Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous

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  • benjaminhbenjaminh Member Posts: 6,038
    edited August 2021
    In terms of mpg and adequate acceleration I'm sure the hybrid Maverick will be fine. But I think it would be nice to be able to have fun, as well as feel more confident when driving in the snow.
    2018 Acura TLX 2.4 Tech 4WS (mine), 2018 Honda CR-V EX AWD (wife's)
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,630
    Not sure any model will really be “fun” on road. But the FWD still has good ground clearance and tires so should be better than most FWD cars in snow.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384

    @andres3 said:
    2 DOORS are in fact, lighter than 4 doors, no matter how big the 2 doors are, 4 doors will be heavier because they are never twice as heavy.

    Wouldn’t it depend on what the doors were made of? Carbon fiber over aluminum 4 doors vs steel 2 door for instance. We are painting with a broad brush. :)

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 30,874
    ronsteve said:



    SUV vs CUV seems pedantic to me. And why would marketers like me? It was definitely NOT a good thing when the Outback stopped being a wagon. When I got the RDX I was settling, as wagons at my preferred age/mileage/price point were near impossible to find.

    The Venza most closely resembles Edge/Murano/Outback.

    I said they'd like you because they want you to call them SUVs. Wagons are taboo to them. You can obviously call it whatever you want. But that means I can, too. As I said, it is close in height to a wagon. Even if by cargo space, the Venza as 55 cu ft. The V60 has 51 and the Murano 65-67. So I exercise my right to classify it as a wagon.

    '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c, '21 WRX, '20 S90 T6, '22 4xE. 62-car history and counting! MB Sprinter and '92 Nissan Gloria on the way!

  • ronsteveronsteve LooavulMember Posts: 1,051
    qbrozen said:



    I said they'd like you because they want you to call them SUVs. Wagons are taboo to them. You can obviously call it whatever you want. But that means I can, too. As I said, it is close in height to a wagon. Even if by cargo space, the Venza as 55 cu ft. The V60 has 51 and the Murano 65-67. So I exercise my right to classify it as a wagon.

    The Brits refer to a wagon as an estate or a longroof. Emphasis on long roof.

    So the marketers are happy that I call it a SUV even though I'd rather NOT buy their vehicle?

    In my mind it's the aspect ratio of the cargo area that makes the difference.
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2013 VW Jetta 2.5SE
  • ronsteveronsteve LooavulMember Posts: 1,051
    stickguy said:

    IMO the outback, Audi all road and Volvo V60CC are all just jacked up AWD station wagons.

    V60 (be it CC or not) and allroad are wagons, as well as the MB E-class wagon and the now defunct TourX and Alltrack. Outback and Venza are decidedly taller and have less rear overhang, in line with the SUV crowd.
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2013 VW Jetta 2.5SE
  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoModerator Posts: 204,573
    ronsteve said:

    stickguy said:

    IMO the outback, Audi all road and Volvo V60CC are all just jacked up AWD station wagons.

    V60 (be it CC or not) and allroad are wagons, as well as the MB E-class wagon and the now defunct TourX and Alltrack. Outback and Venza are decidedly taller and have less rear overhang, in line with the SUV crowd.
    Funny, when we traded in the CX-7 for the Outback, the wife specifically wanted a "wagon". At the time, the only choices were the Outback and the XC90 (which was about $15K more expensive).

    The test drive of the Outback, to me, didn't reveal a lot of difference between the Mazda and the Subaru, in terms of ride height and visibility.

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    2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2014 MINI Countryman S ALL4

  • 28firefighter28firefighter Seattle, WAMember Posts: 8,570
    edited August 2021
    So to get OEM Mopar replacement is $700 including tax installed. Definitely not worth going through insurance given my $500 deductible. To go with Gorilla Glass is $1000 installed and insurance won't reimburse for that. Thoughts?
    2021 Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2008 Infiniti G35
  • ronsteveronsteve LooavulMember Posts: 1,051
    edited August 2021
    Michaell said:

    ronsteve said:

    stickguy said:

    IMO the outback, Audi all road and Volvo V60CC are all just jacked up AWD station wagons.

    V60 (be it CC or not) and allroad are wagons, as well as the MB E-class wagon and the now defunct TourX and Alltrack. Outback and Venza are decidedly taller and have less rear overhang, in line with the SUV crowd.
    Funny, when we traded in the CX-7 for the Outback, the wife specifically wanted a "wagon". At the time, the only choices were the Outback and the XC90 (which was about $15K more expensive).

    The test drive of the Outback, to me, didn't reveal a lot of difference between the Mazda and the Subaru, in terms of ride height and visibility.
    And the XC90 is definitely a SUV... standard 3-row, even!

    Unless you mean the V90 CC, which is a legit big wagon.
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2013 VW Jetta 2.5SE
  • breldbreld Member Posts: 6,145
    ronsteve said:

    Michaell said:

    ronsteve said:

    stickguy said:

    IMO the outback, Audi all road and Volvo V60CC are all just jacked up AWD station wagons.

    V60 (be it CC or not) and allroad are wagons, as well as the MB E-class wagon and the now defunct TourX and Alltrack. Outback and Venza are decidedly taller and have less rear overhang, in line with the SUV crowd.
    Funny, when we traded in the CX-7 for the Outback, the wife specifically wanted a "wagon". At the time, the only choices were the Outback and the XC90 (which was about $15K more expensive).

    The test drive of the Outback, to me, didn't reveal a lot of difference between the Mazda and the Subaru, in terms of ride height and visibility.
    And the XC90 is definitely a SUV... standard 3-row, even!
    I'm pretty sure @michael meant to say XC70, fwiw.

    2021 Polestar 2 - 2022 M340i - 2022 X5 - 2021 Bronco - 2004 330i ZHP

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,630
    Is gorilla glass really that much better? If so, $300 seems like a reasonable up charge.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • breldbreld Member Posts: 6,145
    Got a call from the Volvo dealership this morning to let me know there was an error in the sales tax collected.

    When I traded the Leaf, they were up-front that was no sales tax credit for the trade since it was leased. I was aware of that and did notice a credit had been applied to the city sales tax (but not the other taxes). I didn't say anything, since I figured it was all done by their system.

    But it was rejected by the DMV for title processing due to the tax collection error, and the finance manager had to call me and give me the unfortunate news that I owed another $851 in taxes. That didn't surprise me in the least, so I think he was pleased at my reaction and prompt payment.

    Makes me wonder though...I have definitely received the sales tax credit for a trade that was leased in the past...most recently with the V90 we traded last year. It must be the dealership is processing the trade in a different manner and hopes to not get audited?

    2021 Polestar 2 - 2022 M340i - 2022 X5 - 2021 Bronco - 2004 330i ZHP

  • oldfarmer50oldfarmer50 Member Posts: 19,908

    So to get OEM Mopar replacement is $700 including tax installed. Definitely not worth going through insurance given my $500 deductible. To go with Gorilla Glass is $1000 installed and insurance won't reimburse for that. Thoughts?

    My go to would be a used windshield but your vehicle is too new for that.

    2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2004 Chevy Van, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,630
    breld said:

    ronsteve said:

    Michaell said:

    ronsteve said:

    stickguy said:

    IMO the outback, Audi all road and Volvo V60CC are all just jacked up AWD station wagons.

    V60 (be it CC or not) and allroad are wagons, as well as the MB E-class wagon and the now defunct TourX and Alltrack. Outback and Venza are decidedly taller and have less rear overhang, in line with the SUV crowd.
    Funny, when we traded in the CX-7 for the Outback, the wife specifically wanted a "wagon". At the time, the only choices were the Outback and the XC90 (which was about $15K more expensive).

    The test drive of the Outback, to me, didn't reveal a lot of difference between the Mazda and the Subaru, in terms of ride height and visibility.
    And the XC90 is definitely a SUV... standard 3-row, even!
    I'm pretty sure @michael meant to say XC70, fwiw.
    That makes way more sense. Also just a lifted station wagon same as an OB.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • tjc78tjc78 South JerseyMember Posts: 13,583

    @28firefighter said:
    So to get OEM Mopar replacement is $700 including tax installed. Definitely not worth going through insurance given my $500 deductible. To go with Gorilla Glass is $1000 installed and insurance won't reimburse for that. Thoughts?

    It’s a lease. Go with the standard windshield.

    Volvo replacement is $1100. I went through insurance but only have a $50 deductible for glass. They are coming tomorrow to do it.

    Just to be sure the $700 includes the calibration? That was almost $400 of the $1100 on the quote

    2020 Volvo XC90 T6 Momentum / 2019 Volvo S60 T6 Inscription

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,630
    I doubt a wrangler has much calibration. Doesn’t the windshield still fold down?

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • tjc78tjc78 South JerseyMember Posts: 13,583

    I just assumed it had safety systems like most new cars.

    2020 Volvo XC90 T6 Momentum / 2019 Volvo S60 T6 Inscription

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,630
    It does but I don’t think anything like eyesite that has a fancy electronics box mounted on the windshield. But as always, I could be wrong!

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384

    Well, @28firefighter , it depends on how lucky you feel. A rock cracked the first windshield in a couple of months and you are paying out of pocket. If it happens again it will be another $700 OOP. An extra $300 seems like cheap insurance to me…

  • 28firefighter28firefighter Seattle, WAMember Posts: 8,570
    So, I spoke to another shop and he says his supplier has an OEM Mopar Gorilla Glass windshield that he can do for $450 installed based on my VIN. That seems low but he his calling them and verifying his schedule this week and will call me back EOD.

    FWIW, I did not get advanced safety package on mine (adaptive cruise, etc.) and means I have no calibration.
    2021 Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2008 Infiniti G35
  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384

    @28firefighter said:
    So, I spoke to another shop and he says his supplier has an OEM Mopar Gorilla Glass windshield that he can do for $450 installed based on my VIN. That seems low but he his calling them and verifying his schedule this week and will call me back EOD.

    FWIW, I did not get advanced safety package on mine (adaptive cruise, etc.) and means I have no calibration.

    I hope that works out. That would be great

  • sdasda Indian Land, SCMember Posts: 5,581
    I haven't heard of Gorilla glass for vehicles. Is that something recent? I have had Gorilla glass protectors on my daughter's I-phone.

    2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav

  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 30,874
    edited August 2021
    ronsteve said:



    The Brits refer to a wagon as an estate or a longroof. Emphasis on long roof.

    So the marketers are happy that I call it a SUV even though I'd rather NOT buy their vehicle?

    In my mind it's the aspect ratio of the cargo area that makes the difference.

    well now I'm curious. What is the aspect ratio you are referring to?

    And, yes, they want everyone to call it an SUV.

    '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c, '21 WRX, '20 S90 T6, '22 4xE. 62-car history and counting! MB Sprinter and '92 Nissan Gloria on the way!

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,630
    I’m guessing height vs length?

    Use Sube. Outback is a wagon. Cargo area is long but relatively low. Forester is a CUV. sorter but taller cargo area.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384
    edited August 2021

    @sda said:
    I haven't heard of Gorilla glass for vehicles. Is that something recent? I have had Gorilla glass protectors on my daughter's I-phone.

    Just recently started offering it on Jeep wranglers. It caused a delay if you ordered it with gorilla glass.

    I believe it is a protective layer over the regular glass just like phones - that was my take looking at the Corning gorilla glass website

  • 28firefighter28firefighter Seattle, WAMember Posts: 8,570
    edited August 2021
    mjfloyd1 said:

    @sda said:

    I haven't heard of Gorilla glass for vehicles. Is that something recent? I have had Gorilla glass protectors on my daughter's I-phone.

    Just recently started offering it on Jeep wranglers. It caused a delay if you ordered it with gorilla glass.

    I believe it is a protective layer over the regular glass just like phones - that was my take looking at the Corning gorilla glass website


    One nuance -I believe there is a layer under the front glass - part of the acoustic interlayer - where the gorilla glass liner goes. Supposedly stops chips from turning into cracks. Can't imagine why they'd be concerned with that...
    2021 Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2008 Infiniti G35
  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384

    Since it is near vertical and seems to attract stones and rocks perhaps :)

  • jmonroe1jmonroe1 Pittsburgh areaMember Posts: 4,453
    stickguy said:

    Is gorilla glass really that much better? If so, $300 seems like a reasonable up charge.

    If I’m reading this right Jeep can install better glass but wants more money to do it. It’s pretty damn bad when an owner can’t expect their windshield to last the life of their cars. They did back in my earlier days. Maybe with all this higher horsepower that today’s cars have, bigger rocks are being hurled around.

    Hold on folks, if this is a profit center for Jeep the other manufacturers are sure to follow.

    That’s not an old person talking…that’s an experienced person talking. GEEZE.

    jmonroe
    '15 Genesis just like jmonroe, '18 Legacy Limited with 3.6R (Mrs. j's)
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 45,630
    Windshields have always been getting cracked. That’s nothing new.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD , 2022 Ford Maverick Lariat Ecoboost FWD.

  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384
    edited August 2021

    Gorilla glass is only $99 more from factory

    Jeep wranglers seem worse with the near vertical windshields vs an angled windshield causing chips and cracks

  • MichaellMichaell ColoradoModerator Posts: 204,573
    breld said:

    ronsteve said:

    Michaell said:

    ronsteve said:

    stickguy said:

    IMO the outback, Audi all road and Volvo V60CC are all just jacked up AWD station wagons.

    V60 (be it CC or not) and allroad are wagons, as well as the MB E-class wagon and the now defunct TourX and Alltrack. Outback and Venza are decidedly taller and have less rear overhang, in line with the SUV crowd.
    Funny, when we traded in the CX-7 for the Outback, the wife specifically wanted a "wagon". At the time, the only choices were the Outback and the XC90 (which was about $15K more expensive).

    The test drive of the Outback, to me, didn't reveal a lot of difference between the Mazda and the Subaru, in terms of ride height and visibility.
    And the XC90 is definitely a SUV... standard 3-row, even!
    I'm pretty sure @michael meant to say XC70, fwiw.
    Yeah, that’s it. XC70 at the time.

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    2015 Subaru Outback 3.6R / 2014 MINI Countryman S ALL4

  • jmonroe1jmonroe1 Pittsburgh areaMember Posts: 4,453
    stickguy said:

    Windshields have always been getting cracked. That’s nothing new.

    Sure, they’ve always cracked but it’s with greater regularity now.

    jmonroe
    '15 Genesis just like jmonroe, '18 Legacy Limited with 3.6R (Mrs. j's)
  • ronsteveronsteve LooavulMember Posts: 1,051
    breld said:



    I'm pretty sure @michael meant to say XC70, fwiw.

    This makes a lot more sense... a legit wagon, even if it is lifted in the spirit of the 2009 and earlier Outbacks.
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2013 VW Jetta 2.5SE
  • ronsteveronsteve LooavulMember Posts: 1,051
    stickguy said:

    I’m guessing height vs length?

    Use Sube. Outback is a wagon. Cargo area is long but relatively low. Forester is a CUV. sorter but taller cargo area.

    Yes height vs length...

    Outback reduced length slightly with the 2010 redesign, but grew substantially taller.
    2015 Acura RDX AWD / 2013 VW Jetta 2.5SE
  • qbrozenqbrozen Member Posts: 30,874
    stickguy said:

    I’m guessing height vs length?

    Use Sube. Outback is a wagon. Cargo area is long but relatively low. Forester is a CUV. sorter but taller cargo area.

    we'll see what the answer is, but I can guarantee you it is not cut and dry. By ratio only, a Suburban would be more wagon-like than a CTS "saloon," for example.

    '08 Charger R/T Daytona; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c, '21 WRX, '20 S90 T6, '22 4xE. 62-car history and counting! MB Sprinter and '92 Nissan Gloria on the way!

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 15,748
    edited August 2021
    mjfloyd1 said:

    Since it is near vertical and seems to attract stones and rocks perhaps :)

    I've had one chip on my Wrangler in the 19 years I've owned it. Insurance covered the resin fix for free.

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2014 M235i; 2009 Cooper Clubman; 1999 Wrangler; 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 15,748
    I found a Mineral Gray M4 manual with 47k miles on it; sadly it is not a Competition...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2014 M235i; 2009 Cooper Clubman; 1999 Wrangler; 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2018 330i xDrive

  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384

    @roadburner said:
    I've had one chip on my Wrangler in the 19 years I've owned it. Insurance covered the resin fix for free.

    I assume glass is thinner now for weight savings???

  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTMember Posts: 17,314
    Back when we had a couple of VW Thing's, the windshield on one got a crack.
    My dad when to a local glass shop and they made one for about a third of the price of the auto glass place.
    2020 Ford Explorer XLT
  • Sandman6472Sandman6472 Coral Springs, FLMember Posts: 6,235
    I had my college roommate take out all four of mine also. He was at the U. of Miami doing his last year to become an oral surgeon so he had me come down to the clinic and pulled all four out. I got sick from the pain meds but once he changed those, I was feeling much better. Took off a week and only ate mashed potatoes for every meal as I couldn't chew. My mother-in-law stayed with us to take care of me and made sure I ate those mashed potatoes.
    Didn't cost us a dime as the work was done in their clinic and I was practice for him. He was/is extremely intelligent so knew I'd be in great hands! Wasn't a good couple of weeks and I lost a good 10 pounds but by week two, was feeling well enough to go back to work. Soft foods only for almost a month though.

    2015 Audi A3 (wife) / 2015 Golf TSI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2)

  • 28firefighter28firefighter Seattle, WAMember Posts: 8,570
    I just wish I could "latch" the regen setting - I literally use it all the time.
    2021 Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2008 Infiniti G35
  • 28firefighter28firefighter Seattle, WAMember Posts: 8,570
    Also makes me wonder on what planet this could be $450 installed...
    2021 Tesla Model 3 SR+, 2008 Infiniti G35
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAMember Posts: 13,084
    mjfloyd1 said:

    @andres3 said:

    2 DOORS are in fact, lighter than 4 doors, no matter how big the 2 doors are, 4 doors will be heavier because they are never twice as heavy.

    Wouldn’t it depend on what the doors were made of? Carbon fiber over aluminum 4 doors vs steel 2 door for instance. We are painting with a broad brush. :)


    Do you know of any car with steel front doors and carbon fiber or aluminum rear doors? If anything it would be the other way around; you'd want the front doors to be lighter.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384
    edited August 2021

    All 4 doors carbon fiber over aluminum. Why mix and match? The total weight of those 4 doors vs the total weight of a different car with 2 steel doors

    No one said it had to be a production car…

  • andres3andres3 Southern CAMember Posts: 13,084
    mjfloyd1 said:

    All 4 doors carbon fiber over aluminum. Why mix and match? The total weight of those 4 doors vs the total weight of a different car with 2 steel doors

    No one said it had to be a production car…

    Well that's comparing apples and oranges. Production cars make sense because they are available to be driven.

    If 4 aluminum doors are lighter than 4 steel doors, it stands that 2 doors made of aluminum (apples to apples) will still be lighter than 4 doors of aluminum.

    This reminds me of the person that said driving faster doesn't get you from A to B faster because of bathroom breaks and eating breaks on road trips. Why the person driving the speed limit gets to eat less and go to the bathroom less I'll never understand.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • mjfloyd1mjfloyd1 Member Posts: 2,384

    Yes I’m comparing apples and oranges. I don’t recall it being stated that it had to be apples to apples. :)

    What do breaks have to do with doors? Apples and pears :)

  • andres3andres3 Southern CAMember Posts: 13,084
    mjfloyd1 said:

    Yes I’m comparing apples and oranges. I don’t recall it being stated that it had to be apples to apples. :)

    What do breaks have to do with doors? Apples and pears :)

    I was reminded of the Pears by a person that didn't like the simple math required to calculate time saved driving X more miles per hour faster over Y amount of time. Pretty simple math. But the person seemed more interested in making it seem like going faster saved no time, so they altered the math to include cherries by introducing bathroom and eating breaks, but for some reason the slower driving equation didn't have those cherries.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
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