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2013 and earlier-Honda Accord Lease Questions



  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 644
    edited August 2013
    You really need to know the actual selling price and the money factor to accurately calculate the lease monthly payment and determine if it is a fair deal or not. Any dealer worth it's salt will provide this info - after all, it will be on the lease contract you will be required to sign.

    I'm glad you found this forum because now you will be armed with the info you need to get a great deal and not overpay.

    By the way - residual is fixed by the manufacturer and can't be changed - it varies by terms and mileage of the lease.

    Bill G
    2016 ES350 Lux/Atomic Silver
    2017 Accord Sport CVT Mod Steel Metallic
  • I think you should be able to do a little better. The standard Honda lease for the LX is $0 due at signing and $280 + taxes per month, 12k miles per year. Not sure how many miles per year you need, but the $289 you were quoted could be the standard national deal if you wanted 15k miles per year. I would shop around a bit - I think $300 / month should be attainable. I'll let Car-Man answer the residual and money factor question, but roughly, it looks like they are using a 59% or 60% residual, which seems right. The dealer should be able to give you all of these #'s - if they resist, I'd try somewhere else.
  • The deal was for 12k miles.

    So it sounds like my only bet is try a cost reduction
  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 644
    Yes - as CarMan will tell you, you can usually do better on the selling price than what is used in the nationally advertised deals.

    You're picking this stuff up fast - you'll do well.

    2016 ES350 Lux/Atomic Silver
    2017 Accord Sport CVT Mod Steel Metallic
  • pjny77pjny77 Posts: 12
    Can you please tell me what the MF and residual are for a 2013 Accord Sport CVT with 15k miles/yr? I've been getting different #'s at different dealers. Not sure who to believe anymore.

  • Yes, i am pretty certain they used the MSRP of the current 0 down lease deal which is $22,951.07 and the my residual was exactly what is shown in the deal as well which is $13,729.30

    I crunched the numbers with their 0.00075 money factor for tier 1 and i get awfully close to that $289 + tax deal he quoted me. The difference may be in the dealer fees they charge.

    So i assume i can get that down a bit. I have seen some EX get out in this forum for about that amount (325 tax in)
  • A local MD dealer offered $259/month for Honda Accord LX 12/36. This price includes everything out the door. Sounds good to me.
  • I posted a quote on the LX earlier. Went back to the dealer and turns out the 289+tx he quoted me was on $500 over invoice which isn't bad. He didn't have that much wiggle room as they didn't have that many LX around.

    He did give me a quote on an EX per my request and i think it's not bad but i want to know for sure.

    Vehicle price: $23800
    Taxes: $1600
    DMV/Misc fees : $470
    Lender Fees: $595

    Total: $26465
    Cash down: $600

    Adj Cap Cost: 25865

    Residual MSRP: 26195
    Residual at 59% : 15455
    Money Factor: 0.00075

    Payment: 320 tax included.

    My target being around $300, they came really close. I don't mind giving $600 down as it's not that much of a deal should something happen to the car. It's not like i am giving $1995 down.

    Now, the Vehicle price looks good at 23800. It's basically invoice price per Edmunds and KBB. However, i find the Misc and Lender fees make the Cap cost a bit high which translates to that $320 instead of the 300-310 range that i had calculated.

    Any ideas? I feel i don't have much wiggle room on the sticker price and residual and MF are pretty much fixed items. I can only play on the fees?
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 4,813
    edited August 2013
    If your money factor and residual numbers are correct you need to work on lowering your sale price. At 500 above invoice price on a Lx model would be a terrible price for Aug. Your target sales price on any Lx model should be starting at 1000 below invoice on the low end and getting as high as 1700 hundred in some area's.
    Check the prices paid forum to see what dealers in your area are selling for 1k or lower. Your wiggle room is on that sticker price and doc fee' charge.

    2016 BMW X-5 35i, 2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2012 MB ML350

  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Posts: 165
    Dan, that $600 down payment is equivalent to $18/month so your payment is really like $338. You aren't close to your target and frankly, your target is too high. Please listen to Brian. Paying invoice price may sound good, but it's not the market price for buyers in the know.
  • Too high even on the EX?
  • the fair purchase price for the EX automatic in my zipcode based on this website and KBB is between $23858 and $24104.

    Their price is $23800 now the end result monthly may be high on the monthly but i feel my wiggle room is not on the sticker price... unless we want to go way below invoice which i am not sure they would do.
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Posts: 165
    sorry, I was referred to the LX, $300 target with tax for an EX is reasonable
  • Hello, Can i get the August Buy rate lease money factor for the following:

    Accord Sedan EX-L 4 CYL no nav
    12,000 miles

    Accord Sedan EX-L V6 no nav

    I was quoted today with a money factor of .00181?? For the 4 Cyl

  • jok4jok4 Posts: 1
    I did a ton of searching around for the best lease deal on a Honda accord LX for 36 months/12k miles and this is the best I found. $239 a month with $1236 due at signing which includes bank fee, DMV fee and first month payment. Taxes are rolled into monthly payment.
  • mnz1999mnz1999 Posts: 12
    edited August 2013
    jok4, if you are saying taxes are rolled into your monthly payments of $239 and upfront of $1236 includes only Bank Fee, DMV, and first payment thn the high level math doesn't make sense
    Bank Fee $595
    DMV $150 (estimated)
    First Payment $239
    Total $984 (Dealer is asking $1236)

    Overall it doesn't seem like a great deal. i think you can do better.
    Personally i would try to roll everything into the payment not pay anything upfront. I leased an EX in July but with different lease program (24K miles a year) and I had everything rolled into the payment even the first payment. I know some people like to pay the first payment upfront that's ok too but shoot for everything else rolled into the payment. if anything happens to the car insurance won't reimburse you on anything you have paid upfront.
    for example if you pay $1236 upfront and you total the car in the first month, insurance won't cover the 1236 and you haven't even used the car yet.

    now the question is what's a great deal. it depends on who you ask but personally if i was leasing LX 12/36 I would tell them roll everything into the payment except for the first payment upfront (assuming 8% tax). I would shoot for $220-230
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Posts: 165
    I agree with mnz1999 that you should put everything into the lease. I advise 36 equal monthly payments with your due at signing being the first payment. Glad that mnz1999 was happy with his deal but using his own estimates of $150 DMV and 8% tax, with the current residual at 59% and .00075 money factor, the dealer would have to sell you the car, including doc fees, for over $1,900 under invoice to get a $220 payment.
    Your lease payment is a mathematical formula using the residual, money factor and capitalized cost of the car (sales price/doc fees/DMV fees and $595 lease inception fee assuming you put them all in the lease as advised). You need to negotiate the sales price/doc fee amount as if you are purchasing so you can get the capitalized cost as low as possible. Take a look at the Prices Paid forum for pricing in your area and negotiating advice.
  • jhun81jhun81 Posts: 1
    edited August 2013
    What a great blog going on over here!

    Would someone care to take a look at my recent deal?

    I turning in my lease early (CRV), with 7 payments left (~$2100), and got a new lease at $340/mo.

    Accord Sport '13, No money down, 12k miles/year, Sticker price of about $24980. I'm in northern NJ, close to NY.

    Please let me know if you need more information.

    Thank you!
  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 644
    Not sure why you're asking if you already did the deal - you might not like the answer. Be that as it may, you need to provide a lot more info before anyone can analyze your deal. Info like:
    - did you carry positive or negative equity from old to new lease.
    - net selling price of new vehicle (incl dest, dealer doc fee and lease inception fee)
    - did you pay any money at signing
    - length of lease in time and miles
    - money factor and residual percentage
    - sales tax and how it is applied to a lease in your state
    - DMV fees and any other fees involved in the transaction

    All of these items should be included in the lease contract you agreed to.

    Bill G
    2016 ES350 Lux/Atomic Silver
    2017 Accord Sport CVT Mod Steel Metallic
  • mnz1999mnz1999 Posts: 12
    edited August 2013
    FYI...i didn't lease LX i got EX 36 months 24k/year and payment was 375 not a penny out of my pocked everything rolled into the montly payment including the first payment. it was a different lease program from his.
    i said go for 220-230 because i have seen advertised. i haven't worked the numbers for this lease program. i agree with you...

    "your lease payment is a mathematical formula using the residual, money factor and capitalized cost of the car (sales price/doc fees/DMV fees and $595 lease inception fee assuming you put them all in the lease as advised). You need to negotiate the sales price/doc fee amount as if you are purchasing so you can get the capitalized cost as low as possible. Take a look at the Prices Paid forum for pricing in your area and negotiating advice."
  • cartime4844cartime4844 Posts: 11
    edited August 2013
    Is the residual value based off of the MSRP or the MSRP + Destination? Does that vary by dealer?

    Also, I had a question about how the $595 lease initiation fee gets applied. One dealer in NJ's internet quote listed the EX-L's cap costs as $595 less than their listed sale price for the car, so that when the lease initiation fee is included the car's cost is still the same as if you were buying. Is this normal? I assumed that the $595 was going to be an additional cost on top of whatever sale price I can negotiate. In other words, if I negotiate a sale price of $25,000, when they calculate the lease is it standard for it to be $25,595 or to stay at $25,000. Is this something I should be watching out for?
  • mnz1999mnz1999 Posts: 12
    edited August 2013
    you cap cost is "sale price + other capitalizable costs" other words adjusted cap cost....if you are rolling 595 into the monthly payments it would be capitalized. But the residual value is based on the MSRP.
    e.g in a simple calculation if the residual is 60% and MSRP is $30,000...take 60% times the $30000 = $18000 that's how much car would be worth at the end of lease. lets take it little further and assume you negotiated sale price of $25000, take 25000 (cap cost) minus 18000 your depreciation is 7000 amount you would pay part of you monthly payment calculation. 595 would go into your capitalizable cost 25595 but in many states 595 is not part of your tax calculation. it is true for NYS.
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 4,813
    edited August 2013
    You broke down that post well. i never lease but i always read up on leasing and how it works.

    Here are my questions for this forum

    Do most people who lease a vehicle have to go into the dealership to close the deal. forum guys who know how i buy will understand. alot of my deals are out of state buys.

    i want to lease my next vehicle can i do it over the phone. Will dealers run my credit without me being present for the sale that day.

    Here is another.. I live in NYC, I secure at great selling price with a dealership in lets say Maryland i asked him to run the numbers, money factor/ residual/ cap / miles etc. everything looks good. How do i proceed to close this deal by phone. Could i do a fax transaction like a car purchase.

    Please advise......... i also want input from... Huskerfan5, and gmanusmc.

    Curious to know your thoughts and tips on this subject.


    2016 BMW X-5 35i, 2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2012 MB ML350

  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Posts: 165
    Brian, calculate your target capitalized cost (sales price/doc fee/lease inception fee/DMV fee}), obtain the money factor and residual and then calculate your monthly payment including tax, assuming 36 equal payments with nothing else due at signing except your first payment. You will negotiate off that number, knowing that for a 36 month lease, each $1,000 of cap cost will increase your payment by about $30, so if the dealer gives you a counter offer $15 higher, he is charging you $500 over your target.
    Once you agree on the monthly payment, the leasing company will check your credit. If everything checks out, ask that the buyers order be faxed to you, just like in a purchase except that you will note that there is a small section on it applicable to leases where the number of payments, payment amount, number of miles and total due at signing will be found.
    When you actually pick up the car, you will execute the lease agreement instead of a bill of sale/ loan documents. The lease agreement should break out the cap cost and due at signing components but should agree with your buyers order. While a dealer in a neighboring state should be able to put everything into the lease, you may have to register the car yourself in NY so you would need to adjust your cap cost accordingly.

  • gmanusmcgmanusmc SoCalPosts: 644
    edited August 2013
    Brian - Gary is to this leasing thread what you are to the pricing thread - he's got this stuff down cold and his explanation is spot on. The lease money factor is based on your level of credit worthiness and the residual is determined by the manufacturer so not much you can do about those. What you can do is negotiate the best selling price you can - as Gary said, each 1k on the price (cap cost) results in about a $30 difference in the lease payment on a 36 month lease. On a 24 month lease, the difference is about $42.

    What I would add to Gary's comments is that folks who keep their cars for more than 3 years or so or drive alot of miles should just do a conventional purchase unless they plan to pay cash to buy the vehicle for the agreed to residual at lease end. If you finance the residual at lease end, you are essentially paying double interest on that amount of money. Example: If you lease an Accord EXL for a cap cost of 25k and residual of 15k, you would pay $30 a month interest on a money factor of .00075 (25k + 15k x .00075). If you then purchase the vehicle at lease end and finance, you're paying interest again on the 15k.

    I also advise folks who want to lease to try and choose a vehicle with the highest residual (holds its value) and a low money factor. These two things along with negotiating a great price for the vehicle will consistently get you a good lease payment. That's why Hondas are great vehicles to lease - you usually get all three of these components.

    Leasing is just another financial method to pay for the use of a vehicle - the negotiation strategy differs very little from that of a conventional purchase.

    Hope this long winded post and Gary's comments clear up some of the mystery of leasing for folks trying to work their way through this stuff.

    Bill G
    2016 ES350 Lux/Atomic Silver
    2017 Accord Sport CVT Mod Steel Metallic
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 4,813
    edited August 2013
    I leased a car right around the time of the internet boom so i was in the dealerships for that. Not so much a big deal had all the leasing numbers and knew exactly what i wanted to pay. Took me about 8 dealerships to find my deal. My main concern is not going down to the dealerships. I want to buy online or by phone. From what you guys have posted it seems like it should be no problem. Both excellent posts loaded with great info

    Thanks Gary/ Bill ................... if i run into a problem i'll reach out.

    2016 BMW X-5 35i, 2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2012 MB ML350

  • cartime4844cartime4844 Posts: 11
    edited August 2013
    Here is a brochure outlining NY's tax rules for leasing a vehicle.

    Interesting notes:

    -The only items that aren't taxed are the DMV fees IF they are paid up front and not included in your monthly payments.

    -NY requires all taxes up front, so if you want taxes rolled into your monthly payments then the dealership pays the tax up front and you are basically paying off a loan for that money each month. You are taxed on your total monthly payment, so your tax is being taxed.

    For example, if your taxes are about $900 and DMV fees about $300, you can pay $1,200 up front or around $1,300 in your monthly payments. So paying tax and DMV up front will save you about $100 in New York.

    If there are any New York leasing experts here, does my explanation sound right?
  • brian125brian125 New york / S.C. myrtle beachPosts: 4,813
    I think i would rather take a chance and pay the additional interest on that dmv charge than having my vehicle totaled or stolen in the 1st couple of months or year and losing that 1200 dollars.

    2016 BMW X-5 35i, 2013 Genesis 5.0 R-spec, 2012 MB ML350

  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 64,637
    Yes.. explanation is correct..

    I'd roll taxes into the lease as well.. It's no different than any other money that you finance.... it's taxed.

    $900 in tax rolled in adds about $40-$50 to the total cost over 36 months....


    Prices Paid, Lease Questions, SUVs

  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Posts: 165
    While I wish my skills and knowledge were compared with the likes of Tiger Woods and Steve Jobs, I appreciate your comments regarding Brian. While Brian has missed some putts while fretting about someone being taken advantage of by a dealer while he’s off-line and out on the golf course, I can go on vacation knowing that people are getting good advice from you ( I just blame my putter for my missed putts).
    Just want to add to your advice regarding the lease vs buy decision. Readers should know that there are rare instances where the lease terms are so favorable that the present value of the lease payments and residual is less than the purchase price. In that case, it makes sense to lease the car and buy it at lease end, assuming, of course, that the car is worth the residual. I know the Camry money factor was recently .00001. I don’t know if they had any special purchase incentives not available on the lease but that is an example where I would have done the math to see if leasing was the best way to go even if I was planning to hold onto the car.
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