BMW 3-Series 2005 and earlier

1pierce · August 2002

I just priced up my 325i with the 2003 pricing for comparison sake. It looks like my car, equipped with the same packages and options would be about $450 more in the '03 model. I had a hard time reading and printing the file, so I am not sure I got the base price right ($27,600?) I have 325i, elec red, leatherette, PP, Xenon, HK, and Step.

The '03 car would have, in addition to mine: rain sensor wipers, auto headlights, head unit w/aux input, and third rear headrest and seatbelt (this is something that should have been standard a long time ago - the seatbelt, I mean).

Is all that worth $450 to me? Hard call. I actually wouldn't mind the rain sensing wipers and the third rear seatbelt, but the rest, I won't miss. So, I'd say I'm glad to have the '02 model (well, to be WAITING FOR THE '02 MODEL!!!), and have the $450 in my pocket.

nyccarguy · August 2002

Damn, you've been waiting for a long time man. Some people have done ED and have their cars quicker than you:) J/K

mschukar · August 2002

The '02 does have a center seatbelt, but no shoulder strap. In my case it works out better since that's where I have the car seat for my 2 year old. The center headrest gets in the way of the car seat on our Volvo.

Regarding the $450, I'm sure the '03 would be worth at least $450 more if you sold it in 6 months, but this shouldn't matter if you plan on keeping the car for 10 years. Resale value definately should be considered when comparing end of model year vs. new model year.

-murray

1pierce · August 2002

First let me say: I like station wagons. We had a Subaru Forester (which is a wagon, not an SUV, don't let them kid you), and we liked it alot. I could easily see us having a Volvo or Audi wagon or an Outback. But, let me explain my "opinion" of wagons, and why I made the comment I did.

1. Wagons are great for hauling people (but inferior to a minivan, by far).

2. Wagons are great for hauling cargo (but inferior to most mid or full size SUV's, by far, due to lower roofs and generally less torquey engines).

3. Wagons make an excellent compromise if you can't stand either of the above, or want a performance-oriented driving experience while your kids and cargo tag along for the ride.

But...

1. IMHO, wagons are NEVER cool, sporty, or luxurious. To me they will always have the stigma they had when I was growing up in the 1970's. They look like utility cars, even if they drive like a BMW. You'll never catch Porsche or Bentley selling one (although I can't explain the new Porsche SUV? Dumber than an X5?) And, wagons rarely look as attractive (subjective, I know) as a sedan. Then again, sedans rarely look as attractive as coupes (except the Eldorado/Seville pair - which proves there is an exception to every rule).

2. While I would love to own an A6 quattro wagon as our primary family car, you would have to put a gun to my head to make me drive it as my everyday car.

3. Just like some people think a BMW "should" have SP and manual transmission,...I think a BMW "shouldn't" be a station wagon. I just don't think its in character. And, I think its kind of goofy looking in the 3-series.

4. Opinions change. Give me a few years, and I may mellow on the subject. Afterall, 10 years ago I'd have written this exact same diatribe about a 4-door car. To think, I once thought "why on earth would somebody buy a 4-door 325?". In 1991 (pre-wife and kids), I wouldn't have been caught dead in a 4-door BMW.

1pierce · August 2002

I am leasing, so I don't care too much about resale, unless I decide to buy out my lease.

I forgot that the 4-year maintenance is included now. I may lease for 4-years, and if I do, that would have been nice. Actually, that alone may have made it worth waiting.

nyccarguy: Made my deal on 5-29-02. Still waiting - this my tenth week. Oh, the pain!!!!! Must be the electric red color. There are so few red Bimmers on the road these days, I think they forgot where they store the paint.

nyccarguy · August 2002

Actually, Free maintenance is only included for the first 3 years/36,000 miles of the 4 year/50,000 mile warranty period.

Especially if you're leasing, you might want to cancel the order for your '02 and wait for and '03. You've waited this long... The residual value of an '03 car will be more than an '02 car when your lease is up in 3 years. Higher residual = Lower lease payments:)

brave1heart · August 2002

<<< wagons are NEVER cool, sporty, or luxurious >>>

Last time I drove down to NYC, an A4 Avant wagon passed me going triple-digits. I had fun keeping up with it and if you see that thing carving the sweepers at high speed, you'd be convinced that it is way cool and very sporty. I've been in one and I know firsthand how luxurious it is inside. That said, a wagon is a compromise, but so is a 3-series. The modern German wagons have nothing to do with the 2 1/2 ton Buick wagons from the '70's.

jpierce26 · August 2002

Hello all,

I just placed my order today for the a new 2003 BMW 330XI with SP, CWP, PP, Xeon, and NAV. I can't wait. They say it will take about 8 weeks. (color is gray green, sand interior.)

I went back and forth between 2002 or 2003. I was able to get the car under MSRP using 2002 prices, so I figured if the 2003 prices are higher then I got a better deal than I thought.

I ordered from BMW Gallery in Norwood, MA. Steve the sales guy was great. Took three hours of his time going over everything.

I will keep you posted on the arrival.

Jeff

jcivitello · August 2002

For my '03 330i - Steel Blue(w/nat brown), PP, SP, BX. Euro Del. Got $1700 over Euro Del. Invoice. Really pleased with the deal...been waiting along time for this moment...whats another 4.5 months for the 3K savings!!!
Bay Area
Civ

mg330ci · August 2002

1.- As mentioned before, BMW does NOT recommend tire rotations.
2.- If the service department gave you this advice, well, it should have done it for FREE, as it either fit the normal mantainance or warranty service requirements or abnormal wear and tear criteria.
3.- Sorry to say this, but they got you.
If you guy back to that dealership and go postal, you will have my sympathy and moral approval

mg330ci · August 2002

chewie5 · August 2002

I don't know about you, but I wouldn't mind driving around in a 540iT or Audi RS6 Avant...

1pierce · August 2002

brave: I know it just personal opinion, which, along with two quarters will get you a newspaper, but,...lets just agree to disagree about whether or not wagons are cool or luxurious.

Then again, I don't think SUV's are cool or luxurious, either. They can put all the leather they want in one, and make it handle like the X5, and I still won't be convinced. IMO, if it is made to look like a truck, its a truck. And trucks are for utility, off-roading, and work,...period. I love them for that - I have a pick-up just for that. But, I have never felt "cool" driving it. I feel the same way about the "utility" of wagons. Just not my cup of sport-luxury tea.

Afterall, a man has to have a little bit of absolutism in his life to provide some sense of order. Right?

aldubya · August 2002

Thank you: mg330ci and nyccarguy:
As U suggested, I checked my owner's manual (labeled for 320i, 325i, 325xi, 330i and 330xi). Tire rotation is not recommended because "the tread wear on front and rear tires is different." When I phoned to make my appointment for the 15K oil change, that was when it was suggested that my tires be rotated. When I heard the charge for that was $100, I declined. When I brought the car in, my service rep, who did the write up, never mentioned it. I should file a complaint with my service rep at Erhard BMW in Bloomfield Hills, Michigan and let him know his phone greeter is "cherning!"

ajvdh · August 2002

The "not available in the USA", extremely limited production, and totally psychotic Audi RS4 came *only* as a wagon.

BMW also doesn't have any problem with sporty wagons - the E34 chassis M5 was available in Europe in a "touring" (wagon) configuration. There are a few gray-market examples that have made it over here.

But it does raise the question: Why does BMW only put the 2.5 in the AWD Wagon? That puppy's pretty heavy and could sure use the extra grunt.

brave1heart · August 2002

Our car insurance bill dropped by a whopping 43% (that's FORTY-THREE PERCENT!!) because we moved from Boston proper to the suburbs. Identical coverage, same insurance company, same policy year. Unbelievable! Another good reason to move to the suburbs.

seivwrig · August 2002

BMW builds a 325 AWD wagon for the same reason they build a 520i Touring. Let's realise that the European car market is different than the American car market. We buy high HP 6 or 8 cyl with the concept of more bang for the buck for use in urban centers. Europe on the other hand has high priced gas, same streets, fewer parking spots and fast highways. If we (Americans) were not bbuying their cars, I think BMW would be selling high performance 4 bangers.

I say this in general terms, have we forgot that BMW is a German automaker selling cars for the home market and to make a profit. Europe has ridiculous emission standards, hence 4 cylinder engines in the 1.6, 1.8 and 2.0 L range. Diesel engines and compact cars. You will not see most of these cars in the U.S. based on U.S. car sales pattern. Yes, M-B is selling the C coupe but I just don't see a long term market for it.

The C coupe is over priced but priced low enough for someone to say "I own a Benz" even if it is a stripped down model. The same would be the case if BMW was to sell the compact. The Mini is out, yes it does not have a Roundel, but it is probably a better performer.

Station Wagon!!! AKA as Estates, Tourings, Avants and my personal favorite(Hybrid - Toyota Vibe). The industry is trying to sneak the station wagon back in and call it a Hybrid. SUVs have got a bad rap and Minivan/MPV/People mover looks like it made for soccer moms. The reality is this, the station wagon is safer than the SUV and better handling. Today's station wagons don't look like the giant size Bonneville wagon from the days of yore. People are going to drive what they like. If I had to place my preference in order it would be 1)Minivan, 2) Station Wagon and 3)SUV. I have a truck and don't like driving it. SUVs drive like trucks. Even the X5, though carlike, has that feeling of driving a truck or van.

vkwheels · August 2002

I really like the new Euro-wagons (BMW, Audi, Volvo) & the appealingly quirky Subies. The idea that you can throw your dogs or whatever in there is great. I guess I felt more comfortable in the sedan, coming from a little coupe. I wish I could afford a stable of fun cars. When I win the lotto....a Mini, an Audi wagon, a Z3, a Crown Victoria, an MGB, one of those old Chevy trucks from the 50's painted in apple green, the old Volvo that looks like a little spaceship...it's Friday 5:06, yabadadadoo time ladies & gents.

pat · August 2002

Read this message in the Owners Club photo topic: KarenS "BMW 3-Series Owners: Photo Gallery" Apr 27, 2001 10:40am. That should get you started!

Just remember to only use that technique to post pictures that you own.

Pat
Sedans Host

brave1heart · August 2002

I think the Hybrids you are referring to are more commonly known as tall wagons. Some people think they are the future because they handle reasonably well, offer a lot of storage, and get good fuel economy. To me, they look like mini minivans (Toyota Matrix anyone?) and if I needed the space, I'd rather get a large minivan...Tall wagons just don't look good...

leenelsonmd · August 2002

Well, as I posted above I am still debating this. My original proposition was take delivery of a '03 330 in 11/02 vs an M3 in spring of 2004. Some said to wait others said the M3 wasn't the right choice. Now, I have negotiated an M3 for as early as 4/03. How many would go with the M3 over the 330 given the choice? Financially the M3 is a stretch and the 330 fits about right. I like the handling, price, and cheaper insurance on the 330, but the M3 has always been a car that I dream about--I just think they look good. I have never driven an M3 though. It may be too much, too stiff, too harsh. I do not autocross, but I drive pretty hard when it is safe to do so. I tend to keep cars a long time and so over 8-10 years a $12k price difference is not too bad. I just don't want to get a car that is too flashy and have everyone think I am a spending fool.

Sorry to take up your time, but the board here is my therapy for now. I love to hear what you have to say.

FWIW: I like the 3 and 5 series wagons. I think they are a great way to haul the family around and still have the advantage of a car that handles well. I applaud BMW for offering them and leaving the decision up to us--I am sure that they do little to generate earnings for the company since they probably do not sell enough to recover the development and manufacturing costs, but they help make the product line complete. I do not understand why they offer a 525 wagon instead of a 530 wagon. I would think the 184HP is a little bit underpowered for a 5 wagon.

Try not to laugh--What does LoL mean?

mg330ci · August 2002

Leenelsonmd

I know exactly what you feel.

It took me a lot of courage to finally bite the bullet and ask the same question.

Here is a link you will find useful

http://www.terryneal.com/Abbr.htm

Oh, yes, I forgot: LOL = Laughing Out Loud

seivwrig · August 2002

Dr.Nelson:

You don't have to apologize here. I think some of us have got to be like beer drinking buddies (even though I do not drink). You were considering the 330Ci, right. I believe the Ci will get a face lift in the middle of 2003. I don't know if this will apply to the M3, probably not. Buying a new car kind of sucks, you want a fresh car but the new year might bring along some thing you want. Case in point, I have a 2002 with a CD based NAV, then they bring along a DVD based NAV for 2003. You just can't win. Since you can afford the M3, I say go with the dream. You only live once and have a V1 for some protection. Buy it before your wife changes her mind. I wanted the Ci but my wife killed that dream.

leenelsonmd · August 2002

mg330ci: A very useful link. One of the most useful I have seen lately.

seivwrig: As far as affording the M3 goes, it depends on perspective. I do not know how everyone else deals with this. I do not want to get a car that makes everyone think that I am some kind of financial lunatic. What sortof minimal family income do most people think is necessary to get say a 330? The car is about 43k. A reasonable family income 100k? What about an 57k M3? Some may say a 100k is necessary, others 150k, still others 500k. My wife and I were talking about it and some of the people that she works with make 350-400k and they drive a 1992 Ford Taurus or a 1993 Acura Legend. They view the car as a way to get from point A to B and they don't care. I do not feel that way. I live to drive the car. I love it and every moment behind the wheel of a beautiful car is wonderful. As I have said before it is like intense psychotherapy. For me a car is a very important part of life and spending more for it is worth it to me even though I am not the millionaire next door. I am very curious to see what everyone on the board thinks. Some of you are millionaires while others may be making 30-40k a year and live paycheck to paycheck, but everyone here seems to think BMWs are money well spent.

I will say this, if I end up with either a 330 or an M3, this is pretty much my only indulgence. Otherwise I consider myself extremely frugal--I take my lunch to work, I do not eat out much, I could care less about nice clothes or fine wine. My only vice is the car, and unfortunately this can be a most expensive vice.

soverypoornow · August 2002

Buying any car, particularly a BMW, is usually so much more an emotional decision than a practical one. I'm not saying an M3 is a better decision over the 330. What I am suggesting is that you should follow your dream at all times as long as it doesn't put you in divorce or bankruptcy court.

Personally, I wouldn't want an M3. But I'm just a sissy-la-la.

brave1heart · August 2002

I personally like the E36 M3 better than the E46 M3. The E46 is too big and too heavy for a sports car of that caliber, IMO. The E36 is probably a better track car anyway. There is also the question of practicality: for street driving, I've never felt like I've lacked power with my 325, let alone a 330. I've run against cars much much more powerful (a few AMG's come to mind immediately) and I typically come out ahead. It's about driving skills and guts (stupidity if you prefer) more than HP. You max out on speed way too fast, why get a faster car in a country that has ridiculously low speed limits and very harsh punishment for excessive speeding?!? The other thing about the E46 M3 is that if I were to get up to that price range, I'd definitely cough up a few grand extra and get a 911. Or even a loaded Boxster... Ive driven the E36 M3 on a few occasions. I've only had rides in an E46 M3 and for feel alone, the E36 wins hands down. You just can't take a Miata, blow it up in size and expect that it will feel the same, you know what I mean? But if an M3 is a dream of yours, by all means, do get one. I could care less what anyone else thinks, as long as the car makes me happy. As far as income, 100 grand in TX buys you a lot more than 100 grand in San Fran, Boston or New York. Whats more important is disposable income and spending preferences. It sounds like you can afford an M3 - don't let the money stop you if you can afford it. You only live once. Live well!

seivwrig · August 2002

You make excellent points. Right now, the most important things to me are God, my Family and getting a home. I enjoy my car but I would not let a car put me in the poor house. I am far from rich but my family income is above the national norm. I don't know if I would buy a car above $50K. Dream cars are nice but family and quality of life is better. Your very wise and I think you would make the right decisions. I think a nice cars should be earned like a reward. People drive cars according to taste. When I started shopping for a car, I started looking at the VW Passat GLX V6. Then I started looking at other cars in the high $20K range. The realism was that there are many good cars in the midsize sedan and near luxury models. I think there are a copy cars under $30K that can provide driving therapy. But one should live within their means. I enjoy drive my cars but I hate washing any car. On the same token, I don't feel that any detailer will do as good a job as myself. As far as happiness goes, only you can bring that to yourself not a material item. Brave make a very good point at the end of his last post. If I lived in NYC or San Fran, I would probably be driving a Geo Metro. $100K definitely goes a long way in TX. This might be part of the reason why so many people drive vehicles in the $25K to $35K range. A big medical center and a little oil does help too.

merckx · August 2002

I do respect them a lot,and would love to get my hands on one for the afternoon,but so much of the car's value has gone into suspension,engine,and brakes! And that's fine,but as much as I love cars,sheer performance has never interested me much-I'd much rather get a 5 series,or even consider the huge stretch to a 745i.
No one would look upon a M3 purchase as foolish,though.
But even though I'm a pretty sober guy,I'd really be concerned about my license with a M3.
They are pretty sharp,though...

hgeyer · August 2002

About 2 months ago, I posted a question on how and where I could get a Euro plate holder for my 2002 E46 330i. I didn't think that this would be too hard, but after 2 wrong part numbers from Bavarian and 2 months later, I called BMW NA. To my surprise, they couldn't find the part either (it's obviously not a standard US part).

Well, after (i) my calling the Euro delivery center and (ii) BMW NA making several inquiries, I can report that there is a part number for this holder (51-11-7-030-592) for anyone thinking of putting this on their car. The cost at Bavarian was $13.50.

Part of the reason that this part is so difficult to find is that its description in the computer is "*BASE", which makes it nearly impossible to find in a query.

The part looks really cool, and for anyone doing Euro delivery, I would suggest that you snap off the plate holder (it's really simple) at Harms when turning in the car to bring it back with you.

ptrm · August 2002

I am experiencing what seems like premature wear on the gray leather seats in my 2002 wagon. It is equipped with the sports package and has the sports seats - high bolsters- on each side of the seats.

Despite trying to be very careful when I enter and exit the car, the seat bolster on the driver's side is showing what I consider premature wear. The color is wearing off and some of the creases that have formed also show premature wear.

I have owned the car since new (10,545 miles and 9 months now) and have taken very good care of the car. I wash and vacuum the car 2 or three times a week and have been faithfully cleaning and conditioning the leather seats.

Does anyone have any similar problems with their seats?

At this time, I hope to have BMW replace the driver's seat and then I want to cover them with a top quality sheepskin cover.

What brands of sheepskin seat covers are the best?

Ptrm.

butmywife · August 2002

My 3er was scratched (keyed?) this weekend. It is about 18" long on the left, rear panel. I took it in to see what could be done and got two suggestions:

1. Have the rear panel repainted including the strip that connects with the roof.

2. Air brush (or some such method) a thin coat of touch-up paint directly into the scratch marks.

Anybody had either of these procedures done?

On a more positive note, congrats to JPIERCE26 and JCIVITELLO for their recent orders. jpierce26, you'll love the greygreen. I got mine with black interior. jcivitello, when do you leave for Munich?

Thanks, ButMyWife

kdshapiro · August 2002

A bus that cut me off added insult to injury as it threw up a rock into my windshield leaving a small circular mark some few milliments in diameter.

Do I get it repaired and what type of repair? Leave it? Is it going to get worse? Is BMW going charge me for it at the end of my lease?

bmw323is · August 2002

hgeyer - the euro plate looks nice. Are you worried about someone stealing it? Do you park outdoors or in parking lots?

ptrm - I've had my leather sport seats for 2 1/2 years with only minor wear on the bottom left drivers bolster. I just did my first cleaning of the seat with Lexol cleaner this weekend. I've treated the seats several times with Lexol conditioner. My seats are Sand not Gray. I've read that others have experienced more color wear with the gray compared to sand or black. But 9 months sounds awful fast to show wear. I know people buy seat covers and pay a lot for fine sheepskin, but then why dish out $1,450 for leather?

butmywife - sorry about the keying. My friends' BMW had the same fate in a Home Depot parking lot. My advice is to get it repainted at a body shop. You wouldn't want to spend money and still be able to see the scratch. Hopefully your comprehensive deductible is not too high.

kdshapiro - After 2 winters on the freeways of Denver I have several nicks and chips in my windshield. One was pretty deep so I had it repaired at a glass shop (insurance paid for full cost of $50 or so). I'm living with the others and they have not expanded. If you have a star chip where the glass is cracking, get it repaired quickly before the crack gets bigger or you'll be faced with a complete replacement and the full deductible cost.

huntzinger · August 2002

...[small engines in Europe] You will not see most of these cars in the U.S. based on U.S. car sales pattern.

Agreed. The problem is that US Marketplace is "big enough", once they've brought the product to market in Europe, but more often than not, the real question is if they want to affect their US product image by offering the product, because it usually is slightly less expensive.

The marketplace question is how much of a market there is. How many hatchbacks are there, let alone German ones, let alone "sport/lux" ones that we would define as being above a VW GTI?

The answer is that 10 years ago, the only car in this niche was the Audi Coupe GT. 5 years ago, it was the BMW 318ti. Today, its the C230K.

Yes, M-B is selling the C coupe but I just don't see a long term market for it. The C coupe is over priced but priced low enough for someone to say "I own a Benz" even if it is a stripped down model. The same would be the case if BMW was to sell the compact.

As a C-Coupe owner, I have to agree and disagree.

First, I'm sure that there's just as many "I own a Benz" buyers as there are "I own a BMW" buyers, (even without the E46 Compact) so this is really a non-starter.

Next, the C coupe is "overpriced" in the same way as the 3-Series is: the basic sticker's okay, but you can cream yourself when adding options. Determining "value" is always a problem when there's really nothing to compare it to, unless you want to compare it to the $45,000 BMW M Coupe. If we want to talk about "poor" values, I'd sayd this is one of them.

FWIW, the C230K's price is IMO in line with dealership MSRP prices I saw on Audi A3's and S3's in Switzerland this summer. Its also at around the same price point below the current 3er that the 318ti was below in its day. My final drive-away price was roughly about what I could have gotten a 3er on ED.

I do agree that the market in the USA for a higher-end hatchback is a relatively small one. But small does not equal zero, and as a lover of hatchbacks, I've found the "pickings" to be very slim over the years. Perhaps it will pick up as we get away from SUV's and if gas becomes more expensive.

Today, the MB C230K is the only player right now. I really would have liked to have been able to consider a E46 Compact, or an Audi S3, but neither BMW nor Audi bring over any of their small hatches. Of course, knowing BMW, they would have not offered a 330i Compact, just as they didn't offer the TI with the 325 motor of the day.

The Mini is out, yes it does not have a Roundel, but it is probably a better performer.

Performance is only half the question. If that's all I was looking for, I'd get a Z3. The key requisite for a hatchback is its flexibility in utility. I hauled scuba gear in mine this weekend; didn't have to drop the rear seats, but I suspect that it probably wouldn't have fit in a Z3 at all. The guy I was diving with has a Miata, and he had his tanks buckled into his passenger seat :-).

-hh

dl7265 · August 2002

Ive yet to see a Sport seat with out a little wear on those large side bolsters. I have some ony Grey leather thats 3 years old. I take care entering and exiting. I dont think BMW is gonna be doing anything about it. I saw a Sand car at car max that looked 10 years old....

AWD TIRES: posted on the A4 board about how critical it is to have even matched tires on a AWD as not to wear out the system prematuraly Quoted from Road and track Mag , now the 3er uses a different system than the Audi, so that means no rotation is appropriate ??

DL

ccotenj · August 2002

yup, the bolsters wear... they are leather, not iron...

-Chris

jcivitello · August 2002

Aaaaagh! Sucks about your car getting keyed...such a pointless act of vandalism...never understood that! So to answer your ED question...I leave Nov. 27 and pick it up the 29, then visiting my dad (who lives an hour South of Bremen)until Monday, flying out that nite. A quick trip, yet well worth it!

tcn2k · August 2002

I used wheel wax on my vehicle this weekend. This product works great. It was recommended by bimmer toys, buy it direct, it is cheaper plus they give you the applicator pad.

mg330ci · August 2002

Usually, your insurance company will repair it for free (otherwise a $26 cost). Sometimes it works, sometime it doesn't, depends on the length.

vkwheels · August 2002

Do you need it? no Do you want it? yes.
But you haven't driven the m3 yet, all this lusting-after might be premature. A loaded 330Ci--very very nice indeed, and if it's no stretch to your budget all the better. Heck you might decide to buy a new house, or go on an expensive trip, or buy something else and you will have a nice feeling like you can. It's like wearing too short of a mini-skirt--if you find yourself pulling the hem down all the time, it might not be smartest purchase even though it's oh so cute.

nyccarguy · August 2002

This is definitely OT, so you can email me if you like. I know you're living in and around the Boston area and assume (I know I shouldn't) that you've traveled to the Cape once or twice. I was wondering if you (or any of you for that matter) could advise on any "must sees" or great restaurants. I'd appreciate it! Thanks in advance. Oh, and I plan to see a lot of BMW 3-Series on the road between NYC and The Cape!

vkwheels · August 2002

Sounds romantic! Have fun.... :-) and responding to your post a while back, no, i have not seen any posts from Dave330 in a long time. Maybe he got tired of us.
or maybe he driving x-country in his BMW...

leenelsonmd · August 2002

Thanks for the continued response. Still thinking about the M3 versus the 330. There are so many positive points to make about both cars. The 330 is more than enough power, gets better gas mileage, costs less, and is less flashy. The M3 has unbelievable power, costs a little too much and grabs the eyes (maybe too much so). The odds of getting a ticket or getting keyed in the M3 are much higher IMO.

Seivwrig: What makes you think the 330Ci will get some changes in 2003? I would be very surprised to see a mid year change this year, but one would think that BMW has some plans to shift with the market segment.

Brave1: I appreciate the comments about the E36 vs E46 M3. I think I would still pick the M3 over the Boxster though. The 911 may be a different story, but the truth is I am not very intrigued by Porsche. They may drive great, but they sound like sewing machines. I have never liked their exhaust note much. An additional feature of the M3 is that it has a rear seat which is handy for hauling people or stuff around when you need to. The fold down seats make the trunk useable too -- I recently took my lawn equipment to San Antonio for my parents in the back of my 325i. The look of the Porsche has also grown old for me. I know I am probably in the minority.

vkwheels: No, Sorta, True, True, True, True. I love how the M3 looks. Where is Dave330?

jpierce26 · August 2002

As I posted a few pages back, I had ordered a new 2003 330xi, SP, CWP, PP, Xeon, and Nav in Gray Green. I decided the color was not sitting right with me so I called Steve, the salesperson back and told him I wanted to change the color to Steel Blue.

During that conversation he proceeded to tell me that there was some "good news and bad news" on the car I put $500 down on.

He said he just received the 2003 prices and the bad news was the prices went up but the good news is that the service is good for 1 year longer and 10,000 miles more.

He said we should split the difference of the new car price. I said ok, and hung up the phone.

Then I started feeling anxious and uncomfortable. I was losing sleep thinking about the deal. I thought back to the three hour negotiating meeting we had and I remember saying to him that what happens if the price is higher for the 2003. He said not to worry about it.

So I called him back today and told him that I was not going to pay the extra money for the car. I felt that he misled me. I reminded him that I have an official piece of paper in my hand with the settled price and the options that I ordered.

He was mad and gave me many excuses. He said he will have to speak with his manager and get back to me tonight. Well it is tonight, and I have not heard from him.

My question is: Am I unreasonable for trying to get the car for the price I *thought* we had negotiated. I feel like the deal will go through if I don't give in. The difference is about $300-$400. When spending over 40K for a car, does $300 seem picky?

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. I am very uneasy about this purchase now because there is a wrinkle in it.

Thoughts. . . ?

Jeff

nerd · August 2002

A deal is a deal unless one of the parties can show a gross error that would kill their business. Losing $400 on a car sale won't even scratch a BMW dealer.

BMW increased dealer invoice prices (not MSRP) after my wife ordered her car. I heard about the increase and asked the dealer. He said that they would absorb the increased cost, about $400, and that they were happy to have her as a customer. They even worked hard to secure better financing than she could have got through her credit union.

I'm sure that you don't want to delay getting your new car, but the dealer is out of line in not honoring the deal. He still will be making plenty of profit. As an altenative, you might consider having the dealer add some options (at his cost!) worth the increased amount of the deal.

jpierce26 · August 2002

Nerd,

Thanks for your feedback. It is helpful to know what other people have gone through. I wished my dealer in Norwood, MA was as nice.

During the three hour meeting, he kept saying he was working *for* me. Now I am begining to think he is working for himself.

Jeff

denk · August 2002

A while back I recall that someone posted about his difficulty in accelerating smoothly from a stop or near stop even after three months with his new car. I am having the same problem with my (automatic trans) car. If I really baby the gas pedal I can get a smooth start about half the time. The other half I get sort of a jerky start that tends to throw you back in your seat. I don't recall if the poster said that this was the well-known notchy gas pedal problem or whether this was a similar but different problem. Would appreciate some guidance if anyone remembers or if the previous poster has found the remedy.

lanas · August 2002

I'm debating between these two models. I'm thinking of the manual but I was told that the manual will sell better with the coupe and the automatic with the sedan. Also, I read somewhere that 330Ci exhibits slightly less wind noise on the highway.
Does anyone have any info?

bmw323is · August 2002

Did you use the product called Wheel Wax? If so, what makes it so good? How does it differ from regular was on the wheels? Does it really keep the brake dust from accumulating on the wheels?

I asked about this stuff once before and apparantly no one here ever used it. I'm willing to try anything that works to help reduce the wheel cleaning.

denk · August 2002

Try the trusty old Klasse all-in-one. It is great on wheels as well as the car itself.

BMW 3-Series 2005 and earlier

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