Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Did you get a great deal? Let us know in the Values & Prices Paid section!

GM News, New Models and Market Share

1100310041006100810091051

Comments

  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Kent, OHPosts: 10,877
    The '11 and '12 Malibu are better-than-average...better than Fusion for '11.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Kent, OHPosts: 10,877
    Subaru has a big corporate office in Indiana? ;)
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Retro design is passe, they had to modernize it.

    It looks like a Corvette, nothing else. Even a child will recognize it, "Wow, is that the new Vette?!"
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Kent, OHPosts: 10,877
    I will say, I see Cruzes all the time and right-out-of-the-box. I don't believe I've seen a single Dart anyplace but a dealer's lot, since he mentioned that.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,381
    Actually, I heard that, as well. A friend of mine brought it up in conversation that he saw an article somewhere (I'm thinking Newsweek but don't quote me) that had a list of some of the biggest product flops of 2012, and the Dodge Dart was listed.

    I did find this article: http://www.autoblog.com/2012/12/05/dodge-dart-misses-sales-targets-as-inventory-- mounts/
    which mentions the Dart isn't selling well, and it also backs up a theory I had, that people are going for the Avenger and 200 instead, because of better deals. The Dart may be a better car, but I think the cheap price is what's attracting them to 200's and Avengers.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Subaru has a big corporate office in Indiana?

    No, they have a big corporate office in Cherry Hill, New Jersey. Growing so fast they're currently looking for a bigger building to move in to.
  • bpizzutibpizzuti Posts: 2,743
    They also have offices in Indiana, since that's where their factory is. It's not like the population is 100% coverall-clad line workers you know.

    I did forget their HQ was in New Jersey though, thanks for the reminder.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Kent, OHPosts: 10,877
    I hate the Spark. It's absolutely Korean.

    The Sonic I see was primarily engineered by "GM Korea" with input from Opel, and the outside was 'styled by Chevrolet' per the site I looked at. I hated the Aveo; the Sonic sedan I actually like.

    The Spark? I absolutely detest what I've seen.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Kent, OHPosts: 10,877
    Well obviously, but I think you know who employs more white-collar people of all levels, more assembly-line workers, and more suppliers in the U.S. And more production is coming to the U.S.--a good thing.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Dart doesn't offer a hatch, so I haven't looked at one closely.

    Of course the new Fiat, what's it called here, the 500L? Fills that niche, I guess.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America I70 & I75 Posts: 22,853
    > the Subaru folks are well informed and do not wear blinders.

    I figured that out long ago, mostly from your approach to this discussion.

    2015 Cruze 2LT, 2014 Malibu 2LT, 2008 Cobalt 2LT

  • bpizzutibpizzuti Posts: 2,743
    Well obviously, but I think you know who employs more white-collar people of all levels, more assembly-line workers, and more suppliers in the U.S. And more production is coming to the U.S.--a good thing.

    Yeah, I'm so glad Ford is around. :D
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I would add one caveat and say "sustainable jobs are good".

    They have to do a good enough job that the cars sell and they can profit, in order to sustain themselves.

    I was pro-bailout because I still think credit vanished and so did demand. Now the car market is bouncing back. The people who have those jobs have to design cars people want, if so then great, maybe they'll even create more jobs.

    If not, then it's not sustainable. Let someone else create those jobs.

    The public is getting their first look at the pickups, Corvette is doing its job to draw crowds, and ATS is getting headlines from the press. So everything appears to be in place. I'm optimistic for GM to at least maintain its current share, with a growing market.

    Let's hope the pickups launch well, without the same hitches that Ford has had with new products lately.
  • bpizzutibpizzuti Posts: 2,743
    Still seems silly that they took the Giulietta, removed the hatch in the process of Americanizing it, brought it here...and will use a DIFFERENT model to provide a compact hatch in the US.

    Something just seems a little inefficient about that. :shades:
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Thank you, wow. What next, peace in the middle east?

    Let's have lunch and we'll work it out.... :D
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Dart is a real head scratcher for me. I kind like it, personally. :confuse:
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 10,594
    I'm sure the Dart is having trouble finding takers for the same reason as it won't catch my dollars.

    There is one HUGE big main reason:

    Previous small Dodge car owner!

    End of story. Period.
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '17 VW Golf AllTrack SE 4-Motion AWD, Wife's '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6T FWD
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,381
    I think the Dart looks a bit clunky in the rear door/C-pillar area, but otherwise I think it looks pretty good. It's a bit tight in the back seat for me, but I also realize it's a compact...it's not supposed to feel like my Park Ave back there!

    I wonder if the styling might be a bit too "youthful" for some buyers? Personally I like it, but I can see the Cruze being a more broadly appealing car...to young, middle-aged, and old alike.

    I haven't seen many Darts on the road yet. I don't see too many of the new Focus, either.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Other redesigned Dodge/Chryslers have fared better, even updates.

    They did try to build some thing for everyone. Maybe too many engine options, too wide a price spread?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Some perspective from the other side of the pond, on the outgoing one:

    http://youtu.be/Ko9kzyqW-l8

    I think the new one will go a long way towards stopping complains from the dash strokers.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Kent, OHPosts: 10,877
    Re.: the Dart, I liked what I've seen, and from the brochure they offer a lot of choices, a big thing for me. Maybe now is a good time to shop for a Dart.
  • bpizzutibpizzuti Posts: 2,743
    Oh I've seen a TON of current-gen Focuses around here. More than I've seen Cruzes. Probably more than I've seen Civics, but you can't tell the difference between the current and previous gens with those. ;)
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,863
    I know that was directed at other people, but the Subaru folks are well informed and do not wear blinders.

    Except of course when anyone mentions building a FWD, I4 Subaru!!

    :)
  • andres3andres3 Southern CAPosts: 10,594
    Maybe the Dart (being a name that was used before) has more negative historical reliability than the other retro names that were brought back like the Challenger/Charger.

    At least the latter has a cool movie associated with it.
    Toy '16 Audi TTS quattro AWD, Commuter '17 VW Golf AllTrack SE 4-Motion AWD, Wife's '16 Kia Optima LX 1.6T FWD
  • dieselonedieselone Posts: 5,729
    What exact ten models were ahead of the 1LT Malibu within that category in the magazine? Honestly, I can't recall nearly that many.

    Some were multiples of the same car due to 4cyl, v6, and hybrid powertrains.

    Here's what placed above the Malibu, not in actual order.

    Camry Hybrid, 4cyl LE, and XLE v6
    Accord LX 4cyl, and EX-Lv6
    Sonota Limited 2.0T, and GLS 2.4
    Subaru Legacy 3.6R
    Altima v6
    Optima SX 2.0T

    Now to be fair, the Fusion isn't listed, and the 2.0T version of the Malibu hasn't been listed either.
  • tlongtlong CaliforniaPosts: 5,182
    Oh I've seen a TON of current-gen Focuses around here. More than I've seen Cruzes. Probably more than I've seen Civics, but you can't tell the difference between the current and previous gens with those.

    Here in CA, I'd say lots of Focuses, quite a few Cruzes, very few Darts, Sonics, or Sparks. An occasional Volt. Some Malibus. I don't see many Impalas or Buicks at all. I've only seen one Verano ever.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 23,381
    Maybe the Dart (being a name that was used before) has more negative historical reliability than the other retro names that were brought back like the Challenger/Charger.

    Nah, the old Dart pretty much went down in history as being one of the most durable cars ever built. Although my grandparents had a '75 Swinger that stalled out at random, and the dealer never could fix it. However, they could have probably bought a 1975 anything and it would have been a piece of junk.

    But, for the most part, the new Dart has a lot to live up to, to carry that name.

    I wonder if a lot of people are staying away, partly as you said because they got burned by the old Neon (or the Caliber), but also partly because it has a lot of Italian technology in it, and they haven't quite shaken off the old "Fix It Again Twice" mindset?
  • bpizzutibpizzuti Posts: 2,743
    That's because

    A. Subaru doesn't build inline engines anymore
    B. Subaru doesn't build FF capable trannies anymore
    C. Subaru using their current engines and trannies to build a FWD car would actually cost just as much as the AWD version.
    D. Subaru customers have no desire for an FF Subaru

    Therefore it is the opinion of well-informed Subaru folks that making an FF Subaru, in addition to being a dumb idea, would be an utter waste of money for a company that shouldn't be wasting it. :shades:
  • bpizzutibpizzuti Posts: 2,743
    Surprisingly I've seen probably 3 or 4 Sparks around here. Which is 4 or 5 more than I expected to see.
  • tlongtlong CaliforniaPosts: 5,182
    Surprisingly I've seen probably 3 or 4 Sparks around here. Which is 4 or 5 more than I expected to see.

    LOL!

    You're in the OC/SD area?
Sign In or Register to comment.