Pontiac Bonneville

benjohnson · February 2002

Matt..email me..ben_johnson_sr@yahoo.com

Got the PCM back......W O W!!!!

ezrapon · February 2002

Tell us more about the PCM. Do you have any other mods? Are the mushy shifts any stronger? Was it easy to instal and did you have to have it flashed by a dealer?

streetracer · February 2002

The Pontiac Brand Manager said at the Chicago Auto show, that GX/P might go into production for 2003 as a limited edition!

benjohnson · February 2002

The PCM is an EZ swap, but, the cranshaft positon sensor M U S T be set by a tech 2 before you drive it hard. The engine is going to ping like you won't believe. Just as an example, I pushed mine somewhat and thought I had blown the engine..What I really did was blow out 3 spark plugs, porcelain and tip. Amazingly the engine performed almost like it should.

I was fortunate enough to buy a new PCM and have it modified, thus having the original in case of a warranty problem, trade in etc.

I also have a bored throttle body, recalibrated MAF, fuel pressure riser, K&N filter..fun car!!

Ben

benjohnson · February 2002

I've been fighting a wind noise problem since I purchased it in Oct 99.. Pontiac replace the channels in the driver and passenger window which quieted down the noise somewhat.

I am still bugging them about this problem, but, worked out a "band-aid" to the problem last night with about $.50 worth of screen door spline.

Interested in knowing how many other people are suffering with this problem.

Thanks

Ben

refiner · February 2002

I didn't have that problem with mine. Its run fine since I got it. Did you get a service engine light when you put it in?
Matt

tpken · February 2002

Woohoo - maybe there's hope for Bonnie!

benjohnson · February 2002

Hey Matt. Yeah. I got the Service Engine light which I expected..If you didn't have the Cranshaft Position sensor set, you should..you may be on borrowed time.
I also had another leftover problem..there was a problem with some crossover pipes in that the inner wall would collapse..When they replaced mine they left the number 6 spark plug wire touching the O2 sensor which had generated a DTC. Didn't know about the wire until we chased the other problems. The wire had melted and the boot was melted to the plug...but the engine kept on goin'!

You having the wind noise problem I mentioned above?

Ben

mfahey1 · February 2002

The Chicago paper today said that the 2003 GTP would be upgraded to 280 hp. Although there was no mention of a similar change to the SSEi, you would have to assume that where one goes, the other follows.
I had mine in yesterday because the "service engine" light had come on. It turned out to be something with the vapor recovery system so it didn't affect driveability.
However, since it was already there, I had them take a look at a whistling sound that the heating system was making after the car warmed up. Since it didn't always do it, I figured that it probably wouldn't happen while they had it. When I picked the car up last night, they said that there is a service bulletin out on it and they have to install some tape or something as a seal. I don't know if this applies to all systems or just the automatic ones but thought I'd let people know that it isn't their imagination if they hear a whistling sound.

ezrapon · February 2002

I've had a GTP for a loaner once or twice. Even though I am a GM man, I could not drive a GP daily. The design is about 10 years old (drawing board inception)and it shows. It feels cheap and is way to small. They could make them 300 hp and it would not get me in one. I wonder with my 3.4 pulley, CAI, and adding a low restriction exhaust; how close to 280 hp I might already be. Does everybody else's SSEi light up the tires for 300 ft when tromped on, or is it my mods that facilitate this adolescent fantasy. When mine was new (pre mods) I was beaten regularly by my brother in law's Lesabre...Not any more! Was it the mods or the engine getting loose? I actually have not done the exhaust yet, I have this fear of spending 500 bucks and having a sound not unlike two modified rice grinders racing... an amplified flatulent sound. My old grand national had a real nice Indy type throaty sound... same basic engine, but can we duplicate the sound?

mfahey1 · February 2002

I'll be interested to find out how GM will be getting the extra 40 hp out of the supercharged engine. It would seem like they either need to feed more air into it via a bigger supercharger or a revised camshaft or get the exhaust out of it easier or some combination of all of them.
It will also be interesting to see if they get there with more torque at basically the same rpm or the same torque at a higher rpm or again, some combination of the two. More lowend torque without better traction seems pretty useless seeing as how we can light em up at will now.

ldevine · February 2002

just getting back into spending more $$ we just had a couple of nice days i got to see some of the snow melt kinda got the fever didnt last long gettin snow blower out in morning refresh 2000 ssei loaded 3.4 pully k&n filter resonator off new ravin mufflers from midas sound ok not to loud inside car and 1" rear sway bar from saner want more i would like to hear my super charger whine i was at grandprixstore.com see they have acouple of them a new monte store not much for us i live in N ont can and have even harder time to get part or info

ezrapon · February 2002

Sound of course is subjective. I have thought about the Midas Ravens and losing the resonator. Some say the resonator adds to a deeper sound. Did you notice any immediate performance gains with the exhaust mods? I am looking for a sound something like a new vette or z/28...pleasant but not too loud or cheesey sounding like the Fast and Furious sound. Fill us in. Did you keep your old exhaust just in case?

ldevine · February 2002

i had res on for a little while i like the sound better with off a little louder but deeper you need to go from the manifold to the cat with the same size pipe midas was going to do it and changed their minds cut the res off and sent me on my way performance gains i dont realy know i was doing mods as soon as i got my car i dont think you will get a super charged 6 to sound like an 8 or a rice burning NOS car i did not keep exhaust i have a GTP buddy he likes the sound he says he can hear me coming but its not to bad he did some slp work but not the cat back maybe this year i havent seen any moose on the road since i put the new mufflers on TIME TO GO WATCH HOCKEY

dboyd3 · February 2002

I have a 2000 Bonneville with leather. The problem is with the passenger seat headrest.

Is there any pillow or addition so that my wife could rest her head without feeling she is staring at the roof? Any links?

The 2002's don't seem so far back as the 2000's.

I bought it used recently and the dealer replaced the alternator and intake manifold (set it was warped) and replaced the coolant tank. Seems fine now but am concerned about potential damage (car has 27,00 miles).

My car has the 3.05 axle ratio but it doesn't seem as fast on take-off as my 95 Bonneville with the same engine but had a taller rear-end.

Car is smooth and the ride is fine.

Any potential problems awaiting me before the warrenty expires?

rltrgar · February 2002

Hi everyone. To dboyd3 on potential problems. I have a 2000 se. Today I stopped at a stop sign and then pulled out into the highway. The Bonneville stopped dead, engine running ok, but the car would not move in any shift position. Had it taken to dealer. Service shop guy says the transmission is shot. All kinds of parts in pan.They ordered a new transmission. The car has 48000 miles. With the spark plug wires going bad at 30000 and this, I doubt if I will look at another Bonneville.

theiceman · February 2002

The good news? It looks like a green light for a 2003 GX/P.
The bad news? I just read a report that Lutz has axed funding for the development of a next generation Bonneville. The Bonneville is guilty of having poor sales and being one of too many large/midsized GM 4 door sedans. The final model year could be 2004.

rltrgar: Sorry to hear about your tranny. Hope GM takes some responsibility. Good luck.

ice

skyhawk3 · February 2002

If the dealer does not go to bat for you with GM, don't hesitate to demand to speak to the Pontiac regional service manager. Don't settle with out a tussel with them. If you have a long history of GM ownership list every GM car new or used that you previously purchased from any GM dealer.

headrest - Brookstone has one that might do. My wife made her own.

mlm4 · February 2002

I have lamented here before about the possible (likely?) demise of the Bonneville when the current life-cycle ends. Even before the infamous Mr. Lutz came on board, GM had made the decision to axe at least a third of it's models. That means ending production of the perennial poor sellers. I think the new Grand Prix will become the new "flagship" for Pontiac and all those potenial Bonneville buyers ("all those": are there that many?) will be pointed to the Cadillac CTS as a substitute in the "large-lux" category.

Bad news for us; fewer choices. Personally, the potential loss of the Bonneville is largely sentimental, since it is a name dating back to the historic 1957 Bonneville, a car which helped Pontiac create it's image as the "excitement" division. Although the Bonneville name languished through the '70s and '80s on the C- and G-body land barges, I think the last three Bonnevilles were steps in the right direction. Pontiac never seems to have tried hard enough, however, to shake the image that the Bonneville is no longer a "grandma" car. (Those who don't follow car trends always give me that funny look when they learn I own a Bonneville -- "isn't that an old lady's car?") I know America's love for SUVs has a lot to do with the drought in sedan sales, but I like the Bonneville better than the Grand Prix and don't see myself in a Cadillac, at least not yet. I know GM is trying to change that; we'll have to wait and see.

On the bright side, if the Bonneville does indeed meet it's demise, and if I continue to keep mine in pristine condition, maybe someday it will be considered... a "classic?" Ha. You never know! Maybe 20 years from now I can cruise my SSEi down Michigan's Woodward Avenue and get interviewed on My Classic Car by Dennis Gage. ;-)

rltrgar · February 2002

Thanks for the words iceman and skyhawk3. I bought an extended warranty when I bought the car in March. Cost was around 650.00 The work has been authorized. Also, towing and rental. I average over 4000 miles per month and would not buy anything without the extended warranty. Thanks

smfran · February 2002

My wife also could not stand the headrest in my 2000 SSEi. From a tip on this board we contacted AAA marketplace and purchased the headrest pillow. It works fine but certainly does not add to the "look" of the interior.

smfran · February 2002

I hope you have returned for good and will continue to post.
Regards,
Stephen

mfahey1 · February 2002

Let's hope that the GX/8 doesn't go the way of the 96 SHO. That was when Ford in their infinite wisdom replaced the incredibly sweet 3.0L dohc with a V-8 and got slower. I think part of it is all where the engine makes its power and what kind of gearing the car gets.
I know the V-8 Grand Prix sounds good but lets see what they actually come up with.

xavier64 · February 2002

Ken,

Any chance you will be in the PA area?

As far as the Bonnie goes, people I drive enjoy the Bonnie very much and I feel the Grand Prix is just a tad to small, especially for those in the back. I was considering the Prix but I enjoy the room the Bonnie provides. I just don't think Pontiac understands that they have a winner of a car. With buying a 6yr/60,000 mile extended warrenty, my Monnie will be around hopefully for the next decade. Drive on and have a great day...sxb

evandro · March 2002

About a month ago I thought I had noticed more wind noise on the highway... I classified it as fruit of my imagination, but you mentioned some parts replaced. Can you please give more details about it?

TIA

evandro · March 2002

I noticed that when my SLE's engine is warming up, and I think that even several minutes after reaching normal temperature, it makes a whistling sound that varies according to the engine's RPM. Any clue about what is causing it and if it's just an annoyance and nothing more?

TIA

mfahey1 · March 2002

If the noise varies with engine load, that typically would be a vacuum leak somewhere, presumably inside the passenger compartment. If it varies with engine rpm, it might be a bearing on a rotating component such as an alternator, compressor, etc.
I just had a whistling sound fixed at the dealer but it was from the heating/air conditioning system and was caused by air getting by one of the dampers. Engine load or rpm had no bearing on this noise.

tpken · March 2002

Just got back from a 2000 mile trip in the Bonneville. Sorry I didn't have a chance to see any fellow posters along the way but I wasn't able to get to view this site all week and I didn't end up with time to do anything extra anyway.

I did drive to Wilmington NC on Wed after 2 days near Philly. The plan to golf didn't go well though, and the temps down there were frigid! I think Maine was actually warmer. However the drive was sheer pleasure. Even the 550 miles on Sat in rain was ok with my new Aquatread IIIs. This car just swallows up the miles and mine at 44K miles is running fantastic. BTW - at average speeds of 75 - 80 over the bulk of the trip I averaged 27.5 mpg. The Aquatreads seem to have cut my mileage back about 2 mpg I think.

Back to the grind now - time to play catch-up here at work.

Ken

socleanone · March 2002

How about those Aquatread 3's? I'm running 225/16/60 Aquatread 3's on my 98SLE.I did'nt like the looks of them at first.But thats changed now.I think this are some kick [non-permissible content removed] tires.I ran Aquatread 2's on my 93SE no complants on those type either.No hydroplaneing what so ever. SO CLEAN ONE. L8TR.

tpken · March 2002

Have you noticed any gas mileage difference between the 2's and 3's? How about winter driving? The III tire does have a different tread design feature for improved snow handling.

Ken

fantascp · March 2002

welcome back ken-

update on the 98SSE - i put on over 3000k since jan 19th- now has 60,600K. Routine maintenance done etc- i also had the engine accessory belt replaced and put 2 new BF Goodrich tires up front- car is running real strong- only a little disappointed with the gas mileage- can't seem to get it over 21 MPG- the 2000 SE is still around 24/25 MPG.
Overall- still happy with both cars!!!!

Chuck

socleanone · March 2002

Not sure about any mileage difference.And for winter driving, Well down here in Tennessee we haven't had any snow or ice covered roads since I don't no when.I do remember having snow back when I had my 93SE with the Aquatread2's.The stopping ability was great.You know that Goodyear is only makeing the Aquatread2's in run flat style only now.One hell of a price tag to.Plus you will need to install a air pressure censor kit for each wheel so you'll know if your running on run flat flat tires or not.I think a Aquatread2's still look better than the 3's .SO CLEAN ONE L8TR.

tpken · March 2002

I also average about 24/25 overall driving in my 2000 SE. Seems like my highway component has dropped a bit but not the local.

Ken

refiner · March 2002

Just got back from the Cleveland auto show. They had te G/XP there. Its nice I loved the color. But I think I can do without the carbon fiber on the interior. The 19 in. wheels look nice. It also had Baer brake calipers on the front. Wish I could get them for mine. The dual chrome exhaust tips are great. One of the people working the show thinks its going to go for 40k. Which I think is too expensive.
Matt

ezrapon · March 2002

Had the ssei in for a sinking moon roof. It is developing a 1/2 gap in the back when closed. Funny thing is, they gave me a 2002 ssei (an exact twin to mine) for a loaner. it had a full one inch gap in its sun roof. The only difference I noticed were the seat heater and traction control switches were on the dash, the cup holders were uglier, the wheels were a bit dull, and it was very slow compared to mine. I tried to get the new Caddy for a loaner, but Pontiac owners don't get Caddies for loaners. It looked neat, but all things being equal, the ssei is a better all around car. A testament to the mods I've completed... there is a gentle swell in the road on the way to a country park I take my kids to. From the stop sign before the swell I floor it and the car lifts up and our stomachs go through our throats... the kids love it as much as I do. Yesterday I floored it, hit the swell, the engine raced up, the tach pegged, the traction control light came on. The car actually left the ground. It made a sound like a 747 landing when I landed. Probably airborne for about a full second...! Call me Bullet.

tpken · March 2002

parachutes in that thing!!!

pat · March 2002

Edmunds.com takes the 2002 Bonneville SE for a spin around town. Read the article by following the link in the Helpful Links box on the left sidebar of this page.

Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board

mlm4 · March 2002

A mixed review, I would say. But then again, most cars seem to get mixed reviews these days, with a few that are extraordinarily good or poor. Bonneville not among the outliers.

Eighty-five switches and levers? I will have to count for myself, but I don't know where that number came from. Off the top of my head I don't think there are more than 50, even with the sunroof and headed seat switches (even that is a lot), but 85?

tpken · March 2002

"It looks like what a kid would sketch if you asked him to draw a car"

It doesn't appear that Edmunds was intending that as a compliment to Pontiac's styling - but I know my kids and a lot of their friends are very impressed with the styling of Bonneville.

As to the salesman connection - has anyone here seen a Bonneville used as a company car for a sales force?? I sure haven't. All the company cars I see are Tauri, Intrepids and Malibus (or Impalas now).

I'm glad the Edmunds testers were impressed with the car but it seems like the typical anti-GM bias shows through pretty clearly.

fantascp · March 2002

I have to agree with Michael - definitely a mixed review at best- one minute their praising the power of the V6- (SPINNING WHEELS ETC) and then knocking the car on interior design and handling etc. -

I also don't see many 2000-to 2002 Bonnevilles on the road PERIOD.- no matter what model SE,SLE, or SSEI. I can sometimes go the entire work week without seeing a single 2000 to 2002 Bonneville!!!Where are all of these so called FLEET SALES vehicles being seen????

On a different note- whats up with all the engine problems re- TOYOTA- ENGINE SLUDGE- very hot topic right now!!

Chuck

tpken · March 2002

Chuck - I see quite a few rental units around - always an SE model. And I do typically see several new gen Bonnevilles every week around here - funny, it seems like they travel in packs - usually see one - then another.

Had a great ride to and from work today in my carpool buddy's (almost) new 2001 Saab 9.5 that he bought last week. He paid $22K for a car that listed new 6 months and 8K miles ago for $36K. What a fantastic car!!!! I had looked at them but never rode in one before - amazingly smooth and responsive, quiet and the most comfortable seats I've ever sat in. Both front and rear seats are heated, upholstered in very nice leather with power adjustments on both buckets. I was VERY impressed. Anyone else ever check one of these out??

Ken

ab348 · March 2002

How did he get it so cheap? Do they typically take that kind of big depreciation hit?

fantascp · March 2002

They MUST be all up by you then!!!(LOL)- case in point-I just went this entire work week without seeing ONE OTHER 2000 to 2002 Bonneville
anywhere from Morning rush hour 6:30 am to 8:30am and from 4:30pm to 6:30 PM,-evening rush.
and this is traveling along major highways here - Interstate 80,280,287.

I'm also curious with regards to your friends 9.5 SAAB- a $14,000 drop in 6 months- that is a BIG depreciation over a very short period of time - is that the norm for those vehicles? or did your friend get a fantastic price on the car when he purchased it.

Chuck

mfahey1 · March 2002

Some kids have all the luck. I think my dad thought that he'd get a nose bleed if he went over 65. Then again, it would have been pretty tough to get a full size station wagon with a very small V-8 airborne unless it was driven over a cliff.

tpken · March 2002

ab348 and Chuck - We have a local used car superstore in my area where my buddy picked up his Saab 9.5 base model. It seems to be an incredible deal and from what I've seen from some checking around it is a price approximately equal to what the dealer might have paid at the auction for that car. I wondered of it had perhaps been a theft recovery or something like that but he says the title is good per CARFAX and it was titled to the state of Maine - go figure.

Does sound like extraordinary depreciation for that car but I know my Bonneville took a $10K hit before I bought it under similar circumstances - 6 months old and with 18K miles over a year ago now. Just goes to show - buying new is VERY expensive and the used market today has some spectacular bargains if you look around for a while.

Ken

pturner1 · March 2002

I always park away from population when I stop in for a cocktail at the Hadley, Ma Mall. When I came out, to my surprise, a 2000+ silver Bonneville SE had backed into the space next to me and next to it was a 2000+ Grand Prix. It's been a while, but every now and then....
Rick
2000 SSEi 55500 miles
Dark Blue Matallic

xavier64 · March 2002

Just read the spin around town article. In it they state that they think there are too many buttons and don't like the red gauges. In my opinion, I think the red gauges are great especially glowing at night and having all the different gauges sure beats one filled with "idiot" lights. To people who see the car for the first time, they like the design of the Bonnie. To each, their own I suppose.

The article does point out the good ride and seat comfort and I would think this is what most people are looking for.

Drive safe and let's hope for an early spring...sxb

scraj · March 2002

All, Checking into the board after a gap of 2 years. I bought this car in 1996 with around 6000 miles. Some shark demo... made for someone in san jose sharks team to drive around for a few months for advertisement i guess. It is of the TEAL color.. Sparkling green with little shade of purple. (The same color as the bonny tested by EDMUNDS in 1996). Guess Mr. Wardlaw did not like(hated) this color.. but, me and my wife love this.

And, the car has been going on and on and on for 75000 miles now. Still runs great. Had a problem with some vacum leak around 35000 miles. Was fixed. Changed tires and brakes at 60000 miles. As of today everything works fine. The 3.8L supercharged V6 is an abundance joy to drive. You have power whenever you need it. No disappointment any time. Highway mileage around 26 to 29. City is around 22. The compressor for the tire inflator and beach craft inflator died at around 55000 miles. Used it way too much i guess. Atleast once a week.

Other than the vacum leak and the compressor dieing, the vehicle still runs great. Really love it.

mfahey1 · March 2002

Your experience with your 96 mirrors what I had with my 96. Even though I didn't have the supercharger (on that one at least), I had no problems with that car in 70,000 miles. In fact, I literally didn't spend a dime on it for repairs, just routine maintenance like oil changes and wiper blades.

scottnsc1 · March 2002

My 2001 Bonneville SE has been a real joy so far. My heart still longs for an Envoy, but I know it wouldn't be as much fun to drive.

During my recent 15K mile service they put it up on the rack to rotate the tires. When I got back to work I noticed that the front passenger side fender had 'seperated' from the car with about a one inch gap. After recovering from my heart attack I took it back in. They said the service tech didn't lift the car from the correct place on the frame and that had placed stress on the body panels forcing it to seperate from the car. It's fixed now and looks as good as new, but that will be the last time that dealership touches my car.

They also continue to 'torque' my wheels off which ruins the black plastic lug-nut covers. I'm riding around with 3 of them missing until I get a chance to get them replaced. (This is the second time.)

I was a little disappointed with the Edmunds article, but not surprised. American cars just simply do not get enough respect by auto journalists. They save their praises for the Germans and Japanese.

Pontiac Bonneville

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