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Run-flat, self-sealing, PAX tires for Minivans



  • bill517bill517 Posts: 6
    I swapped out my PAX tires with Goodyear tires and Honda wheels. However the Goodyear dealer was told that the TPMS senders would not fit on the rims. What type rims did you buy?

    I am pleased with the softer ride and better feel of the road.
  • smlycatsmlycat Posts: 23
    You can pull the PAX units off the PAX rims or you have to buy new units from Honda. Honda uses different units for the Touring and EX models. Mine cost about $37 each from Honda. I left my PAX tires intact hoping the class action will settle and Honda will want them back in one piece.

    I swaped out my PAX wheels with a set of EX wheels. It drives just fine.
  • oldbob1oldbob1 Posts: 5
    I do not use computers alot and thus can not get to the item which listed the depax kit details.
  • msarumsaru Posts: 1
    Can someone please send me the contact information to join this class action lawsuit?

    I am also a Honda Odyssey 2005 owner and now needing to purchase a second set of PAX tires, with no options to purchase, I have put in only 35k miles with the original tires.

  • msmith5msmith5 Posts: 1
    I also own a Honda Odyssey 2005 Touring and took the van yesterday to remove a nail in the right rear tire and get it fixed. I was shocked when a service technican said it could not be fixed and needed to be replaced with a new one at a cost of $400.00. We rarely go on a long trip so the tire thread depth was still good and I was expecting it was fixable because the puncture was not on the side of the tire. The service technician also said there are only 2 service centers in Vegas that have the capacity to replace the PAX tires. Now I'm worried driving through areas with construction sites and also knowing I will need to replace the other 3 tires in a couple of years. I'm also worried going on a long trip and getting a flat tire and not finding a shop that can replace a PAX tire within the 125 miles the maximum distance a PAX tire can run flat. Honda should pay to replace PAX the tires for Odyssey owners who want the tires converted.

    Michelin has also discontinued making the PAX tires after just a few years so I'm sure pretty soon the few shops which have the special equipment to service PAX tires will find it costly to maintain it together with a trained service crew.
  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,148
    While I agree with most of your post regarding the shortcomings of PAX tires, I think it's important to point out that Michelin is still making PAX tires (and will for some time), what they've done is to terminate all development of new PAX models.

    Best regards,
  • vinnynyvinnyny Posts: 774
    Before you pay anyone to fix or replace your PAX tire, you must contact Michelin customer service first. Just google them for the number. You may be surprised when they agree to either replace the tire under warranty or cover a pro-rated share. Don't take "No" for an answer. If you push them, you will get something out of them.
  • Here is the Web Site if the Law Firm that has the class action law suit. I just contacted them and they are in the process of getting "class action" status in CA.

    Shepherd, Finkelman, Miller & Shah LLP
  • Just wanted to share with everyone since I saw it on this blog first. I just dumped my entire PAX system and put on "normal" after-market rims and tires. I went to Les Schwab Tires in San Carlos, CA.

    Ironically, it was CHEAPER to replace all 4 rims and tires than it was to buy just the new PAX tires (which would have been my 3rd set in 50k miles). And the Toyo tires I purchased are rated at 80k miles with regular rotation (about 4 sets of PAX tires based on my experience).

    They were able to even using the existing TirePressureSensor monitors and put them on my new rims. Everything is fully functional and working great.

    Overall the guys at Les Schwab were very knowledgable. They said they are "de-paxing" more and more Honda Odyssesys.

    What a relief to have the damn PAX system off my car. Now I can go on long road trips with peace of mind!

  • Can you tell me what rims and tires you used? I'm now needing my 3rd set of PAX tires with only 42,000 miles on my car. I will not buy another set. I'm done with PAX.

    The honda dealer I called recommended Honda EX-L 16" rims and quoted $2,100 for replacing the tires, rims, lug nuts, and adding a spare. Seems really high. So I think I'll try a local tire company with what you used.

    Also, was Les Schwab able to get a spare that fit in the wheel storage area in the back?
  • cccompsoncccompson Posts: 2,388
    Just check the Odyssey club website - there are scads of threads dealing with this topic and the ways folks have switched.
  • massmanmassman Posts: 21
    Where can I find it? I went to the Honda Forums but did not see it.
  • I am PAX free as of 10/31/08. Here's my short story...

    Bought my 2006 Odyssey Touring brand new. By 39,000 miles I had replaced 5 tires to the tune of $1500 ($300 each). I only use my local Honda dealer for service, including religious rotating and inspection of tire pressures. Enough was enough.

    Purchased a set of 4 2009 Honda Pilot 17" wheels on ebay (from another Honda dealer) for $330. Purchased the necessary 20 lug nuts (acorn style) and 4 new TPMS sensors from the dealer for $280. Called Sears and had new Michelin Energy LX4 235/60/17 tires installed for $750. TPMS sensors immediately set themselves with no trip to the dealer. Total cost for me to DePAX was $1360. I expect to recoup some of that when I sell the 4 Touring PAX wheels and tires with sensors AND the TPMS sensors that came with the Pilot Wheels I bought.

    FYI, the PAX wheels and tires that came off the Odyssey weighed in at 75lbs each. The new Pilot wheels and tires weighed in at 53lbs each. I expect this weight savings to translate into slightly better MPG.

    To everyone having problems with the PAX system and sitting on the fence about this issue, I encourage you to make the switch. It takes just a little bit of research and time, but the benefits are worth it.

  • I did the same thing about two months ago with my '07 @ 27K. I bought a set of used EX wheels, same lugnuts work on both wheels, but I had to buy new sensors of course. The EX wheels drive better in my opinion than the PAX - not as harsh a ride, somewhat softer, but it still tracks well. I've not seen any fuel improvement however. We're still getting 15.5 on average in town and sometimes 20 on the highway - usually 19 despite a hundred pound in weight reduction. The spare does add about 30 lbs if memory serves. So 70 lb's +/- isn't going to make a huge difference. Where you'll see the savings is on tire replacement. I decided on the 16" vs. a set of 17" for that very reason. 16" tires are plentiful and priced about a $100 each whereas the 17" are double that. Honda really sold us a bill of goods on the MPG numbers. I would encrourage you to keep your PAX for a year or so because there are several class action lawsuits pending and they (Honda) may want these wheels/tires back for an exchange program etc....
  • vinnynyvinnyny Posts: 774
    My 07 touring consistently averages better than 20mpg in mixed driving. On several long trips (VA-RI) we averaged more than 24 (six people and lots of luggage). So, I'm not sure how you're only getting 15.5/20. Maybe your economy mode isn't kicking in on the highway.
  • As far as mileage goes. I usually get 18 around town and 23-24 on the highway. My Dad has an '05 EX and gets 26 on the highway. He keeps the speed down to 60-65, even in a 70 zone. I've noted that as well. If I run between 75-80, the mpg goes down closer to 22.
  • My Eco light comes on and the engine tone changes, pretty sure it's working. I've asked the dealer numerous times and they hear the same thing from all their customers. Plus if you'll check the site, I'm not alone. Perhaps they changed the ECM on the '07's, Honda won't tell you a thing.
  • I get 17-18 mpg around town, my wife gets 16-17. I have a lighter foot and it shows. On the highway I get 25-26 mpg keeping to an average of 65 mph. Speed - and the associated wind resistance - does make a big difference over 60 mph. So does terrain - my highway driving is Ohio-Indiana-Illinois, where it's flat. Hills will do you in, even when you coast on the down side.

    Regards, JEff
  • I'm thinking about de-paxing and was wondering if you have any pictures of your Odyssey with the Pilot wheels? If so, can you send them to [email protected]com?
  • I have a 2007 ODY Touring. I've gotten 42000+ miles on the OEM Pax tires and could get another 5K if I wanted, still have 3/32 + tread. One flat repair at $100.00. I'm a 95% interstate driver here in Atlanta. Was quoted $1327.00 for 4 new PAX tires installed by a local Honda dealer. I could not keep the PAX tires balanced after the first rotation, it's OK for while then starts shaking at 65-75 mph after a couple of weeks. 2 Dealers and 1 tire store tried for a total of 7 times with the same results. I replaced everything with the following parts at a Discount Tire dealer. " Very Professional People"

    1. 4 - 235/60R-17 Michelin Energy LX4 tires
    2. 4 - Beyern Mesh 1780BYM305120S72 Silver wheels
    3. 1 set Gorilla Guard 61443ND lug nuts
    4. 1 set 72.6 - 64.1 Excaliber Metal ring set
    5. 4 #2000K TPMS Rebuild Kit

    They used the original TPMS units on the new wheels. I am out the door at $1580 with great looking wheels the ride is better and steering seems more responsive. The tires set a little bit further out in the wheel wells but not bad. Under $700 the next tire change. Hope this info helps if someone wants to switch out the PAX.
  • Sent some pics of the Pilot wheels to your email the other day. Hope you got them.
  • chmnjchmnj Posts: 5
    I put a deposit down on a pristine 2005 Odyssey Touring on Saturday and asked the salesman about putting snow tires on the car - he said he'd get back to me. Then I did some research and, at the end of things, found your post. Honda Pilot wheels seem readily available on ebay for about the price you listed. I do have a few questions and seek confirmation before I figure out what to do about the purchase that I may now want to put on hold. First and foremost, what did you do for a spare? Are the Michelins that you say you installed themselves regular run-flats? If not do you have to also get a doughnut or will a regular spare fit somewhere in the vehicle? Was the cost of the lug nuts and sensors together $280? Have you managed to sell the Touring PAX wheels and tires? I am wondering wonder whether there's a market for them.
  • What I have done to date is buy a set of non-pax snow tires and wheels with the TPMS setup and the spare tire setup. I have included all the information I have for both snow and all season tire setup. At the time I did the snows I needed a very quick turnaround and so I worked with a Honda online dealer ( They where very helpful. That said, I do believe there are local tire dealers that will also do the conversion and they could use your old TPMS on the PAX wheels this would save 4*$33.50. One very nice thing about getting the setup from Bernardi they include all the labor but you will have to pay shipping. We ran all winter on the setup below without problems. I have also found nice wheel and tire setups on Ebay. Once you have a spare you have many more chooses. The prices are about a year old. All Odyssey’s have the spare tire wheel well in the left rear of the van just pull off the panel you will need the wing bolt to secure the spare.

    Here is the standard package for all season tires:
    Wheels (alloy 16x7) – 42700-SHJ-A91 $154.10 each
    Center caps - 44732-S0X-A01 $5.54 each
    Tires – Bridgestone Turanza EL42 (235/65/R16) - 42751-BRI-085 $103.40 each
    Or Michelin Energy LX4 (235/65/R16) - 42751-MIC-082 $143 each
    TPMS sensors – 06421-S3V-A04 $33.50
    Lugs – 90304-SJA-A91 (require 20) $3.07

    Spare tire setup:

    Spare tire – 42751-GYR-034 $107.36
    Wheel disk – 42700-SHJ-A51 $40.63
    Valve stem – 42753-SB8-661 $.63
    Wing bolt – 90106-S0X-A01 $1.07
    Tire bracket – 74651-SHJ-A00 $2.78
    Grommet – 74652-SHJ-A00 $1.72

    What I did for snow tires:

    Non PAX Set up on steel wheels –

    STEELS – 42700-SHJ-A01 $31.61 each
    SNOW TIRES – T1 (Toyo 235/65/R16) - $150
    TPMS SENSORS – 06421-S3V-A04 $32.78 each
    LUG NUTS – 90304-SHJ-A01 (requires 20) - $68.40 total
    (optional) Hub Caps - 44733-SHJ-A00 $17.98 each
  • chmnjchmnj Posts: 5
    Many thanks for all the information, particularly the information on Bernardi Parts. In the New York Times article about Michelin phasing out PAX tires, a Honda representative is quoted as saying that owners shouldn't change out the tires because the suspension was tuned for PAX and it will be degraded if you put non-PAX tires and rims on he car. Have you noticed any deterioration of the ride after you de-paxed?
  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,148
    Unsprung weight (which includes wheels and tires) is the bane of handling for any vehicle, regardless of how "tuned" the suspension is. Said another way, due to the fact that non-PAX wheels and tires will weigh in at only half to two-thirds of the weight of the PAX assembly, it is highly likely that your Odyssey will ride and handle better if you switch to GFTs (Get Flat Tires). As it turns out, I've read anecdotal reports from many-many folks who've made the switch, and they either indicate that they cannot tell the difference (faulty butt skid-pad calibration device IMHO ;) ), or they indicate a significant improvement in the ride and handling department.

    Keep us posted on what you do.

    Best regards,
  • The Michelins I bought are NOT run-flats. They are regular tires. I do not have a spare, yet. Any Honda dealer can sell you a spare and mounting kit (like all the LX and EX models came equipped with). It mounts behind a panel in the rear on the driver's side. Check this thread, I think there are several comments on it, including pricing. Yes, $280 was for the lug nuts AND new TPMS sensors (I believe they are specific to the year of your vehicle). I sold all four Touring PAX Wheels and Tires on ebay for $350. The guy was local and paid cash. Easiest transaction I've ever had.
  • chmnjchmnj Posts: 5
    Well, I told the dealer I'd back out of the deal unless he went halvies with me on the cost of de-paxing the car and putting snow on it for now. So while I would have liked to have negotiated harder with them on this item, I had already squeezed them a bit on the price for some other items. They say it will take a few more days to get all the items together (08 EX rims and Blizzaks) and so I won't be able to let you know what I think of the drive till next week.
  • chmnjchmnj Posts: 5
    Forgot to ask you: What did you sell the 4 PAX wheels and rims for? I'd like to pitch a credit to the dealer to save the hassle of trying to sell them. I saw someone said he'd sold a set on ebay for $350.
  • I have not noticed any deterioration of the ride. To me the ride is about the same but my snow tire setup weights in at about 50 lbs and my PAX setup is about 72 lbs. I have been reading this forum for years and do not recall one person that de-PAXED having any problems with the ride. My last visit to the Honda dealer I told them about how I had de-PAXED, while I was sitting in the waiting room the service rep introduces me to another long time PAX owner looking to stop the madness. This dealer has the equipment to service a PAX tires but still told the customs that people have successfully de-paxed.

    I found one OEM shop on eBay that has claimed to have de-PAXED over 30 Odyssey’s

    If you get the van do not wait to get the spare, the cost to fix a flat PAX is about the cost of the spare.
  • vinnynyvinnyny Posts: 774
    I think my Ody Touring is the best family vehicle ever made. However, I can't believe that Honda is still refusing to do anything to make right on the Pax debacle. My current Ody has 17k miles on it and I'm hoping that Honda will announce some settlement before I have to trade it when the Pax die at 35k (like I did with my 06 touring). If Honda doesn't offer free replacements, I'll trade for an American CUV or SUV and never go back...
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