Acura RL

1violinist · October 2004

"Meteor silver metallic (greenish silver)"
I guess it's more like "blueish silver" -- it's the same color found on TSX!

Thanks for the info!

kenw1 · October 2004

I am looking at 7 choices: 2005 RL, 2005 A6 3.2, 2005.5 A4 3.2, 2005 Infiniti G35X, 2005 BMW 330xi, 2005 Lexus ES330, and 2005 BMW 325xi. I am planning to get the car on a low mileage 36-42 month lease (12,000 km/8000 mi per year if available) as I have only clocked 42,000 km on my present 1999 Lexus RX300. I am thinking of waiting until the '05.5 A4 becomes available in March before buying as by that time the other cars should have lost their brand new status and better discounts/lease terms may become available. I would probably also consider the current '05 A4 3.0 if they give a really good deal at that time.

As I live in a hilly part of town, AWD is preferred, even tho we only get snow a few times during the year. I had a '95 BMW 325 RWD and got caught in a snow storm and couldn't make it up the hill back home. I loved the car, but decided to change it for a '97 A4 2.8 Quattro, which was great. My wife really liked the A4 interior. Both cars (as well as my present RX300) gave great service. We are seniors and like to have a nice comfortable ride, but also have enough power and maneuverability to get us out of trouble if necessary. Also, aids like parking sensors would be helpful.

I'd like to hear your opinions on these cars and if I should wait till March.

legendman · October 2004

Got my brochure today. I found it a bit underwhelming. Had hoped for more.

Too many shots of the car in silver (3 flavors); not enough of the other colors offered, IMHO.

Main 2 interior shots were with the Ebony (Black) interior. I would have liked to see a larger view of the cabin in Taupe or Parchment.

Lots of photos of the car were taken from overhead, that is, looking down on the car, instead of from the side in profile. This is a common technique used by photographers to make the car look better: longer, leaner and showing more sculpting angles, such as those on the hood. Certainly these are very flattering views, but, ones which we as owners would rarely see.

I don't recall seeing a full size, ground level, full profile in the entire brochure. There are a couple taken from the left side rear and right rear, which shows the car in perspective, with a view of the rear trunk. The car looks muscular from these vantage points. The front end shot looks aggresive, but I keep seeing the "cross-eyed" headlights in the front grille.

I'm not crazy about the somewhat zebra-striped wood veneer, with the grain direction going from front to back -- as opposed to left to right, etc.

I am pleased with the palette of exterior colors this year. While I have not seen the car in person, the colors that were shown looked good in the lighting in which the photos were taken -- some of which was side light, late afternoon, dusk, and nightime. Time of day is important because the sun imparts different hues, especially at dawn or dusk. The Celestial Silver shot at the beach looks a tad like it has some gold or champagne in it, but I suspect that this is the effect of the afternoon position of the sun, and retouching, which can be seen on the rear bumper, etc.

I think that getting the colors right is an important milestone for the RL, as the last few years offered colors that did not move me at all (had I found a color I liked I would have bought a 2003 or 2004 model).

I think they could have filled up the catalog pages with a little bit more info and some more photos on the many systems that the car now offers. The coverpage seemed a waste to me, with no car at all seen -- just a birdseye of some beach houses, a curvy asphalt road, some beachfront, and foamy white, wavy green seawater. It kinda reminds me of the ultra abstract TV commercials that were meant to introduce the first generation of a new line of cars called "Infiniti". They featured rocks and water, and no car -- if memory serves. I hope Acura is not foolish enough to retread that same ground. At least they better show the car this time around!

In summation, the new '05 RL is a big improvement and should do a lot better than the moribund RL of prior years. I am happy that I have now seen the new colors and the interior color choices, and will look forward to seeing the car in person.

nebraskaguy · October 2004

Thanks for the heads up on the Motor Week show. It was great seeing it in action on something other than a small video on the internet.

aclc · October 2004

How does the Dealer add backup sensors as a non-factory option? Does anyone know how this accessory would work (?lights above rear glass that warn you of the proximity of car behind you?)?

rroyce10 · October 2004

**I am the guy who, to this day, things the VW Passat W8 should have "flown" off the showroom floor. And, I, to this day, think the Phaeton is a bargain, relatively**

         Unfortunately the Phaeton is all dressed up and no place to go ... people like to look at em', some will even buy a few (and the word here is "few") the biggest problem is the "brand recognition" and the ego ~ $60 grand for a VW.?

             The perceived value ends up flopping around like a mullet and the resale falls like an anvil, 04 Phaetons are barely breaking the $35ish figure with 3/5k, $25,000 is a expensive drive around the block .. dealers are having a hard time trying to move them and once they are sold, they have a tough time keeping them out of the service lanes .. not much "good" going on here.

             What will sell the new RL's will be the reliabilty and longevity factor .. now, whether they will see that $47ish figure we will have to see, no back-up beep beep.? bad marketing ......................

Terry.

monet5 · October 2004

The dealer installed backup senor probably is just like the option for the 03TL. They drill holes in the rear bumper and install the sensors (4 I think). Some audiable alarm in the cabin sounds as you approach something in the rear. Frequency of the sound increasing as you get closer to an object.

As I recall on the TL the senors are black in color so on a dark car (ex: Black) you cannot really see the senors. However, on a white TL they really stuck out.

I've read where a number of people think a camera would be better, but personally I prefer the audiable senor. It allows me to know how close I am while still looking around for other objects on the sides. I have the senor on my A6 right now and love it. Living in a large city (Chicago) it makes parking a breeze.

saedave · October 2004

If you fit the A4 comfortably, the wait to March 05 may be worthwhile. The current 3.0 engine will be an orphan like my W8. Unless the A6 handling is greatly improved from those I have driven, you will find it sloppy after owning an A4; my W8 Passat wagon handles much better!

You have left out a very reasonably priced AWD alternative: The Subaru Outback H-6 LLBean now has a well finished interior and performs much better than the Lexus ES330. The reliability of this six cylinder Subaru should be similar to that of the RL. As a senior who highly values seating position and visibility I choose wagons....and the Subaru is available in a wagon.

shotgun · October 2004

Ceric - I'm getting conflicting reports on what the "Lakeshore Silver" looks like. Some say it's greenish silver, other claim it's blueish, yet others point to pictures where it looks medium blue almost like denim. I'm actually looking for a greenish silver color. Please take another look at the Lakeshore and Meteor Silver (perhaps you and one other person could do this to reach consensus) and share with me and others exactly which secondary color the Lakeshore & Meteor Silver leans toward - light blue, greenish, denim, or whatever. Your help is appreciated...

legendman · October 2004

>I'm getting conflicting reports on what the "Lakeshore Silver" looks like. Some, like you, say it's greenish silver, other claim it's blueish, yet others point to pictures where it looks medium blue almost like denim. I'm actually looking for a greenish silver color. Please take another look at the Lakeshore Silver (perhaps you and one other person could do this to reach consensus) and share with me and others exactly which secondary color the Lakeshore Silver leans toward - light blue, greenish, denim, or whatever.<

I took the catalog outside into the daylight this morning and here are my impressions of Lakeshore Silver. Looking at the metallic color chips (and not the photographs) and changing the angle back and forth from reflection to reflection, I see two distinct colors.

Looking at the chip somewhat at an oblique angle, without being able to see the shiny clear gloss reflected back, the color looks grey -- maybe a gunmetal grey with a hint of gold/brown in it. I saw no blue whatsoever.

When looking at it straight on, and through the reflective,shiny clear coat gloss, the color takes on a metallic gold/champagne color. Again, I saw no blue.

The Meteor Silver, on the other hand, definitely has a very pale blue/hint of green metallic look, depending on the angle of viewing. I think the Carbon Grey has some green in there.

Just as an aside, I took some color ships from a BMW 740 catalog that I had lying around, and pulled off some of those chips and taped them near the new Acura RL colors. Interestingly, the RLs Celestial Silver and the BMWs Titanium Silver seemed pretty close in color and hue. The RLs Desert Mist Metallic looked pretty close to the BMW Sahara Beige. The RLs Carbon Grey Pearl is pretty close to the Anthracite Grey of BMW, and depending on angle of viewing, and both have a hint of green in there.

Hope this helps you Shotgun.

I think that the new paint process Acura describes in the brochure adds a whole new dimension to the paint. I'll have to see the car in person -- during daylight and at dusk -- to get a better sense of how the cars will really look. The photos in the catalog are misleading for reasons I mentioned in an earlier post, including time of day the photos were taken and the amount of retouching, which I think was substantial in many shots.

aclc · October 2004

Thanks monet5, your post was very helpful.

Are wheel locks worth getting from the dealer or elsewhere? Any sites online that would sell wheel locks for the 2005 RL?

aggie76 · October 2004

I've got both the sensors and a back-up camera on my LS430 and it's the best of both worlds for backing up & parallel parking in my opinion. Had a case where the sensors didn't see a short thin pole, for whatever reason, but I saw it on the camera and held up. Using the camera when doing parallel parking also makes it a breeze on finding that curb.

I really hope the RL does well but like many others, I think the pricing is a touch high for it. Having owned 3 different Acura's, and currently have an MDX which is really a great multi use vehicle for my active family

aggie76 · October 2004

I've got both the sensors and a back-up camera on my LS430 and it's the best of both worlds for backing up & parallel parking in my opinion. Had a case where the sensors didn't see a short thin pole, for whatever reason, but I saw it on the camera and held up. Using the camera when doing parallel parking also makes it a breeze on finding that curb.

I really hope the RL does well but like many others, I think the pricing is a touch high for it. Having owned 3 different Acura's, and currently have an MDX which is really a great multi use vehicle for my active family

aggie76 · October 2004

I've got both the sensors and a back-up camera on my LS430 and it's the best of both worlds for backing up & parallel parking in my opinion. Had a case where the sensors didn't see a short thin pole, for whatever reason, but I saw it on the camera and held up. Using the camera when doing parallel parking also makes it a breeze on finding that curb.

I really hope the RL does well but like many others, I think the pricing is a touch high for it. Having owned 3 different Acura's, and currently have an MDX which is really a great multi use vehicle for my active family.

igiban · October 2004

How many standard trims are offered for the new RL? I read somewhere that Nav is standard which leads me to think that there's only one trim, the fully loaded trim (accessories aside)? Is there one w/o GPS? What's the msrp said on the brochure?

The 91 octane not required is surprising as even TL requires that. Marketing in the works maybe?

varmint · October 2004

One trim. Everything is standard, except the dealer-installed accessories listed above.

I believe that 91 octane is "recommended" for both the RL and TL. It is possible to run either car on lower octane fuel, both with reduced performance.

robertsmx · October 2004

An MSRP of $48,900 sounds high when you consider "base price" for the competing models which is usually around $41K. Case in point, Cadillac STS/V6 has a base MSRP of $40,995.

But, to compare to RL, feature by feature, you would need the Luxury Performance package which puts the price tag at $49,590. At this point, STS and RL will be comparable in features, but STS will not have AWD. AWD typically adds $2K-3K (or $4K if it were the 4MATIC applied to Mercedes S-Class).

But, Acura has opted to go with one trim for all strategy. I would think that they know, buyers in this class typically want their car with stuff, not stripped.

1violinist · October 2004

"But, Acura has opted to go with one trim for all strategy. I would think that they know, buyers in this class typically want their car with stuff, not stripped."

I guess it makes it a lot easier to order: you just choose exterior/interior colors and you're all set to go! :-)

robertsmx · October 2004

I prefer it that way for my own purchases. Packages and options get me lost. It has also made it easier for me to negotiate the price. The problem with one-trim pricing is that it creates a perception of priced high. You will see a fair number of people comparing base models of competing models to RL. So, simply advertising on the premise of a stripped trim but sending only loaded models can also do good from market POV.

igiban · October 2004

This one fully-loaded-trim-only strategy is a sharp contrast to MB/BMW world where the advertised base has no even leather to begin with. Granted Acura used to pretty much have two trims only with GPS in between. I guess Acura thinks too many features of the new RL is tied to the screen and so you got to have it.

Acura might also bet that most people buying this near $50K Acura RL are for its contents, and not for badge. In the case of MB/BMW, that's often the other way around. There're many who would get a base MB/BMW + minimum packages, just to get the badge taken care of. It'd be a disaster for MB or BMW if E or 5 series are sold only fully loaded.

robertsmx · October 2004

I rarely see stripped BMWs and MBs on the other hand. That has to be a reason why 325 handily outsells 330 since people can afford more luxury features that way than otherwise. In case of 5-series, 525 and 530 split about evenly.

That said, it could have been possible for Acura to offer NAV as a part a package. With a base of about $46K, I'm not sure though, how much difference $3K would make in this price class. In a $20K or less price class, that could count as substantial money, but not in this class.

legendman · October 2004

>That said, it could have been possible for Acura to offer NAV as a part a package. With a base of about $46K, I'm not sure though, how much difference $3K would make in this price class.<

Right. And the main thing is it wouldn't make sense for Acura to produce two versions of the car with only the inclusion of a NAV system making the difference. Firstly, as others have noted, most people want the car loaded with all the latest amentities.

Secondly, there is the question of carrying dual SKUs; in other words, a parallel inventory. The cost to make them and keep the inventory up for both is simply not economical for the manufacturer; nor does it help the dealer who has cars on the lot that some people won't buy only because one option is missing. It's easier to stock one model and deal on price.

I think that this is one of the reasons that Honda and Acura have always offered a relatively limited range of color choices. The resultant cost savings is presumably what enables Acura to load the car with features at a reasonable price. More cars that are ready to sell, as opposed to cars that "are coming", means fewer lost sales.

Personally, this topic of accessories and options is something that always put me off BMW and MB.

monet5 · October 2004

aclc - Sorry. Can't help with the wheel locks. I've never owned those before.

ml500 · October 2004

I have been reading the various posts about the new RL's price. I am currently driving an MB ML500 and am considering a new car - the RL is one option. It looks like a nice car but I feel that the price is a bit high - maybe not for the car itself but rather for the car to compete with the other vehicles in this segment of luxury vehicles. I am in Canada and the MSRP here is $69,500.00 which is around the MB E320 or the BMW 5 series price range. The issue that no one has addressed here is that most people at this price range LEASE their vehicles. Acura has relatively speaking low residual rates. It is my understanding that the new RL's 36-month residual will be around 52%. When one compares this to MB's residuals (61-62% for a 36-month lease, depending on mileage) and BMW at the same range, the monthly payment on an RL is going to be significantly higher than these two other vehicles. Now, say what you will but driving a car with three pointed star on the hood attracts more attention than any Acura (and I have driven both). If you are reading this message then you care about what you drive as much as I do. I personally like the way the MB vehicles drive but that is a matter of personal preference. I will not prejudge the RL and I am waiting to test drive one. Having said that, the RL will have to be SIGNIFICANTLY better than the MB or BMW for me to pay a much higher monthly payment for it.

shotgun · October 2004

Legendman - Thanks for taking the time to do that color analysis/impression for me. The colors have me perplexed but your feedback helped a lot. I'm handicapped when it comes to colors since I'm #1 on an out-of-town dealers list to get an 05 RL (The local dealer pissed me off and I prefer not to do business with him) and I'll have to make a decision quickly to get my choice of colors without the benefit of actually seeing the real thing beforehand...

ceric · October 2004

Ceric - I'm getting conflicting reports on what the "Lakeshore Silver" looks like. Some say it's greenish silver, other claim it's blueish, yet others point to pictures where it looks medium blue almost like denim.

This Meteor silver has a tint of green and blue in it. It depends on your eyes and the lighting. Honda has this color in many models, Odyssey, Pilot. My BMW has a very similar color (which BMW called Glacier green in 1998). It remains to be seen whether the one offered by Acura is really more blue-ish. You have to see it in person to decide.

On another front, all backview cameras come with color -coded lines to indicate how close you are to objects. They work better than ultrasound sensors. I have ultrasound sensors in my Odyssey. It only works when objects are within 5ft or less. You must move slowly for it to response (with beeps).

There is a picture in the brochure illustrating the structure of RL. There are two large cross members behind the rear seats. That would explain why there isn't a fold-down rear seat. They must be key parts of structure integrity.

BTW, the 18" wheel looks very nice (standard is 17" with 5 spokes). It has 10 spokes but every pair of spokes are formed together so it looks like 5-spokes. This is very much like the M3 wheel of BMW. Those accessories are going to add up very quickly to the MSRP price.

5-10 years ago, no one would dare to mention Lexus together with BMW and MB. Now people are saying Acura can't be in the same league as MB, BMW, and LEXUS. Don't be fooled by the logo. German cars are really behind in electronics. Cost-cutting forces them to use lower-level parts (plastic radiator, anyone?) to compete with the Japanese and the rising domestic name-brands like Cadillac. The trend is getting worse not better. Just look at the sales numbers of Lexus, Acura versus BMW and MB. Look at Acura's advancement in electronics. Not even Lexus can compete with that. Let's see if Lexus can offer the same level of contents in their new GS.

robertsmx · October 2004

"Intereactive Showroom" on RL at Acura's website is worth a look (but only if you have DSL/Broadband).

kenw1 · October 2004

Thanks saedave. I have looked at the Subaru Outback, but the interior does not have any wood trim (and my wife wants wood trim).

legendman · October 2004

Side impact crash testing was in the news today. Does any one have any data on the 2005 RL? If not, when will that come out?

What do we know about the crash tests for the 2004 RL model year?

How do Acura's typically fare?

nebraskaguy · October 2004

>>What do we know about the crash tests for the 2004 RL model year?

From an AP article this morning:

Both the 2005 Mitsubishi Galant and the 2004 Saab 9-3 earned the institute's highest rating, along with the 2004 Lexus ES 330 and the 2004 Acura TL.

I would expect the RL to be at least as good as the TL.

ceric · October 2004

RL, being the first Acura vehicle to employ ACE, should do very well in crash test. On top of that RL use extensively the high tensile steel (80 grade) in vital structure.

However, the standard crash test does not show the full strength of ACE. ACE is specially designed when RL is in a head-on crash with a even larger vehicle like the Hummer. Crash tests against a fixed wall (full frontal or offset) only demonstrate the result of crashing against a vehicle of equal weight and size. A small vehicle has an excellent rating probably still won't do very well in real world.

acuraphile · October 2004

Is remote start available as an option, or might it interfere somehow with the keyless process?
Would appreciate knowing.
Thanks.

maxhonda99 · October 2004

acuraphile,

I do not believe a remote start option is available from the factory or even made by Honda/Acura as a dealer installed option/accessory.

autophile · October 2004

I, like ceric, am a BMW owner ('97 528i and '01 525iT) who will not buy another. I haven't had unreliable vehicles, but am very unhappy with the styling direction and iDrive technology. I frankly like the styling of the new RL--if it were better looking the demand would be even greater and the selling price higher. By spring, when the new Lexus GS comes out in 4WD you should be able to get a discounted RL, but the Lexus will be in very short supply (it is a really good looking car). So here's to bland styling!

dogface5 · October 2004

Styling has never been Honda's forte (except for current gen TL), but hopefully other aspects of the car (RL) make up for that deficit. As for the GS, I think its design is a bold step for Lexus and may be representative of their future styling direction. Looks are subjective, but I believe that Infiniti's new M is the best looker of the bunch (RL, M, GS).

1violinist · October 2004

I'm not too excited about the GS new design, especially the "hatchback" look rear end! ;-)

As for the M, the exterior is ok but the interior is not appealing IMO. I think the RL is on top, with its streamlined style and considering all the features within the price range.

mg808 · October 2004

I sold my BMW (Best car I owned) but with more visits to the dealer than the dentist got me back into car buying mode. From a price point, the RL is perfect. All the new 2005 AWD sedan models are up to $5K more. I built a M35 AWD on Infinti's site and its $55K, loaded. Nicely equipped A6 is $52K, GS will be $50K+ easily. I think the RL is best car for the money. On another note, My last visit to the BMW dealer, the salesman was really pushing a loaded 2004 525i for $49,990 MSRP. I told him, I can't have 184HP in a sedan that can't beat a Toyota Prius off the line. He told me its a BMW, nuff said.

rroyce10 · October 2004

..**I rarely see stripped BMWs and MBs on the other hand.** ..

              You won't see many base MB's rolling around, but you will see bunches of base Bimmers if your looking close ... lots of people will purchase a strippy "3" series or order a "5" to get the BMW logo, thats just ego .. the problem is trying to unload those dudes at trade time and on the retail market they are colder than a January day in Minnesota ..

             It's a good idea to keep the nav systems as a single option, only 30% of the buyers "really" have a need for them after the first 2/3 months, and the resale on Nav systems is only around $500ish at trade time ... what price glory.?

                         Terry.

maxhonda99 · October 2004

A Lexus GS for $50K+?

A current GS300 with NAV, HIDs, mark levinson is only about $46K. I doubt a loaded GS300 for '06 will go far beyond $50K.

nebraskaguy · October 2004

>> It's a good idea to keep the nav systems as a single option, only 30% of the buyers "really" have a need for them after the first 2/3 months, and the resale on Nav systems is only around $500ish at trade time ... what price glory.?

I suspect that may change, however. Every friend who's ever ridden in my RL with Navi has said they won't buy another car without it. I only truly need mine about once or twice a month, but when I need it, I REALLY need it!

markcincinnati · October 2004

. . .virtues.

Two "options" that are MUST haves are Sat Nav and "rear" parking assistance radar, sonar or whatever makes them work.

My Audi proclivity is well known to anyone who has been participating in edmunds for any length of time. And, many folks know that with the exception of the A8, Audis have had navigation for years and it has been dubbed here in the US "nav lite" because it has arrows and voice prompts but no full color, high-zoot, Acura - like moving map.

I use the nav system every week, the park sensors EVERY day and they both are important systems that I cannot imagine being without.

It is my opinion, supported somewhat by my "Audi Sales Rep Buddies" that sat nav sells cars, new or used -- and although TODAY accurate ($500+ trade in value) -- sat nav is becoming "the" must have feature on even the least expensive cars (which means for Audi ~$30K) and a requested feature on CPO'd models.

My guess, clearing up daily, is that Sat Radio is becoming a very desirable feature too. Now, apparently, On*star (but Acura may change this) not so much so, but even that -- telematics -- is growing (slowly) in popularity.

This Acura is perhaps only a little bit ahead of its time -- as it does seem to contain all, or most of, the "virtues" that were once "vices. . . ."

robertsmx · October 2004

Im not sure about M. Infiniti seems to have discovered that G35 succeeded and was praised for its styling (in coupe form). As a result, now every Infiniti must carry the look. This can make things boring, and confusing. It is good to carry a family resemblance, but making cars look identical across the range is not a good idea, IMO. For that reason, I have issues with Mercedes styling approach to C-Class thru S-Class. There is not much else besides size differentiation. In case of BMW and Acura, there is family resemblance, but the styling elements are different.

The Lexus GS will probably look different on the road than most cars and to many that can be a good thing. Except for the bloated appearance (same issues and lines as Nissan Maxima), I actually like it.

But as an overall package, with pretty good (subtle) styling to boot, RL wins it so far. It would be nice to be able to negotiate on the price someday (near invoice, which may be about $44,500).

robertsmx · October 2004

Luxury cars arent about needs, they are about wants. Im not sure if $2K premium on a $47K sedan holds any meaning. So, it doesnt hurt to have the luxury of Navigation system since you can. And Acuras system is very nice, probably the best around.

I would love to own an RL (I have never leased a car), but as of now, TSX and TL are on top of my list. In any case, I will be getting navigation system.

robertsmx · October 2004

I have built Lexus GS300 with stuff here at Edmunds, and it topped out at $47K. AWD may add another $2K-3K to the price, so that could put it in the vicinity of $50K, comparably equipped to the RL. This assumes no price increase or decrease from 2005 model.

ceric · October 2004

And, you'll get a 245hp 3.0L V6 for that kind of money. I am sure it would be weighing about at least 3800lb with AWD added. It will run in about 7.5 to 8.0 sec 0-60. Any Honda Accord V6 can beat it easily.

In my point of view, a luxury sports sedan needs to have respectable performance (not necessarily the fastest, but respectable). On top of that, you add luxury for enjoyment and comfort. An enduring look to your eyes is essential since every time you take a glance at it, it reminds you of the amount of money you spent on it, 50 large.

legendman · October 2004

>It would be nice to be able to negotiate on the price someday (near invoice, which may be about $44,500)<

Would you or anyone care to hazard a guess as to when that will be?

Also, is it reasonable to assume that if the 2005 RL becomes 'Motor Trend Car of the Year' that RL's price will hold up even longer?

robertsmx · October 2004

Something different brewing for the European market? Click here to see a picture. The Autoexpress preview makes no mention of IMA, but under the hood IMA shows up (everything else about the shroud is identical to the RL).

It couldnt be Accord Hybrid, because under the hood the look is quite different.

robertsmx · October 2004

Definitely sometime in the future. From what I have read, Acura is targeting sales of 1000 units/month for first six months, and bump it up to 1500 units/month over the following six.

Demand and supply will dictate the negotiation aspects, as it would in any car. The RL looks like a good value at MSRP. Anything off it, will make it unbeatable.

ksoman · October 2004

no car is good at msrp. period.

Saturn is not the unique pricing structure in the world. There are several countries where you don't have to haggle over price. They quote a price, that just doesn't change dealer to dealer. What draws people to one dealer against another is the people & quality of service. Of course, most other countries have densely packed urban populations unlike the US suburban population.... anyway, my point is, given the pricing structure of cars in the US, no car is worthy of its MSRP in the long run. If cars like the TL & MDX have kept themselves at MSRP for considerable time, its just short term good luck for the dealers.

my 2 cents
ksso

low_ball_88 · October 2004

ditto ksso,

I will never buy a vehicle at MSRP! Even though the car is a good value at that price. I can't wait to test drive it and see whether it will be better than the competition (A6, 530i, E320) before I buy.

Acura RL

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