Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations

qbrozen

Not sure I agree with the reasoning here. As stick said, the pistons and valves are going up and down anyway. I don’t see the point in piling up unburned fuel in the cylinders and exhaust manifold for what would, IMHO, be almost no benefit.

explorerx4

I bring up the oil pressure before starting the car. Probably more important with OHC and variable valve timing engines.
Some extra fuel does get into the cylinders when cranking, so that may account for the smoke, plus the engine starting rich.
Some cars have a 'flood mode', so fuel is shut off to clear the combustion chambers when cranking the engine.

driver100

stickguy said:

it builds pretty quickly. Most likely after sitting that long it will take enough extra cranking that the oil will be up anyway before it fires. Though pistons going up and down either way.

It's just a hooptie C250 anyway. Not like bringing back a Ferrari from a 20 year hibernation. Just let the fuel pump prime for a few seconds, and fire it up.

just check the tires before driving. And of course, take the steel wool out of the tailpipe before starting it!

Stick, you always come through with good common sense advice. I agree 100% - if it blows up it is only $10000 gone, and the body and parts that are left must be worth something.

tjc78

@qbrozen said:
Not sure I agree with the reasoning here. As stick said, the pistons and valves are going up and down anyway. I don’t see the point in piling up unburned fuel in the cylinders and exhaust manifold for what would, IMHO, be almost no benefit.

You have a point. The engine is still rotating. If I was to try this, I’d pull the fuel pump relay so no fuel would go in the cylinders.

imidazol97

The contact points that are normally oiled while an engine is running, likely have lost the oil during the years since it was last started. For the bearings on the rods and crankshaft, there may be some oil still caught there. But....

Cranking the engine with the starter to pump oil up through the passages to the overhead cams or rockers and to the crankshaft bearings and then through the single hole that feeds oil up into the rods to the piston pins at the top allows those parts to have oil before the high impact of the explosion above the piston pushes the piston against the pins and the rod against the crankshaft bearing.

I like the possibility of @explorerx4 mentioning holding the accelerator to the floor which in some cars turns off the injectors for a method of clearing a flooded engine with too much fuel in the cylinders. That lets the engine crank and pump oil for that early oiling during the restart.

Maybe someone here with an MB can test whether doing that from a first crank will keep the car from starting until the key is off again, and then a normal crank cycle is started with the accelerator not touched.

ab348

When I had the Cutlass it sat in the garage for months each winter. I think in 2020 it probably was last out on the road in late October of '19 and I didn't even try to start it until late June of '20. So 8-9 months, the longest sleep ever for it. The routine was always the same. I would crank the engine for 10 seconds, stop, wait a bit, crank it again, stop, crank it a 3rd time. By then the oil pressure idiot light would go out. Then I would give it 2 pumps to the floor with the accelerator, crank it again and vroom vroom every time. It amazed me that way every spring, never an issue. Stabil in the fuel of course.

explorerx4

@oldfarmer50,
Bus drivers have it tough.

oldfarmer50

explorerx4 said:

@oldfarmer50,
Bus drivers have it tough.

Yeah, I saw that and it’s typical of how school districts treat bus drivers when parents make noise. In my district I’d have some protection because of the union contract but only in the specific procedures they’d need to follow. For them to use social media posts against him isn’t fair IMO. I don’t use any media where I can be identified for that reason.

For 27 years the biggest impediment to me doing my job was the parents. Most were great but a few were near psychotic.

I’m glad I’m retired.

roadburner

@oldfarmer50 said:
Yeah, I saw that and it’s typical of how school districts treat bus drivers when parents make noise. In my district I’d have some protection because of the union contract but only in the specific procedures they’d need to follow. For them to use social media posts against him isn’t fair IMO. I don’t use any media where I can be identified for that reason.

For 27 years the biggest impediment to me doing my job was the parents. Most were great but a few were near psychotic.

I’m glad I’m retired.

When I was a judge I had a case where a nutball parent confronted a driver at his kid’s bus stop. The kid was about to run in front of the bus and the driver blew his horn to get the kid’s attention. That’s what set off the dad. The case went to a jury trial and the dad was convicted of terroristic threatening. The guy apparently had a hair-trigger temper and the prosecutor almost set it off. Regardless, he was convicted. Even better, the guy was an air traffic controller.

dad23

Spotted this today, couldn’t catch up to see what it was. Any ideas?

Michaell

dad23 said:

Spotted this today, couldn’t catch up to see what it was. Any ideas?

Looks like a Mazda Cosmo.

roadburner

Lotus Type 14 Elite

dad23

Thanks guys, my son was thinking Cosmo, no idea how he knew but the back does resemble the Lotus pretty closely.

qbrozen

RB wins

driver100

dad23 said:

Spotted this today, couldn’t catch up to see what it was. Any ideas?

Dad23....in case you wanted to see more of the car;

it is a 58 to 63 model.

dad23

driver100 said:

dad23 said:

Spotted this today, couldn’t catch up to see what it was. Any ideas?

Dad23....in case you wanted to see more of the car;

it is a 58 to 63 model.

Thanks, we did a little more research last, sure would have loved to stop and talk to the owner!

28firefighter

After suffering our umpteenth 6+ hour power outage in the last 4 years, I'm thinking it is time to get a portable generator of some kind. Two questions for the knowledgable folks here.

(1) Anyone know roughly what it would cost to have an outside plug in point and transfer switch installed? I'm reaching out for quotes, but ballpark would help. Home is newer build (2012).

(2) Any opinions on portable generators - size, fuel type, and the import of an inverter generator?

explorerx4

@28ff,
If you are looking at having a transfer switch installed, you have to figure out how much of your house you want to run on the generator. That will help determine the size you need.
Some of my neighbors have dedicated natural gas whole house generators.
I just have a 2K Honda that we use alternating between a space heater(if cold) and the main refrigerator.
It can run overnight on a gallon of gas.
Having young kids, you'll want something more robust.
The invertor provides 'clean' power, so safe to run computers.

stickguy

I just watched a video on that! Let me see if I can find it. But it’s more than a transfer switch. Need a sub panel too. I’d guess $1200? Then cost of generator.

Still cheaper than a generac!

28firefighter

I was looking at a 7000-8500 watt dual fuel generator if I can find one reasonably price. That should cover the big hits of the house and then some.

stickguy

Here’s the one. Plenty more out there but this was a good layman’s explanation

qbrozen

stickguy said:

Here’s the one. Plenty more out there but this was a good layman’s explanation

that looks like the genny I had that caught fire after a few hours of use.

laurasdada

qbrozen said:

stickguy said:

Here’s the one. Plenty more out there but this was a good layman’s explanation

that looks like the genny I had that caught fire after a few hours of use.

So, it is became a space heater. Smart design.

venture

I wanted to see if my snow blower would start yesterday. It started right up.

I don't know if I should be happy.

driver100

I was talking to a guy about Electric cars and he said he had a friend who has a Tesla, and she started to do the once a month download....which takes an hour.
And then she got a call that was kind of an emergency, and she had to start driving there right away, but she couldn't, once the download starts you have to wait until it is done....like my laptop.
A friend knows a guy who has a Tesla and he leaves his outside on the night it is doing downloads so he doesn't have that problem.......but, it is another thing to think about.

driver100

We have a Kohler gas generator. Not sure if it is the best make but the company that installed it was excellent. It cost about $12000 Cdn so should be about $7000 or $8000 U.S. It has come in handy a few times......comes on instantly, everything can run, it is a nice item to have. I personally don't want a gasoline one because of gasoline going stale....this is no muss no fuss. It goes on once a week and the company that installed it gets a report and we do, about how it is performing.
MrsD100 wanted it since we were here last winter, I don't know if I would have bought it but I sure appreciate having it when the electricity goes off.

stickguy

Natural gas whole house automatic units are definitely nice. Just way more expensive. US, you can be looking at $12k vs. 2k for a portable plus transfer panel and install. Or more, depending on size and quality.

But, you do have to switch over, and put gas in it. The bigger issue is, what if you aren’t home when the outage occurs?

I would like a whole house unit when we move. If we build I’ll have it done then. At least all the prep work so would just need the unit installed.

Other option I guess is solar and a Tesla battery wall.

28firefighter

Primary interest for me in a portable generator is two reasons:
(1) I don't have a great place to put a whole home generator with automatic transfer switch that isn't an eyesore and doesn't violate lot setback requirements.

(2) In the event of the "big one" (earthquake), natural gas is going to be the first thing shut off. I want to be able to run on propane or gasoline to maybe make it a bit easier to get fuel. Also, I can potentially take with me and use it for other things.

explorerx4

My Honda generator(now a 2200 watt model) had a companion model that can be connected to combine them.
EU2200i/EU2200ic
Probably still too small for what you are looking for.

stickguy

The video I linked I think said it was a 10,000 watt to handle a good amount of stuff at one time.

28firefighter

I was looking at an 8500 watt inverter generator...

qbrozen

Mine didn't cost nearly as much as most places quote. Not sure what the labor would be. I would think an experienced person could bang it out in less than a day. B&S generator and auto transfer switch package was about $4k. Another few hundred in wiring and piping. I'm probably crazy, but I think $4500 all in plus $1k labor should get it done. I know easier said than done.

stickguy

If you can find a cheap plumber and electrician theses days, that will actually show up, it would be a miracle. Plus cost on everything is up.

I assume also depends on where electric panel is compared to gas line. My house, panel is in front corner of the garage. I could easily put the box box 5 feet from it. But the gas line comes in the other side of the house which would be a problem.

28firefighter

qbrozen said:

Mine didn't cost nearly as much as most places quote. Not sure what the labor would be. I would think an experienced person could bang it out in less than a day. B&S generator and auto transfer switch package was about $4k. Another few hundred in wiring and piping. I'm probably crazy, but I think $4500 all in plus $1k labor should get it done. I know easier said than done.

absolutely no chance I could get someone out for that kinda money on a whole-home generator. My BIL lives around the corner in a similar property and was quoted $18k.

venture

28firefighter said:

qbrozen said:

Mine didn't cost nearly as much as most places quote. Not sure what the labor would be. I would think an experienced person could bang it out in less than a day. B&S generator and auto transfer switch package was about $4k. Another few hundred in wiring and piping. I'm probably crazy, but I think $4500 all in plus $1k labor should get it done. I know easier said than done.

absolutely no chance I could get someone out for that kinda money on a whole-home generator. My BIL lives around the corner in a similar property and was quoted $18k.

Ouch!

28firefighter

I mean it is what it is, but it is also overkill for my purposes. I can also appreciate that @qbrozen can save a lot of $$ doing the labor by himself; I just can't (won't) do it.

explorerx4

@stickhuy,
Here is a Maverick review from a guy on LawnG Eye Land.

driver100

stickguy said:

If you can find a cheap plumber and electrician theses days, that will actually show up, it would be a miracle. Plus cost on everything is up.

I assume also depends on where electric panel is compared to gas line. My house, panel is in front corner of the garage. I could easily put the box box 5 feet from it. But the gas line comes in the other side of the house which would be a problem.

Easier to put it near the gas line, and run the wires across the basement.
Also, if we are away it runs on it's own...it runs on natural gas..

driver100

28firefighter said:

Primary interest for me in a portable generator is two reasons:
(1) I don't have a great place to put a whole home generator with automatic transfer switch that isn't an eyesore and doesn't violate lot setback requirements.

.

Maybe you should get one of these;

stickguy

driver100 said:

stickguy said:

If you can find a cheap plumber and electrician theses days, that will actually show up, it would be a miracle. Plus cost on everything is up.

I assume also depends on where electric panel is compared to gas line. My house, panel is in front corner of the garage. I could easily put the box box 5 feet from it. But the gas line comes in the other side of the house which would be a problem.

Easier to put it near the gas line, and run the wires across the basement.
Also, if we are away it runs on it's own...it runs on natural gas..

everything being equal, gas lines are a lot more expensive to run. But in my case, not really practical. Would have to go up through the attic. Though our furnace is behind the garage in the basement, so I theory they could tap into the line over there, run it through the wall and underground. But still very expensive.

Just need to pick the right house when we move!

oldfarmer50

roadburner said:

@oldfarmer50 said:

Yeah, I saw that and it’s typical of how school districts treat bus drivers when parents make noise. In my district I’d have some protection because of the union contract but only in the specific procedures they’d need to follow. For them to use social media posts against him isn’t fair IMO. I don’t use any media where I can be identified for that reason.

For 27 years the biggest impediment to me doing my job was the parents. Most were great but a few were near psychotic.

I’m glad I’m retired.

When I was a judge I had a case where a nutball parent confronted a driver at his kid’s bus stop. The kid was about to run in front of the bus and the driver blew his horn to get the kid’s attention. That’s what set off the dad. The case went to a jury trial and the dad was convicted of terroristic threatening. The guy apparently had a hair-trigger temper and the prosecutor almost set it off. Regardless, he was convicted. Even better, the guy was an air traffic controller.

I wish I had a nickel for every time a parent threatened me. The dad’s threats of physical violence didn’t bother me as much as the smear campaigns used by the mom’s. They would curse at me and then claim I cursed at them. The fact that there were cameras on the bus proving them to be liars didn’t phase them much.

jipster

@oldfarmer50 said:
I wish I had a nickel for every time a parent threatened me. The dad’s threats of physical violence didn’t bother me as much as the smear campaigns used by the mom’s. They would curse at me and then claim I cursed at them. The fact that there were cameras on the bus proving them to be liars didn’t phase them much.

Hmm, you'd think it would be the kids doing most of the threatening, not the parents.

How's your son's Fusion doing? My son's 2010 Mercury Milan still chugging on. It's at 172, 000 miles now (knock wood).

driver100

Nice to hear from you Jip and glad the Milan is still operating.
How are you liking the Accord? Was it the right car to buy?

oldfarmer50

ab348 said:

When I had the Cutlass it sat in the garage for months each winter. I think in 2020 it probably was last out on the road in late October of '19 and I didn't even try to start it until late June of '20. So 8-9 months, the longest sleep ever for it. The routine was always the same. I would crank the engine for 10 seconds, stop, wait a bit, crank it again, stop, crank it a 3rd time. By then the oil pressure idiot light would go out. Then I would give it 2 pumps to the floor with the accelerator, crank it again and vroom vroom every time. It amazed me that way every spring, never an issue. Stabil in the fuel of course.

I store two cars for winter November-April approximately. I start them up once a month just to keep the battery charged. No special prep, just start. I also have a guest car that has been stored for about 18 months with no special preparation other than Stabil. We started it every few months until the TCM failed and it won’t start unless I jump the relay so now I don’t know what to do.

oldfarmer50

jipster said:

@oldfarmer50 said:

I wish I had a nickel for every time a parent threatened me. The dad’s threats of physical violence didn’t bother me as much as the smear campaigns used by the mom’s. They would curse at me and then claim I cursed at them. The fact that there were cameras on the bus proving them to be liars didn’t phase them much.

Hmm, you'd think it would be the kids doing most of the threatening, not the parents.

How's your son's Fusion doing? My son's 2010 Mercury Milan still chugging on. It's at 172, 000 miles now (knock wood).

Nice to see you again. The kid put about 10k on it since last year and it’s now up to about 38k miles. It’ll be awhile before it hits 172k but that’s nice to know it has that potential.

So how did yours last so long? Didn’t you get a pretty serious diagnosis on the engine? We’re they wrong or did the motor not care?

As to kids threatening me on the bus, I was never worried about that. I remember once a kid arrogantly asked “you can’t hit us no matter what we do, right?”

To that I responded that while a couldn’t throw the first punch I could certainly throw the second in self defense so he better make the first one good because he wouldn’t get a second.

Problem solved.

jmonroe1

oldfarmer50 said:

jipster said:

@oldfarmer50 said:

I wish I had a nickel for every time a parent threatened me. The dad’s threats of physical violence didn’t bother me as much as the smear campaigns used by the mom’s. They would curse at me and then claim I cursed at them. The fact that there were cameras on the bus proving them to be liars didn’t phase them much.

Hmm, you'd think it would be the kids doing most of the threatening, not the parents.

How's your son's Fusion doing? My son's 2010 Mercury Milan still chugging on. It's at 172, 000 miles now (knock wood).

Nice to see you again. The kid put about 10k on it since last year and it’s now up to about 38k miles. It’ll be awhile before it hits 172k but that’s nice to know it has that potential.

So how did yours last so long? Didn’t you get a pretty serious diagnosis on the engine? We’re they wrong or did the motor not care?

As to kids threatening me on the bus, I was never worried about that. I remember once a kid arrogantly asked “you can’t hit us no matter what we do, right?”

To that I responded that while a couldn’t throw the first punch I could certainly throw the second in self defense so he better make the first one good because he wouldn’t get a second.

Problem solved.

Bully. (Note: I’d say the same thing)

jmonroe

jipster

@driver100 said:
Nice to hear from you Jip and glad the Milan is still operating.
How are you liking the Accord? Was it the right car to buy?

Thx. The Accord is doing well. I have around 24k miles on it. Developed a intermittent rattle around 20 mph that I can't pin down. A tad annoying, but no biggie. Blew a tire on drive down to Smoky Mountains when I hit a huge pot hole. Other than that,, no problems. Not gonna lie, I occasionally think about that Acura TLX. But...yeah...the Accord was the right car to buy. :-)

benjaminh

Blowing a tire sounds alarming. Glad everyone seems to be safe. Glad you're liking the Accord. What kind of mpg are you getting?

jipster

@oldfarmer50 said:
Nice to see you again. The kid put about 10k on it since last year and it’s now up to about 38k miles. It’ll be awhile before it hits 172k but that’s nice to know it has that potential.

So how did yours last so long? Didn’t you get a pretty serious diagnosis on the engine? We’re they wrong or did the motor not care?

As to kids threatening me on the bus, I was never worried about that. I remember once a kid arrogantly asked “you can’t hit us no matter what we do, right?”

To that I responded that while a couldn’t throw the first punch I could certainly throw the second in self defense so he better make the first one good because he wouldn’t get a second.

Problem solved.

I've had my fingers crossed on that car since the day I took to dealership and they said it had major timing issues. They wanted to put a new/rebuilt/reman. engine in it. It does burn some oil. But, no way. Rolled the dice. I replaced the throttle body myself...no other issues that I haven't been able to take care of myself. Son had a front fender benders in it, so it's a bit rough looking. But, I think it a really comfortable and nice handling vehicle.

LOL on your response to the juvenile delinquent. Bet you could write a book on your experiences. I work with the young people myself, so know where you're coming from.

Thought I may have another sales story for you guys a month or so ago. My recently married daughter wanted me to look at new vehicles for her. Something big enough for my future grandchildren and her 2 dogs. Looked at a Hyundai Santa Fe. Really nice. But she changed her mind and decided to stick with her/my 2007 Kia Optima a bit longer. Knock wood, that has been a really good and reliable car for her.

driver100

@jipster
Glad you are liking the Accord. It seems those little rattles can happen in almost any car....sometimes only at a certain speed or at a certain temperature. Sometimes it can be something in the console, the ashtray, the pockets on the doors etc and not be the car. Once it was Mrs D100s sunglasses that were in her door pocket.....they are hard ones in the E400.
Blown tire isn't fun but you probably only had to replace one....or could it be fixed?
And, I don't have to say it, it probably would have happened no matter what car you were driving.