Stories from the Sales Frontlines

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Comments

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,661
    As an exercise to keep my brain active, I try to make myself remember who said what in the posts. If I miss a day,

    I am impressed. I don't retain too much knowledge because I try to keep my from getting filled up, and then I won't have room for things that are really important, ......such as where I left my car keys.

    It is important however, to exercise the brain.

    Come on, at least you can tell us what the mystery car is now that you have decided. My guess is the GM SUV, I forget which one, there seems to be quite a few out there these days....Terrain, Acadia, Envoy or was that on the maybe list any way...another thing I forgot????

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,661
    t is the only mag that has no subscriptions
    Hmmm....I used to subscribe. Have they changed?


    That's cute, but he must have meant ads. Not too many magazines can survive these days without subscriptions. Remember TV Guide, it was the number 1 magazine for years, now it is extinct, except for the online version. People used to go to the video store to rent a movie, but soon Blocbuster will be extinct. I said I needed a car to get a printer home from the store, and Tidester pointed out you can order it online and they will ship it to your house. Just to stay on topic, people are buying cars online....can buy a car from the comfort of your home. It is a rapidly changing world.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • jimbresjimbres Member Posts: 2,025
    It is the only mag that has no subscriptions.

    Huh? I've been a subscriber since the 1970s.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 21,008
    Didn't mean to ruffle your feathers so much.
    What subject matter do you teach?
    It makes me wonder if we have gotten along as student and professor.
    Even if we didn't, I would never intentionally run into your car, new or not.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 21,008
    The plan would be to get something next April/May.
    Still going to see what I can get for the Fusion, but a little monkey wrench may have been thrown into the plan.
    Took my FIL (going to be 81 in a few months) today to clean out his car. He lent it to a family member and they totaled it.
    It was an 83 or 84 Cutlass wagon. Only had 58,66x miles on it.
    He doesn't really drive anymore and said he is not getting another car.
    Told me since his legs are giving him trouble, he was afraid he could hurt someone if he had to react it a hurry while driving.
    That leaves it to a few of us to drive him if he needs to go somewhere.
    He made a point of saying he could not get in and out of the Explorer anymore.
    Could still manage my wife's Escape, but the Fusion was easier.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • delthekingdeltheking Member Posts: 1,152
    As Driver said -- I meant advertisements , not subscriptions.. Typo error !! :P
  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    I meant advertisements , not subscriptions.. Typo error !!

    Damn...I'm glad there is someone out there whose spelling is worser than mine but I'm sure you're gammar is better. :P

    FWIW, I knew all along what you meant.

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 21,008
    edited September 2010
    Texas Typo = Brain Fart to the rest of the world.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    edited September 2010
    "...but I'm sure you're [sic} grammar is better."

    You are correct. His is better. :P

    Richard
  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    You are correct. His is better.

    Just wanted to see if you're still awake and remembered this stuff. :)

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 17,718
    The salespeople & others who work @ Infiniti of Greenwich (CT). I saw an ad in the paper today saying they must sell off their entire inventory of new Infinitis by 9/10/10 as they will be going out of business. I feel bad for the sales people there on many levels. For one, they will be losing their jobs in the next 10 days. 2, I can just imagine the bottom feeders and grinders and that will really try and ask for 50% off sticker.

    Has anybody ever worked through a car store closing? How does it work? If the store is going out of business, How low will they go? Net, net?

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2025 Camry SE AWD, 2025 Integra

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 54,009
    I do remember when a lot of dealers were getting shut down that there was a way for them to sell inventory back (I guess to other dealers). So I don't imagine they will have to sell brand new stock for thousands below invoice, if it can be redeployed into the pipeline.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • delthekingdeltheking Member Posts: 1,152
    But better than Connecticut typo I guess !!! :P ;)
  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,661
    edited September 2010
    Has anybody ever worked through a car store closing? How does it work?

    Not exactly, but in 1992 a Pontiac dealer had huge ads in the paper, didn't say they were going out of business, but said prices were unbeatable. I went for a test ride in a Sunbird and the owner was the one who went with me. The guy was a nervous wreck and was sweating like a pig the whole time.

    When we got back we went into his office and filled out the offer. It was about $600 higher than I expected so I walked away.

    A week later the dealer went bankrupt and a lot of people lost their downpayment money etc. If I was interested in an Infinity, I would go out of curiosity, but I would be very careful about how I structured a deal. For example, make sure you have possession of the car and haven't left any money such as a down payment on the table.

    Also, I once went to a sports store to buy tennis balls and the signs outside said bankrupcy sale, everything has to be sold off. The tennis balls were more expensive than they would be at any other store. One clerk explained most of the stuff is brought in by a bankrupcy specialist and isn't even part of the stores inventory.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 54,009
    driver reminded me of the other big caution area. THe trade. maybe not with a big name dealer going out of business in an orderly fashion, but IIRC a big problem with smaller outfits going bust is they never pay off the trade, so you get stuck owing on a new car and th eold one.

    another worry might be the DMV work not getting done I guess.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • jimbresjimbres Member Posts: 2,025
    I saw an ad in the paper today saying they must sell off their entire inventory of new Infinitis by 9/10/10 as they will be going out of business.

    Are you sure that they're on the brink? There's nothing on their web site that suggests financial problems.
  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 14,231
    gogi...I agree. For appliances, I like CR ratings. Power lawn equipment ratings? Love'em!

    Cars? Stereo/home theater gear? They couldn't be any further from a trusted resource for me.

    tidester...have to ask, exactly how do you know what happens when you fill a microwave with aluminum foil? Actually, I am so curious that I'm willing to let someone else ruin their microwave to satiate my curiosity. :P
    2024 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD Long Range
  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 14,231
    nyc...I always feel badly for any local business who has to shut their doors. I thought the dealership closings were just about finished. Guess I'm wrong.

    I have no idea how that works, but I would have to think another dealership would buy their stock, albeit at true dealership cost....maybe less. Might be a good deal for the consumer. Maybe, not. Seems I see furniture dealers have "going out of business" sales all the time. Yet, the same ownership resurfaces, most times in the same location, just under a different name.

    "Going out of business" seems to be a marketing tool for those sorts.
    2024 Kia EV6 GT-Line AWD Long Range
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 270,412
    They just announced another Ford dealer closing in Cincinnati... out east on Hwy 32...

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  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Especially when stores are operating on borrowed money and are renting their location. The people that are buying are wringing every last dollar of profit out of the deals and the Service Depts are competing with a lot of cut rate shops.

    Parts are being sold at discount prices over the internet.

    Attracting and retaining quality salespeople is a growing problem. If people have to put up with his business and the hours, they want to be paid well.

    Last night, a well known local owner of a large Toyota Store was on television. He siad that this is the worst he has seen business in the 40 years he's been in business.

    It's not just the car business. The big box stores and on line shopping has spelled doom for a lot of traditional businesses.
  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,661
    It's not just the car business. The big box stores and on line shopping has spelled doom for a lot of traditional businesses

    I really wonder about that. Like I said before, TV Guide was once the best selling magazine, now it is only available online, Blockbuster will soon be finished because of video on demand, the book industry is going through huge changes with e-readers, but also people ordering from amazon etc.

    This has to make a difference in the way we will buy cars eventually. I can see where there might be stores where you can look at and drive the car, but you will actually order on line and get a direct factory price. Do you really need a salesperson at this point? The older generation might prefer dealing with a salesperson, but young people pick up on new trends. Car dealerships will just have very pleasant order takers, who will steer you through the process. It will probably make cars cheaper, but it could be more profitable for the manufacturers. They could still sell franchises to do the service work.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Hard to say where things will evolve to.

    It's tough to attract and retain mechenics/technicians too. Hard work, a HUGE investment in tools and not much money to be made anymore.

    Is all of this a " good thing"?

    Is it a "good thing" when someone orders a book through Amazon and skips going to Barnes and Noble?

    Is it a "good thing" when a Wal-Mart moves into Smalltown USA and puts the three generation mom and pop places out of business?

    Funny how things evolve and Blockbuster is a good example of this.

    When we first moved here, there were three or four mom and pop video rental places in town. Blockbuster opened a mega store and killed the small guys.

    Now, Netflix and Redbox have put the blockbustr store out of business.

    A "good thing"? I don't know.
  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    have to ask, exactly how do you know what happens when you fill a microwave with aluminum foil?

    A family member, who shall remain nameless for purposes of preserving domestic tranquility, attempted to reheat an Arby's sandwich still in its foil wrapper. The display of sparks and flames was impressive. :)

    The microwave oven was not damaged but we saw no need to repeat the "experiment." :shades:

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    I knew a guy who I thought was pretty smart until he tried to hard boil a couple of eggs in his microwave!
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,745
    edited September 2010
    >until he tried to hard boil a couple of eggs in his microwave!

    Better than heating up a mouse and trying to dry your poddle in the microwave.

    We really need a sales story.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • tidestertidester Member Posts: 10,059
    Definitely! Anyone? :)

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • jipsterjipster Member Posts: 6,299
    edited September 2010
    The people that are buying are wringing every last dollar of profit out of the deals and the Service Depts are competing with a lot of cut rate shops.

    I guess that is why my Mazda service department is trying to wring every last dollar out of me on needless repairs. I went in for a $19.99 oil change. They come back with my coolant needs changing (true), need new brake pads (debatable), need a new cabin air filter saying it's "black" (untrue). I just changed it myself about 3 months ago. While a bit dirty it is far from black or needing to be changed. I guess they thought I never check it. Also saying I need new spark plugs at $10 a piece (untrue). I just had these changed out a month ago. They also failed to mention that changing out those $10 plugs would cost another $400 in labor due to having to take out the upper intake manifold to reach the back plugs. On the plus side they did give me the oil change for free as I had to wait over 2 hours.
    2021 Honda Passport EX-L, 2020 Honda Accord EX-L, 2011 Hyundai Veracruz, 2010 Mercury Milan Premiere.
  • gogiboygogiboy Member Posts: 732
    "Ah...I have to ask....how does one punch a hole in a microwave? "

    Isell--

    I was one of those GE spacesaver tabletop units that came with a set of brackets that allowed for mounting the unit underneath a cabinet. The bolts fed down through the cabinet base into the outer case of the microwave. After having successfully mounting it, my wife decided that the kitchen walls needed repainting (this was several years later). So I dismounted it. Later when I remounted it I didn't thread the bolts equally and ended up pushing one through the outer case and into the microwave chamber. Not a good day.

    The good news was that the exact replacement microwave cost $250 less and had all the same features, plus an improved mounting bracket.

    Gogiboy
  • gogiboygogiboy Member Posts: 732
    "Cars? Stereo/home theater gear? They couldn't be any further from a trusted resource for me."

    GG--

    I have found the same problem with bicycles and cycling gear (helmets). Their approach is too cursory, perhaps because of the huge number of manufacturers. Like the annual car issue, CR would have to publish an annual for electronics, cycling and a range of other stuff. That would put them in direct competition with the "enthusiast/aficionado" mags that every sport, hobby and obsession produces. I'm sure that you have your trusted resources for electronics as I do for cycling.

    Probably my biggest bone to pick with CR is over food ratings, which seems nigh onto impossible to conduct without bias.

    I would never argue that everyone should read or accept without question any claims or ratings made by CR--or anyone else for that matter. However, I don't feel that those of us who subscribe to CR should be identified as mindless followers. Some seem to forget that in the pre-internet era--before anyone and everyone became a self-styled expert and could post their lengthy glowing endorsements or brutal condemnations--CR offered level-headed assessments, which anyone could choose to accept or ignore.

    Gogiboy
  • gogiboygogiboy Member Posts: 732
    "It's tough to attract and retain mechenics/technicians too. Hard work, a HUGE investment in tools and not much money to be made anymore. "

    Isell--

    I'm really surprised to hear to that because just a couple of years ago I read that a shortage of qualified mechanics was predicted and that it was the vo-tech degree to get. You'd think the recession would make good mechanics even more valuable and necessary. The high price of new cars and more restrictive credit access makes buying new beyond the reach of many middle class Americans.

    I guess I shouldn't be surprised. 15 years ago I had my TV and VCR (what's that?) repaired locally whereas now I'm expected to toss everything after a couple of years and buy a replacement. What's next: Bottled water? Pay television?...oh wait.

    Gogiboy
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Well, it sounds like your store is big on "upselling".

    I don't have a problem with this provided I really need the things they are trying to sell me.

    On most cars, it's quite a job to even pull the cabin air filters. How could they tell it was "black" unless they spent the time to pull it out? and how could they know that your car needed spark plugs unless thye pulled them out and physically looked at them or if the car was running roughly?

    Too bad. sounds like they can't be trusted.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    Yes, there is a shortage of qualified mechanics.

    The trouble is, the young guys that are thinking about getting into the profession are often scared away by the veterans who tell them they would be nuts to become a tech these days.

    It's never been an easy way to make a living but if you were smart and good at what you did, you could make a decent living.

    Some still do but it's getting harder and harder.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 21,008
    but I must be doing something wrong. 1 kid sent us a picture from the 'Big House' and the other from 'N D Stadium'. I am jealous.
    A couple of houses down, they have a new '10 Ody in the driveway.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • driver100driver100 Member Posts: 32,661
    Yes, there is a shortage of qualified mechanics.

    Isell, do you think that since cars are becoming more reliable there is less repair work to do. I go 15000 miles between oil changes (I know many people wouldn't do that, but I have no fear, I think they know what they are doing), and I have 25000 miles on the car without anything being done to it.

    True, bimmers will need some expensive repairs after the warranty period, but so many cars are more reliable than ever. Fusions can be compared to Camry's and Camry's are very reliable. I suppose, like gogi said, that people are buying more used cars now because of the economy, but once new car sales recover, we may need fewer mechanics, wouldn't you think?

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    "...they have a new '10 Ody in the driveway."

    You could be doing the RIGHT thing. At least you don't have their car payment. ;)

    Richard
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 21,008
    I am sure that payment is less that the tuition payments were are making this year, but we wouldn't have it any other way.
    One funny thing. Egghead's roommate's parents said she didn't have an athletic bone in her body.
    After the first score, her roommate did a pushup for each point.
    2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • jipsterjipster Member Posts: 6,299
    On most cars, it's quite a job to even pull the cabin air filters. How could they tell it was "black" unless they spent the time to pull it out? and how could they know that your car needed spark plugs unless they pulled them out and physically looked at them or if the car was running roughly?

    It only takes about 20 seconds to check the cabin air filter on an MPV. And I assume that they thought I needed spark plugs because they had no record of me buying them at the other dealership, when I had all of them replaced. They were right about my sway bar links a few months ago, when they needed replacing. Seems as if they go thru service advisors every 6 months, while the other Mazda dealership has kept their advisors for the 6 years I've owned the van.
    2021 Honda Passport EX-L, 2020 Honda Accord EX-L, 2011 Hyundai Veracruz, 2010 Mercury Milan Premiere.
  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    On Hondas, it's a b***h to change the cabin filters.

    OK, so, if you were haveing your service done at one dealer nad you took it elsewhere for a service that called for a spark pulg replacement, then thye would have no record of that and would assume it's due. I can see that.
  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 54,009
    craig, did you ever do one?

    on my odyssey and accord, by far the longest part of the process was emptying out the glove box (or if you didn't, picking the crap up off the floor). 2nd was opening the box. The actual replacement time was ~20 seconds, if you were clumsy.

    drop the glove box straps, pop the old one out, new one in, and reverse steps 1 and 2.

    easy peasy.

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • tallman1tallman1 Member Posts: 1,874
    edited September 2010
    I've got to agree with stickguy on this one. Changing the cabin filter on my 06 Accord is a breeze.

    The air filter on the other hand....
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 270,412
    ... but, I was always under the impression that it's a real pain on a CR-V... :)

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  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 17,344
    edited September 2010
    Try a 2000-4 Avalon. Not fun, you havet 4 bolts, the airbag harness has to be disconnected, then a bunch of clips to pull the glove box out. IIRC one of the bolts is under the kick panel which has to be removed. Not a quick and painless job like most.

    Speaking of these filters.... they get pretty scummy and I just did the one on my GFs 08 Elantra (easy BTW) and it was gross and smelled like mildew. Car only had 20K miles and not smoked in or anything.

    2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart

  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    edited September 2010
    I bought the filters for our CRV and I spent about 15 minutes trying to figure out how to get access to the old filter. The guys in the shop told me what to do but I was afraid I was going to break something.

    So, my last oil change, I had them change the filters. For some reason, I had never changed them. At 50,000 miles they were disgusting. Pure black and fill of other crap. I won't let them go that far ever again!
  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 17,344
    To just think before we had cabin filters we breathed in all that crap!

    2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart

  • sterlingdogsterlingdog Member Posts: 6,984
    I know that you'll shake your head in disbelief, but would you believe that I've never heard of a cabin filter? I've always changed my air filters and oil filters on schedule. I bet my Explorer cabin filter is one disgusting thing. Is it expensive to change one? Though we may be trading cars soon, I'm tempted to change it. Surely, I'm not the only human that has never heard of a cabin filter. I don't know how I missed that bit of information or why a service guy never mentioned it to me in all of these years. Man, I do learn something new here all of the time.

    Richard
  • tjc78tjc78 Member Posts: 17,344
    Richard,

    Maybe someone could correct me, but I don't believe that your Explorer has a cabin filter. My buddy has one and I told him to change it and the service department told him he doesn't have one. IIRC his is an 03 or 04.

    2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart

  • isellhondasisellhondas Member Posts: 20,342
    edited September 2010
    Not all cars have them. Don't know about an Explorer.

    We don't really drive on many dusty roads around here so I was shocked at how filthy and black that filter was.

    I don't know about you, Richard, between the cigarette smoke and the unfiltered air you've been breating in that Explorer, I worry about you! ;)
  • gogiboygogiboy Member Posts: 732
    "It only takes about 20 seconds to check the cabin air filter on an MPV. And I assume that they thought I needed spark plugs because they had no record of me buying them at the other dealership, when I had all of them replaced."

    Jip--

    Your question reminded me that I have an impending 30K mile scheduled maintenance--probably in the next 3-4 months. I was cross-referencing the dealer's maintenance "menu" with Mazda's recommended 30K schedule in the owner's manual. There were some startling differences:

    1. Cooling System Flush-$135 (Mazda says isn't needed until 60K)
    2 Transmission flush-$150-$186 (can't find a recommended interval in Mazda's Schedule). How often is legitimate?
    3. Fuel Induction (what is that?)-$150 (can't find it on Mazda's schedule.

    The rest, like oil, air and fuel filter changes are listed as is tire balance and rotation, but the first three are the real money-makers and I'm left wondering whether they are really needed or just profit padding. By the way, I have a 5-speed manual if that matters with the transmission flush.

    I'm out of the manufacturer's warranty period, but I want to take care of the car. What would my forum friends recommend? Should I have the service done locally or take it to the dealer and refuse any service not listed on the Mazda schedule. I don't want to cheap out since I plan on keeping the car for another 10 years, but why pay for fluff?

    Gogiboy
  • delthekingdeltheking Member Posts: 1,152
    1.Cooling system flush-- would certainly recommend.$135 - standard rate pretty much at all dealers.
    2.Tranny flush - If automatic ,would certainly do it. better than a drain and refill especially as it`s still lower mileage. Once you mile it up ,say 80k + miles- a drain and refill is a better option. But not sure of a manual tranny though.
    3.Fuel injection service-- This is the most useless service out there.. Sometimes it can even cause some problems and actually is not recommended by some car makers. Totally avoid this one.
    4. I also would do a brake flush as probably you have never done it especially as you plan to keep the car for a long time.

    Generally ,if you get all of these done simultaneously -- The dealer can give a discount. I would always suggest a dealer -- An indy can also do these but the dealer uses OEM fluids and cars nowadays are very sensitive to non OEM fluids especially Asian cars.Also an indy repair guy`s price will not be that cheaper IMO. :shades:
  • jmonroejmonroe Member Posts: 8,989
    On Hondas, it's a b***h to change the cabin filters.

    I’ll bet that’s nothing compared to what Son #1 had to do to remove the water pump on his ’95 Trans Am track car yesterday. Of course he called to ask for my help doing it. As usual, to do anything on that car, you have to remove at least 2 or 3 other components to do it. I just didn’t know what the other components would be. So I knew I was in for a treat helping him. I wasn’t wrong; you have to remove the AIR pump and its associated diverter valve to get the gear driven water pump off. Yes, it is gear driven not belt driven. Yep, that L1 engine is a real treat to work on. I’ll do a cabin filter change on a Honda any day compared to that ordeal.

    Today will be better for me. I’ll be at my granddaughter’s 2nd birthday party (thanks Son #2, at least you know how to take care of your Father on a long weekend). :)

    Happy Labor Day everyone. I hope you don’t have to do the same type of labor that I did yesterday. As you can tell, I’m still venting. :mad:

    jmonroe

    '15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl

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