BMW 3-Series 2005 and earlier

sjmurray2 · September 2002

From a wear & tear maintenance perspective, how long can I expect the Sport Package tires (Dunlop/Contis/Mich) to last with average driving habits--meaning not too aggressive? I am torn between getting this package, but do not want to be spending $175 per tire every 15,000 miles, which equates to a years worth of driving. My conservative side in me keeps saying go with the non-sport package and save the expense of replacing low profile tires. Opinions/experience is welcome!

choices1 · September 2002

Does anyone know how many more years the current body style of the 3 series will be around for? I've found that it was introduced in 1999 and the earlier body style around for 7 years. With the change in the 7 series, I wondering if a similar change will be forthcoming for the 3 series for 2004/5?

Any comments on experiences between with 325i and A4 as we're down to these as our choices.

Thanks

markjenn · September 2002

I'd estimate you'll get 20-25K average out of sport package tires, another 10-15K out of the non-sports.

I hear MY 2006 (fall 2005) is the most likely time for a new 3-style, likely phased in over the model line starting with the sedan.

- Mark

dolivette · September 2002

Thanks for the response.

burrsr · September 2002

Thought I'd let the rest of you know that I just completed an electronic survey from BMW Consmuer Research on what the name of the upcoming "enhanced" sport package on the 330i should be called. Others may have also received the survey. Key highlights include (I'm quoting the survey):

Increased horsepower
Faster 0-60 mph time than normal 330i sedan
More aggressive looking and sounding exhaust
Aerodynamic kit (front spoiler, side skirts, and rear apron)
Special interior with alcantara cloth
Sportier gear shift
Sports suspension
Sport seats
18" wheels

Thought this looked interesting and worth passing on...

ddblue -- either keep Lena or sell her and buy a 3-year-old Civic. DO NOT sell her and buy a '97 540i -- you'll be at parity financially, best case.

sjmurray2 -- remember that when the SP tires wear out, you can always replace them with all-seasons (with the obvious handling compromises), which may yield about twice the mileage, since wear is important to you.

sjmurray2 · September 2002

Thanks for the quick response on the tires! One more question: Is it possible to do ED Invoice on a convertible? Passport told me the answer is no. No one will do ED Invoice on convertibles period. True statement? Scott

mschukar · September 2002

Except for maybe the ultra rich, we all borrow money to invest, including you

You're right, but there is a huge difference between borrowing for a house and borrowing for a $30k car.

By using leverage, we can afford the lifestyle that we like now when we are in low 30's

Like you said, I don't know your situation. I took a slightly different path preferring to live a bit below my means in my early 30's so that I have the choice to pay cash or borrow for a BMW in my mid 30's. A year or two of saving instead of making payments can make a huge difference in the loan amount.

I'm not criticizing you or anyone here, but I believe our society is too easily swayed to borrow for everything instead of saving. My advice is to know your own situation and be prepared for the worst.

BTW, I didn't find the specifics on the loan you mentioned. I assume it's a variable rate that probably won't last too long.

-murray

andrew001 · September 2002

Thanxs for your info! I guess i have to wait for another 3-4 weeks before getting the car.

markjenn · September 2002

This sounds like the "M Sports" package we've been hearing about - basically the a sedan M3 without the high-strung engine. I think there is a market for a car that niches in where the old 240-hp M3 4-door used to sit with a similar performance level and price. BMW sold a ton of sedan M3s when they were offered.

- Mark

brave1heart · September 2002

Living on credit is the American way, what can I say... We are all "guilty" of that to some degree.

Yes, that rate is tied to the prime, so it fluctuates with it. But if it goes up, so will bond rates - all I was saying is that paying for an asset with cash does not make it free. It will likely make it cheaper to finance because the opportunity cost of your money is generally lower than the rate that you can borrow at.

ddblue · September 2002

Well, after much deliberation and very good feedback from all of you, I've decided to hold on to Lena. It seems wiser to keep the car (refinanced now to $500/mo) and rely on the warranty rather than switch to a much older car with no warranty. The thought of saying goodbye to the car I've babied and cleaned nearly every weekend is just too much to bear, as well.

Thanks for everyone's great advice. The responses I received were all in one acccord (not a Honda). So my original feelings were confirmed. I can always rely on this board!

Tchoo-I did work for the government but no longer. May look to get back in if telecom bottoms out (the bottom looks very close).

azjpeg · September 2002

Does anyone have advice on a good bike rack for the 325 sedan? I'm an occasional mountain biker and wouldn't mind transporting my bike to a trail from time to time.

erickpl · September 2002

BMW has a nice one that mounts directly into the mounts on the roof of the 325.

Check out the BMW site.

I think Thule makes one too that can use the same mounts.

-Paul

seivwrig · September 2002

Hang in there. I'm a telecom employee but I don't think I will get the axe this year. But only God knows if that will happen. Yes, the BMW can be pricey but imagine life without the warranty and service agreement. I think they pay for themselves.

seivwrig · September 2002

LeeNelson:

You will have to give me a ride when your M3 comes in.

I also just got back from Colorado. I drove my vehicle up there. I stayed in Steamboat but made some runs in Vail, Aurora, Denver and Colorado Springs. If I had to live in Colorado, my slushbox would have to get traded. I did not see many BMWs there. I did make a serious spirited run with a Porsche 911 and M-B E-class on I-70 East after the Eisenhower Tunnel. I need driving lessons. I was hanging until the multitude of curves kicked my butt. Mountain driving has to be done with a manual, just for the sake of control. With the slushbox, the reaction time is not good enough. The range of roads were excellent. I have probably developed some new skills. Could I live in Colorado? No, it is beautiful but too expensive. I have got too use to Southern Living. I recommend Colorado as an excellent place to test the legs of any Bimmer.

Note: I think the car sounds better in less humid climates. Or it seemed that way. I did not hear that sound of sucking air.

mschukar · September 2002

Erickpl is right, Thule makes a rack that mounts directly to threaded holes in your roof. It is a bit pricey though.

Check out the Thule site.

-murray

erickpl · September 2002

I got a question answer right... I'm ready for Jeopardy now!

-Paul

leenelsonmd · October 2002

No problem with the ride. I am so anxious about the whole thing until it gets here. If my wife loses her job I will be driving my E36 for another couple of years. I am tracking the M though, and it is "Awaiting transport" --whatever that means.

Where I go after my residency is still up in the air. We'll see. Texas sure is cheap and the hot sunny weather is so easy to deal with--just turn on the AC. There is nothing unpredictable.

leenelsonmd · October 2002

I do not have one on my bimmer, but my wife has a rack that mounts to the trailer hitch and I am a big fan of this. It is easy to get your bike on the rack and there is no risk of scratching the car. It also allows for convenient access to the trunk. A trailer hitch costs about $130 and sits relatively inconspicuously under the car when not in use.

leenelsonmd · October 2002

The roads in CO are fun aren't they. I agree that a manual would be much better, but a slushbox bimmer is great start. I am jealous that you were able to drive up there. My wife hates to drive anywhere.

nyccarguy · October 2002

Did you drive in S mode, D, or manual mode?

erickpl · October 2002

Even the bad storms are predictable in Texas. Every day around 4 pm in north Texas... storms and a dry line.

-Paul

seivwrig · October 2002

My wife drove in D, I varied between S and manual. Between Steamboat and Vail, the roads can be quite steep. With steep grades, manual is the only way to go in order to keep your foot off the brakes. On I-70, just go for broke but keep your eyes on the road. The scenery is great but the type of drivers vary.

The route that I took to Steamboat was TX-288, I-45 to I-35 to I-70 to CO 9 to US-40. Steamboat to Vail, US-40 to CO-131 to I-70 and back. Steamboat back to Houston, US-40 to CO 9 to I-70 to I-25 to US-87 to US-287 to I-45 to TX-288.

This will probably be the last road trip for the Bimmer with the exception of the Arkansas trips.

One really cannot underestimate how driving lessons can help you get the most out of the 325i. I really don't see the need for the 330i. If I was a better driver, that might be the only reason for a 330i. The 325i is a great entry level performance sedan and the compact size definitely helps.

andrew001 · October 2002

tell us your experience with your new BMW.

hiddendragon · October 2002

Just got my 325i, I am still practicing how to shift smoothly and want to see how fantastic the car is. Can you tell me where did you take the driving class? Thanks.

dave330i · October 2002

from my vacation to MD. Couple of observation. Why does it take 4.5 hrs to drive from D.C. to NYC? It's only a freaking ~200 mile drive.

I went through a car withdraw. It was only 5 days, but it got pretty bad. I kept wanting to shift the automatic I was driving on vacation.

tenet1 · October 2002

Actual mileage is 240 miles from DC to NYC, and you are drive through the busiest corridor on the East coast.

Best way to do under 4 hr is drive late at night.

eyws · October 2002

Just bought a 2002 325i, but learned that it does not come with an alarm system. Am debating if I should intall one. My previous cars all had built-in alarms, including a Honda Civic EX. Given the security key ignition system and radio anti-theft feature, would I be spending something that isn't really necessary or worth it? Would also appreciate experiences from those who have an alarm installed in their 325i. Thanks.

brave1heart · October 2002

I got the alarm for $400-and-change installed and I am glad I did it. You get a tilt sensor, motion detector, beeps to go with the blinking lights, a clown nose that is actually good for something, and protection from intruders. In most states, you will get an insurance discount for the alarm, which should pay for itself in 3-4 years. More than anything, it's a peace of mind. That said, most buyers choose not to get it.

ccotenj · October 2002

consider yourself lucky... it could have been MUCH MUCH worse...

-Chris

seivwrig · October 2002

I have not taken driving class but I will try to enroll in the local BMWCCA driver safety and high speed class next year. I figure that I would break my car in before attending these classes. The Houston BMWCCA is offering the high speed class in November at Texas Motor Speedway. I really advise that any BMW owner joins BMWCCA if only for the Roundel and discounts from various businesses. I purchased my alarm and bra from Passport BMW and Pacific BMW, respectively. The discount for the bra alone has more than covered my annual membership fee. If the Telecommunications industry was not in so much flux, I would consider having my wife sent me to a racing school for a Christmas gift. It really is a shame that driver's ed does not teach automobile dynamics. What I know is based on my engineering education.

I have been an off and on fan of F1 and WRC. I am really fascinated by the technology that goes into tyres and suspensions. Forced induction on the other hand does not seem reliable.

sidebar: I had a 2001 BMW 325i SP, CWP, Step loaner. I did not feel any big difference in handling between SP and non-SP. The only noticable difference was the sport seats and steering wheel. The bigger wheels only felt different when I hit a pothole. Life without Xenons suck. I was glad to get my car back even though the dealer did a sloppy job of washing my car. I have to undo their mess this weekend.

brave1heart · October 2002

I regularly watch WRC on the Speed channel. It is fascinating watching from the cockpit. It takes enormous skill to drive like that!!

BTW, you will be able to tell a HUGE difference in handling with the sport pack if you push the car in corners.

troutbum1 · October 2002

Just got my 2002 330ci 5 speed. Have driven a SUV for the last 12 years. Prior to that was a Saab 9000 Turbo. I had forgotten!!

twoof1 · October 2002

Here Here on the WRC. Those guys are incredibly talented drivers!

locke2c · October 2002

I can't believe the season points only "pay" six places in WRC! The rate of mechanical retirements alone to me would suggest that you need to reward, say the next four to six places, for just making it to the end.

Uh, sorry about that. We're getting a little OT...

Trout: congrats on the new 330. I will *never* daily drive a truck or SUV. I might own one, but driving is a lot more than getting from place to place for me.

-Colin

seivwrig · October 2002

The points are no different than Formula 1. At least there is some parity in WRC with the cars. No one car can dominate on all surfaces, even though the Peugeot is kicking much butt but the driver has a lot to do with that. Kind of miss Audi in the rally circuit. Why did the German marques (with the exception of Ford) leave the rally circuit? A modified 3er compact with a turbocharger and four wheel drive should fair well.

skobola · October 2002

I had my 2002 325i programmed at delivery to blink the clown nose when locked and to blink the turn signals when being locked and/or unlocked. So it looks pretty much the same as a car with alarm, except for no sound/siren, no motion sensor and no chirps when locking/unlocking. Still, it is on you to decide how worth is it to pay $400-500 for that "additional" protection.

dlc95035 · October 2002

Good comment - I was trying to figure out how to set off the alarm!
It used to be that if the doors were locked & the windows down, there would be a motion sensor which would alarm if someone put their hand through the open window - but that didn't do it, nor does trying to open the trunk or doors.

---> What exactly will set off the alarm & how much damage would there be to the car at that point?

essweb · October 2002

The fact of the matter is, it has become a culture to borrow money on everything, from a 53 Digital TV to a new BMW to a huge house. You shouldnt be surprised that more than 80% of the owners of a new 3 are paying that same kind of amount.

One needs to always prepare for the worse case scenario, to many that is $724 every two weeks of unemployment benefit for 3 to 6 months. If you are not ready for that without calling your daddy or dip into credit card or cashing out 401K, then you are not ready for putting zero down on your 37k car.

But some might think they NEED the 3, or they DESERVE better than a Camry, right?

brave1heart · October 2002

When armed, my car's alarm goes off if you stick your arm in it. Also, the one time that my car got towed, the tilt sensor set off the alarm and I was able to run downstairs. The alarm is a lot more than beeping and blinking - it MAY actually deter a potential petty thief because it draws attention to the car. It is standard on all 5-series and it should be standard on all 3-series as well. I personally think that it is not smart buying a 30K+ car and not paying for an active alarm. But I can see how a lot of owners would not want to spend $400-500 on it. At any rate, it lowered my insurance and that's a reason good enough to get the alarm, esp. if you are not leasing the car and you are planning on keeping it for a while.

brave1heart · October 2002

Congrats!! You must be in heaven. It gets even better from here ;o)

brave1heart · October 2002

I think they both should award drivers in the top 10 positions at least, not just the top 6. There really is a merit to finishing a race!! The problem is more pressing with F1 because all the attention is on the top 3 teams which have a much bigger budget than the rest of the teams. I read that Ferrari's annual F1 budget is >300 mil!! F1 is more of an exercise in technology than an exciting race to watch. I still rarely miss a race but CART is more fun to watch.

ccotenj · October 2002

i like the fact you gotta run good to get points... and that there is a major premium placed on winning... i love nascar, but their points system is screwed up...

brave - why'd you get towed? or don't i want to know?

-Chris

brave1heart · October 2002

That happened toward the end of last year. We were living in an apartment building in Boston and we were both parking on the street. I was coming back from Albany, NY where I have been working for the past couple of years. I drove around for about 10 min but could not find a parking spot and I parked in front of our building to go see my wife who was 7-8 months pregnant. Literally 2 minutes later, I heard my car's alarm go off and when I looked through the window, I saw a tow truck hitching my car. I ran downstairs and I told the driver (a very young kid) that I was going to move the car. He told me that'd be $50 and that they typically charge $100 CASH ONLY if they have to tow me. I told him that was blackmail and that I wanted my car back. He floored the truck and took off. I started running after the truck and it's probably a good thing I couldn't catch up because I would have picked up a fight. I had to go get my car with my pregnant wife so she'd drive the other car back. I called the apt. building management and they told me that they had a contract with that towing company and they weren't going to do anything about it because I was illegally parked. I started looking for a house to buy the day after this incident and now that we live in the suburbs, it's safe to say we'll be living HERE happily everafter

)

seivwrig · October 2002

I think that experience would have me looking for a house too! They apparently did not care that you were a customer. That is just too bad.

F1 is a farce especially when you look at the manufacture points and the company represented.
Europe:Ferrari, BMW, M-B, Renault, Jaguar then the rest of world, made to scramble for the rest of the points: Toyota, Hondas and lowly Sauber(if they can ever qualify.) I like the point scheme for F1, you only have about 22 cars out there. FIA WRC on the other hand, has alot of cars and a lof of talented drivers. They could share the points better. CART seems to have more drama and personality. My wife will not watch an FIA F1 race because M.Schumacher always appears to win. But technology is what drives F1. The approach is BMW and Ferrari are opposite. Ferrari builds consumer cars to fund F1, while BMW does F1 so the technology is passed on their consumer models.

brave1heart · October 2002

I told management that I understand the need to have a contract with a towing company but that they should have contracted someone who charges a reasonable fee for towing and someone who takes other means of payment than cash. They did nothing about it except raise our rent another 6% that year. Oh, they also charged a finders fee for finding us an apartment in their own complex (that's how bad the Boston market was back during the boom) and they tried to charge us $350 "clean-up fee" considering we left everything sparkling clean.

Well, the new Enzo resembles an F1 car a lot. Plus, Ferrari would be hard-pressed to fund their $300 mil F1 program with just their street car sales. As far as CART, the cars are almost identical (setup varies of course) and it is more versatile than F1. It's a shame they can't work it out with the IRL and have one strong league together.

hiddendragon · October 2002

what's the discount you got off from the membership? can you give an example? thanks.

ballbag23 · October 2002

I've been driving the 2003 325XI all week and I love it. It certainly lacks the punch of a 330 or G35, but its quick enough for me. The ride is smooth, the handling is agile and the interior is comfortable and convenient. To top it off, my golf clubs fit easily in the trunk...what more could I ask for?! Anyway, I am very happy with my purchase. Best of luck with yours!

abcnyc · October 2002

I thought I read a previous post that indicated that the torque on the lug nuts were suipposed to be 120 NM. Do most of you who change out wheels & tires for winter actually use a torque wrench or just tighten as much as you can ? I want to know if I should buy a torque wrench for changing my wheels & tires.

hippo168 · October 2002

I do use a torque wrench to check every time I switch out the summer/winter wheel-tires...

my question is, besides the Roundel magazine, where else can we get info like this? I don't get the Roundel, so how do I know there are updates/changes/adjustments?

Also, 100Nm to 120Nm seems like a big jump. Is this "officially" from BMW or from some user who was just playing around with the tightness?

BMW 3-Series 2005 and earlier

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