Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations

snakeweasel

abacomike said:

fintail said:

In visiting and browsing at the local MB dealer and chatting with the salesguys I have dealt with, I've been told I should sell them, as I already know about the option packaging and the history of the cars, and I like the cars. Not sure I could do the selling part though, I'd be more of the "if you don't want to buy it, fine, see ya" - not into the hard sell. The salesguys I know said "the cars sell themselves", but I don't know.

abacomike said:

When I started selling cars back in 2000, it was because it was Lexus that offered me the opportunity. This was in my second life - after retiring from teaching and school administration. If the sales position was with Toyota or Nissan or Ford or Chevy, etc., I would not have taken the job.

I owned Lexus cars in the 1990's and had no problem "selling" people on the attributes of owning or leasing a Lexus. I was selling a car I would own or lease - not a car that I would have difficulty selling.

When the opportunity arose to be a sales manager at an Infiniti dealership, I was driving a G35 at the time and my Dad was driving an M45 (1964-65). Great automobile and easy to sell others on.

So I agree that I could only sell cars or manage sales of cars I would own. I just could not bring myself to be in the car business selling a product I would never buy myself. It's a form of "sales fraud" in my opinion. Trying to sell others on a product you, yourself, would never buy is dishonest to others as well as yourself.

Maybe that's why I was a teacher, school principal, private school headmaster, and a salesman selling a worthy product! 🤓

Once the buyer perceives himself/herself as the owner of that car, sitting behind the steering wheel, the rest is merely agreeing upon an acceptable price. The car sales professional's task is to negotiate with the sales manager buyer for the buyer sales manager - that is the final stage of the sales process - the sales professional becomes the agent for the buyer. The more skilled the buyer's agent is in negotiating with management for a fair price, the more successful that sales professional becomes.

I fixed it for you.

imidazol97

fintail said:

Raspberry interior, so mid-90s Ford. My sister had a Contour, purple! It was a 96. When she traded it in 04, its next stop was either a sketchy BHPH lot or worse, it did not age well and there's no way it would end up on the used car section of a new car dealer, pretty alarming for an 8 year old car. She was young and not meticulous with car care, but I am certain she serviced it properly anyway. I think she got $500 for it, and I told her to be happy, given the condition. It had some electrical quirks that made it technically not roadworthy - I think it had headlight and interior light issues.

Contours were MY 95-00 I believe, with a facelift for MY 98 which enlarged the headlights.

imidazol97 said:

This reminds me of a long time friend who felt sorry for his 20-year old son and bought him a car this week. He contacted a neighbor who runs a junkyard. Asked if she had anything cheap that runs well. Arranged for her to have junior take delivery of an older model from her stock.

When junior stopped to pick up his Ford (maybe a Contour?), silver with faded raspberry interior, 1992 model, his face dropped dramatically when she pointed it out to the son, is the report from the lady running the used car end of the wrecker yard.

I tried to recall the model name my friend told me but I was more struck that it was a 1992 model year. Still running well.

This is for a kid who wrecked a 2017? Mustang that was bought for him after less than a year.
Then he got a 1998? Cobra Mustang in a special yellow paint. AFter many problems with it
he eventually wrecked it recently after he got back driving privileges.
Then a motorcycle which was recently in a not-at-fault accident. Kid's having
surgeries for fix hands and wrist.

It's an unusual story. In a week or so I'll ask again about what model car it is.

snakeweasel

driver100 said:

To me, good salesmanship should be easy.....but, for people who have never done selling before they think there is some kind of magic involved.
Only a con man is going to talk you into something you don't want or can't afford.
If I can find a car, that suits your needs, and the price works for you, then why would you go somewhere else? All I can do is #1...most important FIND OUT WHAT YOUR NEEDS ARE. Then I show you the cars that suit your needs...and I explain how this car is going to suit you. If I had to con people into buying cars they won't like, I would rather find a non-selling job.
A con man can last for a little while, but successful salesmen need repeat business and word of mouth...that will only happen if you have happy, satisfied customers.

I will say that being a good sales person is not easy. To be good at any sales job you need to be able to extract the wants and needs of the buyer, you need to engage that person to get the right information to match that person with the proper product. It's an art form that not everyone can master.

graphicguy

kyfdx said:

ab348 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

You might be better off advertising yourself out to the snowbirds to drive their car down to Florida in the Fall and back in the Spring.

Personally I’d rather have a mature driver take my car than a college kid going down for spring break.

The problem with that is getting yourself to the location of the vehicle and then getting yourself back home once you get to the destination.

GG lives in the CVG area. $99 one way flights, every day, from almost every FL airport (once flying gets back to normal, if it ever does)

Never thought of delivering snow birds their cars. I could do that. And, as Walt mentioned, I can get flights out of CVG pretty regularly and relatively cheaply. Add in a night in a hotel? A couple of stops at a Mickey D, and I could probably have a nice little part time business.....Hmmmmmmm!?!!!!!??!??

oldfarmer50

imidazol97 said:

fintail said:

Raspberry interior, so mid-90s Ford. My sister had a Contour, purple! It was a 96. When she traded it in 04, its next stop was either a sketchy BHPH lot or worse, it did not age well and there's no way it would end up on the used car section of a new car dealer, pretty alarming for an 8 year old car. She was young and not meticulous with car care, but I am certain she serviced it properly anyway. I think she got $500 for it, and I told her to be happy, given the condition. It had some electrical quirks that made it technically not roadworthy - I think it had headlight and interior light issues.

Contours were MY 95-00 I believe, with a facelift for MY 98 which enlarged the headlights.

imidazol97 said:

This reminds me of a long time friend who felt sorry for his 20-year old son and bought him a car this week. He contacted a neighbor who runs a junkyard. Asked if she had anything cheap that runs well. Arranged for her to have junior take delivery of an older model from her stock.

When junior stopped to pick up his Ford (maybe a Contour?), silver with faded raspberry interior, 1992 model, his face dropped dramatically when she pointed it out to the son, is the report from the lady running the used car end of the wrecker yard.

I tried to recall the model name my friend told me but I was more struck that it was a 1992 model year. Still running well.

This is for a kid who wrecked a 2017? Mustang that was bought for him after less than a year.
Then he got a 1998? Cobra Mustang in a special yellow paint. AFter many problems with it
he eventually wrecked it recently after he got back driving privileges.
Then a motorcycle which was recently in a not-at-fault accident. Kid's having
surgeries for fix hands and wrist.

It's an unusual story. In a week or so I'll ask again about what model car it is.

With that kind of driving record I think the Contour would be the first car I bought him.

roadburner

I’ve been driving the G20 3er to work while my 2 Series awaits its new tires. The car’s fuel economy is phenomenal. Today I averaged 44 mpg driving to my office- a number the Mini would be lucky to beat.

andres3

oldfarmer50 said:

graphicguy said:

I may just have some new business cards printed up and start an LLC for car transport. Will have to get off my lazy behind and go talk to some dealerships first to see if there’s any demand for those services.

As far as sales are concerned, I’ve spent my career in high tech sales and marketing. Not sure how that transfers to car sales, though. Way different than going into a dealership and buying a car.

Do you own a tractor-trailer car transporter? That’s the only outfit a car dealer would likely contract with. I think for individual car swaps/deliveries most dealers would want their own part-time (no benefits) staff. It would be tough to undercut minimum wage employees and still make a profit. You might be better off advertising yourself out to the snowbirds to drive their car down to Florida in the Fall and back in the Spring.

Personally I’d rather have a mature driver take my car than a college kid going down for spring break.

What if the mature driver cost twice as much as the college kid, and the college kid had better more solid insurance anyway?

driver100

graphicguy said:

kyfdx said:

ab348 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

You might be better off advertising yourself out to the snowbirds to drive their car down to Florida in the Fall and back in the Spring.

Personally I’d rather have a mature driver take my car than a college kid going down for spring break.

The problem with that is getting yourself to the location of the vehicle and then getting yourself back home once you get to the destination.

GG lives in the CVG area. $99 one way flights, every day, from almost every FL airport (once flying gets back to normal, if it ever does)

Never thought of delivering snow birds their cars. I could do that. And, as Walt mentioned, I can get flights out of CVG pretty regularly and relatively cheaply. Add in a night in a hotel? A couple of stops at a Mickey D, and I could probably have a nice little part time business.....Hmmmmmmm!?!!!!!??!??

GG, being single you may find a unique little angle to add to your business model. Drive the car to Florida and stay to drive the car back, of course depending on...............

andres3

abacomike said:

fintail said:

In visiting and browsing at the local MB dealer and chatting with the salesguys I have dealt with, I've been told I should sell them, as I already know about the option packaging and the history of the cars, and I like the cars. Not sure I could do the selling part though, I'd be more of the "if you don't want to buy it, fine, see ya" - not into the hard sell. The salesguys I know said "the cars sell themselves", but I don't know.

abacomike said:

When I started selling cars back in 2000, it was because it was Lexus that offered me the opportunity. This was in my second life - after retiring from teaching and school administration. If the sales position was with Toyota or Nissan or Ford or Chevy, etc., I would not have taken the job.

I owned Lexus cars in the 1990's and had no problem "selling" people on the attributes of owning or leasing a Lexus. I was selling a car I would own or lease - not a car that I would have difficulty selling.

When the opportunity arose to be a sales manager at an Infiniti dealership, I was driving a G35 at the time and my Dad was driving an M45 (1964-65). Great automobile and easy to sell others on.

So I agree that I could only sell cars or manage sales of cars I would own. I just could not bring myself to be in the car business selling a product I would never buy myself. It's a form of "sales fraud" in my opinion. Trying to sell others on a product you, yourself, would never buy is dishonest to others as well as yourself.

Maybe that's why I was a teacher, school principal, private school headmaster, and a salesman selling a worthy product! 🤓

Cars don't sell themselves fintail! There are many aspects to the "selling" of a car process. The most important, if not critical, piece is the desire on the part of the prospective buyer to "want" a specific car. It's the job of the sales professional to reveal the value built into the vehicle by highlighting the hidden rewards of owning that particular SUV or car.

Once the buyer perceives himself/herself as the owner of that car, sitting behind the steering wheel, the rest is merely agreeing upon an acceptable price. The car sales professional's task is to negotiate with the sales manager for the buyer - that is the final stage of the sales process - the sales professional becomes the agent for the buyer. The more skilled the buyer's agent is in negotiating with management for a fair price, the more successful that sales professional becomes.

I always took the position of becoming the buyer's agent - "...let me see what I can do for you in getting the price you are willing to pay for this vehicle..."! Sounds easier than it is - but if you truly represent the buyer's interests when going to management, you will sell a car.😎

You mean that "let me see what I can do with the Sales Manager" crap isn't all showmanship? Are bottom line margins never discussed at sales meetings?

I think there is a percentage of the population out there that think all sales are gimmicky. I don't need to be sold, if I want something, I'll come to you. Not everyone is like this, but I think a good percentage don't need to be sold. Test driving the TTS and seeing the fit and finish for myself was enough.

The salesman made some great moves ushering me along and cementing the sale, but it was all cement, the brick was already laid down by me.

benjaminh

roadburner said:

I’ve been driving the G20 3er to work while my 2 Series awaits its new tires. The car’s fuel economy is phenomenal. Today I averaged 44 mpg driving to my office- a number the Mini would be lucky to beat.

That is incredible mpg. What kind of speed and conditions?

You've beat my all-time high for mpg in my TLX. This was about 20 miles on a mostly level Interstate on a day when ac wasn't needed. The engine had previously been warmed up before this drive, and the adaptive cruise was set at 64 in a 55 zone. I took the pic as soon as I got off the freeway, and so this is basically all highway mpg.

pensfan83

roadburner said:

I’ve been driving the G20 3er to work while my 2 Series awaits its new tires. The car’s fuel economy is phenomenal. Today I averaged 44 mpg driving to my office- a number the Mini would be lucky to beat.

There's a former 3 series loaner at a dealer about 3.5 hours away with premium package, H/K, M-Sport, heated front/rear seats, digital cockpit, and a few other things with what looks like a very healthy discount as you would hope/expect for a car with 4,300 miles. Silver over parchment, looks really good.

imidazol97

oldfarmer50 said:

imidazol97 said:

fintail said:

Raspberry interior, so mid-90s Ford. My sister had a Contour, purple! It was a 96. When she traded it in 04, its next stop was either a sketchy BHPH lot or worse, it did not age well and there's no way it would end up on the used car section of a new car dealer, pretty alarming for an 8 year old car. She was young and not meticulous with car care, but I am certain she serviced it properly anyway. I think she got $500 for it, and I told her to be happy, given the condition. It had some electrical quirks that made it technically not roadworthy - I think it had headlight and interior light issues.

Contours were MY 95-00 I believe, with a facelift for MY 98 which enlarged the headlights.

imidazol97 said:

This reminds me of a long time friend who felt sorry for his 20-year old son and bought him a car this week. He contacted a neighbor who runs a junkyard. Asked if she had anything cheap that runs well. Arranged for her to have junior take delivery of an older model from her stock.

When junior stopped to pick up his Ford (maybe a Contour?), silver with faded raspberry interior, 1992 model, his face dropped dramatically when she pointed it out to the son, is the report from the lady running the used car end of the wrecker yard.

I tried to recall the model name my friend told me but I was more struck that it was a 1992 model year. Still running well.

This is for a kid who wrecked a 2017? Mustang that was bought for him after less than a year.
Then he got a 1998? Cobra Mustang in a special yellow paint. AFter many problems with it
he eventually wrecked it recently after he got back driving privileges.
Then a motorcycle which was recently in a not-at-fault accident. Kid's having
surgeries for fix hands and wrist.

It's an unusual story. In a week or so I'll ask again about what model car it is.

With that kind of driving record I think the Contour would be the first car I bought him.

That was my advice several years back. I suggested a well used leSabre or such for a car to drive for a year. Or a used Hyundai, e.g.. The kid had friends who were really, really into Mustangs. Their own Mustang group. Honorable intentions.

Because I had said to start with a non-status car is the reason my friend tells me all these stories. The kid
had some money from a lawsuit, and that helped buy the first Mustang. Having friends that were into modifying Mustangs was a big factor.

abacomike

Let's face it, the salesman has almost no influence in determining the price of a car! It is all up to the manager at the sales desk or in his office to work out a price to sell the car - it is up to the salesman to "sell" that price to the customer. That's where the value aspect enters the picture of the sales structure. The more value the salesman has built into his presentation of the vehicle to the customer, the easier it is for the salesman to refer back to those "built in values" in order to make the car worth the price. Here are some examples of what I am trying to convey:

"...you mentioned to me that the features that were most important to you in your new car are..." Here is where you refer back to the value of the features the customer found essential or most important in his decision making. A technique that I used to use with customers was when they found the pricing too high for the car, I would suggest selecting a car with fewer options in order to reduce the price. Sometimes, the customer agreed to a less equipped car, but most often, the customer would not give up on those features which, after discussions with the customer, continuously built value into the car he selected with the equipment/features he wanted. That's how I was able to get a little more money from the customer in order to make the deal that management would accept.

When I was a sales manager, I used similar techniques, but I already knew what the bottom line was in terms of pricing - a price that was not known to the salesman. If a salesman knows the price for the car that management will accept, most sales people would skip steps in the sales process and just present that bottom line price - many sales people are lazy when it comes to selling a getting the best price possible. They skip steps in order to make their jobs easier. Those of you who have been in the car business know what I am talking about. There are those sales people who sell huge numbers of cars - but at the bottom line price - thus they are earning $200 per car, give or take.

It's the salesman who works hard at building value into the car and determining the needs of the customer who makes money in the car business.

When I sold cars, I would work as hard as I could to sell my first 10-15 cars each month because my commission percentages increased at pre-set intervals of sales - sell 15 cars per month and my percentage of gross would be 18%; 20 cars would net me 22%; 25 cars would net me 25%, etc., retrocactive to the first car I sold each month.

abacomike

andres3 said:

abacomike said:

fintail said:

In visiting and browsing at the local MB dealer and chatting with the salesguys I have dealt with, I've been told I should sell them, as I already know about the option packaging and the history of the cars, and I like the cars. Not sure I could do the selling part though, I'd be more of the "if you don't want to buy it, fine, see ya" - not into the hard sell. The salesguys I know said "the cars sell themselves", but I don't know.

abacomike said:

When I started selling cars back in 2000, it was because it was Lexus that offered me the opportunity. This was in my second life - after retiring from teaching and school administration. If the sales position was with Toyota or Nissan or Ford or Chevy, etc., I would not have taken the job.

I owned Lexus cars in the 1990's and had no problem "selling" people on the attributes of owning or leasing a Lexus. I was selling a car I would own or lease - not a car that I would have difficulty selling.

When the opportunity arose to be a sales manager at an Infiniti dealership, I was driving a G35 at the time and my Dad was driving an M45 (1964-65). Great automobile and easy to sell others on.

So I agree that I could only sell cars or manage sales of cars I would own. I just could not bring myself to be in the car business selling a product I would never buy myself. It's a form of "sales fraud" in my opinion. Trying to sell others on a product you, yourself, would never buy is dishonest to others as well as yourself.

Maybe that's why I was a teacher, school principal, private school headmaster, and a salesman selling a worthy product! 🤓

Cars don't sell themselves fintail! There are many aspects to the "selling" of a car process. The most important, if not critical, piece is the desire on the part of the prospective buyer to "want" a specific car. It's the job of the sales professional to reveal the value built into the vehicle by highlighting the hidden rewards of owning that particular SUV or car.

Once the buyer perceives himself/herself as the owner of that car, sitting behind the steering wheel, the rest is merely agreeing upon an acceptable price. The car sales professional's task is to negotiate with the sales manager for the buyer - that is the final stage of the sales process - the sales professional becomes the agent for the buyer. The more skilled the buyer's agent is in negotiating with management for a fair price, the more successful that sales professional becomes.

I always took the position of becoming the buyer's agent - "...let me see what I can do for you in getting the price you are willing to pay for this vehicle..."! Sounds easier than it is - but if you truly represent the buyer's interests when going to management, you will sell a car.😎

You mean that "let me see what I can do with the Sales Manager" crap isn't all showmanship? Are bottom line margins never discussed at sales meetings?

I think there is a percentage of the population out there that think all sales are gimmicky. I don't need to be sold, if I want something, I'll come to you. Not everyone is like this, but I think a good percentage don't need to be sold. Test driving the TTS and seeing the fit and finish for myself was enough.

The salesman made some great moves ushering me along and cementing the sale, but it was all cement, the brick was already laid down by me.

No! Bottom line maragins are not discussed at sales meetings - refer to my most recent post.

imidazol97

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

fintail

Sounds like some parenting fails there. A Contour may be too posh - I have some suggestions. Tempo (which is effectively what a 1992 Contour would be), Chevette, K-car, Tercel, Sephia.

imidazol97 said:

I tried to recall the model name my friend told me but I was more struck that it was a 1992 model year. Still running well.

This is for a kid who wrecked a 2017? Mustang that was bought for him after less than a year.
Then he got a 1998? Cobra Mustang in a special yellow paint. AFter many problems with it
he eventually wrecked it recently after he got back driving privileges.
Then a motorcycle which was recently in a not-at-fault accident. Kid's having
surgeries for fix hands and wrist.

It's an unusual story. In a week or so I'll ask again about what model car it is.

Sandman6472

I know down here in the Ft. Lauderdale/West Palm Beach area, a few companies hired guy like me as independent contractors, and paid us a set amount to deliver vehicles all over the state. They'd have a 13 pack van and a lead driver to drive and do the paperwork. We were on a "stand-by" status daily and and either was told the day before or had to call in at a certain time to see if one was working the following day. I started in early 2013 and it was busy for awhile, naturally slowed down during the summer months when business was slower. Only bad part was the personalities of the drivers and if the lead liked folks or not. My first one had his particular favorites and they worked the most hours, fairness was never a variable in the equation.
I left the first company due to the fairness issue and left the second after awhile as the distance from home made the money not worth it. And again, the fairness issue was there. Having to pay for insurance from our wages was also a sticking point. Not having a set schedule also became an issue as one wasted a large part of the day just waiting to be notified about any available work. Found that being am employee with a set schedule worked so much better. They took care of the taxes and the hours were what one was hired for.
Did the Hertz gig for 6 years and enjoyed it but the distance got to be an issue when my days/hours were increased. Finally landed at Enterprise late last year as it was so close to home, made no sense to turn it down. And then of course, Covid-19 reared it's ugly head and we were placed on furlough March 22, 2020.
Some have gone back last Friday, those that live closer to the airport in West Palm. I'm just waiting for our local office to re-open which should be by July 1st or so. But, we still have job to go back to and I'm thrilled as it's a fun gig for retired folks like myself. Work a few days per week but still have a life. Drive their newer vehicles and they pay the petrol and tolls. It's a win/win for car guys like those in these forums. Check out Indeed.com and you'll be amazed at the job offerings under "driver". At this point, am ready to go back a few days a week.
Ask O F in this forum as he's also doing the same gig and enjoying it just as much. The pay ain't nothing to write home about but, it gets you out of the house and many of the other guys are real characters so there's plenty of laughter in the vans. And if you're like me, you'll find a couple of folks you bond with quickly, which makes the days so much better!

abacomike

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

isellhondas

fintail said:

Some people would flip their lid over that nice 66 Squire these days.

There's a Seattle variant of that commercial out there, too.

omarman said:

But you're helping buyers find the right car as a favor. I'd do it for a living if the pay was good or if I could own my own shop. "I don't care about making money! Omar just loves to sell soul-slaughtering appliances to payment buyers."

Sense of humor always helps. (translation: this video is not G rated and never aired on tv.)

I grew up in So. California and I remember how those stores were. They would be a horrible place to work. Sales staff turned over constantly and were treated like little kids. Customers were held hostage while people searched for their keys. They were turned from one salesperson to another. Every salesperson with above average closing skills was a "manager" and shifts were often Bell to Bell. There are stores like this up here too as I found out a few years ago when I helped our son buy a Jeep Wrangler. One A-Hole tried taking me on and quickly regretted it. I spent nearly 14 years at my store. It was different. Family owned and in my last few years I rarely took an "Up". Most of my business was to repeat and referral customers who trusted me. When it came to used cars, I tried my best to steer them away from troublesome makes. I have zero love for Volkswagens and these seem to be a favorite among young girls. One dad asked me..." You really don't like Volkswagens, do you? I told him that I didn't like them at all but they might get lucky. These were my next door neighbors! She ended up buying a Jetta and I never asked once how it was doing. She drove it for probably eight years and traded it in on another used Jetta! Go figure.

andres3

abacomike said:

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

So if you sold a car right at invoice, then you'd get the minimum $200? I could see why a salesman would take a loss on a car at the end of the month just to get to the higher % payout.

andres3

abacomike said:

Let's face it, the salesman has almost no influence in determining the price of a car! It is all up to the manager at the sales desk or in his office to work out a price to sell the car - it is up to the salesman to "sell" that price to the customer. That's where the value aspect enters the picture of the sales structure. The more value the salesman has built into his presentation of the vehicle to the customer, the easier it is for the salesman to refer back to those "built in values" in order to make the car worth the price. Here are some examples of what I am trying to convey:

"...you mentioned to me that the features that were most important to you in your new car are..." Here is where you refer back to the value of the features the customer found essential or most important in his decision making. A technique that I used to use with customers was when they found the pricing too high for the car, I would suggest selecting a car with fewer options in order to reduce the price. Sometimes, the customer agreed to a less equipped car, but most often, the customer would not give up on those features which, after discussions with the customer, continuously built value into the car he selected with the equipment/features he wanted. That's how I was able to get a little more money from the customer in order to make the deal that management would accept.

When I was a sales manager, I used similar techniques, but I already knew what the bottom line was in terms of pricing - a price that was not known to the salesman. If a salesman knows the price for the car that management will accept, most sales people would skip steps in the sales process and just present that bottom line price - many sales people are lazy when it comes to selling a getting the best price possible. They skip steps in order to make their jobs easier. Those of you who have been in the car business know what I am talking about. There are those sales people who sell huge numbers of cars - but at the bottom line price - thus they are earning $200 per car, give or take.

It's the salesman who works hard at building value into the car and determining the needs of the customer who makes money in the car business.

When I sold cars, I would work as hard as I could to sell my first 10-15 cars each month because my commission percentages increased at pre-set intervals of sales - sell 15 cars per month and my percentage of gross would be 18%; 20 cars would net me 22%; 25 cars would net me 25%, etc., retrocactive to the first car I sold each month.

"Building value" seems to be at odds with internet pricing, and the use of the internet/email. Then you know you have a shopper. I suppose you could say your dealership is better than the other dealership, but how much is that worth on a new car? They can still get service at your dealership.

oldfarmer50

We heard you the first time. :@

jmonroe1

omarman said:

But you're helping buyers find the right car as a favor. I'd do it for a living if the pay was good or if I could own my own shop. "I don't care about making money! Omar just loves to sell soul-slaughtering appliances to payment buyers."

Sense of humor always helps. (translation: this video is not G rated and never aired on tv.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDFeIPwrDrs

That guy is so right about having a station wagon. When I learned to drive my father had a new 1968 Plymouth Sport Suburban station wagon. The car was a typical Chrysler product piece of junk but gee did I have fun with that car for the two years he had it. Man, what I wouldn’t do to be back in those days !!!

jmonroe

driver100

omarman said:

But you're helping buyers find the right car as a favor. I'd do it for a living if the pay was good or if I could own my own shop. "I don't care about making money! Omar just loves to sell soul-slaughtering appliances to payment buyers."

Sense of humor always helps. (translation: this video is not G rated and never aired on tv.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDFeIPwrDrs

Where did it air....on the internet?

I bet some people would love to go to a dealer like that....they would see him as up front about what to expect. I once managed a catalog showroom store (Ab will recall Consumers Distributing), 25% of the items were out of stock, once you bought the item you couldn't return it.....once sold a sprinkler that wouldn't work when the customer got it home so he brought it back and threw it at us across the counter. I always thought some people love to be treated like crap ....why don't they spend a bit more and go to a real store?

ab348

Huh. I just thought our local Consumers Distributing was like that.

driver100

I just called my MB dealer to take MrsD100s GLK in for an oil change. They are booking for July, but had an opening due to a cancellation on Wednesday which I took.
What always amazes me is they always know which car I am calling about before I even talk. I know they have caller I.D., but it must work instantly to bring up the callers car. As soon as I say I want to book an appointment the lady says, is that for the E400 or the GLK?

Now that is impressive!

ab348

Maybe they have the picture of you in that famous shirt taped to the wall, with your phone number and cars written underneath. :laughing:

driver100

ab348 said:

Huh. I just thought our local Consumers Distributing was like that.

I always thought their slogan should be "The store for masochists".

driver100

ab348 said:

Maybe they have the picture of you in that famous shirt taped to the wall, with your phone number and cars written underneath. :laughing:

Maybe I could give them permission to use that picture....since it sticks in peoples minds so well.....for a small fee.

andres3

La Mesa, a City I used to live in, was hit with some bad looting/rioting/protesting last week. Sacramento, my hometown, also has been hit a bit.

In both, the City PD has no love lost from prior traffic run-ins. I'm 2-0 against La Mesa in Court, but the amount of wasted time irks me. Sacramento PD is the reason I got off on the wrong foot with my first ticket being one of the most incorrectly issued tickets of all-time.

driver100

We traded in our 2013 Passat because I thought it wasn't fast enough for driving on the highways in Florida. Today I got the bright idea of checking out the 0 to 60 time, mainly because I was curious how slow it was.
One article says;
VW says the in-line five can accelerate to 60 mpg in 8.7 seconds; a manual could drop it to 8.2 seconds, but probably wouldn't make it feel any more engaging. Highway fuel economy of 34 mpg lags the best in class by as much as 4 mpg.
Like I say, 0 to 60 should be at a minimum under 6.4 seconds! The faster the better and 5 is very comfortable for entering a 75 mph highway.

andres3

driver100 said:

We traded in our 2013 Passat because I thought it wasn't fast enough for driving on the highways in Florida. Today I got the bright idea of checking out the 0 to 60 time, mainly because I was curious how slow it was.
One article says;
VW says the in-line five can accelerate to 60 mpg in 8.7 seconds; a manual could drop it to 8.2 seconds, but probably wouldn't make it feel any more engaging. Highway fuel economy of 34 mpg lags the best in class by as much as 4 mpg.
Like I say, 0 to 60 should be at a minimum under 6.4 seconds! The faster the better and 5 is very comfortable for entering a 75 mph highway.

That inline 5 was a dog. The current inline 5 in the Audi's is 400 HP and 0-60 in 3.6 seconds in the TTRS.

snakeweasel

abacomike said:

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

Actually gross profit is the sales price less the cost of goods sold which includes all costs in acquiring the vehicle and getting in a saleable state. So in your example if the dealership spent $500.00 prepping the car then your gross profit would be $5,500. If there are other costs associated with getting the vehicle ready for sale then your gross profits go down.

snakeweasel

driver100 said:

I just called my MB dealer to take MrsD100s GLK in for an oil change. They are booking for July, but had an opening due to a cancellation on Wednesday which I took.
What always amazes me is they always know which car I am calling about before I even talk. I know they have caller I.D., but it must work instantly to bring up the callers car. As soon as I say I want to book an appointment the lady says, is that for the E400 or the GLK?

Now that is impressive!

Not that difficult to connect the caller ID to a database keyed to the phone number and have all your information come up when they pick up the call.

snakeweasel

andres3 said:

La Mesa, a City I used to live in, was hit with some bad looting/rioting/protesting last week. Sacramento, my hometown, also has been hit a bit.

In both, the City PD has no love lost from prior traffic run-ins. I'm 2-0 against La Mesa in Court, but the amount of wasted time irks me. Sacramento PD is the reason I got off on the wrong foot with my first ticket being one of the most incorrectly issued tickets of all-time.

The next suburb over got hit pretty bad. We went there yesterday evening, most of the stores had at least one window smashed in. Now I dont want to get political so: a horse walks into a bar, the bartender looks at him and asks "Why the long face?"

stickguy

Took be RDX on first road trip this weekend. Great travel car. Comfy, loves to fly. But man, mpg sucks. If I wanted a car that drank like a V8 Jeep I would spy’s e bought one!

benjaminh

stickguy said:

Took be RDX on first road trip this weekend. Great travel car. Comfy, loves to fly. But man, mpg sucks...

What kind of mpg numbers are you looking at? It's got more torque than most V-8s had back in the 80s and 90s. But that does make me think that getting the new 2021 TLX with that Type-R 2.0 engine might not be such a good idea for me. It's a really good engine for power, but....This guy at Engineering Explained goes through in this ten-minute video some of the features of the engine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtkGMUY-4hs&t=44s

venture

driver100 said:

I just called my MB dealer to take MrsD100s GLK in for an oil change. They are booking for July, but had an opening due to a cancellation on Wednesday which I took.
What always amazes me is they always know which car I am calling about before I even talk. I know they have caller I.D., but it must work instantly to bring up the callers car. As soon as I say I want to book an appointment the lady says, is that for the E400 or the GLK?

Now that is impressive!

When I called Subaru of America last month to ask if they would provide a loyalty incentive, the lady who answered the phone said, "Good morning Mr. Venture". It sort of creeped me out a little, but impressive.

tjc78

stickguy said:

Took be RDX on first road trip this weekend. Great travel car. Comfy, loves to fly. But man, mpg sucks. If I wanted a car that drank like a V8 Jeep I would spy’s e bought one!

It’s not broken in yet. It will get better.

All three of my GM 3.6s got terrible mileage for the first few tanks.

benjaminh

@stickguy Here are the epa estimates for mpg for your two vehicles. How close are you to these numbers?

oldfarmer50

snakeweasel said:

abacomike said:

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

Actually gross profit is the sales price less the cost of goods sold which includes all costs in acquiring the vehicle and getting in a saleable state. So in your example if the dealership spent $500.00 prepping the car then your gross profit would be $5,500. If there are other costs associated with getting the vehicle ready for sale then your gross profits go down.

I seem to remember that dealers have ways of screwing the salespeople out of a portion of the commission. Like not counting into the equation dealer pack. So in Mike’s example if the $65k car he sold had $5,000 of VIN etching and mop&glo the gross profit would be based on $60k thus reducing the payout to the salesperson.

Or am I remembering that wrong?

oldfarmer50

venture said:

driver100 said:

I just called my MB dealer to take MrsD100s GLK in for an oil change. They are booking for July, but had an opening due to a cancellation on Wednesday which I took.
What always amazes me is they always know which car I am calling about before I even talk. I know they have caller I.D., but it must work instantly to bring up the callers car. As soon as I say I want to book an appointment the lady says, is that for the E400 or the GLK?

Now that is impressive!

When I called Subaru of America last month to ask if they would provide a loyalty incentive, the lady who answered the phone said, "Good morning Mr. Venture". It sort of creeped me out a little, but impressive.

Unless you block your number doesn’t it come up on their screen?

stickguy

So far need to practically Use hyper mile Tricks to break 23. Though I wasn’t going all that slow it still was loafing along. The old one did better. The tlx gets a good 10+ mpg more. And that’s with the 10 speed, with the engine barely at 2k RPMs at 75.

I can’t recall having a car that did not at least meet, if not exceed, the highway rating on a trip. So if this won’t get better than 25-26, minimum, will be very disappointed. And filling up way too often. Around town, I expected it to be mediocre.

The real test will be on the way home. I’ll fill up just before getting on the highway and the trip back down is usually better since more downhill.

At least it’s very comfy, but do have to be careful with speed creeping up. It loves to run.

stickguy

oldfarmer50 said:

snakeweasel said:

abacomike said:

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

Actually gross profit is the sales price less the cost of goods sold which includes all costs in acquiring the vehicle and getting in a saleable state. So in your example if the dealership spent $500.00 prepping the car then your gross profit would be $5,500. If there are other costs associated with getting the vehicle ready for sale then your gross profits go down.

I seem to remember that dealers have ways of screwing the salespeople out of a portion of the commission. Like not counting into the equation dealer pack. So in Mike’s example if the $65k car he sold had $5,000 of VIN etching and mop&glo the gross profit would be based on $60k thus reducing the payout to the salesperson.

Or am I remembering that wrong?

You are correct.

abacomike

stickguy said:

oldfarmer50 said:

snakeweasel said:

abacomike said:

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

Actually gross profit is the sales price less the cost of goods sold which includes all costs in acquiring the vehicle and getting in a saleable state. So in your example if the dealership spent $500.00 prepping the car then your gross profit would be $5,500. If there are other costs associated with getting the vehicle ready for sale then your gross profits go down.

I seem to remember that dealers have ways of screwing the salespeople out of a portion of the commission. Like not counting into the equation dealer pack. So in Mike’s example if the $65k car he sold had $5,000 of VIN etching and mop&glo the gross profit would be based on $60k thus reducing the payout to the salesperson.

Or am I remembering that wrong?

You are correct.

Gross is, of course, the net profit realized from the sale of a vehicle. That would include all costs associated with the preparation, add-ons, transportation, and "pack" which includes advertising and all costs associated with the "floor plan" (interest on loans used to maintain an inventory). The average "pack" on a car when I was in the business was $375 +/-, which was deducted before commissions were calculated.

graphicguy

driver100 said:

graphicguy said:

kyfdx said:

ab348 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

You might be better off advertising yourself out to the snowbirds to drive their car down to Florida in the Fall and back in the Spring.

Personally I’d rather have a mature driver take my car than a college kid going down for spring break.

The problem with that is getting yourself to the location of the vehicle and then getting yourself back home once you get to the destination.

GG lives in the CVG area. $99 one way flights, every day, from almost every FL airport (once flying gets back to normal, if it ever does)

Never thought of delivering snow birds their cars. I could do that. And, as Walt mentioned, I can get flights out of CVG pretty regularly and relatively cheaply. Add in a night in a hotel? A couple of stops at a Mickey D, and I could probably have a nice little part time business.....Hmmmmmmm!?!!!!!??!??

GG, being single you may find a unique little angle to add to your business model. Drive the car to Florida and stay to drive the car back, of course depending on...............

Actually, I was thinking, if it works out, I could contract to drive down, and then drive someone else’s car back, if needed.

I’m serious. I have some friends down in FL that are checking around for possible business leads. I’m going to call my lawyer today to set up the LLC.

kyfdx

abacomike said:

stickguy said:

oldfarmer50 said:

snakeweasel said:

abacomike said:

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

Actually gross profit is the sales price less the cost of goods sold which includes all costs in acquiring the vehicle and getting in a saleable state. So in your example if the dealership spent $500.00 prepping the car then your gross profit would be $5,500. If there are other costs associated with getting the vehicle ready for sale then your gross profits go down.

I seem to remember that dealers have ways of screwing the salespeople out of a portion of the commission. Like not counting into the equation dealer pack. So in Mike’s example if the $65k car he sold had $5,000 of VIN etching and mop&glo the gross profit would be based on $60k thus reducing the payout to the salesperson.

Or am I remembering that wrong?

You are correct.

Gross is, of course, the net profit realized from the sale of a vehicle. That would include all costs associated with the preparation, add-ons, transportation, and "pack" which includes advertising and all costs associated with the "floor plan" (interest on loans used to maintain an inventory). The average "pack" on a car when I was in the business was $375 +/-, which was deducted before commissions were calculated.

Gross does not = Net.

snakeweasel

kyfdx said:

abacomike said:

stickguy said:

oldfarmer50 said:

snakeweasel said:

abacomike said:

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

Actually gross profit is the sales price less the cost of goods sold which includes all costs in acquiring the vehicle and getting in a saleable state. So in your example if the dealership spent $500.00 prepping the car then your gross profit would be $5,500. If there are other costs associated with getting the vehicle ready for sale then your gross profits go down.

I seem to remember that dealers have ways of screwing the salespeople out of a portion of the commission. Like not counting into the equation dealer pack. So in Mike’s example if the $65k car he sold had $5,000 of VIN etching and mop&glo the gross profit would be based on $60k thus reducing the payout to the salesperson.

Or am I remembering that wrong?

You are correct.

Gross is, of course, the net profit realized from the sale of a vehicle. That would include all costs associated with the preparation, add-ons, transportation, and "pack" which includes advertising and all costs associated with the "floor plan" (interest on loans used to maintain an inventory). The average "pack" on a car when I was in the business was $375 +/-, which was deducted before commissions were calculated.

Gross does not = Net.

Correct, gross profit would be the sales price of the vehicle less all the direct costs associated with getting the vehicle ready for sale. This would be, but not limited to, the actual cost of the vehicle to the dealership, any freight costs, costs in prepping the car and inventory carrying costs.

Net profit would be the gross profit less any other dealership expenses allocated to the vehicle. This would be a portion of interest paid on any business loans, property taxes on the land, commissions, salaries of non sales people, utilities, repairs and maintenance, legal fees, advertising and a host of other expenses that the sales department incurs.

It is possible to have a gross profit but a net loss.

driver100

snakeweasel said:

abacomike said:

imidazol97 said:

Does this mean a sales manager sells a car for $20000 used and he gets $5000? 25%?

What is the definition of "gross."

Gross profit is the difference between the selling price and the net invoice of the car. So if I sold an SC430 for MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500. That was about average for me on those SC430's when they first came out and they were selling for sticker. If I hit the 30% commission bracket at the end of the month, I earned 30% of the gross profit on every car I sold that month, retroactively.

Actually gross profit is the sales price less the cost of goods sold which includes all costs in acquiring the vehicle and getting in a saleable state. So in your example if the dealership spent $500.00 prepping the car then your gross profit would be $5,500. If there are other costs associated with getting the vehicle ready for sale then your gross profits go down.

Accounting is one of my worst subjects but isn't gross profit what Mike said
"MSRP at $65,000 and invoice was $59,000, I made a commission of 25% of $6000 or $1500".
and net profit would be $6000 less expenses, commissions, operating expenses (salaries, taxes, heat, prepping the car etc.)?

If he sells the car for under invoice does he have to pay back 25%?

driver100

snakeweasel: Not that difficult to connect the caller ID to a database keyed to the phone number and have all your information come up when they pick up the call.

I thought they hired people who were psychic!