Keyless, Pointless - 2015 BMW M235i Convertible Long-Term Road Test

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Keyless, Pointless - 2015 BMW M235i Convertible Long-Term Road Test

Offering keyless ignition without keyless entry defeats the purpose, as our 2015 BMW M235i demonstrates.

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yellowbal

Luxury car manufacturers often do this. Charging a lot extra for features that come standard or at reasonable costs on everyday cars like the the Mazda3. The premium brands often charge extra for backup cameras whereas the cheapest Toyota or Honda has it standard.

schen72

They do it because the market will bear it. Not me though. Even though I really like BMWs I won't spend my own hard-earned money because it's just too expensive. I once drove a rental 328i and the lack of proximity key for the door was infuriating.

kirkhilles_

Man, that's crazy. Of course that's German luxury vehicles for you. For me, I'd feel bad enough about spending an extra $3k to go from the Civic LX to the EX w/ HS and you get A LOT for that. Nickle and Diming you (well, that's A LOT of nickels) would just drive me nuts.

vvk

I would rather have a base BMW with wind up windows and no features than a fully loaded Toyota. To each his own, I guess.

What irks me more, sometimes, is manufacturers using ugly, low quality materials in lower priced models, seemingly on purpose. The plastic steering wheel in my Passat S was terrible.

schen72

vvk said:

I would rather have a base BMW with wind up windows and no features than a fully loaded Toyota. To each his own, I guess.

What irks me more, sometimes, is manufacturers using ugly, low quality materials in lower priced models, seemingly on purpose. The plastic steering wheel in my Passat S was terrible.

I'm the opposite of you. I need any car I buy to be pretty much fully loaded. I buy my cars and keep them for 15+ years minimum. The nickel and diming of German cars is simply their price structure. Everyone understands it. It's the premium they can charge because of their badges.

kirkhilles_

I'm more of a "sweet spot" type of guy. I can CERTAINLY appreciate larger engines and leather, but things start climbing really fast at the higher level and then you reach the point to where it doesn't really make sense at that price. Often the base LX model is do-able as basic transportation, but upgrading from steel wheels to alloy is nice (while still being small, soft ride and affordable tires), plus things like moonroof, Android Auto is a big push, larger screens, adaptive driving technologies, remote start, push button start, etc really are big features and are often just a single step up (at least for Hondas: going from the LX to the EX is big for about $3k on a Civic).

The whole German thing where you can double the price of the car with options is absolutely insane though. No, I don't want to pay $500 for painted AC ducts. No, I don't want to have to add a $10k package just to get a critical option.

roadburner

With the exception of the Club Sport-which I custom ordered to get the 25% locking diff as well as to avoid a hole in the roof-every other Bimmer in my garage was purchased as a CPO.
Depreciation is my friend.

benson2175

I'm a fully loaded guy too, I can't bear dead buttons, but I'm also a German car guy which means with my means I can basically only buy a used Mercedes S-Class. Which is not a great solution because my S-Class has been in the shop since December. Seriously. I've never heard of that happening to Toyota people. The shop is finally giving up though and it's going to be towed to the dealer on Monday. This is going to cost more than what I paid for the car I'm sure. I still don't know what else I could drive; nothing I have ever been in has the same combination of fun, luxury, and room.

allthingshonda

BMW and it's German counterparts are going to have to realize that most people don't really think they should pay extra for things that are standard in the Nissan Altima . An auto dimming rearview mirror costs extra in a 2015 BMW but my Mom's 1994 Buick had one and it's standard in my Acura TSX. There was a time when German engineering was something that differentiated them from others. But today I would say Ford's Ecoboost V6 engines are just as good as the BMW turbo I6. Cadillac's ride and handling characteristics are now better than BMW. A Chevy Volt makes the BMW i3 look like a golf cart. Even when you read the long term posts about the Mustang and the 4 Series you have to ask; why buy the 235 over the Mustang except for the badge. More power and features for less money in the Stang.

sharpend

Or you can just buy a loaded used BMW (or any luxury car) for a fraction of the original new price.

roadburner

sharpend said:

Or you can just buy a loaded used BMW (or any luxury car) for a fraction of the original new price.

Exactly; I liked the Mustang GT quite a bit, but I was extremely unhappy with the way Ford bundled options- forcing me to take a raft of things I didn't want in order to get one or two things I did. I ended up with a CPO 2er for about the same price as a base GT with the Performance Pkg. and Recaros.

allthingshonda

sharpend said:

Or you can just buy a loaded used BMW (or any luxury car) for a fraction of the original new price.

Or you could buy a brand new fully loaded 2016 Camaro SS with single digits on the odometer and full warranty and save 10 grand over the Bimmer. You'll get a 455 HP V8, Magnetic Ride Control, Brembro brakes, dual mode exhaust, built in Wi-Fi and other features. And a engine and exhaust sound no CPO BMW will give you. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moZpjHhUUE8

roadburner

I priced a new Camaro SS 1LE- $10k more than my CPO...

thepuff

Love the pony cars too but, at least in the Denver area, the insurance is almost twice the price and with USAA. Also, the pony's aren't getting 24-26 mpg like the BMW and have 4 years of included maintenance (and abetter warranty to boot). Just a few long-term ownership costs. Oh, and you'll have something a little more unique vs the 100's of Mustangs and Camaros I see.

roadburner

I'm with Safeco, and a Mustang GT or Camaro 1LE was about the same-or a bit less-than the 2er I eventually bought.
I might also mention that another thing that dissuaded me from the GT was the fact that-even with the Performance Pkg.-the car needs the $1500 FRPP Track Handling Pack to make it suitable for HPDEs.

craigo7

allthingshonda said:

BMW and it's German counterparts are going to have to realize that most people don't really think they should pay extra for things that are standard in the Nissan Altima . An auto dimming rearview mirror costs extra in a 2015 BMW but my Mom's 1994 Buick had one and it's standard in my Acura TSX. There was a time when German engineering was something that differentiated them from others. But today I would say Ford's Ecoboost V6 engines are just as good as the BMW turbo I6. Cadillac's ride and handling characteristics are now better than BMW. A Chevy Volt makes the BMW i3 look like a golf cart. Even when you read the long term posts about the Mustang and the 4 Series you have to ask; why buy the 235 over the Mustang except for the badge. More power and features for less money in the Stang.

I think you're projecting your own feelings a little bit there. Sales of lux cars are just as good as usual... different people have different expectations and motivations. Some get irate when their econo-honda develops a minor rattle and vow to never return. Others, like the Mercedes guy above, have their lux vehicles in the shop for weeks and put up with it until they buy their next Mercedes because they like Mercedes.

throwback

Typical German pricing. They even charge extra for color on your car, hence a sea of grey and black cars.Until sales start dropping they will continue business as usual.

roadburner

throwback said:

Typical German pricing. They even charge extra for color on your car, hence a sea of grey and black cars.Until sales start dropping they will continue business as usual.

The domestics are doing the same thing- just not to the same extent as the Germans.

boff

The lack of "Comfort Access" really is a big fat bummer...here's why: you have to fish the key out of your pocket to open the doors, and in a normal car you'd then have the key in your hand to put into the ignition. But not in the Bimmer...you have your [non-permissible content removed] key in your hand and nowhere to put it...except maybe cram it in your pocket when you are already sitting down. Then when you get out you have to fish the key out again, where in a normal car you'd have it in your hand already having taken it out of the ignition. I had a loaner without Comfort Access and after 3 days I still hadn't got used to the (in hindsight, simple) tactic of tossing the key in the cupholder. I cursed and cursed that car. I think BMW makes certain packages, like the Premium Package, a de facto must-have because not getting it results in a penalty box. I remember for the 2012 year, when we got our 328i, not getting the Premium Package meant no fold-down rear seat. The dealer had ordered a bunch of cars so (not) equipped and our salesman lamented ever being able to get rid of them.

vvk

> The lack of "Comfort Access" really is a big fat bummer...here's why: you have to fish the key out of your pocket to open the doors,
> and in a normal car you'd then have the key in your hand to put into the ignition. But not in the Bimmer...you have your
> [non-permissible content removed] key in your hand and nowhere to put it...except maybe cram it in your pocket when you are already sitting down.

Not sure why you can't insert the key into its slot on the dashboard. This is actually required to start the car if you don't have Comfort Access. I don't mind it. In fact, I would prefer a real key you have to twist.

I currently have two BMWs with Comfort Access and it is nice because BMW makes it perfect, especially on my 550i. I have tried it on some Asian cars and it was not nearly as well implemented, with a physical button you have to push, sometimes only available on the driver's door. I did not like it at all. I like the way the BMW system senses your hand instead of having to push a physical button.You can unlock/lock from any door on either side of the car by simply bringing your hand in close proximity of the door handle..

boff

No slot in the 2015 328i I had as a loaner. I am sure there is no slot in the M235i, either. There WAS a slot in our old E90 328i...

roadburner

The F3x and F2x cars do not have a slot on the dashboard, although I believe at least some have a slot in the console to hold the key.

allthingshonda

I think Tesla (and probably others) do it the best. On a Tesla you shut off the car, get out, close the door and walk away. The car will lock itself automatically when it no longer senses the key. No buttons to push or sensor to touch.

craigo7

allthingshonda said:

I think Tesla (and probably others) do it the best. On a Tesla you shut off the car, get out, close the door and walk away. The car will lock itself automatically when it no longer senses the key. No buttons to push or sensor to touch.

I think most of the true keyless systems have this as an option that can be enabled. Potential downside is that its possible to lock the key in the car if it's in a place where the signal is weakened. Certain purses seem to have this effect.

agentorange

After owning an unreliable basic BMW in the UK, I came to believe that BMW is actually an acronym for a long, compound German word meaning "The Ultimate Gouging Company". I once visited the local BMW lot on a Sunday and went away holding my ribs laughing at the prices.

reighty8

In the UK you can just spec the Comfort Access. I don't have it and it isn't a huge issue for me as I prefer to empty my pockets before driving regardless; just a habit. One thing I quite enjoy about keyless start is being able to start the engine and heater with the car locked whist sit indoors with the keys waiting for the car to warm up before leaving the house or work.

reighty8

boff said:

No slot in the 2015 328i I had as a loaner. I am sure there is no slot in the M235i, either. There WAS a slot in our old E90 328i...

There is a slot in of the cupholders.

2016 F23 M235i