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Jeep Wrangler



  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591

    Not sure I would use the term "Death Wobble" at the service department. I just said it sounds similar, and maybe the same causes come into play.

    Does the steering wheel saw left and right real rapidly as you experience this? It would if you really had death wobble.


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • Y'all are correct, I am of the Female persuasion.

    For me I don't want an auto (can't make me this time). I live about 20 minutes outside of the Smoky Mtns and there is a GREAT place to Off Road with some pretty awesome climbs. Even the dealers have tried to talk me out of the manual but until you try to climb/descend from some of these hills slowly ..augh. It cracks me up to go to the dealers and tell them I want a manual as they all take a double take and say excuse me, around here about 90% of what you find on the lots are automatics.

    Well my biggest decision right now is to go with the Rocky Mtn X or the Sport with the AAC (I think) option. I will be talking to the dealer Monday so we will see.

  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    But, now that I have a better idea of the type of wheelin' you will be doing, I would like to see you get a Rubicon, if there is any way you can swing it.

    I suppose Windrock and Tellico will be places you will take your Jeep for wheelin'? You could put the 4:1 T-case and front and back lockers of a Rubicon to good use at either of those places.


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?


    Forgive me, if you posted some kind of spending limit for this new Jeep. The Rubicon may be above your limit, but you could never buy a Sport and add all the goodies that a Rubicon has without spending about three or four times the difference in price between the two. The Rubicon has Dana 44's front and back, a 4:1 Transfer Case low range gear ratio (standard is 2.72:1 in other Wranglers), SELECTABLE lockers front and back, 4.11 gears and 16" MT/R tires in 31 x 10.50 size. The Rubicon is an awesome trail rig at a super bargain price!
  • mtngalmtngal Posts: 1,911
    Try going northbound on the I-405 in either lane 1 or 2 - I can't quite remember if I notice it when I'm coming down the last bit of the Sepulveda Pass or just between where the 101 goes off and the carpool lane starts because it's been a long time since I drove the Sport into work. It doesn't sound like what what you have - what I feel is like rocking, not a vibration. By any chance are your tires cupped? Mine get that way (especially if I'm lazy about rotating the tires) and will cause vibration similar to an unbalanced tire or having your front end out of alignment. But that's pretty much speed dependent.

    Laura - I prefer the manual for going down hill for the reasons stated (engine braking going downhill) but I prefer an auto in the sand (something we see quite a bit) - it is easier to spin your wheels with a manual, which means it is easier to get stuck. Both are really minor advantages for the terrain I experience (I'm not a rock crawler so don't know about the auto having the problem that Tom talked about). If you want a manual, stick to your guns and get one - you'll be happy you did.

    By the way, while I didn't special order the Unlimited, there was only one that met what I wanted in SoCal. The dealer I bought it from (Buerge) had to trade with another dealer to sell it with me, so perhaps whatever dealer you like best can do the same thing to get your manual.
  • I can certainly understand the automatic and no clutch, especially in up-hill situations. It's the downhill situation that has always bothered me and I have driven automatics over the last 18 years. After test driving both here in Colorado on some real steep declines, there was no doubt which one I was going to buy this time...the manual let me poke coming down and never touched the brakes while the auto found me riding them all the way to stop speed. And I couldn't crawl over the same terrain with the auto that I just did with the manual. I read a great article in one of the 4X4 magazines when they test drove the Rubicon with both trannys on Hell's Revenge in Utah...they couldn't hold the auto back and wound up sticking the nose in the dirt (great picture)...the manual crawled down with no trouble and no burning brakes. Again, I still prefer the auto for convenience, but it's the blasted low gearing that wins out in the manual. And we have not spoken about those situations where you might need to back up the side of a hill to turn around...manual wins again with the lower gearing in reverse. It really does come down to a preference and what type of off-roading a person will actually do. That's what each person making a decision must analyze...what % of the time will I need the low gears of a manual versus the automatic...probably less than most of us think. Ooohhh, just thought of some awful trails here in CO with lots of loose shale where braking will send you sliding down several thousand feet and now I'm glad I have that low crawl speed with engine compression coming down...but that's about 1% of the time. Heck, if we all agreed where would the fun be in all this great learning we get here on Edmunds? ;)
  • "The dealer I bought it from (Buerge) had to trade with another dealer to sell it with me, so perhaps whatever dealer you like best can do the same thing to get your manual." This is very true, Laura. Actually all dealers are inter-connected and can get any vehicle they want from another dealer...if they have something to trade that the other dealer might want. I have bought cars/trucks in CO that came from trades in Utah and Arizona. It all depends on how hard the dealer wants to work to earn your business. If they are not willing, I'd find another dealer. All they have to do is get on the computer and find your vehicle and then see if the dealer is willing to trade with them. If it's a popular model then it might be harder, but it can be done. Dealers like to work with each other because they never know when they might want to trade. I have lots of friends who own dealerships so know how they work together (and sometimes hate each other). Good luck...they can get a manual from another state if needed and they want your business. :)
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Even with that 4:1 low range gearing on a Rubi, the compression braking is not good with the auto? Combine that with the 4.11 gearing of the differentials, and I would think that puppy would crawl REAL slow (still, not as slow as a manual, but slow enough I would have guessed). Hey, if you have driven both, I sure ain't gonna argue with ya, but I am surprised.


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • I missed this one ... What I was talking about with the Fuel Bypass was actually a Fuel Disabler, a switch you put in your jeep to turn off the flow of Fuel so even if they did steal it they wouldn't get very far.

    As far as the alarm I was thinking of getting one with the Perimeter & Motion Sensor with a pager.

    If I am correct, I don't think the X has the Sentry Key option

  • embeedueceembeeduece Posts: 260
    >By any chance are your tires cupped?

    Cupped? Cupped?! Of course not. My tires are not cupped! How dare you!

    Um...what's cupped? :blush:

    Seriously, I don't know what that means but looking at my tires nothing about them suggests cuppage. I do get the tires rotated per the schedule (Well, I request it. God knows if they actually do it.) Since this has happened to me 3 times -- once early on and twice recently I'm wondering if some combination of tire placement causes it. Like maybe the tires have been rotated back to original starting position. Maybe one's a defect. I had an increasing wobble in a Prelude; turned out to be a slowly bubbling tire. Probably not, but I'm trying to cover all bases before my Wrangler up and explodes.

    I will brave the Sepulveda pass and drive the 405 later tonight.

    Thanks Mtngal & all.


    "Weebles Wobble but they don't fall down!"
  • 99tj99tj Posts: 187
    -In response to Tom's posting about posting images:

    I work as a Graphic Designer and deal with image size / file size issues every day.
    When saving a Jpeg in Photoshop (I assume other photo-editing applications do this as well) a "jpeg options" window appears. You then have the option of choosing a compression size; Large, Medium, or Small. If you choose the smallest Medium setting, 5, you can lower the file size significantly.
    I just tested a file that was 370k at the Large setting, saved it at the "5" setting and dropped the file size down to 50k. Keep in mind I never changed the actual dimensions of the file. So the picture was still decent size to view. It lowers the quality of the pic, but not by much. Let's face it, we don't really need Hi-Res images on here. :P

    Long story short, we can still post good size pics at small file sizes.
    This way we don't kill the dial up folks. :shades:

  • Hi everyone,
    Ever since I was a junior in HS, I have loved jeeps. At 48, I am thinking about taking the plunge! I know, I know, maybe I should wait until I have given it some serious thought or looked at all the available options, BUT... It appears that time is running short vs what I have heard about the '06-'07 model year changes. Rubicon is what I am thinking. Any one have any thoughts vis-a-vis the Sport or other models. Your input would be appreciated. Tom, I would like to hear your thoughts.

    Thanks everyone - Chuck
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Hi, Chuck.

    Man, it would be impossible to recommend a particular model without knowing how you plan to use the Jeep.

    Unless you are going to do some pretty serious off roading, the Rubicon will have way more capability than you will ever use. Still, if you can afford one, and if you really want one, then go for it. Jeeps ain't practical anyway, are they? We get 'em for FUN. If you think it would be fun to have a Rubicon, that's what you should get.

    If you do not go with the Rubicon, then a Sport with that AAS package would be the next best thing. You would have the Dana 44 rear axle and some gorgeous wheels, the Ravine style wheels, and good gearing, 3.73's. This is a platform that can be built on nicely. You have gearing to support up to 33" tires, although you might not be completely happy with acceleration with 33's amd the 3.73 gears, it would be "liveable." You would have the Dana 44 to support a full locker in the back.

    Next would be the X model, and you should really consider the Rocky Mountain edition, if you go X. It would get you the Dana 44 rear axle. I think it comes with 3.73 gears also.

    Chuck, the very lowest model Jeep, the SE, with its four banger engine might be all the Jeep you need. If it would be mainly used around town with very little highway driving, then the SE would be fine.

    It all depends on how you will use the Jeep. ANY JEEP IS COOL! You take the top and doors off a Jeep, whether it is an SE or a Rubicon, you got yourself one FUN ride!


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • embeedueceembeeduece Posts: 260
    Hey Ocean Shipper (awesome name!)

    Here's my 2 cents.

    SE -- The base model. 4 cyl. Very simple. Utilitarian. But it still gets you in a Wrangler! Top down, doors off!

    X -- A smart compromise so those who don't want to spend on a Sport don't have to settle for 4 cyls. A few choice bells and whistles.

    SPORT -- Middle of the Road. Lots of possibilities. Comes standard with attractive options, and has good options packages. A real deal Jeep. This is what I chose.

    SAHARA -- Not sure they make these anymore, at least in the short wheel base. If there are some kicking around, these are the luuuuuuxury model. Better seats and colored fender flares. I think there's an Unlimited Sahara (but is that the luxury edition or the movie edition? Anyone?).

    RUBICON -- This is an honest to goodness serious off roader. No foolin.'

    UNLIMITED -- Extra cab space, more leg room in the back. A streeetch Wrangler. Not sure of the trim options.

    At various times there have been Wrangler Tomb Raider editions, as well as Patriot, Rocky Mountain, Columbia I think, etc.

    If you're already thinking Rubicon, then you probably won't want to dip further down than a Sport. Still, all Wrangelrs are, I believe, trail rated. They will all go into 4 wheel drive and perform well. But, there is a difference of exactly what capabilities the different trims will offer. Tom summed it up pretty well. Others will too. Axles, gear ratios, etc.

    Thought I'd offer my primer in newbie speak, since I speak it well.

    Happy Shopping,
  • Tom:
    I was speaking about the 3:73 rear end with the trac-loc...not the Rubicon. I thought we were talking about what Laura might buy in the case of her wanting a manual versus the auto. I think the Rubicon is certainly a different animal with the 4:11...sorry for any confusion. I tested the Unlimited in auto and manual and there was no comparison in crawl ratio or engine compression coming down hills. As we all know, there is a BIG difference between the Rubicon and a 3:73 Wrangler and I would probably opt for the auto in the Rubicon for my driving conditions. :confuse:
  • Since I have never carried external gas cans (never had to in the past, but will do so now), what is the proper safety measures (if any). Warnings about direct sunlight are rather confusing since these things sit on the back and in direct sunlight. And I often park where there are no trees for shade and hike for hours...leaving them under the vehicle insures they won't be there when I return. I like the Briggs and Stratton cans with a tight seal...tried to make them spill in every way and no leak. Question: is it OK to leave these cans on the back of the Jeep in the sun for hours? Thanks :confuse:
  • keatskeats Posts: 412
    I had always wanted the Sahara model, but when I finally decided to get a Wrangler, I had to go with the Rubicon. Of course I don't use all the capabilities, but so what? Do Corvette owners race to work every morning? If you can afford the Rubicon, get it. You'll love it.
  • Hey, Tom:
    I found the article about the test drive of the Rubicon automatic that was done by RockCrawler in Moab. This is what they discovered about the auto versus the manual. Not for argument, just for information discovered in test drives.
    "I don't typically prefer automatics when four-wheeling but I figured I may as well give this one a try so I could check out the new four-speed tranny. Compared to the manual's 66.4:1 crawl ratio, the automatic's 46.7:1 (not including the torque converter) quickly revealed itself as we began our descent. No longer could I sit back and let the motor hold us as we crawled down the hill. The automatic's higher 1st gear was a different animal, entirely. The brake pedal was used almost the whole way down the rim, as the gearing just couldn't hold me back as much as I would have liked it to. However, if you like automatics and the simplicity they offer when driving, the new 42RLE will be a great improvement over the 30/32RH three-speed previously offered through 2002. The 30/32RH had a first gear ratio of 2.74 compared to the 42RLE's 2.84.

    Craig and I headed toward the Devil's Crack, which is below the infamous Z-Turn. Craig told me about his ride the day before where his driver stood the Jeep straight up. I laughed and assured him that we'd be just fine. As we got to the crack, I eased up to it and tried to hold the brakes as much as I could. As the Rubicon dropped over the edge, the front end went straight down, putting all of the Jeep's weight on the front end. I stood on the brakes as Craig stood up in the footwell. The front end was practically buried and one wheel was in the air. This was a great test for the Rubicon's new axle joints which are said to be about eight times stronger than the 297 joints found on the Dana 30 axles. I looked over to Craig and said, "we're totally fine. No problem. Under control." Craig's worried face soon relaxed as I eased forward and leveled the Jeep. "Is that what happened yesterday," I asked him, as I laughed.
    Not too many people will put themselves in this situation and I would still go with an auto in the Rubicon...just a preference.
    Keith :)
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    I was out exploring in some strip mine land today. Just me and Ross Allen.

    Thelma Jane got stuck in a small but deep mudhole, and good old Mr. Warn came to my assistance. (That's my Warn 9.5Ti winch I am talking about.)

    The hole was deeper on the left, so Thelma Jane was leaned over to the drivers side quite a bit. I was afraid water would come through the door opening, since it must have been deep enough on the drivers side for the bottom of the door to be under the surface of the water. I climbed out the passenger side and avoided the mud by standing on the passenger side door jam and jumping to solid ground.

    Fortunately, the front end was close enough to the end of the mudhole that I could stand on solid ground to pull winch cable.

    Without Mr. Warn today, I would have been up the proverbial tributary without the proper means of locomotion.

    Thank you, Mr. Warn! :)


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • OK, Mr. Lucky...what was close enough for you to attach the winch cable? Or did you attach it to Ross? Let us know all this story so I'll know how to get out of quicksand in Utah when there are no trees or rocks or humans to help! ;)
  • I have a '95 YJ, and have trouble starting it sometimes...seems worse when it's cold. I turn the key into the on position (not far enough to actually start it) and then have to wait...eventually, without fail, the starter relay will start to click...I have opened the power distribution box and actually felt that particular relay clicking....but until it starts clicking (clicks 10-15 times) then there is a hum, and it will start right up. I have a new battery, the posts are isn't the starter, because juice isn't even getting that far until the relay kicks over...I bought a new relay and it does the same thing. Any suggestions?
  • bamatazzbamatazz Posts: 311
    WHEW, love all the newbies in here now!!
    You guys keep asking the questions, We dont mind aswering them..
    And TOM, you know you our "door greater" in here. Ohh wait, are you still our President?
    Thats great news that we may be able to post our pics staight on here.
    be good to me too, im still on dail-up too.
    I would like to know what kind of service I need to give TAZZ now.
    I just replaced my front brakes last month. When I got my oil changed he checked all belts & hoses told me everything looked good. He is a customer of mine so I trust him with this info.
    Mac/Tom any info?

    Keep Jeepin
    Bama :shades:
  • rankinhubrankinhub Posts: 19
    As with the Tomb Raider Wrangler, Jeep has introduced an "embedded content" movie / special edition Wrangler Unlimited Sahara built on the Rubicon platform -- 1,000 copies only. These are very similar -- but not identical -- to the Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon model outfitted with the Sahara package.
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    OK, Mr. Lucky...what was close enough for you to attach the winch cable? Or did you attach it to Ross? Let us know all this story so I'll know how to get out of quicksand in Utah when there are no trees or rocks or humans to help!


    I had my choice of a couple of trees, fortunately. In these strip mines, they leave some of the ground untouched, because they follow the coal seam. The untouched ground and the mined acreage are intermingled throughout the whole mine area. Also, even some of the mined and reclaimed land has trees big enough to anchor a winch.

    I have heard that you can bury your spare tire halfway in the ground and use it to anchor a winch, if there are no trees.


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Long story short, we can still post good size pics at small file sizes.
    This way we don't kill the dial up folks.


    Exactly right, Dan. The high resolution is needed only for printing.

    On a computer screen, beyond a certain point, the resolution of the monitor becomes the limiting factor, not the resolution of the pic. For most folks, a 640 x 480 image would look as good on their screen at 80 KB or so vs. 500 KB or even higher.


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591

    Your Jeep is four years old now?

    Ask Mac for his opinion, but it might not be a bad idea to change gear oil in your differentials and change the fluids in your tranny and t-case. If you were an off roader, I would say you are WAY overdue on that, but since you don't off road, I'm not sure it is even necessary now. Mac???

    What about your coolant? You don't really believe the claim that the factory coolant is good for 100K miles do you? I changed mine after a couple years to the normal anti-freeze, the green stuff. Think it was Prestone.

    If you have never changed coolant, be sure to do that, and get a good flush. I would have them just put normal antifreeze in it and plan on changing it every two years. That long life stuff is a bunch of crap, in my opinion.


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591
    Welcome, Tuck. No help for ya here, just saying Hi and Welcome.

    Mac will probably have some suggestions for ya, so stick around.


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • Thanks for the welcome...hate to open up with a problem, but this particular problem is really starting to tick me off. Sometimes I have to let it sit with the key in the on position for like 10-15 minutes before the stupid relay starts's weird.
  • cap1374cap1374 Posts: 1
    hi there! i have a 2005 jeep wrangler X (which i am madly in love with) with the basic four speaker stereo/cd player. i am looking to keep the factory deck and install a subwoofer just to give me a little bit of base...not enough to shake windows but enought to listen to my favorite cd's and hear a bit of bass. any suggestions? i have heard the one from jeep that goes in the console is poor quality sound so i am just looking for some tips! thanks! ;)
  • tsjaytsjay Posts: 4,591

    The factory sub makes the radio bearable. I can't believe how totally absent any bass is without the sub. At least on the 01's it was like that. I'm not terribly demanding on my sound system, and the factory sub is fine for my purposes.

    Crutchfield used to carry a sub that would go in the console of a Jeep. Not sure if they still do or not. We have some folks in here who are much more into stereos than I am, and I'm sure you'll get some answers from them.


    Have you hugged your Jeep today?
  • erickplerickpl Posts: 2,735
    You can go aftermarket if you want. I have an aftermarket Tuffy security console that is much stouter than the factory. It has an 8" Kicker sub in it. Sounds great (granted I do have other aftermarket stuff in there).

    As for winch anchor points, you can make some kind of 'land anchor' like a bruce anchor for you sailors out there that will plow into the earth when pulled and give you a point to anchor with (pun intended).

    I can't add much to the discussion about trim levels, but I have an SE (4cyl). I like it for the driving I do, just wish it had more on the highway. I'd love to have a Rubi with all the stock stuff it has, but there is no way I'd be comfortable wheeling a brand new Rubi and the $$ I spent to wheel it. My SE is a 97 so I don't mind it getting banged up a bit. Have you considered a slightly used Rubicon? Lots of em available and few if any see offroad action.

    The current Unlimited Sahara is indeed based on the movie, not the trim level, but most of the stuff in it is pretty nice (chrome grille hasta go).

    For manual vs. auto, the auto is easier to work offroad, but with a hand throttle for the manuals, it becomes a lot easier - your right hand basically becomes your gas foot and your right foot can work the brakes if needed.

    For the 405, try driving south before hitting the 101... feel like you are riding a horse... up /down/up/down especially in the HOV lane!

    My 97 SE does not have the sentry key available, but an aftermarket alarm with kill switch for the ignition system would help. I'm considering one, not so much for the alarm portion, but for the kill switch. I've seen writeups on doing this myself, but I don't know how comfortable I am doing something like this myself.

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