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Toyota Sienna 2004+



  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    Simply remove the ABS pumpmotor fuse and use any size temporary you have.
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    ...and lose your ABS functionality at the same time? I would think that your ABS would be even more necessary given the extremely uneven braking traction available when running a spacesaver spare.

    How easy is it to manually modulate your brakes if your ABS equipped system is on the fritz because you've removed the pumpmotor fuse? And are you gonna accept the liability when some poor unsuspecting TH reader actually follows your advice and then slides off of a rain-slickened road?
  • kmeadkmead Posts: 232
    Given that Toyota offers a temp spare kit specifically for the AWD, they did test it with that setup to know how it would behave and function. Keeping the ABS system functioning and along with it the VSC system would be the correct thing to do. Disconnecting those systems would be an error.
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    The latest news is that ABS is actually slightly more hazardous overall than non-ABS equipped vehicles.

    And do you consider "temporary" as in "temporary spare" meaningless?
  • warubozuwarubozu Posts: 5
    My tire is a Firestone and the paperwork does not show a Toyota P/N.

    I would go with the Sear's deal, since my dealer charged $190 for the tire <ouch>. But I felt better after picking it up, because I can easily do that with one hand (I am a 125 lb weakling).

    Interesting that the max load rating of the spare is 1,819 @60 psi, while the Dunlop is 1,653 @51 psi. Probably made like the tires on semi's, skinny, but strong. Probably handles like a semi truck tire, too, hope I never have to find out :)
  • mark76mark76 Posts: 15
    I am a chemist. While the list of chemicals in your web link is "scary", the risk they pose need to be kept in context. There is no long term risk associated with exposure to these trace (volatile) chemicals. There are countless things in ones life that pose far greater risk to one's health such as poor diet, smoking, lack of exercise, engaging in risky behavior (drinking to excess, excessive speeding, etc.). I don't want to come across as preachy, however. These chemicals are scary because most people are unfamiliar with them. We all know how bad saturated fat and cholesterol is to our health but since we are familiar with these (chemical) compounds we are not as scared by them. Even though they they pose real long term health risks.

    We have owned numerous new cars over the years and in fact just took delivery of our own Sienna XLE w/cloth. The new car smell will continuously diminish over several months. The upcoming summer months will accelerate the elimination of that new car smell because the higher temperatures will drive off the volatiles that are causing the odor.

    I don't deny you may be very sensitive to the odors. We are all different. Cat dander drives me "nuts". My advise if the odor is hard to tolerate is to open the vans windows whenever you can, even if you just crack them open when parked; and to keep the ventilation flowing when diving the van. Also, keep the vents "open" so that you are drawing in fresh outside air into the van and not on "re circulation" which just recycles the inside air.

    I would not recommend trying to cover up the odor with a spray or air freshener because all you are doing is adding another layer of "chemicals" to cover up the new car smell, which may aggravate your sensitivity to smells.

    FYI, I just saw on the news that Cadillac is hard at work trying to formulate a way to PROLONG that new car smell. Go figure! ;-)
    Hope this helps. Enjoy your new van!
  • lenrlenr Posts: 13
    Is Toyota more inclined to fix problems at model year time, or do they slipstream fixes in through out the model year? I'm debating whether to buy now or wait until 05 models. Problem is dealers are less inclined to deal in the fall just after the new models arrive. Since this was a major re-design with significant drive line changes, I'm wondering if I should give them just a bit longer to smooth everything out. Experienced Toyota buyer's thoughts?
  • mylescatmylescat Posts: 1
    If you have the DVD & children in 2nd row child seats can you tell me if there are any problems with the viewing angle of the DVD.

  • kksdadkksdad Posts: 28
    My 3 year old loves watching from the 2nd roll, especially with the "her own" headphones on! During spring break, we took a 900 mile roundtrip drive down to Disneyland and she was very happy to have all her Dora the Explorer, Brother Bear and Nemo DVD's! You'd be surprised, I don't think kids seem to be AS PARTICULAR as adults are, with all the fine tuning and view angles. Remember, it's a minivan, not an IMAX/THX surround-sound theater where you are fighting for prime viewing seats! For what we've got in all our Sienna's, I think it serves it purpose well and does an excellent job of "entertaining" passengers of all ages!
  • norbnnorbn Posts: 70
    Where did you hear that ABS was more dangerous? This really upsets me when people just post crap like this. Same thing with the airbags, people hear of one incident and they go all overboard. ABS works, airbags work.

    Note, those kids that got killed by airbags were in the front seat, UNBELTED and playing on the dash when the car had a front end collision trigerring the airbag, so yes the airbag did kill them but if not the airbag then the windshield would of. See how the media spins it?
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    Sorry, the reports have been out for quite some time now so I didn't think to post the source, I seem to remember that the origin was the IIHS(??) Insurance Institute for Highway Safety.

    As I remember it the one area that was the most diverse, ABS vs Non-ABS, was single vehicle injury or fatal accidents. Apparently something about ABS equipped cars make them more prone to these.
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    I'm never going to set here and disparate airbag safety, they undoubtedly do an excellent job when properly used.

    The IMPROPER use was belting the child, with or without a child's seat, into the front passenger seat. "Belting", therefore no threat of flying through the windshield.

    It's really the same problem of some adult of slight frame and weight behind the steering wheel and being injured by the airbag in an otherwise non-injury accident.
  • carman123carman123 Posts: 71
    I think the safety issue that wwest is referring to is improper use of ABS by ignorant drivers. When needing to stop quickly, people would feel the brake pedal pulsing and let up pressure. This resulted in longer stopping distances and increased accident rates for ABS equipped cars versus non-ABS equipped cars. If people would mash the brakes and hold the pressure, then there would have been no statistical anomaly. To correct this problem, many automakers have added "brake assist" so that when a driver presses the brakes faster than normal, the computer holds maximum braking even if the driver releases the pedal. Thus, in emergency situations, today's ABS equipped vehicles help even the ignorant driver stop faster. One of the main advantages of ABS is that steering control is maintained even under maximum braking. This can greatly improve one's chances of avoiding a collison.
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    ...if wwest has permanently removed the ABS pumpmotor fuse from his RX300 if he feels ABS is more dangerous that non-ABS. And again, I would like to know how difficult it is to manually modulate the brakes in an ABS-equipped vehicle when the system has been purposefully disabled by the owner.

    BTW - "brake assist" is standard equipment on the Sienna.
  • kmeadkmead Posts: 232
    The issue WWest refers to is accidents where the vehicle hits objects off the side of the road as a result of being able to brake and turn. So a larger number of vehicles are hitting secondary objects (trees, rocks etc) and these vehicles tend to suffer extensive damage. Does this make ABS equipped vehicles more dangerous? No.

    Some drivers are tending to drive their cars to the limit of ABS, ie driving such that even ABS cannot save them.

    However this is not evidence that ABS is less safe. Its just not safer. From the IIHS site:

    Quote:4. Do car antilocks reduce crashes? Although car antilocks perform well on the test track, there's no evidence they have made significant reductions in the number of on-the-road crashes. A 1994 Highway Loss Data Institute (HLDI) study1 and a subsequent 1995 study2 compare insurance claims for groups of otherwise identical cars with and without antilocks, finding no differences in the overall frequency or cost of crashes for which insurance claims for vehicle damage are filed. Because antilocks should make the most difference on wet and slippery roads, researchers also studied insurance claims experience in 29 northern states during winter months. Even here they found no difference in the frequency of insurance claims for vehicles with and without antilock brakes. A 1997 Institute study,3 as well as a 2001 update,4 reported no difference in the overall fatal crash involvement of cars with and without antilocks.

    Federal studies of car antilocks are consistent with Institute and HLDI findings. According to one federal report, "the overall, net effect of antilock brakes" on both police-reported crashes and fatal crashes "was close to zero."5 The federal studies of effects of antilocks on passenger vehicle crashes found positive effects on wet roads and negative effects for run-off-road crashes. These two opposite results cancel each other. Leonard Evans, a researcher with General Motors, reported that antilock-equipped cars were less likely to rear-end other vehicles but more likely to have other vehicles rear-end them.6 Again, the net result was little effect on overall crash risk. In a study done for auto manufacturers, Failure Analysis Associates reported a net beneficial effect of antilocks on nonfatal crashes but no effect on fatal crashes.7

    5. Why aren't car antilocks reducing crashes as expected? No one knows for sure why their test performance hasn't translated into a significant reduction in real-world crashes. A possible reason is that the average motorist rarely experiences total loss of vehicle control, which antilocks are designed to prevent. There's also evidence that many car owners don't know how to use antilock brakes effectively. An Institute survey of drivers with antilock-equipped cars found that more than 50 percent in North Carolina and 40 percent in Wisconsin incorrectly thought they should pump the brakes.8 Another possibility is that some motorists may drive less cautiously because they believe antilocks allow them to brake better.

    This was from the following:
  • user777user777 Posts: 3,341
    thanks. got anything similar for vehicle stability control and increased safety? ;)

    you write:
    Some drivers are tending to drive their cars to the limit of ABS, ie driving such that even ABS cannot save them.

    i'd have to agree - the automation may be enabling some driver's poor habits.
  • kmeadkmead Posts: 232
    more links available for stability control. Vehicle stability control is the first major enhancement to show a strong improvement in safety. I need to go to bed now, but will find some of my older posts and info on this subject. As I recall, in Europe they are crediting VSC and similar systems with a considerable drop in the number of rollover and other accidents.

    I strongly believe in VSC, I have it on my Sienna LE.
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    I haven't figured out just how VSC differs from simply adding more roadbed traction by putting wider tires on the car. Both seem to give more advantage at or near the "edge", but once the driver starts using the new parameters then we get back to square one.

    Once I start relying on VSC then there is no difference than wider tires???
  • kmeadkmead Posts: 232

    There is a huge difference between VSC and wide tires.

    VSC has little or nothing to do with getting more roadbed traction, it will allow you to use the traction that is there.

    VSC is about keeping the vehicle on the chosen path, ie the steering wheel is pointed in a particular direction, the vehicle should be going in that direction. We have had this conversation before so I won't belabor the point.

    I will take the time this evening to post information about VSC.
  • norbnnorbn Posts: 70
    What do you mean relying on VSC? Do you mean you are driving at 10/10 all the time? Cause that's the only time you'll be setting off the VSC. Here's a piece of advice, slow down before you kill someone.
This discussion has been closed.