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Kia Sedona (2005 and Earlier)



  • killerk,

    Yes your right...the Sedona is heavy no doubt about it. And yes it does play on the fuel mileage a little. With that said let me ask a question......Whats wrong with a little extra weight? It may be low tech but they acheived a 5 star crash rating and I'm certain the steel has something to do with it. The extra weight also makes for a nice ride. The 3.5 V6 is stout enough and the brakes are good enough that you wont notice the weight much.

    All Sedona's are 7 passenger. The middle row differs between the LX(small middle bench) or EX(captains chairs). If your looking for the most van for the least amount of out of pocket as possible go for the LX and laugh all the way to the bank. If your looking for an affordable luxury cruiser that wont break the bank get the EX.

    As for the '06......I'm sure its gonna be even better than the current Sedona so if you can wait why not? Just expect to pay more for them. At least initially.

    As for our new Sedona(we used to also own an '02), We have a small vibration when braking from high speeds the dealer is having trouble tracking down. other than that we love it!

    '04 Sedona EX
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Posts: 2,554
    Sedona is heavier than it needs to be. I feel Kia decided not to spend extra money on better engineering or lighter materials at the expense of fuel economy. That said, fuel economy seems to be closer to other minivans than the EPA numbers would suggest. The 2004 models have higher EPA ratings than the 2002-2003, which I think were on the conservative side at 20mpg highway. Sedona's curb weight is actually more like 4800 pounds, not 4600! Still, there are several vans that weigh 4000+ pounds. I believe the AWD Chrysler T&C is about 4500 and that's the closest competitor in weight. In our use of the van, it still feels peppy and responsive. This is a good engine/transmission combo, even if the professional reviewers don't think so.

    The extra weight does not bother me. Car and Driver's review pointed out that some aspects of Sedona's underbelly are pretty heavy duty. Except for a fuel economy and possibly handling penalty, I see no drawbacks. Our minivan is a minivan and to me it handles just fine. We get 21-25mpg highway depending on the circumstances, and this is reasonable for a minivan.

    Sedona LX models come with a bench seat in the 2nd row. I don't recall if it is rated for 2 passengers or 3.
  • I read with interest the exchanges regarding tires. We had 48,000 miles on our 2002 EX and needed to replace them. Step one, call the dealer. He tried to sell us Firestones that were S rated. I was looking to replace the original Hankooks. He said he would order them if I wanted them, but that the tire he was suggesting was better. I could tell from our brief discussion that he was not the guy to talk speed ratings with and decided to shop around.

    I discussed speed rating with Sears and the biggest "local tire guy." Both were willing to order H rated tires for me, but BOTH recommended S rated tires (from two different makers).

    Next step, go to the Hankook site and talk to a Hankook authorized dealer. There was only one in our area. A small local shop with great service and a no-nonsense approach. Not surprisingly, he recommended Hankooks, but he too suggested an S rated tire, the Mileage Plus. We talked at length about the speed rating difference. He explained that the Mileage Plus had better traction and treadware that the H rated original tires. He said Kia put H-rated tires on as the original equipment because of the top speed of the van. He explained that the H rated tires were good, but that he believed the S rated tire he was recommending was safer because of the better wet and snow traction. He fininshed by giving me quotes on both. The original Hankooks were 15 dollars cheaper per tires -- hardly a difference.

    I chose to go with his recommendation. We have about 2000 miles on the Mileage Plus and very pleased. Naturally, the van rides smoother, quieter and handles better -- new tread alone would account for that. But, I think it rides and handles a bit better than when it was new. Of course, I could be deluding myself to justify the purchase.

    It goes without saying that just about any new tire would be safer than H rated tires with 48,000 miles on them. So, I am not concerned about the choice we made. I am curious though what others hear when they talk to "the tire guys" when it comes time to replce the originals.
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Posts: 2,554
    Sounds like you did your homework.

    Which brand is the 'Mileage Plus' tire you chose?
  • The Mileage Plus are Hankooks. Four of them installed cost us $345. I had them do a front end allignment for an additional 40 bucks. They ride great and have an 85000 mile warranty. Worth a look if you can find a dealer nearby.
  • jendjend Posts: 6
    We only had 200 miles on our Sedona EX before having to evacuate Melbourne Florida because of this hurricane! I only owned my Kia for one week!

    Just wanted to let you know that we loved having the Sedona to withstand stop and go traffic on the roads...millions were evacuated! And most of the travel time was spent at a complete stand still...I-4 was a parking lot!

    Gas mileage was my husband says..I don't pay too much attention to that..although I know I should with prices these days! I also have to say that having the (portable DVD player) at a time like this was a BLESSING!! Remember I was the one asking about installing overhead or headrest version. Needless to say..we haven't done either yet.

    Thanks again for all your comments..we love our Kia!
  • Jend,

    Congrats on your new Sedona. We too weathered the storm here in Tampa but our Sedona stayed tucked away in the garage and didnt see a drop of rain. Glad you enjoyed the Sedona even in a stressfull time.

    '04 Sedona EX
  • Occasionally, our sliding doors hang up a little bit. The dealer said that they use Syl-glide to keep them well lubed. Was wondering if anybody has dealt with this product? Was thinking of getting some to keep at home.

    Also, when being closed, the passenger window has developed a click at the end of its travel. Seems to come and go. So far, does not seem to affect operation of the window at all.

    If these points have been discussed recently, I apologize for rehashing them - I have not checked out the site for several months.
  • steverstever Posts: 52,683
    The Honda Odyssey people seem to have good luck with something called Shin-Etsu or similar (I never can remember the spelling).

    Steve, Host
  • navyairnavyair Posts: 202
    Hi, everyone. I know that not everyone cruises different boards. This is worthy of repeating on the speed rating of tires discussion we were having earlier. It does a much better job of explaining why (personal opinion) to stick with the OEM speed rating of the tire to have that defined safety margin.

    From the tires forum:

    "#4129 of 4141 Re: Importance of speed ratings [bluedevils] by yurakm Sep 02, 2004 (9:03 am)

    Tires blow out or fall apart when hot, Ford Explorer style. They turn hot for different reasons, or more often a combination of reasons: high speed, overloaded (or heavy) car, low tire pressure, hot air / pavement, etc.

    Tires are rated for temperature resistance. The best rate used to be A, but now some tires are rated AA; the worst rate is C. Most cars have B-rated tires, with C-rated factory installed on many tracks. The infamous Firestone tires factory installed on Ford Explorer were rated C.

    In theory, the speed rating and temperature rating are different. In practice, tires H-rated for speed are A-rated for temperature, while S- and T-rated tires are B-rated. Z rate came with AA. At least it was so the last time I checked at Tirerack.

    It means that even if you never drive as fast as 120 mph (or even at 90 mph for this matter), with H-rated tires you will have much better safety margins against underinflated tire, factory defects, long trips with family (load), etc. Especially important with your heavy minivan.
    #4130 of 4141 Heavy minivan by corvette Sep 02, 2004 (9:26 am)

    Egads, 4800 lbs? And that's before you strap Aunt Edna to the roof for the family roadtrip! Be sure the load rating on the replacement tires is at least as high as the originals.

    Don't Michelin tires have the lowest failure rate?
    #4131 of 4141 Re: Importance of speed ratings [bluedevils] by capriracer Sep 04, 2004 (6:55 am)

    Some background on speed ratings:

    Speed ratings are based on an indoor wheel test that relates very well to the real world. But like many types of ratings, there are things that folks need to be aware of.

    A tire's actual speed capability can be adversely affected by many things. Inflation pressure is one of them. Even if the tire has enough inflation to carry the load being applied, it's speed capability goes down with reduced inflation - I've seen as much as 2 steps.

    Speed ratings are based on smooth road surfaces. Add some bumps and the speed capability goes down.

    As tires age, their ability to perform decreases. This applies to speed as well. The latest research I have seen indicates that this performance degradation is very much age related and not related to the amount of usage the tire has seen. The research said the degradation can be as high as 2 steps in speed capability.

    This also means that an unused tire in the spare rack has degraded performance at about the same level as the tire that is has been used for 40,000 miles and is practically worn out. While I have some problems with this research, my experience seems to agree with this. So my current recommendation is that tires should be replaced when they are 10 years old regardless of the state of wear and where they have been used, and that folks that live in AZ, CA, NV, TX, NM, and FL, the age limit is reduced to 6 years. Other places are in between 6 and 10 years depending on how far north they live. For example TN would be 8 years.

    It is always good engineering practice to overdesign and underutilize. This means that while the vehicle may not be going 130 mph, it is safer with H rated tires than with S rated tires."

    Hope this helps.
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Posts: 2,554
    Good idea to cross-post that info here.

    I have concluded that, in the specific case of Kia Sedona and Hankook RA07 (H speed rated) and Bridgestone Turanza LS-T (T speed rated) tires in stock P215/70R15 size, the safety margin is no better with the Hankook than with the Bridgestone. Perhaps more accurately, the Bridgestone will provide enough safety margin to allow me to sleep well at night.

    I base this on several factors:
    1. Perceived quality of the Turanza LS-T tire line.
    2. Our Sedona is never driven above 80 mph.
    3. Specs of several P215/70R15 tires as follows:
    Brand / Model / Speed Rating / Treadwear Rating / Trac rating / Temp rating / Max Load (lbs) / Max pressure (psi) / Price per tire
    Hankook RA07 H 440 A B 1653lbs 35psi $58
    Kumho 798 H 440 A B -- -- $55 (info not specified on
    Bridgestone Turanza LS-T T 700 A B 1620 44 $83
    Michelin Hydroedge T 760 A B 1620 35 $102
    Michelin Energy MXV4 V 340 A A 1609 44 $135

    Comparing the tire with the max and the min load rating - Is there any real difference between a tire rated for max load of 1653 pounds vs. a tire rated for max load of 1609 pounds? This seems like an insignificant difference.

    I was surprised to see the H-rated Hankook rated for max 35 psi while the T-rated Turanza was rated max 44 psi.

    Traction and temperature ratings for all 5 tires were the same: A traction and B temperature.

    We put Turanza LS-Ts on our Sedona rather than a new set of Hankook RA07, even though I had no gripes with the Hankooks and a set of 4 would have saved us about $100. Why? Because in spite of the Turanzas' T speed rating, I felt they were better tires and were perfectly safe for our Sedona.
  • We've had our Sedona about a week and a half now and are already contemplating a few modifications. We bought the LX because of its incredible value, however there are a couple of the EX features I wish we had. The main one is a keyless entry system. There are several aftermarket companies that sell kits for around $100 that one can install themselves. I'm curious if anyone here has installed an aftermarket keyless entry kit? If so, please share your experiences. I also wonder if I were to install such a kit would it void any part of my warranty should there be some sort of electrical problem.

    Secondly, my wife is kicking me for not getting the EX for the captains chairs. Our 1 and 3 year old are in too close proximity in the middle seat as they don't leave eachother alone, and the rear seat is too far back. I read from someone else here that they wished to remove the middle seat and move the rear set to the middle. I too wish we could do this but the latches on the floor do not match up. The only option I can think of is to try and pick up some captains chairs from a wrecked Sedona EX. The floor latches are there, so it would work. Am I correct in understanding that the cloth grey seats are different between the EX and LX?

    And lastly, I want to get a second set of wheels so I can have a set for snow tires. There is a nice set of Kia Amanti wheels on Ebay and I'm wondering if the Sedona shares wheel offset and lug dimentions with other Kia vehicles.

    Thanks for any information anyone can share.

    - Chad
  • My wife and I bought a 2003 Kia Sedona brand new from a local dealer ( Nisan/Kia of Middletown, N.Y.). We loved the car and aside from some minor problems ( passenger side power seat not working, excessive wear to tires at only 20K miles, hot spots on the brake rotors), we must say that it was an excellent vehicle. Two weeks ago I dropped my daughters off at school which is five minutes from our home. When I returned, I noticed smoke coming out of the vent on the drivers side. I could not believe it the car was serviced properly, and still had nine years and 80,000 miles left on the warranty... how was this happening??? I went in the house to tell my wife we had a serious problem with the van and then returned outside to check on the situation with the smoke. At that point the car ( with no keys in the ignition) started all by itself, and the windshield wipers switched on. Not knowing what to do, I called Kia roadside assistance to see if they could tell me what I should do. While I was on the phone my wife went outside to see what was going on, and when she did the car had filled with smoke. She then opened the door, to let the smoke out of the car and the panic alarm sounded, and then she screamed the car was on fire. I grabbed a small fire extinguisher from our kitchen, but as soon as I saw the flames, I discarded it, ran upstairs and grabbed my seven year old son out of bed and evacuated the house, and called 911. If not for the quickness of the fire department arriving our home would have been destroyed. It is a miracle it was not damaged other than our driveway ( which was paved a year ago) having the surface of it melted, soot stains all over our carpet from the firemen checking the house for any fire, and a bad smokey smell.
    If I had been in the car when the fire started ( or my daughters which were only out of the car 10 minutes before the blaze started we surely would have been burned or killed. The fire chief stated it was an eletrical problem with the car that started the fire, and another two or three minutes and it would have exploded.
    Now for the best part. Kia refuses to talk to us about this problem. We called them an hour after it happened, ,and we have e-mailed them pictures, and the police report. We are still waiting for the official report from the fire chief. We have contacted our dealer, and Kia directly and the case has been turned over to someone , but the operaters at the Kia customer service hotline will not give me a name. or a contact number. This is madness. What good is their warranty, if they will not back it up.
    Anyway for those of you that have a Sedona already, I pray that you will not have to go through the agony that my family is experiencing. If you are thinking of buying one I would not suggest it, these cars are a death trap waiting to happen.
    Also just a note the car was totally stock. there was no after market equipment ever installed in the vehicle. Oh, and yes we have alredy contacted a lawyer!!!
  • steverstever Posts: 52,683
    If Kia knows you have a lawyer, they probably won't talk to you anymore. That's fine - that's what the lawyer is there for. Good luck!

    Steve, Host
  • theundying,

    I am dissapointed you had such a traumatic experience. If that event happened to me I suppose I'd use similar if not stronger language in opposition to Kia's Sedona.

    I imagine you are a one in a million case otherwise NHTSA would be all over the Sedona. I've seen all kinds of cars on the side of the road over the years that flamed to nothing. I wouldn't call the Sedona a death trap anymore than I'd call the Toyota Camry I saw once burned up once either. Sometimes good products malfunction.

    We owned an '02 Sedona for a while then traded for an '04 and have had some nuisance problems(mostly with the crappy dealer) but we still enjoy the Sedona. I just hope if it ever does take a dump on us it wont be as dramatic as yours.

    '04 Sedona EX
  • nornenorne Posts: 136
    Kia should just play dumb like Honda and blame it on poor techs and jiffy lubes.
  • Norne,

    Sounds like an interesting story you have to tell. Do tell :-)

  • navyairnavyair Posts: 202
    OK, let me see if I have this right...a car with an obvious electrical problem is smoking in your garage, and the phone is going to resolve the problem? There appears to have been plenty of warning to move the vehicle out of your garage and away from the house including when you first noticed smoke coming out of the vents. How was this part Kia's fault?

    I'm sure the emotions and adrenalin are still running high, but death trap? Madness? Although your wife's reaction to open the door was very typical, the fire folks tell you not to open doors to your house that have smoke/heat because the increased oxygen/fresh air can cause the flames to break out.

    If your description was correct, and your children had been in the car, would you really have continued driving when smoke came out the vents, or would you have pulled over and unloaded everyone from the vehicle?

    I'm sorry you feel like a victim but this is exactly why Americans have become a litigous society and the lawyers run roughshod over everything. You carry car insurance, let them and "their" lawyers work it out with Kia. Meanwhile drive on with your life.

    BTW, I fought a car fire at my father's service station many years ago, and again roadside with a trucker not so many years ago. Once they start to burn, you won't put one out with typical home extinguishers, no matter what size/class...just too much to burn.

    I had a brand new aircraft with 60 flight hours on it blow up on me in the air and dump me out into the slipstream at 500mph...I flew 10 days later, as soon as I got my arm out of the sling and didn't call Grumman products death traps and warn other aviators to stay away...sometimes good products just have hidden defects and malfunction.

    I am not trying to start a free fire zone here, but this isn't a Pinto/exploding gas tank situation here, and unless yours happens to be the tip of a "Kia hidden defect" iceburg, I think you are overreacting a bit.
  • First of all read what I wrote!!!! What a typical know it alll response.
    1)I never stated that the car was in the garage. the car, it was in fact in the driveway.

    2) The car did not start smoking until I pulled into my driveway. I had just dropped my kids off at school. If the car had started smoking while they were in the car, or while I was driving on the street, I would have shut it off, and pulled over and evaxcuated the car.

    3) There was no warning of an eletrical problem, until the car started smoking.

    4) How is this Kia's problem... hmmmmm.... let's see the car only had 9 years and 80k miles left on the warranty. No, you are right I should just go on with my life and let my insurance company cut me a check that will not payoff my loan, replace the same car ( KIa's reasale value is terrible in comparison to other similar vehicles), or fix the driveway I just had repaved for $1000.00.

    5) The car door was opened to let the smoke out of the car. We did not know the fire had started or that there was even a potential fire until the door was open and this happened after the panic had sounded

    6) I also found two other people who have had their Sedona's catch fire as well. Hidden defect....???

    7) Since Kia will not tell me what they intend on doing ( I finally spoke to someone who promised to call me back with a decision yesterday, as they are aware this is their responsibility, and they never bothered), yes I think a lawyer is necessary.

    8) "There appears to have been plenty of warning to move the vehicle out of your garage and away from the house including when you first noticed smoke coming out of the vents. How was this part Kia's fault?"
     This is the dumbest statement I have ever heard. The car is one year old. It certainly is not my fault, and as far as getting in the car and moving it, it took less than five minutes for the whole event to take place.

    Every message board has at least one person who knows everything and posts messages without even reading and acknowledging the full content of the post. You have no idea what we have been through and if you had any clue, you would've thought twice about the comments you made.
  • navyairnavyair Posts: 202
    I can see that you are a person on an even keel especially after those two posts of yours, so if the group feels I'm out of line, I will apologize.

    You will note that I refrain from personal attacks in my posts, and suggest you do the same in the future.

    BTW, if you haven't looked into it, your homeowners insurance probably will cover your driveway damage, minus the deductible.

    This post probably belongs on the Kia Problems board, so apologize to the group/host in advance.
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Posts: 2,554
    Hey, relax. I am very sorry to hear about the problem with your Sedona. It must have been fairly traumatic. I hope this is a fluke occurrence and is not a design defect that may be likely to occur on other Sedonas. Still, there is no reason to come on this board and say 'Kia Sedona is a death trap.' That is a silly thing to say. These sorts of things happen to vehicles of all makes and models. It is simply the rate of occurrence, which a single owner cannot determine based solely on his/her own experience, that determines the quality of the vehicle.

    navyair is a frequent contributor to the Sedona forums. He/she is not a know-it-all and is quite a helpful and even-keeled poster. His/her response to your post was a little strong, but I felt it was mostly on target, save for the part where he thought your car was in the garage when this happened.

    I do agree with you that a lawyer is probably needed in this situation. I also agree with navyair that our society has become overly litigious.
  • I too thought Navyair might have been a little strong in the reply but I will admit I also was a little irritated by the comment accusing the Kia Sedona of being a "Deathtrap".

    I have no more fear of my Sedona catching fire in my garage than I would if I had a Chrysler or GM in there.

    As I mentioned in a previous post, Had that happened to me I'd expect Kia to step up and do the right thing and not only replace my vehicle, but repair my driveway IN ADDITION to compensating me for "Loss of use".

    The only way I could imagine Kia not willingly do this is if there were modifications done that caused the failure.

    '04 Sedona EX
  • nornenorne Posts: 136

    Oh I was just trying to make a point that no car company is perfect. There will always be defective cars whether its honda or kia or whatever. I thought I would just mentioned Honda since there is a big discussion going on in the honda cr-v and has honda run out forum about cr-v's catching fire after the first oil change but no one calls them death traps.
  • If I offended anyone with my statements about the Sedona being a death trap I apologize. You have to put yourself in our shoes. We really did love the van until it burst into flames, and as a result it makes it that much harder to swallow.
    I am sure that Navyair was just trying to provide some information, but I took it the wrong way, and saw it as a personal attack. For this I apologize to Navyair as well.
    Anyway, we did finally hear from Kia Motors of America, and they rejected our claim (without even asking us any question or even viewing the police or fire report), so we are proceeding with a law suit. We have also contacted the attorney general of N.Y.S., the N.H.T.S.A. and about a dozen other consumer advocate groups. My main complaint is that Kia advertises how great their warranty is, and if this isn't a defect, than what is???? We should actually make a service appointment for warranty work at the dealership. Can you imagine the look on their faces?
    So in closing, my apologies and respect to all who have read our story, and posted their views on it.
  • Rejected your claim? On what basis? Are they saying it was not a manufacterer defect? Did a Kia rep even inspect the vehicle? Where is the vehicle now?

    '04 Sedona EX
  • bluedevilsbluedevils Posts: 2,554
    I didn't like your characterization of Sedona as a 'deathtrap' but I am still with you that Kia should replace your van. What do you mean, they rejected your claim? You mean you asked them to repair the van under the factory warranty and they denied it? Did you make this attempt through your dealer, just as anyone would with a normal warranty repair? Or was this through Kia USA or what?

    I'm very curious to hear how this turns out; please keep us posted. Obviously, Kia owes you a new van and I don't see how an impartial observer could see otherwise. It seems Kia would have to prove the problem was caused by user negligence or something like that, and that does not seem to be the case.

    What vehicles are you considering as a replacement for your Sedona?
  • After doing some research online, I found 6 other Sedona's that have burst into flames, due to eletrical problems. If anyone is interested, 5 of the complaints are posted at the N.H.T.S.A. website.
    To me it makes me wonder what kind of company Kia is? If you look at the list of problems that people have had and how poorly they are compensated it is unreal. I feel like we were treated very unjustly, and it seems we are not the only ones.
    In response to bluedevils, I do not know what kind of vehicle to get at this time. We have three kids so a minivan is really convenient. The crazy thing is that we thought the Sedona was a great car. The whole family liked everything about. Trying to equip a minivan with all the options we had would cost us somewhere between 35-40k if we wanted to get something like a Honda, Nissan, or Toyota ( which have much better resale values). Is any car worth paying that much for???? I mean at this point I would have a hard time believing in any warranty. We might just go with Chrysler. At this point I just have no idea.
  • I spoke to a represntative of Kia Motors of America. Our claim was rejected because they say it is an insurance issue. I didn't know that the insurance company had a ten year 100K mile warranty on our vehicle!!! What a joke!!!

    No one inspected the car, because quite frankly they do not give a damn. Even though the fire inspectors report states it was an eletrical fire that started in the dashboard, they stated that they could not be sure that it was in fact the cause of the fire. Since they did not inspect the car how could they be sure. You would think that there would be some concern on there behalf. As I have previously stated we did find at least two other stories online that people that owned Sedona's had experienced the same kind of occurence, and Kia didn't want anything to do with their cases either and referred them to there insurance company. To me that is scary. I understand that this is only a few cars out of thousands, but don't you think that they would show some concern. I am sure if someone was injured in one of these caeses they would being singing a different song. Any opinions??

    At this point the car is still in my driveway because we were hoping Kia would take care of this, and figured they would need to inspect the vehicle. It took almost two weeks for them to even acknowledge they were reviewing our claim. It is heartbreaking to see what used to be our transportation sitting there every time we open our door. Our bank is sending an inspector over today to check out the damage, and then we are moving it to a friends yard until we have figured out what needs to be done.

     As a consumer we feel like we have no power at all, and that is why we are forced to get a lawyer. We would have dropped the whole issue if they would have replaced the vehicle.
  • andrdandrd Posts: 13
    I don`t now if this can help, but last year I was looking under the hood of my Sedona 2002 and I noticed that the main cable power supply was rubbing against a sharp end of a bolt on the driver side at the tower supporting the left strut. I advised the technical services rep. and the cable was redirect a bit lower and some tape was put around it. Promenades Kia in Gatineau was supposed to advise Kia Canada about the problem.
    Where did the fire started under the hood or in the ventilation system?.
    You can buy a base leftover Sienna 2004 that have most of the features of the Sedona for a MSRP of 3-4K more than the Kia and the Toyota has a better fuel economy; also it is a lot roomier and the ride is better on top of the better resale
    value. There is already big discount on the Caravan 2005 here in Canada and i`m sure it is the same thing over the border.
    Good luck with your negotiations with Kia.
  • Thank you for your knowledge. At this point every bit of info that I can gather helps me in this matter. In this case the fire started in between the dashboard, and the fire wall. When the car first began to smoke I popped the hood to see what was up, and there was no smoke coming from under the hood, and instead was pouring out of the drivers side vent.
    Also thank you for the advice about a new vehicle. We will certainly check into the Sienna prices.
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