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Acura TSX

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Comments

  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 100,631
    Uh... it was a joke.. ;)

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • no proble...To each his own.

    My whole point was that the Euros get engine choices far beyond what we get in North America, and if some automakers other than VW (I wouldn't buy one either) is brave enought to bring their diesels here, people who test drive them who sometimes opt for them.

    TSX is a great car - handling, standard equipment, relibility, value and looks. If only we had a choice with regard to the engine.
  • No spelling errors this time.

    no problem...To each his own.

    My whole point was that the Euros get engine choices far beyond what we get in North America, and if some automakers other than VW (I wouldn't buy one either) is brave enough to bring their diesels here, people who test drive them would sometimes opt for them.

    TSX is a great car - handling, standard equipment, reliability, value and looks. If only we had a choice with regard to the engine.

    My neighbor is a Honda dealer. Next time I see him I will ask him about when H will bring their diesel CR-V, Accord etc to N.A. I think that there is an opportunity here. Mitsu should do it because right now they are virtually invisible in the car market. Bring diesel versions of their cars and maybe someone will buy one.

    Diesel is widely available in Canada. Also recall, you fill up every 600 miles not every 200-300, so you should have plenty of time to find a station.
  • delmar1delmar1 Posts: 744
    No problem....I also understand and agreeable with choices. Choices are good.

    I do wonder though...what would it do to the overall cost structure for the model. That is...if they produce too many variations and choices...production become less efficient and costly with retooling and with alternate production lines....and they will be unable to efficiently absorb fixed costs. Therefore the gas powered car lineup would have to absorb more costs and cover for the shortfalls of a slow diesel lineup...which would raise the price of the gas powered cars.

    Help me understand please on the benefits of diesel versus hybrids? From what I understand....the Honda Insight has 65hp and gets something like 60mpg. Why would it be beneficial to go diesel? Because of power? If so...what would the power be in a Honda Accord Hybrid?
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,863
    Some issues with offering diesels now.

    Markets - the biggest market in the country (California) doesn't allow the sale of diesel cars as they currently do not meet the emissions standards. Those standards also affect the Northeast where imports outsell domestics. It doesn't make any sense to offer the vehicles where they won't sell the most.

    Low Sulphur Diesel - expect diesel costs to go up 25-30% when the low sulphur requirements are implemented. It requires more refining and processing to achieve the lower levels - that doesn't come for free. Also, it takes 25% more oil to make a gallon of diesel than a gallon of gasoline. It also emits 17% more greenhouse gasses than gasoline.

    Diesel is part of the solution - not the entire solution.
  • Undoubtedly one reason why they don't bringthem over is that it simplifies the assembly to just do one or 2 variants of a model. That said, they already are making CRV and Accord diesels, so they would just run the line longer. Perhaps they have a sourcing problem in getting enough diesels fast enough.

    You're correct about the little Honda insight. It already gets great mileage, so a diesel would not improve things as much as say, for a CRV. However the smart car you refer to has a 1-L diesel (3 cylinger I believe) engine. It gets awesome mileage. The Accord hybrid in NA has been a big disappointment in terms of mileage though people report great power.

    I just loved the torque that is available in these turbo diesels. It is much different from the tsx. Now there was some speculation that Honda might put a turbo on this 2.4L gas engine and slap it in the coming Acura CR-V clone (RDX?). That would be an amazing engine IMO. However, they seem not to like turbos for some reason.
  • agree with most of the post. But, its CO2 emissions are lower, and for saps like us in Canada who signed on the the Kyoto treaty, this is significant.

    I think the US states like Cal ought to reassess the situation. I think mileage is a bigger issue confronting America than particulates and NOx. They should reverse themselves and allow clean Euro style diesels.

    BP already runs cleaned up gas. Is their diesel also clean or are they waiting till next year. They seem like a good corp to me for implementing changes before they were mandated to. Their gas costs the same as everyone else's.

    See you boys later. 10 days in the S. Pacific to cool my (diesel-loving) jets.
  • laineylainey Posts: 62
    Here's some excerpts from an interesting article that came out today:

    "Asians oversell horsepower-

    Toyota, Honda inflated claims of engine muscle; new tests force automakers to come clean with buyers...After years of touting ever higher horsepower numbers to win new customers, Toyota Motor Corp., Honda Motor Co. and possibly other automakers are now backtracking on some of those claims...Honda is reducing horsepower ratings across its Acura brand. The flagship RL sedan will lose 10 horsepower, to 290 from 300. The popular MDX SUV will fall from a rating of 265 to 253..."

    Full article here: http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0508/17/A01-283759.htm

    It looks like they inflated everything by about 10hp. So this means the '04-'05 models are really around 190 hp, and this horsepower "increase" of +10ish is going to put it at 200 hp for the '06.
  • johnny420johnny420 Posts: 473
    This is interesting. I had read about the new standards, but was under the impression it was more of a redefintion or standardization of the criteria for determining engine output.

    I had always heard that Honda actually underrated their engines slightly, and this had been borne out in dyno testing down by drivers on other enthusiast sites. The new V-6 Accord is one model that comes to mind.

    I think the big problem is comparing BHP versus measuring power at the rear wheels, as is done on dynos. Something is invariably lost in the translation.

    Johnny
  • frisconickfrisconick Posts: 1,275
    Diesal exhaust yield particulates that are very damaging to the lungs, and the 2006 standards do not address this problem. Diesal exhaust is nasty stuff.
  • drewbadrewba Posts: 154
    Getting the sulfur out of diesel fuel is a crucial milestone toward reducing air pollution nationwide, said John Millett, an Environmental Protection Agency spokesman on clean-air issues.

    "It's analogous to taking the lead out of gasoline as we did in the late 1970s," Millett said. "By taking lead out of gas, it allowed catalytic converters in cars and light trucks, which was a huge public-health benefit because emissions were dramatically reduced.

    "With diesel, we're able to do much the same thing by reducing sulfur. That allows catalytic reduction of pollutants and particulate controls to be added to the engine."
  • lmacmillmacmil Posts: 1,758
    200hp may look better than 190hp in the brochures but there's no noticeable difference in performance from a 10 hp difference. And since any difference is due to the test procedure rather than an actual engine change, there will be no performance difference at all!
  • lmacmillmacmil Posts: 1,758
    How can they claim to have "inflated" horsepower when they were rating it under a bona-fde SAE standard at the time? The more recent procedure was adopted 1 year ago (August 2004). The ratings for the 2004 models were probably established in the 2nd quarter of 2004. Re-testing is fairly expensive. Ford has said they aren't going to retest to the new standard unless they bring out a new engine or new vehicle. Much ado about nothing, in my opinion.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 100,631
    The new '06 TSX will have some engine revisions.... It will have 15 more horsepower than the old model.... no matter what measurement scale you use..

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • frisconickfrisconick Posts: 1,275
    I worked for the Californa EPA and worked on diesal regulations for years, and battled the oil industry hot and heavy. We finally won after a 11 year battle. The California EPA is much more agressive than the Federal EPA that has to cow-tow to a hostile congress. The reason that the battles against the California EPA are so bitter is that many smaller states that can't afford an EPA follow what California does. It's a domino effect, so the fights here are hot and heavy.
  • biker4biker4 Posts: 746
    Low Sulphur Diesel - expect diesel costs to go up 25-30% when the low sulphur requirements are implemented. It requires more refining and processing to achieve the lower levels - that doesn't come for free. Also, it takes 25% more oil to make a gallon of diesel than a gallon of gasoline. It also emits 17% more greenhouse gasses than gasoline.

    The oil companies have already stated that it will be 3-5 cents/gal more expensive for the low sulfur diesel - not 25-30%.
    The emissions issue is meaningless - the diesels will meet the same exact rules as gas cars.
  • frisconickfrisconick Posts: 1,275
    The emissions issue is meaningless - the diesels will meet the same exact rules as gas cars.

    This is not true, the particulates of diesal emissions are of such a size that they get stuck in you lungs that you cannot expell, car emissions are much smaller that are easily dislodged with a cough. I highly recommend that you hold your breath when a diesal bus drives by you.
  • biker4biker4 Posts: 746
    The EuroAccord iCTDi is no smoke belching bus. Look at the EPA and CARB emissions rules - they are the same for gas and diesel engines. Particulate filters make the diesel particulate problem a non-issue. Like the old Volvo commercial used to say - depending on your location the air coming out of the tail pipe might be CLEANER than the air going into the air box. :shades:
  • frisconickfrisconick Posts: 1,275
    Yes, the Japanese and Europeans have really done a good job with diesal exhaust, and yes there has been progress on emissions recently. :shades:
  • ckennedyckennedy Posts: 82
    Hi all, I am a lexus owner and have found the lexus board very helpful that's why i seek some help. My sister's 2004 TSX had the two front black louvers stolen from her car this past weekend. Are these in demand or were they trying to get to something else? How much do these run or is there a reliable OEM that i could purchase them from?

    Thanks,
    Chris
  • ckennedyckennedy Posts: 82
    Hi all i have had great feedback on the lexus board with my car however i need help with my sister has a 2004 nsx and this past weekend they stole the 2 front black wind louvers on the front of the car. Are these in demand are were they after something else. How much does they run and is there a reliable OEM that i could get them from?

    Thanks,
    Chris
  • Just wondering if there's an estimate for the MSRP of 06 TSX. I talked to a dealer a week ago and she can get me 05 TSX for $2000 under MSRP. But new 06 TSX will have no discount for sure. So even if MSRP stays the same, it's at least $2000 difference. If MSRP was to raise, it would be a $2000+the raise difference. Is this worth the extra stuff new in the 06?
  • frisconickfrisconick Posts: 1,275
    Wait until the 06 comes out and see all the extra goodies it comes with, and it's new price, and if you don't like it, buy a used 05 with very low miles on it.
  • biker4biker4 Posts: 746
    You should be able to get a discount on the 06 from the start. If the dealer is willing to go $2K below sticker now there should be some discount later also. When Lexus floods the market with its new IS250, the TSX might be one of the cars that takes a hit - watch for discounts on the TSX after October.
  • frisconickfrisconick Posts: 1,275
    I don't see a new moldel TSX being cheaper, plus the IS will be much more expensive than a TSX.
  • eusnlleusnll Posts: 10
    I was told by the dealer that the '06 MSRP will increase in the range of 500-700 but they don't have much clues about what goodies will be added , modified.

    In any case when '06 starts coming out all the '05s will be sold ASAP. It is already 2000 below MSRP. The only problem will be color choices .

    My 0.02 :D
  • biker4biker4 Posts: 746
    I didn't say the TSX will be cheaper. I said there's a good chance they'll be discounted a bit more than normal due to folks gravitating to the newest thing on the block - the new IS. It depends on what you call a lot more expensive - the base IS250 MT might be with $1000 of the TSX.
  • 307web307web Posts: 1,033
    The dealer is spewing garbage. If they don't know what features the car is going to have yet, they don't know that the price will be $500-$700 either.
    It's just sales pressue to buy now under the pretense of trying to save you money so you can avoid the huge price increase looming just around the corner.
  • nyernyer Posts: 32
    I purchased a 2005 AT TSX 3 months ago and have driven roughly 2000 miles so far. I know I have time, but I have to ask what the real timeframe is regarding oil changes? Acura says to service every 10k miles and the dealer told me to have it done every 5k. Then I am reading about certain break in additives in the oil that should be left in the car for the 1st 10k miles. Does anyone know what is the most prudent thing to do to ensure longevity of the car? Thanks for the help.
  • fredvhfredvh Posts: 854
    Personally I would change the oil and filter in a new car every 3-5 thousand miles. I have two older cars but I still change every 3000 miles. It is cheap insurance. If your car does highway driving exclusively then you could extend a couple thousand to 5000. Even if the initial oil has additional additives in it, 3000 would be sufficient for its break-in. This is my opinion.
    I am not a mechanic nor am I an expert on oil or the Acura TSX. The TSX is on my short list for my next new car as is the Camry. What kind of mpg are you getting? I hear that the ride of the TSX is a bit rough. Do you find it that way? Did you compare the ride of the TSX to any other cars?
This discussion has been closed.