Unrepairable Foul Emission Oder In New Camry
After extensive research, we purchased a new 2002 loaded Camry XLE in Oct. 2001 thinking it was a solid buy. From the beginning, we began to experience a foul intermittent "rotten egg" smell entering the cabin. The smell can be so intense that the windows must be opened. We have talked to the dealer repeatedly and the district service manager finally even inspected the vehicle. Their response is that the emissions settings are correct and that there is no solution. They maintain that it is likely caused by variation in gasoline quality. (We only use Amoco or Shell but this has made no difference.) My wife and I have finally figured out that when the smell starts (which seems to be at least once every outing now) we need to switch to inside air to stop it immediately. The problem is the windows then begin to fog up quickly. Our disappointment and frustration with Toyota is obviously great. Ironically,I had previously been a great Toyota fan having studied their manufacturing methods. We are desperate at this point and must decide whether to get rid of it. Has anybody else heard of this problem or know why Toyota will refuses to remedity it? Any suggstions would be very greatly appreciated. Thanks.
PS: We have also experienced several other so far less serious but surprising defects.+
PS: We have also experienced several other so far less serious but surprising defects.+
Tagged:
0
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Although i don't see this very often with Camrys, I see this frequently in other vehicle like Subarus and Fords (somewhat similar systems).
Contact an attorney if they won't repair the problem, but even though it bugs you, take my advice and don't be too dramatic. I deal with issues like this every day and the drama factor will really hurt your chances of recovery.
I have read that US gas is very high in sulfur levels as compared to gas sold in Japan. This is especially true with 87 octane. The 89 octane has a lower level of sulfur. (see message 2588 on the "Toyota Corolla" topic. Toyota maybe has just not designed their system to accomadate high sulfer levels of the US gas.
I am going to try the 89 octane and see if it helps, but had I known I was going to have this problem I would have never bought the car. I have been driving around the same way as you, windows up and the inside air recirculation running all the time.
The PCM/ECM can be programmed, to a certain extent and at times when these modules aren't adjusting themselves like they should, they need to be overridden and reprogrammed. Many techs call this "flashing" a PCM since they kill the memory and reinstall what the module should be thinking.
Most poor idle, transmission shifting and foul smell conditions are caused by poor PCM calibration.
The concensus is that it is caused by high sulfur content in gasoline. This is especially noticeable in winter and in the midwest where fuel formulations change as cold weather arrives.
If a PCM adjustment can fix the problem, great. But every Saab owner I know of just lives with the issue. Saab's emissions control system is the same worldwide and is very sophisticated but obviously is not customized for the US market.
Changing octane won't help. Sometimes changing brands does help. Reformulating gas helps also. And sometimes there's nothing you can do about it.
I wonder how an attorney can help prevent sulfur smells from an emission system?
but in fact, folks, they have a special way of 'splainin to the dealers that they need to look at their procedures book and dust off the four-pager on how to flash memory using new parameters they get from the automaker's support web site.
I am not sure it will help, and really don't like the extra expense of premium gas even if it does help.
In any event, I will see if my dealer's mechanics can fix it when I show them the information you guys have provided. Thanks.
I am not sure it will help, and really don't like the extra expense of premium gas even if it does help.
In any event, I will see if my dealer's mechanics can fix it when I show them the information you guys have provided. Thanks.
a brand-new automobile (have fun with it!) will also be burning paint, dressing wax, little critters that hid in the car during shipping, etc. as the engine and exhaust system heats up. it will take a couple weeks to burn off all the protectants and stuff that weren't detailed away by the brushless car wash at the dealer prep department. that can be a fooler as well.
if you can cup your hand around the exhaust stream with the car idling and parking brake on, bring it up to your nose, and not keel over from the smell of rotten egg, it might not be from combustion, but from other new-car sources. a real issue with the engine computer letting gas into the catalytic will knock down bystanders at the bus benches. it's hard to miss the bad cases.
some unrepentant techs may point out that putting an emissions wand in the tailpipe and punching the standard EPA idle test will find excess H2S emissions real fast, as well as unburned HC. but since nobody appears to want to fix the stinkers, bet they don't volunteer to sniff the tailpipe for you, either.
The next time I went in, with 6,000 miles, still stinking. They said to try premium gas. They said it's the sophisticated catalytic converter. I mentioned that the mfr. recommends regular gas and now saying that premium is required to eliminate the rotten egg smell would be considered bait and switch by some.
I'm glad I found this msg board and this problem. The dealer made it sound like I was the only person who ever reported the problem.
Now to see what they can do. I will ask them to sniff the exhaust...and videotape their reactions
I wonder why the car magazines haven't reported the stink? You'd think it would crop up since they tend to put the car through its paces during testing. Something Toyota is holding out on us? Wouldn't surprise me considering the horror stories I've read about their customer service.
I guess that's the double edged sword...buy a reliable car and deal with jerks on the few problems it has or buy a detroit car and spend your time asking for rides while it's in the shop.
-> It is based upon the larger catalytic converter size (redesign by Toyota engineers to support better emissions) and upon the makeup of US fuel.
-> There is no known repair for it.
-> It is not considered by Toyota to be a defect.
-> The sulfur smell is not dangerous.
When I raised the suggested PCM/ECM calibration ("flashing"), he stated that it has nothing to do with it... and they weren't even going to try it.
He just apologized and said there was nothing he could do. I informed him that I was dissatisfied with this response. He gave me Toyota's National Customer Service Assistance number, 1-800-331-4331. He said they weren't going to throw parts at the car to try to fix it, because it is not a problem to them.
There are some things I can live with, but this smell is unbearable. With the small fortune I put into the camry, I expected better. I was thinking about purchasing another Toyota vehicle in the near future; however, I have decided against it in light of this experience. I'm going to call the number and inform them of the problem although I'm not holding my breath that a solution will be found.
And, I don't think anyone else (owners, dealers, mfr) have suggested any real solutions for this problem.
Good luck to all.
I have just tried premium gas, and it does take care of the problem, at least so far. Phillips 66 was what I tried, but I suspect other brands are lower in sulfur in the premium grades. Yes it is more bucks, but as you say, the smell makes the car unbearable.
Help!@!@!@$#$ ???
Thanks again!!
I can understand your predicament as I am also thinking of buying a used MPV. @!@!@$#$
Just when I thought I found the right vehicle... :-(
1. You mention that a PCM/ECM re-program does the trick to get rid of the stink. Do you have any proof? Is there anyone reading this list who has had success with this method?
2. How soon in the life of the car does the stink happen? Is it variable? Could I possibly detect it while test driving at the dealer?
OK, overall there's more than 2 questions above, but I'd really like input from others on the topic. Thanks!
For everybody else:
Camry is not the only car with this problem. Check Corolla forums to see many people pissed also. Toyota will do nothing about it. Other brands are also affected occasionally (mostly imports but not only).
Hopefully, the amount of sulfur in gas will gradually decrease in the next several years.
One word of caution, the severe smell is sometimes associated with poor fuel efficiency and signifies rich fuel mixtures. So if it is very bad, get your car checked.
Couldn't find that yourself??
well, at least feel happy you haven't lost your place in the original endeavor...
At any rate, my concern was entered, and hope to hear from them soon.
more sociable at this point to try premium or any of the 2005-legal reduced sulfur gasolines that are in your area. if anybody has 'em, they're advertising it in some fashion like, "Clear Air Gas... the government demands it in 2005. Spilco has it now! Because our town's worth it."