Lexus ES 300/ES 330

kreativ · April 2002

The new engine may appear in 2004, with an exterior fascia update in 2005.

"If Toyota plays their cards right with the 5 year plan...with the 3rd year of production of usually powertrain revisions even introduction of a new motor and or tranny, and the 4th year of production exterior fascia update, Toyota should be using that new 3.3L in the whole Camry and related line i.e. Solara, Avalon, Sienna, Highlander, ES300 and RX300. 2004 is the target year for a new powertrain...unless Toyota marketing does something unconventional "

rebelsk · April 2002

Thanks for the information on Zaino. I ordered it and will try it on my ES.

stej · April 2002

I mentioned in a previous post that I ordered an ES 300 in Starlight Pearl with a charcoal interior. I placed the order knowing that Lexus usually only equips it in ivory or black. The dealer called me today to tell me the car can only be ordered in ivory. Has anyone else had this experience with a factory order? Am I being hoodwinked?

fredvh · April 2002

The valve cover change was made in the 3.0 in March '02.

kreativ · April 2002

Here's the article I was referring to:

http://autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=carnews&loc_code=&content_code=06190829

Any place on the 'net I can find more info on the valve cover change?

lexus1 · April 2002

Stej: I also factory ordered a starlight pearl. When I did, it was explained to me that although it is a factory order, you CANNOT order a combination that is not in the brochure. The reason you factory order is to get options that may not be available in your region or a combination that is not in the current build cycle (such as ML without Nav).

fredvh · April 2002

Lexus1 is correct. It is my understanding in regards to the Starlight Pearl that Ivory or Black are the ONLY two interior colors that one can get. This information is directly from the sales brochure. You cannot get any other color unless Lexus decides to change colors in the middle of the model year which is highly unlikely. Of course, a car manufacturer can make changes at any time. In the past Lexus dealers only get a certain option package when they arrive at the dealerships. Lexus Corporate determines what they think sells best in a certain geographical area. Recently and apparently Lexus is allowing perspective owners to "order" ES300s with any options that they want as long as it meets the allowable color combinations. For example, one could order cloth interior, but still would have to follow the brochure interior colors as they are available with their respective exterior color. I hope this helps. It is my understanding from people on this post who have special ordered an ES300 that any available option can be ordered but it takes approx. 3 months to get the vehicle.

fredvh · April 2002

This is a direct quote from a Toyota representative concerning the 3.0 engine:

"No engine is immune to damage when the oil breaks down after time. However, in response to the growing industry problem of deferred oil maintenance, Toyota has initiated a revision to the crankcase ventilation system that will help it tolerate sludge buildup somewhat longer. The design change was to the cam cover's interior baffle. The holes that allow oil vapor carried by the PCV system to condense and drip back into the cylinder head were enlarged. Still, if oil changes are deferred, this change will not eliminate the build-up of sludge. It will likely just delay the onset of engine damage."
There is a very interesting discussion going on at the "Engine Sludge/Oil Gelling- Toyota Customer Response" topic under the "Maintenance and Repair" section of Edmund's Town Hall. The above-mentioned Toyota representative is answering questions from the posts. This is very informative and you would probably need to start from the beginning of that discussion.

tk_det · April 2002

ES300 02 Sometimes when driving at resonably high speed on the eway 50-80 mph and I back off and just "feather" the gas pedal, I get a little hesitation or jerk in the car for a half second as if the engine were missing. It is almost as if the engine misfired but just very briefly. I have been watching my avg mph closely and it is as good as or better than when I got the car and there is never a problem at idle so I don't suspect the engine at all. Rather I think it might be when the transmission is down shifting. Anyone else been experiencing this phenomenom? Comments, suggestions? PS I am using premium gas.

sliang · April 2002

tk_det,
What is the mileage reading on your ES?
I have been experiencing the same transmission jerking many times when the speed is over 50 MPH, assuming the 5th gear was using at that speed. This happened mostly when I was driving on the free way and ease my foot on the gas pedal a little bit. But I have noticed less jerking recently (almost none) since my ES is now close to 4K miles, the transmission is much smoother than before. I would expect the transmission will further smooth up when it reaches 10K miles.
Just out of curiosity, did you hear any noise when you press the black plastic cover for the climate control system? Mine makes some noise, it looks like the plastic cover was not secured tight enough. I am not sure whether this is a common issue for every ES, or just local to mine.

kreativ · April 2002

I haven't driven my '02 ES enough, but I experience exactly what you described in my LS. I've been wondering about that for a few months now.

kreativ · April 2002

I'd heard of various creaks, squeaks, and rattles with the '02 ES, and not surprisingly, they've been in all different places. The car's so quiet with the windows up and stereo off that any small noise really makes its presence felt.
I don't have what you mentioned, but I do have this ticking noise coming from what sounds like left of the steering wheel. It's annoying, but not enough for me to want the Lexus service center to take things apart and possibly create other creaks and squeaks.

micalene · April 2002

My new ES does not do this{hesitation when easing off the accelerator}, but our GS has been doing it for quite a while. Of course,dealer could not duplicate the "gripe".It feels like throttle switch(?) or computor vice a tranny glitch.Anyone else with this problem who's had it fixed?

stej · April 2002

Thanks for your input on factory orders. My dealer seemed like a good guy, but I could not get the cynic to stop questioning...always good to know I am being dealt with honestly. Nothing left but the wait!

dbhatia · April 2002

I have been experiencing the same transmission jerking many times when the speed is over 45 MPH, This happens mostly when I am driving in city and ease my foot from the gas pedal a little bit.
I have had my ES'02 since last 2 weeks and have already put 500 Miles ...I also have some vibrations from the engine in the morning time for few seconds before it get's warmed up ...than everthing is fine ...no noise ...just when downshifting transmission is hesitating ...let's hope with time it will learn, when I go for my 1000 miles service or check up I am going to bring this point and let you know what the service person said ...good luck and safe driving

kreativ · April 2002

Give Lexus a call too if you're not happy with the performance of the transmission. I heard enough people have complained about the '02ES that they're "evaluating the situation." It'd be nice if they issued a transmission program update (since it's all electronically controlled).
The problems may go away after you drive longer, since it's a "learning" transmission. But there's probably some baseline standards that the transmission program adheres to.

tk_det · April 2002

This is tk_det. Thanks for the quick response gentlemen and/or ladies. My car has just over 4000 miles on it. I think I shall print this last page and show it to the Lexus dealer the next time I go in. Since it is not an engine issue (I'm getting excellent milage) I feel that it is not something I need to rush off to the dealer to get looked at immediately.

Kreative: When you say give Lexus a call are you suggesting the dealer or the national customer service number?

Sliang: I'm not sure if the transmission "learns" as mileage accumulates although that would be nice but it is more likely that we drivers "learn" what action causes the reaction and then subconsciously don't do it as often.

Thanks all

tk_det · April 2002

This is tk_det again. It may sound like I am unhappy with my car but just the opposite is true I really really love it and it just these little quirks that need to be tweaked.

My car has the NAV system and I live in the metro Detroit area that has full coverage. The NAV systems when it acquires the GPS signal has a little box that appears below the compass in the upper left corner of the map. The system uses this to coordinate its position. During brief periods when the car is in a tunnel or among tall building that block the signal, the block will disappear and an internal "inertial navigation" (my words) algorithm will take over to estimate the cars position until a signal can be re-acquired. By the way, that is why you can and should do a re-calibration when you get new tires. The new circumference of the fresh tire needs to be compensated for by the algorithm.

My problem: When I got the car, the GPS box was hardly ever on. When it came on it wasn't always at the same spot on the earth. This tells me that the problem is not the satellite signal having a weak "footprint" in the area I happen to be driving in because the absence of signal was not geographically consistent.

Without a GPS signal the NAV system valiantly tried to show me where the car was and sometimes it succeeded for 15 to 20 minutes but then the internal navigation would be overwhelmed. The map pointer would go off in a random direction and I would be "driving" in the middle of a lake or "cross country" in the wrong direction some twenty or thirty mile from where I actually was. When a GPS signal was finally reacquired for a sufficient length of time the maps would snap back to the correct position.

After two trips to the dealer who tried to implement some diagnostic suggestions from factory technicians in California, the end result was that they put all the original parts back in (antenna and ECU) but couldn't come up with a reason for the GPS dropouts.

The last time I got the car back it did work different and it did work better. A GPS signal would be acquired anywhere between 2 minutes and 10 minutes from start up (previously sometimes not at all) and once acquired it stays on for the duration of the trip (previously it only stayed on briefly).

Yesterday however I didn't get a signal for the first 15 minutes of driving and the car got lost again. I was exiting the e-way to head over to the dealer when of course it acquired a signal again. I plan to have this addressed again when I go in for my 5000 mile checkup and I really don't want to lemon law this thing as the car is beautiful and I love it. But Lexus is reluctant to switch out the part because it is so expensive. (The service rep has told me this.)

Anybody out there experiencing the same problem? Was it resolved? Any techies got any ideas?

Sorry for the wordiness.

sunshine60105 · April 2002

Has anybody had any transmission, Engine problems or any other problems with the ES 300? I am considering the option of buying a ES 300 that just came off a lease.....

karklin · April 2002

Has anyone removed the CD changer from the glove compartment of a Lexus ES-300.
Any advice would be appreciated.
Thanks Leo-K

sunshine60105 · April 2002

Has anybody had any transmission, engine problems or any other problems with the 2000 Lexus ES 300?
I am considering the option of buying a 2000 Lexus ES 300 off a lease! Thanks!

sr97 · April 2002

I've had my 2002 ES300 for two months now and also noticed the transmission problem. I reported it to the dealer at the 1000mi check-up and they "could not reproduce it at this time".
Except for the transmission, I'm very happy with the car. It is very quiet and the interior has a rich, luxurious feeling.
My previous car was a 97 Camry V6 with the 4-speed automatic which was much smoother than this new 5-speed in the 2002 ES300. We should organize a petition to Lexus Corporate to investigate and fix the transmission.

-SR

kreativ · April 2002

You could give Lexus headquarters (not just your local dealer) a call, let them know about the transmission, and ask them if Lexus has planned to do anything about it. Try to get past just the receptionists if you can...they usually don't know much of anything.

I'm not far from their headquarters in Torrance, CA. So if I ever pass by, I'll go in and bug them in person.

kreativ · April 2002

'02 ES pricing seems to be at the lowest point thus far. If you're in an automotive hot spot, I wouldn't pay any more than $800 over invoice for a low to mid-level package. Internet sales departments appear to be the most willing to deal, and it's the most hassle-free. Good luck.

amken · April 2002

I am considering buying my first Lexus,a 1995 ES 300, from a private party, for $8750. It has 136,000 miles. Any advice about this model and whether or not you think this is a good price for the miles etc, would be very much appreciated!

cwdavis1 · April 2002

Just to let you know....I have checked with about 20 dealers in the midwest region from Oklahoma, Iowa, Missouri, Illinois, Kentucky, Tenn. and even North and South Carolina and I think that is it. I finally put my order in on a 2002 ES 300-Silver with light charcoal and Nav/ML and was given a $3,000 discount. I was able to get that price from a dealer in Missouri and again in Oklahoma (the latter very reluctantly)---otherwise most discounts were in the $1000-2000 range. Others would not budge off list. Amazingly, dealers are not aggressively pricing the ES and very few have any in stock at least from those I checked (I actually emailed 40 dealers). I am moving to LA in the summer but thought I would get it now (scheduled to come in June) rather than wait and see if I could get an even better deal in LA. We are now getting closer to the end of the 2002 model year so depreciation will become a factor. I did consider waiting until the 2003 model came out but felt pricing discounting would lessen. How is everyone else doing on pricing?? I am somewhat bothered about the recent transmission comments however.

rebelsk · April 2002

I used the Zaino Z-2 and am quite pleased with the results. The car feels quite smooth and has a great shine. I have another question for ES owners. I got my 2002 ES in January and will be reaching 10000 miles in a few weeks. Do most of you get the service from Lexus dealers or do you go to independent places. The independents are certainly a lot cheaper and I wonder if it will make much difference to go to a lexus dealer. What are the advantages of paying the premeium when bringing it to a Lexus dealer?

fredvh · April 2002

You have 10K miles already? Have you had any troubles and what kind of highway mpg have you been getting? Do you use premium fuel?

kreativ · April 2002

10K service for '02 ES is basically an oil change and a tire rotation. The price you're going to see for that at a Lexus dealer is $90+. If they charge even more and tell you that's because they do more, they just want more of your money. Also, Lexus dealers like to charge a premium on checks and inspections when they'll gladly do it for you for free during an oil change if you ask. After all, if they find anything wrong, that just means they get to rip you off again to fix it, or have Lexus corp. pay for it if it's under warranty.

What you do get at a Lexus dealer is a nice loaner car for the more expensive services, a much nicer waiting area for the shorter services, and maybe friendlier service for those who don't mind paying to be treated more nicely. I took my LS in recently for an oil change because they were willing to give me an '02 ES loaner car while they were doing the change. I baby my '02 ES for the most part, so this let me test out the ES more aggressively.

You can have other places do the same oil change/tire rotation service for about $30. If you don't have any idea about oil quality, oil filter quality, or tire rotations, I wouldn't take it to just any independent service place though. Try a place that works only on Toyotas, or your local Toyota dealer. As long as the service advisor there isn't a complete moron (like the one at my local Toyota dealer), he'll know that something as easy as an oil change and tire rotation can be done on an ES just like if it were a Camry V6.

If you plan to take it elsewhere, here's some things to keep in mind:
1. Check what brand and type oil they are using. It should be 5W-30 or 10W-30, new (not recycled) oil, and from a name brand you recognize.
2. Make sure the oil filter is of acceptable quality. This is what helps keep your oil clean. Most independent places use cheap $1 oil filters (Fram, Champ, etc.) that just plain stink. Some good brands of oil filters are: Purolator PureOne ($5), Mobil1 ($10), and the Toyota OEM filter that is made in Japan by Denso (90915-20003 or 90915-20004, the latter filtering better. I've seen it for $7 at Toyota, $14 at Lexus for the exact same filter) The domestic-made Toyota oil filter isn't as good, but it's much cheaper at $3-5 and is certainly better than the ones used at most independent shops.
3. For tire rotation, make sure that your wheel bolts are hand-torqued to 76ft-lb, in the appropriate criss-cross pattern. Overtightening will cause problems.

rebelsk · April 2002

So far, knock on wood,I have not had any problems and have been very happy with the car. I do a lot of driving and have been using premieum fuel and averaging 27-28 highway mpg. The engine is very responsive and I really enjoy the Levinson Stereo system. I got the car in starlight pearl as a special order as I had not seen the color on a car and am very happy with the color as it changes depanding on the amount of sunlight.

66tall · April 2002

Hi all,
In considering the ES300 I've been watching this space with great interest over the past few months, but there are still three questions for which I have not yet found answers.
Perhaps someone out there can elighten me??

1. What Internet sites (such as Autobytel.com) would you recommend buying through (if any)? Or, would you recommend sticking with simply emailing dealers directly for best results?

2. Speaking of dealers, can anybody recommend (or warn me about) any dealers in the PA/NJ/DE/MD area?

3. Finally, how would you say the Air Conditioning does when the weather gets hot? My current car's A/C is HORRIBLE, so I'm hoping to upgrade with this car...

Thanks a LOT for any insights you can provide!
I really could use your help!!!

woobah · April 2002

Hi, nice board, with a lot of useful information. I was curious as to what age brackets are buying the ES 300. Which one of these brackets apply to all you ES 300 owers:
under 28
28-35
36-45
46-54
55-64
65 +
me, I am in the 36-45

justfind6 · April 2002

If you can afford the maintenance, and the car is in good condition, and you really want an ES 300, it's probably a good buy.
My friend just had his 130,000 service on a '93 ES 300, and although it needed $1200 worth of replacement suspension parts (not bad after almost ten years), the tech told him it should last another 130,000 easy.

However, if you're buying this car on a very tight budget, I'd say don't do it. If a sudden $1000 repair bill could break the bank, you're probably better off going for something else - like a much cheaper, newer car (say a recent Corolla or Civic, etc).

Just as an example, I left my '96 ES 300 in for a service, and it had a slight fuel leak - needed a fuel rail (if I remember correctly). Also needed a couple of other minor things, but a $70 service bill turned into a $700 repair bill.

Basically, you have to make the right decision for you.

Dave

kreativ · April 2002

1. Use them all. This gives you the best chance of landing a good deal. E-mailing the dealer directly with a specific purchase offer is probably your best bet after you've done a little research into how much these cars are selling for in your area.

kreativ · April 2002

I'm in the "under 28" category, but according to Lexus the stereotypical ES buyer is a married, 50 year old male. Guys that have gotten past their sports car craze and want a smooth, peaceful ride. Or buying the car for their wifee.
Basically, an old fogey's car. haha.
Of course, you'll probably find more of the younger owners talking online about their ES. I don't quite see my grandpa chatting about cars online.

gambiaman · April 2002

Very funny. 50ish. Bought a MY02 last week for wifee. Traded an MY00. Car does have a very smooth/quiet ride.
Fuel type? I used 89 octane in MY00 and in my 01 RX 300. Premium not required or needed. Right? What do others use?

sunshine60105 · April 2002

Do you like your RX 300? I am considering buying a 2000 RX off a lease!

Thanks!

lenscap · April 2002

I'm in the 28-35 category.

In my area, the ES 300 is extremely popular with people (mostly men it seems) in their late 20s/early 30s.

To provide some examples, the following people I know drive ES 300s:

1. Friend from growing up (33, on his second ES)
2. Roommate from college (33)
3. Brother's friend (36)
4. Friend from graduate school (32)
5. Another friend (30)

rtorreca · April 2002

I'm 29 but already suffering from mid-life (quarter-life?) crisis

. Before I bought my '02 ES, I considered the BMW 325 - a car I perceive is more appropriate for my age. I asked most of my friends and family which car they would choose and most guys (ages 28-33) liked the BMW better and most women (ages 27-32) liked the es300 better. My mom likes the es300 better. She likes it so much she's picking one up in October.

If I could do it all over again, I would pick the bimmer and pick the es300 5 years from now. I feel old driving the ES.

texas83 · April 2002

I bought my 2002 ES about a month ago. From time to time the transmission feel like it slips. Mostly notice it at low gear. Feels like it spins and then finally kicks. Causes a bit of a delay which can be dangerous when changing lanes or wanting to enter traffic. Anyone else notice this?

rebelsk · April 2002

I took my 2002 ES for a 500 mile roundtrip between Masachusetts and New York and averaged over 30mpg for the trip. I have about 10000 miles on the car and maybe when they break in, the mileage goes up. I did use premieum fuel for the trip. By the way, I am 48 and have only driven Hondas, Toyotas, Acura, And Lexus over the past twenty years.

rtorreca · April 2002

I experience the same problem with my 02 es300. This is actually one of my major gripes. When slowing down to make a turn, I feel the transmission "kick." I am definitely not impressed with the passing power of this car. Not very confident when passing or merging into traffic.

I drove a 00 es loaner and it had a much smoother tranny than the 02. I hope the 02 can be fixed.

Some people here say the tranny "learns" your driving so it should get better. I have 600 miles on mine and it still hasn't "learned" how I drive. Sounds like BS to me.

alpha01 · April 2002

Hasnt there been a TSB issued for a programming fix on early production ES300s? Perhaps I am imagining things, but it is something you ES owners may want to look into.
~alpha

rtorreca · April 2002

http://www.alldata.com/TSB/31/02310308.html

Does not mention tranny.

hk2la · April 2002

I've read most of the posts here regarding Zaino and printed their website pages, and looking at all their products gave me a headache. For those of you who have used this product on your new ES, can you please tell me if the following are the steps you took?
1.) Wash car with standard laundry detergent (did you use something else? I think kreativ said not to use Dawn.)
2.) Use Z-1 (Polish Lok)
3.) Use Z-2 (Show car polish for clear coated finishes).

Do you recommend ZFX? And then did you also use Z-6 Ultra Clean?

I've had my ES washed and hand waxed already. I would greatly appreciate it if someone would take a minute and let me know what steps you took when you used Zaino. Thanks in advance.

lenscap · April 2002

I've used Zaino and love the results. Here's what I did:

1. Washed with Dawn to remove any existing layers of wax (only do this for this first wash; after the first application of Zaino use a wash recommended for cars).
2. Applied Z-2 (to which I added ZFX drops). Note: You do not need Z-1 with the ZFX, which is good because that eliminates a whole extra step.
3. Waited about 30 minutes and wiped off the Z-2.
4. Sprayed and wiped Z-6 on the car.

The whole process took abot 1-1/2 hours.

Good luck.

sddlw · April 2002

I would not think a laundry detergent would be a good idea. They usually have a bunch of additives. Use soap formulated for cars, or as recommended by all the Zaino folks, a first wash in a high alkaline liquid soap like Dawn to remove any wax the dealer might have used in prepping the car.

The true fanatics will clay or polish the car before applying Zaino to remove any other environmental contaminates and smooth the surface for the best shine possible. ....remember this product came from the show car people... and many of the Zaino afficianados (sp?) are absolutely nuts about their car's appearance.

I've used Zaino now for about a year and a half and love it. I use the older formulation which sometimes requires more dry time. The biggest mistake most people make in getting started with Zaino is that they use too much. It then takes a long time to dry and buff off. I like to wet the applicator with the Z-6 and then use only a few small drops of Z-2 at a time. I can barely see the haze when it drys.

Check out the Zaino chat group over in Maintanence. Your sure to get good advice there.

tclemons · April 2002

I am in the 58 year old category and rapidly approaching the 59 level (May). My wife has a 98 ES 300 (CPO) that we have had for about 2 1/2 years and we both really like it. I usually do not drive the car unless we are going out of town. My wife likes to do her needle-point and tell me how to drive. We have always used 91 octane and we usually average 28-30 highway (at 70-80, depending on speed limit). Around town, she averages 16-17 with a 6 mile commute to work.

Re: Transmission - I notice sometimes when driving on the freeway and slowing down, there is a slight "pause?" that almost seems like I have touched the brake and gas at same time. Never had a problem (24K+ miles), but still just barely noticeable.

I like the '02 ES-300 but my wife doesn't particularly care for it. She said her next vehicle will be a RX-300. Wants a SUV and doesn't have any rational reason for wanting it. Do they ever have a rational reason? We all know wives usually get what they want. After all, they got us!

gs4rx3 · April 2002

I am about to buy a 2002 ES300 and need to decide on a few options. First, I cannot decide if VSC is worth it. I can understand wanting it in a rear wheel drive car. It makes sense to me to cut the power to a spinning wheel to prevent the car from sliding. But with a front wheel drive car I don't picture that being as worthwhile. If it is icy or raining out and the tires slip, they usually just slip until they catch some traction and go in the direction I have them facing. Has anyone here had any experiences with their VSC that would make them think it was a worthwhile option? It isn't cheap. If it helps to know, I live in Chicago.

Also, just curious how many people on this board have chosen the chrome wheel option with their ES300. I am trying to figure out if it is a popular option or not. In some ways I think it makes the car look more sporty, and in other ways I think it is too glitzy for the more corporate nature of the car. I know it comes down to personal preference, but I'm curious what others have to say about it.

gambiaman · April 2002

Yes I love my RX. Not as quiet or as peppy as ES but still very nice and more flexible. Can't say more than that here or else someone will remind me that this is the "ES300" board. Go to RX board for more info.

Lexus ES 300/ES 330

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