Azera is just the opposite and I'm having a very hard time getting used to it.
a.) the "Transmission Control Module" which picks up information from other systems in the car (which are independent of your own particular driving habits)
b.) "Adaptive" mechanism for the transmission which DOES change over time with your own driving behavior (not sure if it serves as additional input to the Transmission Control Module or whether this is another unit?)
In any event, it is my understanding further that:
a.) The Transmission Control Module can be checked and modified (if necessary) with their scanning tools
b.) The "memory" for the transmission can be erased by disconnecting the battery (however, that also will force you to re-enter a lot of other information which should be on some kind of separate battery back-up, but is not!!)
I would try and get some response from Hyundai USA about getting your transmission to perform more to your liking. I do know that there was a major issue years ago with harsh shifting Hyundai transmissions that led to a class-action lawsuit....so they will probably be sensitive to helping in this area, since it seems like you and Ric are having the opposite problem (too subtle?)
I am coming from a BMW 740iL which really kicks you in the pants when you downshift, so it is hard for me to make a judgement as to whether this is correct behavior, but mine is also quite "smooth" whereas I would rather have the more pronounced downshifts.
Starting with late 2004 or early 2005 production, disconnecting the battery no longer erases the TCM's "learned" shift quality programming in Hyundai automatic transmissions. That can only be accomplished now using the High-Scan code reader/reprogrammer tool. Much of the "mushy" shifting in your new transmission is the result of brand new clutch facings that are still establishing a full seat against their driven plates. It'll get better. Still, you might wanna check your AT fluid level on the off chance it's a bit low. Your owner's manual gives instructions and it isn't rocket science. Use ONLY SP-III ATF for top up if necessary. NEVER fill above the full mark on the ATF dipstick. Some of your phantom shifts when ascending a slight grade at ~40mph could well be nothing more than torque converter lockup kicking out. That speed is about where TCL is engaged, so if the engine is pulling, the trannie may "hunt".
“After driving several large, top-of-the-line sedans in the past couple of years, some costing more than $80,000, we wondered whether the new, $28,000 Hyundai Azera might put them all to shame. That didn't happen.
“ Handling is reasonably sharp, and the car's suspension, while too soft for vigorous sport-sedan-style driving, gives a nice combination of isolation from bumps and feedback from the road.”
“ The Azera appears to mark the end of buyers having to explain their reasons for buying a Hyundai. Where previous models lagged behind the competition in design, quality and performance, the Azera is at least on par with rivals. We also think it has a prettier shape than many competitors. Its low cost is simply icing on the cake.”
Nonetheless, at $28K the Azera is too expensive and I would never buy it regardless of what the Wall Street Journal says.
The only resetting of the "Adaptive" shifting is to reenter the current settings if the transmission is replaced. Why one would want to do this is beyond me.
The Hyundai computer tool can't accomplish this task
Not sure I understand why, unless you are so conscious of the brand-status that you would rather drive a different name that you think projects a different image for yourself?
1.) I have not seen an unfavorable review from ANY source...Every reviewer (knowledgeable car people who do this for a living) have heaped varying degrees of praise and have ESPECIALLY noted that the car is anything but "too expensive". The Wall Street Journal mentioned about $5,000-$7,000 if I recall, as the value excess.
2.) I have not seen one purchaser amongst ALL of the ones who have posted on this forum and have posted almost 100 reviews, indicate they have had ANY serious problem with the car during the first 1,000-4,000 miles. Truly amazing.
3.) The feature set found on the Limited Ultimate, which includes such nice touches as:
rain-sense windshield wipers, light-sense headlight control, true driver/passenger A/C-heat individual settings with rear-passenger outlets, high-quality air filter, rear window automatic sunshade, 310 watt (read carefully--310 watt) Infinity Stereo with 6 disc in-dash CD, plays MP3 discs and reads codes, stereo cassette, full-size spare (thank you!), fold-down rear seats with huge 16 cu ft. trunk to boot (bad pun), power side mirror retractors, real leather seats with nice stitching, memory settings for power seat, electric tilt/telescope steering column and sideview mirrors, expensive Gentex rearview mirror with electronic compass and homelink built in, eyeglass holder, only car in its class with electric tilt/telescope steering wheel and EZ-out programming; electronic stability control, anti-lock brakes, all airbags and side gear, cruise control, active-restraint headrests, 0-60 in around 6.5 seconds, 5 year 60k bumper-bumper warranty, sunroof/moonroof, ergonomically-pleasant (as the WSJ also emphasized...nice car to spend a lot of time in!!), good looking, huge interior space with giant back seat and legroom.....
I can understand if you just don't like Hyundai, don't like "foreign" cars, don't like the styling...but when you say it is "too expensive" I don't understand what you are talking about. Car can be bought out the door as above for $27,500 approx. If depreciation has you worried, and you don't intend to own the car more than 4-5 years (at which time you will overcome depreciation for an Avalon with difference in price) then you can lease the car....but TOO EXPENSIVE??? NO WAY JOSE
Obviously, Azera owners must find a way to justify shelling out $27-$28K for a $20,000 car. But in no way is the Azera an entry luxury sedan.
Obviously you have not been inside or driven an Azera.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I don't think any of us in here REALLY care what car you end up with, but whatever it is, enjoy it!
You might want to spend some time in the rooms of those cars you do like instead of in one of which you think is so bad for the money.
Just curious though, if you had to spend ONLY $22,000 to $30,000 for a new large luxurious powerful car with lots of up-to-date features, on what WOULD you spend it? (and not a Sonata LX since it is available for SO much less $)
Interesting perspective. In our extended family, we have a Lexus 450, Lexus 330 and a Hyundai Azera. When we're all together and it's time for all of us to go out, guess which vehicle everybody wants to take? Yep, the Azera.
Sure, one reason might be that the Azera is the "newest" vehicle of the bunch and it's still a "novelty." But, everyone is very impressed with the looks, the finish and the ride of the Azera -- And these comments are coming from Lexus owners.
I have had no major problems with the Azera and it's certainly a step above my previous VW Passat. I very much look forward to driving and even find excuses to take a spin.
However, with that said, there are a few items that bother me a little. One is the uncertainty of the crash data (#1 on my list). Another is the rather poorer than expected gas mileage. I drive about 70% city and I'm averaging around 17-18. With my Passat V6, I averaged about 22. And the other issue is with the transmission which I'm still uncomfortable with.
None of my "issues" have to do with a mechanical problem. They are just overall issues for me and the Azera.
With my month with the Azera, I can declare that it's the best car I ever owned and a "step up" over my Passat.
But I respect other viewpoints. If somebody feels the Azera is a step down over a Camry, then so be it. Everybody has different needs and expectations. However, the "professional" testers of vehicles have been very impressed with the Azera and would certainly differ with that opinion.
Are you kidding, you think getting a Azera is moving up from Chevy or Saturn?? nah i dont think, the Impala can run circles around the Azera. the Azera as a nice car, but a little overpriced 20 to 25k is more reasonable, you can get a 300 Touring for tha kind of money, never thougt id see the day where Hyundai would be asking 30k for a car. i do agree with you about the Azera not beign a entry lux car.
"When the Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (www.iihs.org) crash-tested a 1996 Hyundai Sonata some years ago, the car did poorly. The passenger compartment buckled, and the crash dummy's head almost hit the windshield pillar.
A few years later, the IIHS crash tested a 1999 Sonata, a new generation of the car. This time, the Sonata did better overall, but the Insurance Institute rated the car's front-crash performance "marginal," because the car's structure didn't do enough to protect the dummy's legs, and the metal around the passenger compartment -- the "safety cage" -- showed signs of considerable buckling.
Last night the Insurance Institute released a test of the 2006 Hyundai Sonata, a redesigned car being assembled at a new Hyundai factory in Alabama. This time, the Institute tested the car twice. In the first test, the seat flopped back and forth during the crash because the seatbelt got tangled in the seat-adjustment lever. Hyundai engineers redesigned the lever, AND RECALLED ALL CARS MADE BEFORE Aug. 1, 2005 to fix the old design.
The Institute retested the car, and gave it a good front-crash rating. Video shows how the new Sonata's front end crumpled from the force of hitting a barrier at 40 miles per hour. But the cage around the dummy driver – framed by the driver's side window -- looks almost intact.
The new Sonata also did better on side-impact tests, improving to "acceptable" from the "poor" rating handed to the previous-generation car. One reason: The new Sonata has standard side-curtain airbags for the front and rear seats, and standard side airbags to protect the torso. The Sonata is one of the few cars with a base price below $20,000 to offer standard side-curtain airbags"
I could also feel the steering vibrating slightly when stopped & in gear with no A/C on. I don't know if this is normal. I am planning to have the dealer checked out the car soon. Any advise/experiences ar most appreciated!
I'm not saying you don't have a problem, but I'm not convinced you do, either. A half second may be in the realm of normal operation. It takes some time, regardless how brief, for the pump to pressurize the appropriate clutches once the valve body solonoids activate for a shift or mode change. At engine idle speed, that delay might be perceptably longer. There's also the matter of tranny clutch materials running-in to their full adhesion properties. (Their milled surfaces are somewhat soft, initially, and slip a bit in the takeup transitions. I had a hard time distinguishing my '03 Sonata's shifts at all for the first couple of weeks. After a thousand miles, they became consistently noticeable - but still creamy smooth, even to this day. Hyundai definitely got shift quality right on mine.) Finally, your "fuzzy logic" TCM mapping is slowly learning your driving characteristics. Definitely have your dealer check it out, though. Maybe drive a well run-in demo for comparison while you're there, too.
You might want to run a search of this forum, too. There were a lot of earlier posts about how the "learning" aspect of the tranny might be mis-taught by a succession of test drivers before you ever took delivery of the car. The dealer can reset this so it can learn your habits from scratch, though knowledgeable posts indicate it's not as simple a task as disconnecting the battery as some have thought.
Briefly disconnecting the battery's negative terminal used to wipe the TCM's volatile memory and less than a minute was sufficient. However, Hyundai responded to owner complaints that whenever the battery was disconnected for replacement or other electrical repair procedures, sometimes at advanced accumulated mileage*, their transmissions shifted like poop afterward. Hyundai's response in mid-2004 was to use non-volatile memory in the TCM to store shift point/quality mapping. To erase the accumulated mapping now requires active intervention with the handy-dandy HighScan code-reader/reprogramming tool.
*Adaptive learning also elliminates the need for periodic trips back to the dealership for transmission band adjustments. The good news is that "takeup" over the service life of the transmission is essentially continuous. The not-so-good news for owners of pre-2004 Hyundai automatics is that, should the battery be disconnected at some advanced accumulated mileage, "getting back" to previously established shift patterns with currently established clutch facing wear, is likely to be a somewhat drawn-out process...
I realize this reply might not make you happy but it simply states the facts.
as i drove, there was almost no acceleration. pulled over and had Hyundai road service tow it to the dealer. any idea what this is? dealer can't look at it until tomorrow.
They did provide a loaner (brand new sonata V6 but its not my Azera!?!)
If I do NOT come to a full stop and give gas my car will continue from 3rd gear. I have never seen it go from 3rd to 2nd gear and my mechanic says it's normal.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Thanks