By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our
Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our
Visitor Agreement.
Comments
Rick Wagoner, did what before he worked at GM ???? Oh he didn't do [non-permissible content removed], besides go to college and played a little basketball at Duke. It's not like the guy has a substantial amount of education and some of the dumbest people I know have college degree's 62. So Rick Wagoner, before GM, had no prior experience either. He ran the chevy and pontiac divisions in 1988. Well remembering the cars from that era very clear I can only think of one that was worth a damn and that was the I-Roc Z-28. Outside of that their car sucked.
Invite every UAW member to do the same.
I have relatives, and know UAW member's with more education and experience than Wagoner, before he landed a job with GM. Wagoner, brown nosed his way to the top. It's well known. He's not a bad guy or a horrible CEO, but I think he's sucked way more money out of GM, than what he's earned.
Start a business and prove yourself. Work your way up to the position. That is how they all make it (unless it is a family business).
Dude, Wagoner never started a business and proved himself. He went to Duke, on a basketball scholarship I believe got a bachlor's degree in economics and then went to Harvard, as I think his family had connections and read somewhere they are well off. Well anyways he went to Harvard, and got a MBA in buisness administration. He then landed a job with GM, in the Treasures office I think in New York in the late 70's.
Sorry, just saying you could do it will not cut it.
If I surrounded myself with talent I have absolutely no doubt I could do his job. I would never allow automobiles like the Aztek, to see the light of day.
I know I could not.
Perhaps, you might not ? I'm not you.
Then again I have/am very close to that position and I know what it takes.
Well if you know what it takes then I don't see why it would be so hard to do. As I said some of the dumbest people I know have a college degree or two. They lack common sense. I'll take good common sense and people skills over sheer brains anyday. Wagoner, while being obviously pretty bright lacks people skills. He has allowed GM, to remain one of the most top heavy corporations in the world. Even Ford, has trimmed the fat at the top. GM, has done some but they still have many layers of bacon, that could be trimmed. Instead, they will upset people by making their products in Mexico, like the Avalanche and Escalade both of which could profitably be made here in this country. GM, has lost it's "american" image closing all these plants and now many consumer's look at Toyota, being more american than GM. This plays in the minds of consumers. Wagoner, has dropped the ball and allowed the perception of GM, automobiles to remain in many consumer's mind's as 2nd rate cars. He has done little to stop that on his watch. A 100K powertrain warranty isn't going to fix perception. It takes more. It takes better product. He has done zilch on coming up with honda smooth OHC engines on his watch. This would be a major area of focus if I was the CEO of GM.
So I know I cannot blow smoke and be honest with myself.
Well you can say I'm blowing smoke. We've had this discussion some time ago. I stand by my words as I do think I could do as good of a job if not better than Slick. I see so many area's of failure it's not even funny. This should be common sense. He is letting the american market slide when he could do things to fix it. Maybe he is arrogant enough to think he doesn't have to do anything yet as GM, is number #1 still in sales. However each year Honda and Toyota, make gains piece by piece in market share here in the U.S. while GM, is now talking about not bringing out the RWD ZETA's to this market. Just what the hell is he and Putz thinking ???? These are the reason why I gfeel with a few bright minds out of the good ol boy's club I feel along with a few smart cronies I could do a better job than he.
Just my $0.02 of smoke, as you would call it. :confuse:
Rocky
Sorry Rocky I cannot buy your story. My three 3/4 ton 4x4 Chevys were built in Canada. My 1999 Suburban 4x4 was built in Mexico. My 2005 GMC was built in Indiana. They were/are all good trucks. The fit and finish on the four built elsewhere was better than the current truck built in the USA.
You and I were not born into privilege. Of those that are, some are good some not so good. Not all make a mess of corporations Bill Gates comes to mind. Most make it with charm, wit and the ability to sell themselves to those on top. If high IQ is all it took, you and I would be running Exxon and Shell where the real money is being made.
My previous and future daily driver is a Silverado 4x4 ext cab with 19k miles in going on 6 years. That kinda tells how enjoyable the old Rivy is to drive because the loaded Chevy was MT truck of the year. A '98 Astro bought new still looks and drives like new. I bought a used '98 Mustang a year after getting the Rivy and based on what the prev owner told me, it has been very reliable, even better than my Astro per their story, but is not anywhere near the ride, features, comfort, and utility of the Astro. It has 10k less miles but is nowhere near as solid as the Astro. To my suprise, it has much better resale value than the Astro but I consider the Astro a league above the Mustang in every way.
My foreign car was a VW bug ready for junkyard at 88k miles.
I replaced it with a just turned over GM RWD V8 that took me to 203k miles in 10 years with a timing gear and some A-arm bushings. I sold it for $230 less than I bought it for, when it was 19 years old. By then I also had two F cars bought new. An '88 Formula 350 and an '84 Camaro. The Camaro needed tires at 65k, a battery at 83k, a belt at 90k, and then an alternator rebuild (maybe $25 of parts)at 105k and 9 years. CR was wrong by a factor of ten for me with that car so I got the Formula 4 yrs later. The guy I sold the Camaro to in '98 ran it from 168k up to about 230k and then got $4000 trade-in value for it when it was about 19 years old. So much for Horrible resale for GM. I paid $10,600 and sold for $2800 after 15 years.
The Silverado will one day again be my daily driver and I expect to replace tires at 50k and tires again at 100k with nothing else between except maybe a battery in year 8 or 9 due to it sitting so much. It has the 4.8 and gets 17 over the same loop that the Rivy gets 27 on. Not bad for 5000 lbs of 4x4 in mixed driving. I got $7k off sticker on it so I've only lost about $1200 a year in depreciation on it. Tough to top that I imagine. I'm hard pressed to find things 'cheap' about these vehicles, except the Mustang interior, but even that car is sought after as it is.
I lost you somewhere in the resale values of trade-in and sold after prices, but I get the point -- Camaro has some resale value. Actually the Mustang is very good, and the Camaro and Corvettes have been very good or good on different models. They only go so low. Some kid will always grab one for fixer-upper sporty car, or the case of Corvettes, they become collectibles.
The third generation F cars were not noted for being all that structurally sound, and particularly reliable, but if they held up well, and the parts held on, so be it. I like all the Camaros and Firebirds for looks, and wouldn't mind having one for a collectors car some day. I think the data from Consumers Report on reliability issues is correct however. And I would assume some creaks and moans to the body, as with more old cars of the 80's, but the look and to a degree the performance for that era car is pretty cool. Can't argue that you did not find some better choices and body styles in GM products over the years. As for trade-in price, someone was blessed, as $4K with that many miles is pretty high. A Firebird with a 350 or a Camaro SS in excellent condition will always bring a great price, and those 350 engines are so inexpensive to replace. Any of the 350 engined F body cars, or heck the Corvettes sound like good cars for keepers. I like the looks of the large Riv, but I prefer less mass in a coupe as a driver. For freeway cruising, I would say very cool -- or as a collectors cars.
As for trucks, the full sized American fleet seem OK. The smaller truck, like the Colorado, I would stay far away from.
Best smaller truck value appears to be the Tacoma.
You did find some of the better values and purchase price points for your American cars.
As for the VW, well others feel your pain as well, if the data in Consumers Reports is true.
Loren
Though it may never come again, I would like to see both cars, with basically the same style, but with a lower beltline look. The Solstice Coupe is a very hot look indeed. The Camaro just seems like it is a bit large, wide, and heavy looking, though it too catches the eye. Basically, the same look Camaro shrunk down, and with a lower overall beltline / lower door window sills, would be so cool. Both cars, just tweaked a bit, would be something I would consider buying some day. The New Camaro, with a retro look dating back to it origin, is on track IMHO. It is a bit of the old flavor, and some more futuristic / tuner look mixed in. The Dodge Challenger looks good, but like the Mustang is leaning pretty darn close to what I call the replicar look. A Challenger or a Mustang in say '69 was a beauty, and a very fine collectors car. Should they copy the look directly is the question? And they seem to gainning in size and weight. Fat Pony cars died in the past, as you may recall. A little leaner, yet meaner on power without sacrafic of performance, would be one neat combo. GM has the 3.6 V6 for power and decent gas mileage. And they could throw in any V8 up to 500HP, for those in need of bragging rights, or larger speeding tickets.
:shades:
Loren
Gagrice, I really respect your opinion and yes I'm not questioning the build quality pal. Well my mother's 99' Tahoe Sport was built in Mexico, and it did come to the dealership with a cracked leather seat. Boy, both her and my step-dad were very upset. They didn't know it was going to be built in Mexico, otherwise neither of them would of baught it. I, and my whole family refuse to buy anything made outside of the U.S. or Canada. I guess I'd be the only black sheep that would consider a Saab, made in Sweden, if they come out with a great product in the next few years. I'm most likely to buy a buick or cadillac as my next automobile.
You and I were not born into privilege. Of those that are, some are good some not so good. Not all make a mess of corporations Bill Gates comes to mind. Most make it with charm, wit and the ability to sell themselves to those on top.
Gates, I believe still is a majority owner of his company thus I give him a little more priveledges than other CEO's.
He isn't perfect as I still believe he doesn't pay any benefit's to his employees which can be a good thing if and only if the salary's are high enough to make up the difference so each individual can afford to buy plans and retire someday. He also is for something else I don't like which is giving a unlimited supply of Visa's to foreign workers. Educated or not he needs to show compassion and give american kids the chance to work for him. Even if it costs him a little more.
If high IQ is all it took, you and I would be running Exxon and Shell where the real money is being made.
Yes, that is where the real money is made. I personally think being CEO of GM, would be more fun.
Rocky
Or could it be that Honyota, is placing unrealistic demands on their U.S. supplier's to cut costs or lose business ????
Rocky
I believe you were trying to be helpful. The UIMs were a short term quality item. Replacement without ripoff is around $350 for UIM and LIM gaskets. BUT the Riviera is supercharged and those all had aluminum uppers!!! He just needs to change the oil in the supercharger every couple of years. Many don't and end up replacing the tail unit for wear at 100K.
There are many Rivieras that have come out of garages around my area in the last couple years. There also are many Auroras. These are cars that were owned but driven little as second cars and finally ahve been sold or traded for replacement cars.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Well that might be because we all know those cars weren't exactly great. However the owners I know that drove those cars all put over 100K miles on them. My father's ex girlfriend drove her Corsica, something like 60 or 70 miles a day. She drove the heck out of it. she had no problems with it either. Those were considered crappy cars. My brother has a 01' Sunfire, and the only problem he has had was his power door locks failed him. I don't know anyone with an Alero. I almost baught one back in 01'
I'm just saying we could say the same thing about the indomitable Tercels, Preludes, Civic's
Rocky
Rocky
Rocky
P.S. So is the Sky Redline.... :shades:
GM had some good styling on some of those older cars too, but the overall integrity and to an extent, reliability, were problems going down the road. BTW, you might want to take Aleros out of that list of three- that model seems to be one that most owners enjoyed.
At any rate, GMs recent smaller entries are there or getting there in pretty much all ways but fuel economy. If the Cobalt gets an interior that matches the more recent updates on other GM platforms, and GM figures out how to get a bit better mileage out of the otherwise good Ecotecs, I'd say it's a great value in its class. The SS versions (either Supercharged or non) are already excellent vehicles for the class they're intended to compete again, though many folks turn a blind eye to them because:
1) They're GM compacts (based on the historical stuff we're talking about here more than the reality of what this generation offers- reputation hurts)
2) Many folks associate the 'SS' moniker with RWD V8 powered vehicles. Those same people consider attaching that label to *anything* FWD and / or lacking a V8 to be blasphemy. Never mind that these cars handily outperform the original SS cars in pretty much all ways, or that in many ways they even compete well with modern RWD / hi-po performance cars too..
"It is getting its groove on, while making Trax"
http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/new_york_auto_show_2007/138/Chevy-s-Got-the-Beat- /
Now these cars should be outlawed just like the rest of the Sardine cans that are out on the market. :sick:
Rocky
Gotta respect Kia, for having the guts to send a top guy to edmunds.com.
Rocky
I am having trouble understanding exactly what you are trying to say here. All I am saying is that the G6/Malibu get good mileage and anyone who is interested in that can purchase them. I dont think GM has specified that four cylinders are for rental agencies only so your point makes no sense. Retail customers can buy those models if they so chose. I rented a car last fall and there were several G6's on the lot and I dont think one of them was a four cylinder model.
Until last month the Aura had very small incentives. I believe the best month was well over 6000 units. Its been averaging around 5k units since it came out though. Pricing is not the car's problem. Number of dealers, brand awareness and lack of early advertising are its problem. I am willing to bet we will see some better months ahead. Lets not forget that the G6 was also called a flop by the media and critics after a few months on the market and now its averaging 10k+ units a month.
the Lambda SUVs will get back up cameras for 2008.
1487,
I think this is a problem for GM, as if they would open a few more dealers that would sure help sales. I can think of a few area's back home where Saturn's would be good sellers "if" their was a dealer avaialble.
Good post pal !!!!
-Rocky
They killed the hot dog Cobalt? :confuse: One can only hope the rumored turbo Cobalt is ready to take its place.
I'm pretty sure the Civic, Focus and Sentra do not offer stability.
2007 Civic does, but the other two don't.
http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/NCAP/pages/ESC-EquippedVehicles-2007.html
I like you to much to allow you to drive those Sardine cans. I'd have to come whip your butt and knock some sense into you. :P
Please, don't embarrass us traditional GM, owners with such a POS car. Those cars are un safe !!!! :mad:
Rocky
For the rural dealers I think GM, should allow them to sell Saturn, products. For instance my nearest Saturn dealer is about a hour away in Amarillo. For other's it's much longer than that and their choices are restricted to Chevy, Buick, Pontiac, GMC, Ford, Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep, and in some rare cases like Dalhart, Tx a Cadillac division is also included. Wanna know what ? I bet ya the small town of Dalhart (8000) people sells as many Cadillac's as some much larger towns/city's. I mean that town moves Cadillac's at a high rate baught by mostly local folks. If I buy a GM, car it will likely be from them.
Rocky
This or the Volt, if/when it ever comes to fruition, are probably the only cars planned from GM that might get my money. I appreciate the trouble they took to offer the Aveo, and I wish them well with it, but it isn't the best car or the best value in its class.
And what were those other two little cars intro'd with the Trax? I have forgotten the names, but I liked all three.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
I'm shocked you actually like these lil' GM buggers. :surprise:
They are each un safe for american roads. I basically think it should be child abuse to put children in one. This go's for the FIT, Yaris, Smart, etc. They are Sardine cans. What's gonna happen if a Land Crusier hits you broad side. You and your family are deader than a door nail. I think a car should have to be a certain size and weight to be driven legally in the U.S. These lil bugger's if they crossed the Mackinaw Bridge, would blow over like a feather. :surprise: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mackinaw_Bridge
-Rocky
Groove and Beat. Silly names, but all new cars get silly names now.
BTW- What is the gas mileage on that diesel ?
Rocky
These lil bugger's if they crossed the Mackinaw Bridge, would blow over like a feather.
Naah, it's only five miles long; not long enough to worry about that. This one is a bit longer.
Well I know that but you can improve your odds with normal speeds where accident's occur in city driving like folks running a red light.
Naah, it's only five miles long; not long enough to worry about that. This one is a bit longer.
I've been across the Mackinaw a couple of times and dude it get's dangerously windy and cars have ended up in the bottom of the Great Lakes in the past. Now that
"Chesapeake Bay Bridge" is a bridge pal !!!! I always wanted to go across the Golden Gate Bridge. Maybe someday I will take a trip to Cali, and go race Socala4, in his Bimmer.
Rocky
You're absolutely right: Land Cruisers should be outlawed, along with all full-size SUVs, and full-size pick-ups should only be sold to licensed contractors, just like only folks with a contractor's license can buy explosives. And if you think I'm kidding........well, I am, sort of. But I believe very strongly that vehicles on our roads need to downsize for lots of reasons, safety among them.
Bumpy: thanks for the names of the other two. Silly, but fun as well! :-)
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Rocky
Rocky
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
The Corsa 1.7 gets just under 50 mpg (US) combined.
Interesting about how GM is going forward and the involvement by GM in China. The Chinese love Buicks. How far away are we from Chinese built GM cars (Buicks) being imported to US.
Believe that Chinese will be importing Cherys and Geelys to the US within next few years. There might have rumors that Chrysler might want to do this somehow.
What with Walmart soon opening doctors' offices in their stores, and they already are importing lots of Chinese stuff, maybe we will able to buy Chinese cars there also. This will close the loop. We can load our baskets with Chinese items, go to checkout counter with them, then take to the Walmart department selling Geelys, buy one, and put in basket load of items and drive home with all Chinese stuff. Alas, the gasoline will not be from China.
There's no such thing here. There is exactly one four-way intersection and zero traffic lights in the county. Accidents around here consist of people either running off the road into a tree, or badly misjudging distance and pulling out in front of traffic.
Does GM build cars/vehicles in Mexico and/or Canada? If so, what quantity and how many US equivalent dollars are given in wages/salary to Mexican/Canadian citizens?
Rocky
Rocky
Rocky
Rocky
It'd be nice if any of the domestics would send us a top-level chatter!
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h)
Review your vehicle
I have written requests to GM, and all I get told is they will forward it to the appropriate people. :sick:
Rocky
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I live in rural Virginia, which consists of fields, trees, and houses randomly distributed along the curvy, sometimes bumpy roads without much in the way of shoulders.