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Stories from the Sales Frontlines
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Don't forget about all the stress and aggravation. My sanity is worth more than $100.
You talking about the consumer or the dealership?
You could be talking about the dealership just as well as you could the consumer. What with the screamer ads, fine print, dealer fees, bait & switch, mop n glow, dust and rust, etch a sketch and other dealer-add ons.
Business is business. Either party want to save that extra $100, as long as it's legal and halfway ethical, that's their business. Don't understand why isell gets so worked up over people who go out of their way to save a "lousy $100" ... guess that's his business.
Great point! And, my experience has been trying to save every extra dollar puts wear and tear on my mind and body, and probably makes me not as nice a person (if carried to the extreme).
3 to 5 years in time, new cars have gone up about 25% to buy one and that extra 100 bucks is meaningless. You got a good deal (if you are within $100), you have probably got 5 years of good driving, your extra payment at the end will be like an extra $75 after inflation.......and you are going to start all over again at another dealership to possibly save $100. Over 5 years that $100 is about 5 cents a day!Life is too short!
You do have to do some homework and try to do the best you can....but it isn't good to go overboard on this. And, the dealer has to make some profit too, or he won't be around to service the car.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Driving the exact car a person is going to buy is a waste of time but if it makes them feel better, go for it.
I'm not "worked up" but how would you like to spend two hours answering questions, driving cars etc, building a rapport with a customer only to learn that that same customer ended up driving two hours to "save" 100.00?
What is the value of a person's time and as someone else noted, his stress level?
I try to make things relaxed and easy for my customers but the fear of just maybe spending an extra buck drives some of them nuts.
That is what I'll never understand.
Also, I also don't waste time or ask questions. My homework is done before I get there. A reasonably quick test drive is all I require.
I once bought a used Miata.
The car was in excellent condition and the fussy owner had all of the service records. It was a dark, rainy night and I didn't want to take it out of the garage to drive it. I paid him and arranged to pick it up the next morning.
On the way home, I noticed it had a bad rear wheel bearing that was making some noise. Not a big deal.
The seller called me the next day to let me know he found some spare parts for it that I could pick up. He asked how I liked the car and I mentioned to him that I was going to take it in to have the rear wheel bearing replaced.
A week later, he sent me a check for 200.00 and a note saying he had no idea anything was amiss with the car.
There are good people left in this world!
Yeah, I meant to mention that in that post of mine. Pre Delivery Inspections don't catch everything. I think there are many posters here that could attest to that.
Case in point my 2004 Mazda MPV, on the test drive I noticed a whistling sound coming from the rear of the van. I mentioned it to the salesperson, she said it could be adjusted. Didn't seem like a big issue... we really liked the van. So, we went ahead and bought it . Brought it back a few days later, the dealership made an adjustment to the rear hatch... no more whistling.
I'm sure more serious problems are not that uncommon. So no, test driving is not a waste of time. Better safe than sorry as they say.
At the gas station on Edwards AFB, California, there's a guy arguing with the clerk about the price of gas. He says that he can get it in Victorville for 7 cents less per gallon. He wanted her to adjust the price to match. She said she couldn't do that.
He left in a huff in his C3 Corvette to drive the 65 miles to Victorville.
That was a memorable day because after corvette drove off, an elderly couple in their RV hit the awning over the pumps with the AC unit on the top of the RV.
Ahhh, if only I had a nickel for every time you wrote that. I'd have enough money to buy one of them "Porches" moo has on his lot.
But, I've been nice to you... just sharing my opinion. Return the favor will ya?
I'm not "worked up" but how would you like to spend two hours answering questions, driving cars etc, building a rapport with a customer only to learn that that same customer ended up driving two hours to "save" 100.00?
No, I wouldn't like it. But, that's part of the "game". Not something I would do (drive 2 hours to save $100), as I have documented in recent posts. I would have given you the opportunity to match the other dealerships offer. Can't really blame someone for wanting to save money... as long as they go about it the right way.
I can tell almost immediately whether the dealer wants to grind. They start off with asking about payments, and ignoring the other questions regarding pricing.
I usually have a little notebook I carry with me with all of my research in it on any car I'm interested in. It shows the price I plan to purchase the car for (based on my research), the taxes, the license cost, the "doc" fee....all totaled for an "out the door" price. I'm always willing to show it to the dealership if they want to see it.
If they ignore it, or don't want to see it, I always find they'd rather "grind it out". While I can do that, I normally don't.
Last time I did, it was on a Lexus IS350. I showed them the numbers in my little notebook and they totally ignored them....like I was silly for even trying to put them on an OTD price. I actually let them "bump" me a couple of times. We got to within about $300, but I walked. They almost acted incredulous that I walked for $300. It was more their attitude that made me walk, though. They acted like it was so distasteful to them to negotiate for something like a Lexus.
I've bought cars without driving them first (at least not at the dealership). I will do the test drive after we get the numbers part done, just in case there's something amiss with the particular car I'm buying.
In my former job, I travelled a lot. Rented a lot of cars. I'd say the only ones you can't rent are Hondas. Everything else is pretty much available to rent, however (even had Hertz put me in a Jag one time when they didn't have anything else to rent to me). IIRC, i got it for $40/day, too.
Obviously, I don't see any BMWs on rental lots. Nor Audis, Lexi or Benzes. But even there, with a little cajoling, if you're really serious about buying their wares, I've been offered to take their cars on overnight test drives.
Tried to rent a 'vette once. I was going to take my son on a cross country jaunt for his 21st B-Day. Couldn't find a dealership willing to rent me one, though.
I do hope you understand that I am not trying to pick on you. Just saying that "It's just $100" can cut both ways.
I do appreciate your perspective. You and the other sales folks here do this dance a hell of a lot more than the rest of us. I can understand it could get frustrating, especially over an amount that is small in the grand scheme.
Once he makes the trip, and the price is only $100 lower, he'd be a fool to go back across town.. to the dealer that wouldn't drop his price by $100 to begin with.
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While I was just visually looking at the car, the UCM and my salesperson were checking out my trade (normally I never trade, just sell myself, but this time I had to). The salesperson made an offer for my trade, I countered, he went to discuss with the UCM, they accepted, and the only thing left was signing some papers.
He asked my nicely (he knew I was a very educated buyer) if he needed to show me the features, explain the maintenance, etc. and I declined. Then, he sent me to the finance person where I wrote the check, signed a few more things, and they nicely (no pressure at all) asked if I wanted extended warranty, etc., to which I politely declined.
All told, I was out the door in 75 minutes. They did not waste my time, and I did not waste theirs. I got a fair deal, and I will go there again, even though it was not my local dealer, because of the way I was treated.
They finally realize that they have found the bottom of the market and they just cave in and buy the car from that other store.
A lot of times, they won't give the first salesperson the satisfaction of coming back even though that salesperson spent three hours with them.
And this works both ways. I have made many a sale to an exhausted shopper who came to me last.
It still amazes me to watch just how far some people will go in their attempt to save a lousy buck!
Life is short....enjoy!
I think the answer as to whether it's "worth" $100 to haggle further is more related to what the seller's time is worth to himself. I mean, senior citizens might clip coupons and drive through a snowstorm to get the price break on the "sunset special" at the restaurant, and that's GREAT because they have time on their hands and a fixed income. But I wouldn't do that. I could put that time to better use I think.
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The guy ended up leaving in a huff and went elsewhere where he wouldn't be getting "ripped off".
But not everybody feels like we do. For some, it's not the dollars. It's the fear that just maybe, somehow and somewhere, somebody just may have paid less money for the same car.
And for these people a dealership's reputation means nothing nor do they care about the salesperson who spent hours with them. It's all about "saving" money.
We are all different I suppose...
Need a few more nickels. :P
I want that sucka loaded with every dealer option known to man. :shades:
I was talking about the customer. For the dealership it's just business.
Speaking as a salesman who sold both Hondas and Nissans, this is something I saw virtually every day. And frankly, I get it. I understand that the vehicle that are purchasing is normally a "need" car. What does it matter that you have award winning dealership and that you are super nice. These customers are savvy enough to know that they don't need "You". They realize that turnover is insane at low line dealerships and any promise made to them may very well follow the salesperson to the next dealership, rendering it useless.
They aren't buying service. They aren't buying a dealership. They are buying a car. That will serve them well enough and they will move on. I get it. So why should they pay more? They view all the dealerships the same.
That's like saying "all dentists are the same---oh here's one on a freeway billboard. 'All extractions, only $29.95". I'll go there".
I have only worked at one store and I've been there 13 years. A couple have been there even longer than I have.
Probably a third of my business is from repeat or referral customers.
But, you're right. A lot of people don't care about that. They don't care about anything than price. I know that.
By the same token I have never seen a LEGIMATE price that I couldn't meet or beat.
I once interviewed a guy who worked at a nearby Ford store. I remember him saying they had something like 25 salespeople. He was second in senority and he had been there eight months.
You're the exception to the rule, Isell. The reality is that salespeople don't normally stick at one store.
In addition, I took steps to get away from the grinding and "need" vehicle. Porsche fit quite nicely into what I was looking for. People who appreciate the service, the aftersale and are willing to pay for it. Maybe 5% of the people buying Hondas appreciate what you've done for them and will be loyal. I would say 50% of the people buying Porsches appreciate the service and will be loyal. Hell, I've already had 3 people buy multiple vehicles from me here (at separate times) and I've been here under a year.
We lost some people last year to a new Lexus store that opened. They are back and very grateful to be back.
I must say, however, it is refreshing to meet so many of you guys on here who have been with your stores for more than a couple of months and at least advocate building a relationship with your customers. That is the kind of relationship that my father had with some car salesmen over the years, but one I have not enjoyed. On a related note, it was that relationship that resulted in him buying cars sight unseen on 2 occasions that I recall. Both times the deal was initiated by the salesman.
You get over that real quick when you look at your time invested and your paychecks.
We're planning on heading back there this spring.
I'm just slightly north across the border in Vancouver.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
That's why I stopped going out of my way to customers after I left Honda. It kinda sucked when people came in and you'd spend 2-3 hours with them, and in the end like Isell said, they'd go elsewhere to save a hundred bucks.
You'd find out because on the follow up call you'd get the: "thanks for your time!" speech "you were great" and on occasion they said I was the reason they bought a Honda, but from somewhere else because I didn't want to bargain etc......
So basically I did all of the work while another dealer closed them and got the deal. It feels you got sucker punched in the stomach because the customer was so nice to you but ultimately they couldn't care less to come back or even give you an opportunity to match the deal.
Where I'm at I don't do that anymore. I give my customers professional service, and it will be to the point, no time wasting, no joy rides unless you're buying, no offeers without credit card coming out, and you are going home in that car today.
Surprisingly I get a lot more business, more referrals, more gross too.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
What do you mean by that?
If this means I've got to provide a credit card before you will take an offer to the manager, I'd be out of there quicker than Flash Gordon.
No way am I having my credit card number floating around to be used as some sort of leverage. Even if I did provide it at some point in the deal, I would call the CC company and report it lost/stolen before I left the parking lot to leave.
Surely this is not what you meant, is it?
I am curious too, what is it you are selling boomcheck?
It is one of the problems with sales - you do all the work and then the prospective customer goes somewhere else just to compare or see if they can get a better price. Then, once they are there, chances are that dealer will at least shave off a few more dollars to get a sale. Customer is too warn down or embarrassed to return - and you lose the sale.
Maybe sales people should start off with (if you suspect this is the case with a particular buyer) why don't you compare 1 or 2 other dealers first, come back here with your best price and I will beat it?
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
What do you mean by that?
That's exactly what I mean. I know some of you here may disagree, but I've been burned before grinding my manager for the best price only to end up looking like a goof when the customer got the price they wanted and walked.
I don't grind, or negotaite for fun, or for the heck of it, or do all the work so someone else can get the deal. If you're serious about buying a car from me then by all means I'll bend over backwards to get the price you want. BUT you have to show me that you are buying the car.
As for security of "having the card float", your cc is not left somewhere by reception or wherever. It's usually with me or the sales manager.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
What I measnt to say is I think at Honda I was the no pressure laid back guy who offered everything and got nothing in returm other than a hard kick in the butt. You wanted all the brochures, info, 3 hours of my time, plus 5 test drives and best price? No problem, here it is. Enjoy!! I know you'll come back to buy cause I'm a nice guy right? Plus you won't shop our prices elsewhere over $100 and buy from a person you barely know right?
Wrong! All of that happenned more time than I care to remember. Hence my change of attitude.
So here I'm still laid back, easy going, friendly, but I'll waste no time on nonsense, and I'll have most buyers closed on the test drive before we ever hit the 4 square
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
I've only been selling for about 9 or 10 months though, so maybe I'm just not jaded enough yet.... ?
We bought a Camry Hybrid this spring to replace a 99 Explorer. We had been deciding on what to do for about 6 months. When we decided on the Camry, we went to our local dealer, talked with a nice salesman, did the test drive. This guy was so new he didn't have business cards so when we came back into the dealership the SM came by. We were interested and asked what kind of deal we could get on the car. Reply was 'The deal is, we have one in stock.' We thanked him went home and sent out an e-mail to all the local and near out of town (< 1 hour) dealers. This dealer came in at 1K under MSRP, another at 2K under and had it in the showroom. Phoned, left a deposit and picked it up on the weekend. No surprises when I picked it up, this was the 2nd easiest car purchase I've ever had.
Why didn't I go back to the first dealer and ask if they would match? 1) the SMs dismissive comment. 2) I treated my e-mail as a tender. The dealer with the lowest total price wins. If it was within a $100 and I didn't have to drive 45 minutes out of town then I would have paid the extra $100 and bought from the place 5 minutes from my house, time and gas have a value.
I remember when negotiating for a Silverado, the GSM actually came out to the table to check out who was crossing off his offers made in green and counteroffering in red.
Just a little something you might want to consider to add to your "repertoire".
It's either that or the place you work at. I started off in the automall environment, 5 years ago. So we had a lot of joy riders, tire kickers, plus people coming from all over the city to "start their shopping" and test driving every make and model, plus gauging the market for pricing. As you can imagine, it got tiring on a saturday when you went through 5-6 test drives, and got no deals. Usually many of those customers would eventually buy from a delaer closer to home, somewhere in their neighbourhood. :mad:
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
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