BMW 3-Series 2005 and earlier

kominsky · June 2001

Have you considered getting the SP and a set of dedicated winter tires/wheels to swap on? The car will drive better in summer AND winter than a non-SP car outfitted with all-season tires.

I apologize if this has been covered already, I haven't checked in for a while and I'm working my way backwards through the posts.

emilyk · June 2001

I've been busy lately and was just now able to catch up on all the posts. Your comment about the titanium headlight trim on the 330i SP intrigued me - I picked up my car last Friday and made sure that I checked out the trim. I ordered a 330i SP/PP and I had the titanium trim. The car was produced on 5/3. I'm not sure how to explain it.

jk26 · June 2001

I have considered that option, I think that I could get away with it(summer and winter tires for SP). I don't know whether I would have to swap out the rims or not, does anyone know? I'm not sure the 325 with SP would handle better with winter tires vs all seasons on a non SP. Does anyone else have thoughts on this? I have always had all season on my Accord and am unfamiliar with winter tires. I'm just not sure it is worth the hassle of changing out tires and possibly the rims twice a year.

JK

tchoo · June 2001

I'm going to pick up my car soon. I remember reading somewhere about enabling the flashing clown nose without the Alarm being installed. I was wondering if anyone can remember the options selection in the MODIC programming? Was it carmemory/anti-theft/DWA/enable? Any help appreciated. My salesman is not really tech savvy I'm just afraid he might claim that its not possible to enable the blinking light. thanks.

alpine325i · June 2001

I used to use Armor All. I found this stuff called "Vinylex" by Lexol, The company that makes that really good leather treatment that's recommended by alot of detailers, cool stuff. "It is a state of the art protectant that combines cleaning, protection, and beautifying properties". It penetrates below the surface to restore the underlying PLASTICIZERS!" LOL. "DH-60 UV sunscreen filters out damaging ultraviolet rays while protecting the surface from fading and cracking". It is specially made for vinyl, rubber, and plastic surfaces. I like it ALOT better than Armor All.:o)

mfeldman · June 2001

Has no one else noticed rust on the exhaust header pipes (under the car going into the muffeler)?
I'm still curious for my informal poll

Tried a tester of Vinlex. Didn't work too ell as a cleaner. Don't know how well it protects.

Saw a 3.2 TL-S at Costco. Couldn't believe it was only $32k for 260hp and all the standard stuff -- 6 cd and xenons. I guess if I want to trade my 330 in 2 years I can get a new one then for almost no new money. Too bad it's fwd and bland looking.

patrikk · June 2001

Can anyone share pictures of sport vs non sport seats on the 3 series? BMW's site is not exactly user friendly when comparing their own options against eachother. Thx in advance.

-pb

dl7265 · June 2001

Remember the 330i gets the metal trim and the 325 shiny plastic, i get tons of compliments on my SILVER/GREY LEATHER, the trim isnt too bad but the shiny black and sand dont quite do it for me. so i would prefer wood with sand.And the black is a no win the wood is pretty much drounded out in the dark interior.

RE: exhaust rust, my car is 2 years old and from the tailpipe to coverter there is no rust whatsoever. hope this helps.

Regards,
DL

aaron330i · June 2001

My ship comes in Friday per Wallenius not Sunday per BMW! I hope that translates into getting to me two days earlier than planned!

Oh the excitement of it all!

shawn33 · June 2001

I ordered a 325i with the only option being heated seats. Would like to have SP, but didn't want to buy snows and rims for a leased car.
Geez, the 16 inchers (standard) perform just fine anyhow, this is a BMW.

gurumike · June 2001

The $2000 incentive that you may or may not still be unsure about.....

Was only on the Z3 model, there are no such payments made to the dealer on 3 series (except M3 which has $1,500 . Just kidding). A couple of us just got Z3 2.5s and we were discussing what were basically off topic issues. Sorry for causing that confusion.

emilyk - Well there we have it. Now I'm thinking that it comes down to, we're talking headlight insert trim here, which would best complement the overall color/option combination. This decision is made solely by the supervisor of the headlight installation station at the factory. It is entirely at his or her discretion and their decision shall be final. Except on Friday afternoons during "Oktoberfest" when all cars shall have the black trim. This is so as to avoid the accidental installation of a silver piece onto, say, a 325 car. I hope this clears everything up.

gurumike · June 2001

Yes, you can all have a flashing clown nose with out the alarm system unless you have a 99 sedan or an early 2000 model. It's a car memory option. If the salesman does the car and key memory at your store, it's under alarm system, then confirmation w/out EWS, then select yes. Most dealers still have the service dept do it during PDI. If you have a car on order, your BMW center might have the BMW car & key memory sheets. You could get one of those, take it away and choose your settings (or just do it at the dealer) and be sure to tell them you want the locking confirmation ON. The turn signals will flash when you lock/unlock the car and the clown nose flashes while it's locked.

Got that ?!

gurumike · June 2001

This is my first attempt at posting pictures here so please forgive me if it doesn't work! it'll likely take up lots of space but that will do justice to the shots. Which are the result of a lot of time and effort. M'kay.....

I think it's in this order: Just about to go into the garage, the Mercedes service drive at sun-down and the best one of the cloth seats I could manage.

Enjoy-

Bulk listing tools, image hosting, counters, auction management and more at AuctionWatch

yeeeha · June 2001

Darn! I started to hold off for a Friday afternoon build in October, because I wanted that black headlight trim!!! Since I just took delivery, can I ship my car back to the factory in October so they can change it???!!!

...................Wow Mike. Beautiful car. Thanks for the pics.

gurumike · June 2001

With the frequency with which I change cars (every eleven months) I'd get killed just off the sales tax. If you got a 330i and it's selling price was $36,000 (a modest 330) I'd wave bye-bye to $2,700 the day I signed the paper work. My monthly payment tax is $30.75. So if I make eleven payments before changing it, I've paid a total of $338.25. The way I see it, using some rather non-scientific calculation, if you want to buy the car you've got to keep it for at least seven years to "break even" vs leasing a new car every two or three years. Exceptions might apply to some people doing a very high mileage (over 25k per year), because beyond 15k per year, the residual value is reduced by 15 cents per mile so the lease payment starts to get up to the buy payment.
Got that ?!

kominsky · June 2001

I would definetly recommend getting a tire/wheel package. As long as you have the space to stow whichever one's are not being used, the only hassle is swapping them out twice a year (I'm conservatively guessing a total of 1 hour for each 4 wheel change).

If you chose to swap the tires on your factory rims, you'd be paying for the mounting and balancing twice a year... it probably wouldn't be too many seasons before the rims paid for themselves. You'd also be saving your factory rims from the harshness of winter.

Only you know if the SP makes sense for your situation and I typically try to avoid posts dealing with subjective issues (color choices, desirable options, 325 vs 330, etc) but the sport-pack is the one item I enthusiastically recommend to everyone. Reading thousands of posts here, on bimmer.org, and on e46fanatics.com, I've never seen a post from someone who regretted getting the sport-pack, but I have seen several from people who regretted NOT getting it.

max93 · June 2001

Mike, if you have some base figures to base your lease vs. buy argument, I would appreciate seeing them. I'm looking to lease for 30 months vs buying and would like to know my negotiating room (after already agreeing on a purchase price) when finalizing with the dealer. Thanks!

patrikk · June 2001

Thx.

allano · June 2001

Yes there actually was AM Stereo (I have a receiver somewhere downstairs) but it never caught on because it sounded really noisy, was trying to compete with FM Stereo and occurred around the time that AM Stations were changing to an all-talk or all-sports format. Doomed by both technology and the times.

postoak · June 2001

The cloth looks great! Now, how do I go about ordering some? Will the dealership have information on them, as far as colors go?

allano · June 2001

I believe digital audio tape suffered the same copywrite objections from the recording industry as mp3s, DVDs and HDTV are suffering now. If a _digital_ media is recordable, then recording studios don't want to issue their copywrited material on that media because copies are as good as the original. As long as you purchased the original, analog tape copies are acceptable because the music is degraded with each copy. The recording industry accepted CDs _long_ before personal CD burners were thought to be economically feasible.

jasonkureejii · June 2001

Great pics of your 330i! Although I'm not one for cloth seats, I'd say that the seats are a great compliment to the white exterior....congratulations! Have fun!!!

drcr · June 2001

Gosh, I would have loved to have those seats vs my gray leather and the respective $$. I got the leather b/c didn't want the blk ette. I have the titslv and your cloth would have been nice. Dont get me wrong, the leather is sweet just $$

Did you put on the clears? Nice! How much? How long to install? Good fit?

Steering wheel. is it standard sport? looks thick. I have to look at the profile of mine

AM stereo: learn something everyday

Vinylex: can i get it at a kmart/walmart or do I have to get online?

jenne1 · June 2001

I know Acura is American-made, front wheel drive and has a bland shape, but you get all those extras for the same price. Even with it being made in US, I hear the reliability is excellent.

Even more troubling, I've heard "whispers" that BMW's aren't quite as reliable. Am I justified to now lean towards the Acura, or am I just paranoid?

Test drove the Mercedes C240 yesterday. Was impressed except with the acceleration, I've ruled them out. the Lexus ES300 is too cramped in the back, so as they say on Weakest Link, "goodbye"

postoak · June 2001

drcr - I'm pretty sure I've seen the Lexol Vinylex and the Leather Conditioner at Walmart. You should also be able to find them at an automotive supply house. Personally, I prefer to call a 1-800 number, give my credit card information, and have the products delivered right to my front door -- delivery charges are about the same as the salestax you save. You can do a web search and find a number of websites that have the product (many allow online ordering, which I don't like, but you may). But, in case you don't want to go to that trouble, just call 1-877-796-8300. I've dealt with this company with no problems, and they have Lexol products.

denright · June 2001

Any word on your car's status? Mine is on the train heading to the port, status 182.

Wondering if we're really going to get our cars at the same time afterall.

shipo · June 2001

All things are relative when comparing reliability. The only "Problem" as in actual flaw, that I have seen with any consistency on the E46 over the last three years was the "Auxiliary Fan" problem with many manual transmission equipped 3-Series cars. It turns out that BMW got a bad batch of fans from Siemens AG. While it seemed to take BMW a while to acknowledge the problem, they did replace all problem fans in the field with a new Bosch unit as well as all cars entering the US with the old fans as of sometime in May 2001. In one case, one of our members here on the 3-Series board had his car overheat and his local dealer offered him a new car, which if I am not mistaken, he is due to pick up soon.

As for my personal experience, I have a very early production E46 (built in December of 1998), as such if there were any design problems, I would most likely have experienced them. You will be happy to know that so far, I have only had to replace two small taillight bulbs (one on each side). I can live with that. ;-)

It is true that some people feel that BMWs do not have a reputation for reliability. In my opinion, that is ancient history. For a company to design a high-end luxury/performance car so well that even the early production models exhibit no apparent bugs is a very strong testament for BMW and their design and quality control teams. It might be true that the Acura you are considering would be even more reliable than a 3-Series, in my case, I am more than willing to change a few bulbs in exchange for driving a car (large enough for my family) that has a driving experience unrivaled by anything this side of $50,000.

Best Regards,
Shipo

jasonkureejii · June 2001

I was in the exact position you were about a month ago when I was looking into getting an 2002 Acura TL or TL-Type S. I test drove all the cars you did except for the MB C240...didn't want to waste my time with a car that I already assumed lacked umph and didn't want to spend $40+ on the C320 with options. I thought I was ready to get the Acura (great deal for what you pay), until I test drove it for a second time. I had to give Acura credit for the best deal in the near luxury bracket, but I couldn't get past how cheap the interior seemed (leather, layout, material, etc.). I didn't say anything until my girlfriend mentioned the same thing...one of the few times I had to agree with her. If I'm going to pay $30+ for a car, I wanted something that didn't reek "well, we skimped here and there to bring the sticker down". Don't get me wrong, it is still a great car...

The Lexus ES300 was also a great car with a more luxurious feel with its interior, but it was too much of a cruiser for me...girlfriend said I looked too damn young to be driving it. I'm unsure whether the 2002 model will keep that style or go for a more sportier model. The IS was very nimble and fun, but it should've had a manual, redid the guage layout, added a center armrest, and did away with some of the toyish style.

Actually, I never looked into an Audi A4 either...but either way, I was satisfied... no, make that ecstatic, when I test drove the 325i...I guess I really missed having a manual, too. I was smiling the whole way through the test drive. I loved the layout of the interior...and it's more spacious than I had imagined. It stops on a dime, doesn't feel like a tank around corners, enough acceleration for my daily commute, and it just looks DAMN GOOD! None of the other test drives had me feeling that I wanted to drive more! And in all, it fell nicely within my budget with the options I wanted....can't say too much about reliability until I own it for awhile, but after being on this board for awhile and talking to others who actually own one, I put my purchase request in last month...BTW, I was also concerned about reliablility, too, at that time, but BMW has come a long way with the onset of the 3-series....

Don't let me fill your head with much of my opinion...hopefully, the test drives will unclutter all that is written down in ink or on your monitor!

hippo168 · June 2001

There are afew posts discussing leasing vs buying (financing). I'd like to share my 2c on why I decided to finance instead of leasing.

say, you are going for the exact same car, and put the same amount of down payment. Assume there is no differences in the loan rate (for 60months) vs lease rate (for 36months) -- that is what I got from my bank -- my calculation come up to a $100 difference on the monthly payment, leasing being cheaper.

So after 3 years, you will have saved $100*12months*3years on leasing = $3600. Starting from the 4th year, you go and lease another car for 2 years (for easy calculation later), and lets assume the lease payment comes up to be the same as your first lease. For the second lease, you'll also save $100/month. Over the course of the *first 5 years*, you'll have saved a total of $6000 ($100*12*5) from leasing... but you have to return the car.

If you had gone for financing in the beginning, and decide to sell the car after the 5th year, when you will have paid off the loan, I'd think you can sell it for more than $6000, esp for a bimmer. So, I think buying/financing is better, at least for me.

eddie2224 · June 2001

I didn't realize how bad leasing is in Illinois. You get charged sales tax, upfront, on the whole purchase price of the car, regardless of length of lease. AND, at lease end, if you decide to buy, you get charged again for sales tax.

I guess I now know why I was never able to get my lease calculations to work out and just ended up buying in order to avoid getting screwed. It seems that given the leasing/tax issue in Illinois, it is very hard to justify leasing over the balloon types of programs offered at high-end dealerships. I will have to look into this further, but any thoughts from other Illinois people.

thanks,
Eddie.

jenne1 · June 2001

I will test drive the 325i this upcoming weekend...the BMW mystique will be hard to pass up

jrct9454 · June 2001

First, at least one observation about your observations: how can an ES300 be more cramped in back than ANY 3er of MB C? Huh? Not the last time I sat in the back seat of these choices...

Second, reliability and fit/finish issues mean different things to different people. I for one find the opinion offered above that the TL's interior looks "cheap" compared with a 3er to be bemusing at best, and hilarious at worst. Even with the upgrades that came with the E46, I have never heard this described as anything but a weakness of the 3er, never a strength. I don't think there is any body of available objective data [as opposed to anecdotal evidence offered up in a forum like this one] that doesn't have the TL as a car that is more likely to be trouble-free than any BMW, including the E46.

Having said that, to me the most important things you should be thinking about are two-fold:

-Drive both cars over the same route, if possible, and see for yourself how the total experience adds up. No one else's opinion on this topic matters except yours.

-Think about the dealers involved, from whom you will be buying and seeking service and problem-solving. AGAIN, no opinions in this forum are worth two cents if they do not take into account the quality of the business people with whom you will actually be doing business.

Finally, on the latter topic, remember that you are more likely going to need to avail yourself of the BMW dealer than the Acura dealer when it comes to problem-solving. If you have lots of confidence on that topic, then the tactile differences between the cars probably lean toward the 3er. If you have doubts, think hard...

As for problems, there actually have been quite a few for the E46, though a lot of it is old news involving things that have long since been resolved in production. The cooling fan business on the manual trans cars is actually only the latest in a long line of electronic glitches, but they tend to get resolved with reasonable speed, and again assuming you are dealing with a competent, good-faith service provider, shouldn't be a big concern.

A last thought: if you plan to keep a car a REALLY long time, like 10 years or more and in excess of 100k miles, you had better start setting aside a fair amount of change if you pick any German car over its Japanese competition. As cars get really used up, they all fail in one manner or form, but the cost to make it right gets really steep when you are dealing with BMW or MB. It's generally less expensive to run any Honda product to its life-end than anything from Munich or Stuttgart.

errickson · June 2001

I really don't pesonally care to go down this road, but when I read your post, I couldn't resist....

We went through the EXACT SAME CALCULATIONS when trying to figure out whether to finance or not.
DEJA VU!!

The only other thing we considered was purchasing "Certified New" every two to three years (assuming you could find what you wanted),
thus avoiding the instant "hit" you take when you drive off the new car lot!

errickson · June 2001

....especially about the Honda. As much as I am in total bliss with my new 325 sitting in the garage, I must say that the 1994 Honda Accord EX that I sold earlier this year was the BEST car I have ever owned. In the SEVEN years I had it:

NOT ONE SINGLE PROBLEM WITH ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!

Not even a stupid light bulb went out! I changed the oil every 3K, and kept fresh tires on it. It was totally trouble-free for all 125K miles I owned it.

Hope to have similar luck with my BMW (but not expecting too)!

denk · June 2001

I would agree with hippo and eddie. I have never run a purchase vs lease analysis where leasing came out ahead.

burrsr · June 2001

Your analysis is sound except for TWO key things:

1) Does not take into account time-value of money (assume you INVESTED the $100/month).
2) At the end of 5 years, you will have had almost TWO (1.67) brand-new cars while leasing, while buying yields ONE 5-year-old car -- not exactly apples-to-apples. For those who prefer to have a brand-new car every 3 years (not in and of itself a practical decision, but a popular one for auto enthusiasts), leasing makes it economically attractive and relatively painless come car-transition time.

Other reasons, such as tax deductibility for business expenses, also make leasing more financially attractive for certain individuals.

jasonkureejii · June 2001

I agree that much of this is completely subjective when topics come down to interior or exterior aesthetics, but to be honest, I didn't find it hilarious when I found the Acura's interior to be mediocre at best, because I wanted to really overlook it....but in the end, couldn't. I didn't say that BMW's 3ers were a great improvement either, but in my opinion, it definitely was an improvement over rippled leather on the doors, marbled fake wood (especially the ebony), Honda Acoord-like layout, and poorly-sewn leather. There's nothing wrong with the Honda's layout either...hell, I owned one through college...but I'd sure like to make the distinct difference when I step into Honda's luxury branch. Anyways, glad you found it hilarious....I didn't when forking over $30+ to a dealer.

jenne, like I said..."Don't let me fill your head with much of my opinion...hopefully, the test drives will unclutter all that is written down in ink or on your monitor!"

Beyond what is said here, by the dealer, or what's written in reviews, you'll need to really sit down, find what's most important and dessriable to you about your selection, and be meticulous before and during the test drive....

midtowneast · June 2001

I got my 330XiSteel Gray, PP,SP,Xon,Red Leather, 5spand CD yesterday and so far so good. I asked the dealer which fan was in the car he said it was the Bosch and he also had the car running for 40 minutes with no temp problems. I drove in rush hour NYC traffic form Jersey to Queens with no problem the gauge never moved off center. The car is very cozy compared to my TL-S and it has similar performance numbers. The dealer told me I had to get an alarm module to get the clown nose to blink. Looks like he was wrong according to Grumike. The only problems I have with the car is the location or reverse and the Steering wheel needs to be realigned.

Jennie The TL-S has alot more space than the 3series, performance numbers are similar and the controls is a subjective thing. Personally if I was a hard driver I would go for a stick 3Series if I was a cruiser and or needed space I would opt for the Acura. Right now for me the Acura is the family and long trip car and the 3series is the daily driver.

postoak · June 2001

Can you describe what the "red" leather looks like? Is it more of a burgundy -- or is it really red?

Yesterday in stating my preferred interior color for each exterior, I said that red with grey exterior would be my preferred choice but BMW apparently didn't agree as they didn't offer it. Seeing your entry caused me to recheck myself and I see I was wrong (obviously). So I go back to stating that red interior with Silver and Grey should look great, assuming the red isn't a bright red.

denk · June 2001

Assume any time period you wish--3 yrs, 4yrs, 5yrs, ---Purchase will except in very rare cases come out costing less from a strictly economic point of view including the time value of money as a factor.

gurumike · June 2001

Leasing - I'm really not about to write an hour long essay on how leasing is the best choice for folks keeping the car for less than 6 or 7 years (depends on how well the car holds it's value); it just is. If you add up all of the payments and cost associated with driving the car, leasing does still work out more expensive over 5, 6 and 7 years (beyond that and the purchase becomes noticibly cheaper) but to pick the buy option has two massive set backs. Firstly, you must totally abandon the "only costs a little bit more to go through life first class" rule (remember, "it's always worth it"), secondly (and perhaps more intelligently) you're not driving a brand new car after three years, allowing you to stay up with all of those issues discussed at length on this board - safety, technology, reliability and, most importantly, that special "just got a new car (new BMW?)" feeling.
Don't cheap out! If you're not going to keep the car and "run it into the ground", then lease a new one every three years (unless you live in Illinois, sorry about that!).

Cloth interior - Your dealer will need to phone BMW distribution and, after ordering the car with a valid interior like black l'ette., have them change it to your choice. For example, I ordered mine with blk l'ette. then we phone and fax distribution with a special request, in my case changing from K6SW (blk l'ette.) to E3AT (anthracite cloth). They can also do grey and sand I believe.

midtowneast · June 2001

The red is more of a maroon rather than a bright red. One of my colleagues Quote" The red seats are hot." I will try to post pictures of the cars soon.

midtowneast · June 2001

Has anyone with Xeon lights changed their fog light bulbs to more closely match the Xeons. I did this with the Acura and it looks more uniform.

postoak · June 2001

Thanks!

Cloth sounds like the way to go for me right now, but if I don't go cloth, a Silver/Tannin or Grey/Tannin sounds good, especially so given midtowneast's description of the Tannin.

genie1 · June 2001

Has anyone used it on black? What were the results? Is it too shiny? I also have some paint chips knocked off on the hood. (They're microscopic but I know they are there.) Will the Zaino help protect the finish?

While I don't want to spend my weekends polishing this car, I'd invest a couple of days now for ease of maintenance later...Is it worth the effort?

platypus · June 2001

Great pics - awesome car and color combo!!

I want to do clears for my titanium silver 330i SP, but am having a hard time justifying $280 for a purely cosmetic upgrade. I'm thinking of doing perhaps just the fronts (~$80).

Know of anyone selling a used set of clears for a sedan?

kominsky · June 2001

I have, in the past, seen several posts on e46fanatics.com about the foglight change. You might want to check the archives over there if no one here can give you any more info.

jenne1 · June 2001

you guys are feeding me the intangibles that help make decision. This will be a family car going on both daily short work commutes and occasional long trips. I hear what you say about maintenance, as we INTEND to keep the car for a while (of course, we said the same about our 99 windstar!). for me, in the end, it comes down to whether we want:

acura = japanese reliabilty/value vs.
bmw = german ride/heritage/"name recognition"

midtown, we should all be so lucky as to have one of each!

BMW 3-Series 2005 and earlier

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