BMW 3-Series 2005 and earlier

fjk57702 · March 2003

The CVT transmissions give you an "infinite" number of gears. But for most purposes 6 speeds will probably give you most of what you need. A big engine does not need a really low gear and a small engine can't use a really high gear (overdrive).

The powerglide dates back to the 1950's. What did BMW have then?

riez · March 2003

fjk... Not sure I'd agree with your statement that "a small engine can't use a really high gear (overdrive)".

Don't all current BMW automatics have an overdrive 5th? (Didn't even the previous 4-speed automatics use an overdrive 4th?) Thinking the 325ia's is a 0.75, which is numerically lower than the 0.82 on my 540i6.

There are a ton of cars with small engines that have decently deep overdrives, including on both manual and automatic transmission versions. I can't think of a single small engine economy car sold in USA with an automatic transmission that doesn't have an overdrive top gear.

Ultimately, it is the interaction of the overall gear ratio (final drive x individual gear ratio) with the engine's output curve that determines whether the setup is efficient and effective.

I don't mind needing to downshift out of top gear to pass or accelerate. An automatic does that automatically. I just need to do it myself in my cars with manual transmissions. That is what lower gears are for at speed if I also want efficient high speed cruising in top gear.

3catmom · March 2003

Hey - I'm new to the board here. After years of reading about BMWs here at Edmund's, I finally picked up my 2003 330i this weekend. I LOVE it! But, I have a question regarding the daytime running lights. I think I'm following the instructions correctly. The headlights turn off automatically when I shut off the car but, the dashboard lights stay lit. Can someone tell me what I'm doing wrong? Thanks!

fjk57702 · March 2003

The overdrive ratio and the axle ratio are not independent of each other. Somehow you do not seem to understand this. The automatic BMW's come with a different axle ratio than the manuals in general.

Anyway, a big V8 with lots of torque can run at a lower engine speed and still pull fairly well than a 4 cylinder engine with less than half the torque. So the small engine will need to run a bit faster in high gear to pull the car along comfortably.

In particular:
the 540 comes with a 2.81:1 axle ratio and the overdrive is 0.8 for an overall ratio of 2.25:1
the 530 comes with 3.46:1 axle ratio (automatic) and overdrive is 0.75 for an overall ratio of 2.6:1 and the 330 is 3.38:1 with overdrive of .76 giving an overall ratio of 2.57:1

BMW is running the smaller sixes faster than the V8s.

riez · March 2003

fjk... I'm quite familiar with the individual gear ratios in the 3 and 5 Series transmissions as well as the different final drive ratios. The overall ratio per gear is the individual ratio multiplied by the final drive ratio. That is why both are important. And manufacturer's select carefully to take into account the desired outcome, as the ratios interact with the engine's output curve. A "poor" final drive can undercut what might be otherwise decent individual gear ratios and vice versa.

Better comparisons are between the 325i and 330i--both automatics and manuals of each. Compare the individual gear ratios, final drives, and overall ratios.

Many vehicles can be had with different final drive ratios (esp. vehicles that tow heavy loads). Just take the 540ia. The Sport model gives you the more aggressive, "hotter" 3.15:1 final drive. This boosts acceleration performance in all gears versus the numerically lower final drive in the non-Sport 540ia. The overall ratio is higher in every gear. But it also means the engine turns higher RPMs in each gear, esp. at higher speeds. And say hello to the gas guzzler tax. That is the trade off. (Though some of this is created by the way the EPA tests.)

Yes, the 3 Series automatics with overdrive use more aggressive final drives. But they also end up with a lower overall ratio in top gear. They use the numerically higher ratio to improve acceleration performance since there will be efficiency losses and the overdrive to gain increased efficiency at higher speeds. A 6 speed manual will essentially do the same.

(One of my favorite set ups today is the Acura 3.2TL Type S. Believe its 5-speed automatic uses a 0.47:1 5th gear in conjunction with a 4.11:1 final drive. Great acceleration and great highway fuel economy. The overall ratio in 5th gear in this car is lower than that in any current 3 or 5 Series. Check out the overdrive ratio in the Corvette.)

fjk57702 · March 2003

All I am saying is that no matter how many gears there are, in the end the overall ratio is what matters. There is no difference in having a 4:1 axle ratio with a 0.75 overdrive and having no overdrive and a 3:1 axle ratio. The final ratio is still 3:1 (assuming a 1:1 high gear otherwise).

BMW is adding a 6th gear to their 5 speed and the 6th gear is an overdrive. They have also changed the first gear a little, but the 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th gears are essentially the same. This 6th gear will allow the 330 to run a bit slower at cruise, but I do not see that it gives the car much improvement in performance otherwise.

riez · March 2003

fjk... Whether it is for the 330i or 325i, the use of a 6-speed manual vis-a-vis today's 5-speed manual, with the new transmission's gear ratios as already described earlier (by shipo?), will increase acceleration in 1st gear and improve fuel efficiency in top gear. That is a win-win. And likely why Acura, Infiniti, Mazda, MB, Nissan, etc. have moved to 6-speeds.

And as we both know, the overall ratios in top gear for the automatics are different than the manuals. The use of the automatic's overdrive offsets the automatic's higher numerical final drive, to give a lower overall ratio in 5th gear.

I believe BMW has chosen its current final drive ratios and non-overdrive 5th (and, thus, the resulting overall ratio in 5th) to satisfy those drivers who don't want to have to downshift to pass or who need to accelerate in top gear on interstates/autobahns. BMW could gear the current manual transmissions similarly to the 5-speed automatics if they wanted to.

riez · March 2003

fjk...

In top gear...

325i manual is 1.00 x 3.15 = 3.15
330i manual is 1.00 x 2.93 = 2.93
325i auto is 0.74 x 3.46 = 2.56
330i auto is 0.74 x 3.38 = 2.50

BMW has varied final drives (4 different ones) and 5th gear gearing (2 different ones).

EPA figures are:

325i auto = 19/27 mpg
330i auto = 19/27 mpg
325i manual = 20/29 mpg
330i manual = 21/30 mpg

33

mschukar · March 2003

3catmom-

Congratulations on your new 330! I still love my 325i a year after I bought it.

Regarding the daytime running lights, there are a number of options the dealer can set for the car and some specific to the key used. Things like how many times you push the key fob to unlock all the doors, automatic locking of the doors at 5 mph and daytime running lights. Ask your dealer for a list or perhaps someone has a link.

Activating the DRL's turns on the middle two "brights" (halogen lights if you have xenon's) to a lower level when the light switch is turned off or the middle position. Turning the light switch to on the main headlights (outer two) and turns off the DRL's. You should turn the light switch to off when you stop the car regarless of DRL's.

I opted for the DRL's for the small amount of extra visibility plus I can leave my xenon's off around dusk, dawn or when it's cloudy. You can also turn on your fog lights with the DRL's.

-murray

brave1heart · March 2003

I would not want 1-st gear in my 325 to be any shorter because it would max out too fast. I don't much care for an overdrive because it would only give me (maybe) a couple of extra mpg at the expense of responsiveness. I like the responsiveness I get out of a direct 5-th gear. Does anyone know how much weight a 6-th gear adds BTW?!?

If you can't get the most out of the car with 5 gears, a 6-spd will do you no good (the law of diminishing returns comes ot mind). Unless it helps you feel better about yourself because everybody else has it.

bmw323is · March 2003

pab5 - I have the Conti Sports on my car with 25,000 miles on them. I may get another 5,000 miles before they're gone. I've done one driving school and one autocross. I've also rotated them once, front to back. After about 10,000 miles they got noticably louder on rough concrete, but are still quiet on smooth blacktop.

Others here have had a poor opinions of these tires. I find their grip to be very good. Very little squeal and a progressive breakaway at the limits. I also keep a watch on prices at The Tire Rack and they regularly sell these tires for less than $100 in 16" form. About half the cost of performance Michelins.

riez · March 2003

brave1heart... So if you don't want the benefits of an overdrive top gear, all you would need to do is never shift into 6th. But then the rest of us can enjoy more relaxed, efficient high speed cruising. (I enjoy downshifting from top gear when I need to pass or accelerate quickly.)

With all the other amazing benefits of technology, seems like these 6-speeds are coming in lighter than the trannys they replace. Thought I read that the 6-speed automatic used in the 745i and Jags is lighter than the 5-speed it replaced. Thinking I read that about MB's development of its 7-speed transmission, too.

Key to lower gearing (for magazine testing) is to ensure the car can go 60 mph without needing to go into 3rd gear. The upshifting costs time. That might be a problem with the 325i (though a solution would be to leave 1st and 2nd gear ratios unchanged from the 5 speed and add the overdrive 6th).

fjk57702 · March 2003

Automatic transmissions are different than manuals. Automatics use planetary gearsets and do not have one gearset for each gear. Rather, by combining various gearsets, a set of gears can be provided. A six speed automatic can be made with 3 planetary gearsets. A 5 speed automatic also requires 3 planetary gearsets. So a six speed would not have to be much different from a 5 speeed automatic.

Another point: the BMWUSA website says that the automatic in the 325 has different gears than the automatic in the 330. Not just the overdrive (0.74 vs 0.76) but other gears are also listed as different. I would think that this is not a typo.

fjk57702 · March 2003

I think that the gears in the 6 speed could have been refined more, but BMW should know what they are doing I guess. I would have changed the 2nd gear too and would have had more of an overdrive. Or, kept the first 5 speeds the same and made the overdrive more and put a higher performance axle ratio as standard. But then if 1st and 2nd gears are designed to get to 60, then any change would affect the 0-60 time if a shift to 3rd is required.

riez · March 2003

fjk... I pulled my numbers off the BMW full-color, full-size MY 2003 3 Series sedan brochure. Off the tech specs page. Believe those numbers also agree with the same numbers posted in the MY 2002 and MY 2001 brochures.

But who knows, maybe BMW has changed them? What with Infiniti G35, Mazda 6, Acura TSX, etc. all on the prowl for BMW-type buyers, BMW might be doing all it can quietly to improve performance. Things like new Perf Pkg, revised styling on coupes & convertibles, 6-speeds, etc.

fjk57702 · March 2003

I would think that there is one automatic transmission for the six cylinder engines but I don't know. Certainly typo's can creep into webpages, and your brochure should be right.

fjk57702 · March 2003

The AWD 330 gets a different automatic transmission than the RWD 330. BMWUSA has mixed them up.

brave1heart · March 2003

I installed the ECIS CAI in my 01 325i back in October 02 and within a couple of weeks, the Service Engine Soon light started coming up. Initially, it would disappear the day after I tighten up the gas tank lid but the light has been constantly on for the past couple of months. I have not been overly concerned about it because I have not noticed any problems with drivability whatsoever. I brought in the car for service today and I asked the dealer to look at the fault codes. They found out that intermittent misfire and lean conditions codes were recorded. Basically, too much air is getting into the engine and the air flow meter cannot compensate with enough fuel beyond a certain point. Ive read about issues due to over-oiling the cone filter but I have not had to clean and oil it yet and over-oiling should not be an issue, esp. considering the fact that the problem started occurring within two weeks of the initial install. The tech rep said that it doesnt mean the engine is misfiring regularly and it might well be only sporadically and that the light is extremely sensitive. He recommended trying 91 octane instead of the 93 octane gas that Ive been running since day 1 and if that doesnt help to go back to the stock setup and see if that will take care of the problem. Has anyone else running CAIs experienced a similar issue? Wondering if it could be related to the extremely cold air (down to 10 F) that Ive been driving in this winter. Maybe I should not use the CAI during the winter because the AFM cannot handle the combination of extremely cold air and a free-flowing filter?

brave1heart · March 2003

I can't argue with a 6-spd that gets the same or better acceleration, provides better fuel economy, costs the same, and esp. weighs less. I rest my case - the 2 mpg or so improvement due to the overdrive is better than no gain at all.

BTW, My 325i manual cannot reach 60 in 2-nd gear in stock setup - it maxes out at around 55-56 mph before the rev limiter kicks in.

locke2c · March 2003

I have no problems whatsoever, but I also have the gift of OBD-I. ;-) I could slap on a turbokit and tune around it with bolt-ons!

-Colin

shipo · March 2003

Hmmmm, "He recommended trying 91 octane instead of the 93 octane...", my friend, I am seriously "Hairy Eyeballing" that one. While it is certainly true that with the cold weather we have had this winter, that the fuel will be less volatile in its normal state, I think that it would be otherwise under the compression of the engine. My reasoning for this is that with the cold air (like you said -10 F), comes far greater density, so your engine is actually ingesting far more air molecules per liter than it does on a hot day. In my way of thinking, more air means that your compressed charge of Air and Fuel will be hotter that it was in the summer time when you were compressing hot/humid thin air. To be sure the air in the intake plenum is 100 degrees cooler than it would be in August, however, under compression, that difference seems to me to be trivial, keeping in mind that I have not actually calculated the differences.

Hmmm, let's see, PV=nRT, Avogadro's number is, ummmm, I forget, damn, its been only 33 years since I took physics. Anybody?

Based upon what you are experiencing, I am inclined to guess that the BMWs' standard intake is more than adequate for the colder winter months (given air densities and your engines ability to supply enough fuel...), and that the CAI would best be kept for the summer months.

Best Regards,
Shipo

fjk57702 · March 2003

Another equation is: P=density*R*T
So density(1)/density(2)=T(2)/T(1)
Temperature is absolute ->~300 Kelvin = 80F
At zero F the density increases about 18% above that at 80F if pressure is the same.

93 octane is sea level premium while high altitude premium is 91.

gpwatfrd · March 2003

I have a situation here which I would love to hear some feedback on.

I had ordered a 03 330i which came already and must be picked up by Sat. March 29th the latest. I am leasing the vehicle and the payment we settled on is at the max I set my budget for. Unfortunately I ran into some very large bills sooner than I anticipated and can not pick the car up this soon. I could really use a couple months time to come up with the inception fees and push off the lease payments. I have some ideas running through my head like:

1. lease a left over 03 330ci
2. order another 330i and pay the extra money per month
3. order 04 325ci
I have to come to a decision by the end of the week.I would greatly appreciate and of your comments.

kyfdx · March 2003

I would reassess your car needs. If the lease payment you negotiated is the maximum you can afford, and because of unexpected bills, you can't afford to consummate the deal for another couple of months, it sounds like you are in over your head. Whatever you do, don't take delivery of a car you can't afford.

kyfdx

kdshapiro · March 2003

Do what you need to do, to make sure you are financially sound with any car purchase. Don't rush into it. PS where did you order your car from?

Good luck.

locke2c · March 2003

gp, I agree wholeheartedly with the above comments. if you've got to make your next vehicle a BMW try used and say half the price of the 330 you've been considering. that should be sufficiently cheaper to fit your budget much more comfortably.

if that idea doesn't settle well, I'd find the most mechanically sound <$1500 beater you can and drive it for 6-12 months until you are ready to do this new 330 deal.

-Colin

twoof1 · March 2003

See my post #20387 from last October regarding my ECIS experience.
twoof1 Oct 9, 2002 9:20am
Good Luck

bmwdoug · March 2003

I am in the market for a used BMW. I have the opportunity to purchase a 2002 330i Silver on Grey, Sport/Premium package, Xeons, 18 inch M wheels for $34,000. Or, I can purchase a 01 530i, 26000 miles, Sport/Premium, Xeons for $36000. Which do think is the better deal? Which will hold value longer? Thanks

abcnyc · March 2003

I just swapped my winter tires (Dunlop Winter Sports) back for my summer tires. I think the snow is finally over. It's great to have the summer tires back on the car. It makes a big difference in the ride and handling. Though I can't complain about the Dunlop Winter Sports tires this winter. They were great up to about 5-6" of snow. Unfortunately, in the Balt/Wash area, we had much more than that this winter. But the Dunlops are great in moderate snow. I know BMW doesn't recommend rotating the tires (I have mixed front and back tires with the 330i and the SP), but should I rotate the winter tires for next year (they are all the same size) ?

gpwatfrd · March 2003

kyfdx. kdshapiro,locke2c

Thank you for your advise. I do appreciate it. I have decided not to take delivery of the 330i. I will speak with my salesperson about pricing for a 325i and 325ci. I will order the car which will give me the extra couple of months that I need. The only other option I am looking into is the new Mercedes C230 sport sedan. One of my unexpected bills was a bill for $8,300 from Mercedes for over mileage,diposition fee,and taxes. If I go in on the Mer. They will knock 2,000 off my over mileage. I would prefer a 325 over the C230 but I will have to see what the final numbers are.

kdshapiro
The dealer is open road BMW in NJ

kdshapiro · March 2003

$8,300. Big gulp and wow. That is the only problem with leasing. Good luck and I hope all turns out well for you. I am familiar with Open Road, they are annoyingly on the worst route in NJ. King is minutes from my house and they will pick the car up if needed. Although my 330i hasn't seen them since late spring last year. I need to think of an excuse to get the car to the dealer, so I can drool over the M3 and M5. If there are any on the lot.

bluebeast · March 2003

The current 5 series is coming to an end, so I would think that the 330i would hold it's value better. Not to mention that the 330i is more sought after than a 530i.

brave1heart · March 2003

<<<At zero F the density increases about 18% above that at 80F if pressure is the same>>> This is consistent with what I've read on other enthusiasts' boards. I remember reading that ~ 4 F change in temp in the intake results in ~ 1% denser air, which should roughly translate into a 1% HP gain. My car feels like a rocket at 0 F temp!

I got a printout of the fault codes from the dealer today. Basically, it has recorded one-time misfires on cylinders 2 and 5 on two different days and they were both due to lean conditions (air exceeding permissible range). I am not overly concerned about 2 misfires over a 5-mo period but having the light on in front of me at all times is annoying. Shouldn't it have reset itself after a few days? Does anyone know of a way to disable it?

Shipo, I agree with you on the octane level. I argued the same with the tech guy at the dealership...

brave1heart · March 2003

It was an '03 325ia with a PP. The steering is decidedly quicker than my MY '01 retro'ed 325i. Due to the lack of sport package with its wider tires with stiffer sidewalls, the steering felt lighter (about the same as my SP with a size down snow tires). The combination of quicker and lighter steering gives the car a slightly nervous feel. I think I'd love that quicker steering with the heavier feel of the SP tires, though! The car had Pirelli P6 all-seasons, which felt better than most all-season tires I've seen on an E46. Suffice to say that handling can't touch the SP's, though, and the difference is very pronounced under hard cornering. Another thing that I noticed going back into my car is that the shift throws are beginning to feel a little long. Maybe a short-shift kit is next ;o)

locke2c · March 2003

I could tell you how to disconnect the MIL so it's not annoying you in the dashboard...

The only thing you can do is disconnect the battery for about an hour. This will clear any hard codes and the lamp goes out.

-Colin

fedlawman · March 2003

$8300 does sound like a huge penalty. Wouldn't you be better off buying your off-lease Mercedes?

You instantly save the $8300 and you could either keep it for a while, or trade it in on a new car.

kyfdx · March 2003

Note to self:

Forget about buying one of those service loaners, to save money.

LOL

kyfdx

billherrmann · March 2003

BUY your off-lease mercedes & save $8300.
Or, Buy something & forget leasing since your mileage indicates that you are NOT a lease prospect.

dave330i · March 2003

I know what you mean by short throw shifter. When I went from my friend's Boxster to my 3 series, I couldn't believe how much longer my throw was. I'm surprised there's that much of a difference between MY01 & MY03 though.

leenelsonmd · March 2003

10,000 miles in the last 5 months.

The BMW is just too addicting not to drive for fun.

walter12 · March 2003

I took my 2001 325Ci into the dealership for a sticky throttle under light acceleration and a rattle on the parcel shelf when using heavy bass. Both problems were fixed per TSB. However, I had to bring the car back a second time after the dealership verified that my 325 did indeed have a sticky throttle and they could order parts. I believe this is the result of the manufacturer rather than the dealership and was somewhat inconvenient for me.

Thanks to this Board, I asked them also to change the oil and filter since it had been over a year since it had been done. They did it without cost to me. In addition, when asked about brakes and brake fluid, the dealership flushed and refilled the brake fluid without charge since the car was two years old.

Thanks to all of you who post information here. It is hard to ask the right questions when we don't know what they are.

riez · March 2003

kyfdx... My wife's '00 323ia (PP, CD, heated seats, steptronic, met paint, etc.) was a service loaner. She bought 12/1/01. CPO at about 18,000 miles. Saved about $8,000 off MSRP. Now has about 45,000 miles. Some mostly minor issues. Nothin' too bad. Passenger-side seat heater failed. Problem with highbeam light switch. Issue with sunroof cover/slider not working properly (not the sunroof itself). All covered under warranty.

So far all repairs under 4/50 warranty. All maintenance has been covered under full "free" program. She did replace her worn tires around 38,000 miles (replaced w/OEM Contis). Replaced battery around 39,000 miles. Replaced windshield wipers around 35,000 miles. Replaced front brake pads/rotors around 34,000 miles.

Driver-side leather seat is wearing out. On the left bolster. But she uses it for lots of short trips. Gets in and out a lot.

riez · March 2003

Germany's public broadcaster, DW, reporting today that BMW signed a $483 million joint venture agreement with a Chinese company to eventually build 3 & 5 Series vehicles in China. Not a lot of details but the article is on Deutsche Welle's web site, in English.

kyfdx · March 2003

Just a response to his post about how he flogged it, to compare to his own. I think the loaners are usually a great buy, and I've come close to getting one for my wife twice... Just never quite seemed to be able to pull the trigger. I had a chance to buy a 2000 528ia a couple months ago, that was originally a service loaner.. had the extra 3mo/5K miles on the warranty.. 40k miles... could have picked it up for $24.5K from a used car dealer... Kind of kicking myself for that one, but wife still has 9 months left on current lease. Wouldn't have had CPO on that deal, though.
Wow..$8000 off msrp.. that means a pretty nice 03 325ia could be had for $27K with a CPO warranty. Hope 9 months goes by fast.

regards,
kyfdx

gpwatfrd · March 2003

billheirmann, fedlawman
I considered financing the car but I ran into few problems with that scenario.

1.We built a house a few years ago which we did not have when I leased the car 4 years ago. I need to lower my monthly payments not increase them which is what would happen if I finance the car for another 4-5 years.

2.The other problem is the car had 83,000 miles on it. (Now granted my job is 15 minutes from home as opposed to the 60 minutes it used to be so I will not be putting on nearly the mileage) I would be lucky the car makes it 5 years and if it did, the maintenance costs on a clk430 are not cheap.
3. The other issue is the car seemed to be having some transmission problems which might lead to major expenses down the road

4. The Mercedes bill was the smaller of the large bills that came in the last couple of months meaning I did not have a large amount of money to put down on the car to lower my monthly payments anyway

That lease payment of $800 per month was not much money to spare before I had to pay a mortgage payment along with property taxes that were out the WAZZU!

kdshapiro,
Thanks and I hope you enjoy your car as well. I live minutes from King also but open road was more competitive in terms of dollars and cents.

kdshapiro · March 2003

Open Road seems to be a bigger dealership. But I got a very competitive quote from King for the car I have. Though today would I do it again, I definitly would solicite additional quotes as the landscape is always changing. I liked the family style feeling of the dealership. They call me every few months to see how I am faring with the car. Although not necessary I think that's a nice touch.

chile96 · March 2003

Was about to pull the trigger on a new 325ia tonight when the salesmen showed me a copy of his invoice and said invoice + $1000 and the car is yours. I almost signed until I realized that the invoice didn't look familiar with what I have been seeing on Edmunds, KBB, etc... Added into the price was:
MACO $550
Systems & Training $160

I questioned these fees and he said that they come directly from BMW and that is what they had to pay to get the car. I almost blew up but didn't because what if he was telling the truth? Any ideas? Are these just dealer fluff fees?

Thanks

nyccarguy · March 2003

These are somewhat bogus dealer fees. MACO is standard for living in a major metropolitan area, but it is usually about $200.

Systems and Training? What on earth is that?

kdshapiro · March 2003

The BMW 5 Series was named a AAA Auto Guide award winner in the $35,000 - $40,000 category. This is the second year in a row that the 5 Series has won this award, and the fifth time that AAA has awarded the 5 Series. AAA Auto Guide ratings for each vehicle are based on comprehensive reviews conducted for AAA Auto Guide: 2003 New Cars and Trucks, an annual book of new vehicle evaluations. The book features ratings on vehicles ranging from sports cars to minivans. Each vehicle receives up to 10 points in 20 different categories for a maximum of 200 points.

Now, seven years after production first began in March, 1996, the 5 Series is still selling robustly and receiving numerous accolades from the automotive press. In 2003 alone, Money Magazine presented BMW with "Best Luxury Car" for the 5 Series, Automobile Magazine presented an All-Star award to the M5 for Best Sports Sedan, and Wards Auto World bestowed upon BMW the thirteenth consecutive 10-Best Engine Award for the 3.0-liter engine which powers the 530i. Further, AMES Award LLC, the auto industry's leading authority on environmental performance, heralded the 5 Series as an environmentally safe 2003 model year product. In a recent Car and Driver comparison test of seven similarly-priced and equipped semi-luxury four-door cars, the BMW 530i finished second, even though it is the oldest of the seven cars in the comparison.

http://waw.wardsauto.com

http://subscribers.wardsauto.com/Microsites/index.asp?srid=10088&- amp;pageid=5991&siteid=26&magazineid=1004&srtype=1

chile96 · March 2003

Do I simply state I will not pay those fees(maybe I will pay $200 b/c I live in Houston). Anybody w/ experience with this at Advantage BMW?

Thanks

BMW 3-Series 2005 and earlier

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles