Toyota Echo

janbee · March 2001

Love the ECHO accessories!! Check out the website www.echo.co.nz ..I love the red trim on the steering wheel, guages and a/c vents, I would also be interested in the headlight surrounds...what do you guys think?? maybe to flashy?? I think its fun and thats what the echo should be!! Do you think Canada/U.S. will ever get these??

blue_echo · March 2001

I've had my electric blue Echo for 3 months and I love it. (And I've yet to see another one this color)! But I'm very unhappy about the stereo. I put a CD in and it got stuck, and now when I try to use the CD player I get a message that says "Error" and it just eats the CD without playing it. I brought it back to the dealer who of course said he would replace it, but I have another CD player and changer that I want to install. Rather than have the dealer put in a new Echo stereo and then have to get it replaced again, I asked the dealer if he would just install my own stereo and give me the new Echo player as a backup. He wasn't crazy about the idea, then said he could only do it if I supply the installation kit. But theaudio places that have it won't sell it without letting them do the installation. Does anyone know where I can get one of these kits? Or maybe I should just let the dealer replace the Echo stereo and then replace it again. Any opinions?

koyoteee · March 2001

The Echo has a great CD player/sound system, especially for this price of car, and many posters have attested to that. I think you just got a bad one, unfortunately. My advice would be to let the dealer install a new Echo CD player, which I'm sure you'll be happy with, once you hear the quality. Best of luck.

koyoteee · March 2001

hera23, that's crazy, what those Alberta dealers are telling you (unless you live way up north or something, where they could probably charge what they want). In fact, I doubt if Toyota would let them get away with charging over MSRP. I recently leased a 2001 5 speed, and the price came out about $500 under MSRP, $15,700, I think, with air conditioning, and the cd/power locks upgrade option. You should have no trouble getting $300-500 off MSRP. Note that the price quoted by mravery in message 1250 is US$ Let us know how it goes, it's a great car!

tmcc1 · March 2001

In Jan I bought a Echo in Vancouver B.C. area.
Got it for $925 Canadian under MSRP.
Dave

toytech · March 2001

The radio removal procedure is located in the Echo service manual . It's removal is listed in the instrument panel section. The quick and dirty is; the remove the heater control buttons , under the two removed knobs, you will remove the two black phillips head screws. Then pull straight out the trim panel from around the heater control cluster. On the top of the exposed lower radio finish panel remove two more phillips screws. Pull the ash tray out completely and in that opening you will find two more phillips screws to remove. Remove that panel and there you will find the radio awaiting. and as most shop manuals will tell you, "installation is the opposite of removal". ;I)

babyboomer · March 2001

Noticed something strange in the graphic of an Echo in the Jacksonville, Fl Times-Union newspaper dated Feb 17th. Orange Park Toyota's ad had an Echo drawn with the gas cap cover on the wrong side.

I never have figured out why some cars have the gas fill on the left and some on the right. One old car I use to have had the gas filled behind the tag in the rear. I prefer filling the gas tank from the driver's side since more convenient. How many times have you stopped to gas other cars and wondered which side that gas cap is on?

kneisl1 · March 2001

My 79 240d had a pneumatic locking system that when you locked the drivers door either with the knob or the key, the trunk and the gas filler also locked. It took the gas station attendent and I about 15 minutes to figure out how to unlock the filler so I could fill the tank the first time I had to buy diesel.

Paul

mschaffer · March 2001

Babyboomer,

We own an Echo and the gas cap is on the drivers side. It could be that the photo is reversed.

amaranth · March 2001

Hi everyone! I've been looking over this site ever since I became interested in the Echo (pretty recently). I went in to look at a Corolla, and grabbed an Echo brochure as well. since the sales folks were pretty much ignoring me, I took some time to go over the brochures and was surprised to see all the Echo offered (especially in terms of room) for a lesser price than the Corolla. I had been checking out the usuals -- Sentra, Saturn, Corolla, Civic (stayed away from the Focus because I was a bit wary about the reliability), and nothing really grabbed me. That dealership didn't have a 5speed Echo to drive, but later on we stopped by another dealer's lot just after closing and I found just the one -- silver, 3-in-1 stereo, fold-down seat, intermittent wipers & power steering, a/I and the all-weather package (I'm in Rochester, NY). I got to drive it a couple days later and since then I've been stuck on the Echo. What fun!

vitaminj -- I'd love to hear how things go with your Echo and all the snow we get here in Western NY! I previously had a '97 neon (totalled

) which I could handle reasonably well in the snow, even with the so-called "all-weather tires". I'd consider snow tires if it were necessary (had considered them but never gotten around to it for the Neon), but am curious to hear other's experience with the snow.

Anyway, I was wondering if you guys were pretty much able to get your Echos at the TMV or carsdirect.com price, or if you had to do a lot of haggling. And I wanted to let you all know that all the enthusiasm I've seen on this board has made me want the Echo all the more!

mnoras · March 2001

Why don't you guys visit

http://consumerreview.com/categories/auto/categories_10.asp

and write a nice review for Echo? (click on midsize/compact)

Let other people know that this is the good and happy car, why keep it secret?

Thanks,

Maciej

amaranth · March 2001

I've been impressed with how many posts this topic gets daily, but when I finally decide to post, everyone vanishes! boo - hoo... well, I still hope (cross fingers) to have an Echo by the end of the week...

danny28 · March 2001

Hi there. You're not alone today.

danny28 · March 2001

Sorry I've been away for awhile. The original post describing my aftermarket cruise control experience is 0094 on this topic. Ever since I sorted out the installation, I've been very happy with it. I use it all the time, even on some 60 KPH expressways to ensure that i don't get a speeding ticket.

danny28 · March 2001

See post # 344 for a link to the US dept. of energy. The last time I looked, the Echo had the best mileage of any 5 passenger conventional gasoline vehicle. This excludes hybrids and diesels, of course.

aeroterremer · March 2001

I thought it was interesting that the ECHO is probably the only car under $20K on both lists.

danny28 · March 2001

see also post#1039

danny28 · March 2001

Yipee!

1st time to break the "5 liter" barrier !

Here's the whole scoop:
Date: Mar. 1,2001
Start time: approx. 9AM
End time: approx. 3PM
Start temp: -1C
End temp: +1C
Avge temp: 0C
Payload: about 135 KG (300#) plus full tank
Tire pressure: 42 PSIG
Wind: 20 KPH, tail wind 1/2 way, head wind 1/2 way.
Traffic: light
Terrain: flat (that's all we've got !)
Road condition: dry
Speed: 90 KPH (56 MPH) both ways under cruise control
Start odometer: 15944 KM
End odometer: 16138 KM (about 10,000 miles on the clock)
Start fuel: visible in the spout.
End fuel: added 9.3 litres (up to the cap threads!)
Engine start condition: warm for 1st 1/2, cooled for 3+ hrs before 2nd half.
Fuel consumption: 4.8 litres/100km (49 MPG (US), 59 MPG (Imperial))

Yahoo! I can't wait to do some serious travelling this summer.....
P.S. who says an automatic has to gobble gas ????
P.P.S. If we ever get together as a fan club, a gas mileage contest has to be
on the agenda!
Maybe we can figure out a nice weekend tour to go on, and start and end the
event with a group "topingup" session, supervised by Kniesl1 , our own personal
maintenance trainer !! How about it Paul, are you up for it ?

Danny

dsgecho · March 2001

Congratulations! That is about the highest mpg I have heard of although Consumer Reports got 46 mpg in their hiway mpg test. That is as good as some of the Prius mpg posted elsewhere. I drive both and have gotten 57-59 mpg in some all day 50-100 mile trips in the Prius [temps above 50 F].

echolalia · March 2001

Danny 28: you are lucky to get 49 mpg on your ECHO.
Mine is a 4 doors automatic and the current combined city/hwy mileage is only 29 mpg. I used to get 33 mpg combined but it is getting worse now.
Too many rattles come from the dashboard. The door speakers now rattles alot even I turned up the volume slightly. Maybe too much cheap plastics material on the dashboard and on the doors.

kaz6 · March 2001

Hello fellow echoistas!!! I just got back from a trip to Baja California to visit friends. I can attest to the capability of carrying 5 passengers while in Ensenada. Avg height of group 5'5". The duraion was only 40 minutes of mixed driving. One thing became very clear: if you plan on carrying even 3 people with you the suspension needs some assistance. I remained fairly level although it bottomed easily on sharp bumps.
Another aspect was tested: off road duty. LOL
Well, dirt roads with some serious inclines and deep ruts from water erosion. It handled some pretty bad roads fairly well.
As far as gas mileage; 35mpg avg. overall. Included carrying 2-3 passengers for half of the time in mixed driving.
The engine is still smooth as silk and the body tight as a drum.
echolalia:sorry to hear you are still having problems with yours. Mine has been stellar so far @ 5500 miles.
Amaranth: Welcome and congratulations!!!

koyoteee · March 2001

Danny, thanks for the cruise control info. Could you tell me what conversion factors you're using to go from km/litre (or l/100 km) to Imperial MPG? I seem to be only getting around 44 mpg in mixed winter driving. Thanks.

kneisl1 · March 2001

I was thinking more along the lines of a car stuffing contest a la VW Beetle where you see how many people you can fit in an ECHO. Of course, you need fairly small people for that...I was thinking we could drive to some college campus and recruit college co-eds. As its my car I get to get in first...
Pretty impressive mileage obtained with an antomatic transmission no less. That would take away one of my main objections to automatics. I'd be curious to see a comparison done with tires set at 32 psi. I had my own mileage contest driving from Saratoga Springs to Cobleskill NY about 60 -70 miles. I was going 40 mph in fifth gear and got buzzed by irate motorists who wanted to go faster, including a duel with an 18 wheeler who tailgated me and ran up and back while honking his horn! I won when I slammed on the brakes while going up a long hill and he had to panic stop, locking his wheels and sliding from side to side. I had to discontinue scientific observations of fuel economy after that and run like hell! It was all in good fun...
Kaz6 How many miles in Baja do you do? I'm planning on taking my motorcycle way up north into BC and the Yukon with a possible shot at the Dempster Highway if the weather holds. Was toying with the idea of taking ECHO as you could sleep dry in it and it would be safer from animals. I remember crawling under ECHO in the dealers showroom and looking at the suspension components and the underside of the car in general and how light weight the parts looked. I wondered how they would hold up under such conditions. I imagine the Dempster would destroy my new ECHO (smashed headlights, smashed windshield, scratched paint, dents all over).

kaz6 · March 2001

How many miles? Well, it's not like I go to the southern part...I had a bud in NYC that rode his BMW dual-purpose all the way down from NYC!!!
Ensenada is not that far south...BUT you don't really want to fill your car/motorcycle with Mexican gasoline!
As far as how the parts will hold up...yes, you'd probably destroy the headlights! Not because of the material but rather the size and upright nature of them.
I was afraid that I was going to damage the bodyside cladding when I bottomed out in the dirt but the frame rails kept them from harm.
The tires are pretty useless in the mud too...but then I wouldn't recommend off-roading with Potenza's at any rate.

In another unrelated matter: I made a slight dent in the rear door along the crease line when I used my butt to push the door shut! LOL I was a bit overzealous...the dent is more like a vertical crease. So Echo owners...make sure if you are pushing the door shut when ajar, make sure you push along the trailing edge of the door.
Being that the side-crash ratings are the same as the Focus 4-door, I am not concerned with safety.
Soft metal takes up more energy than hard.

amaranth · March 2001

kaz6 and danny28 -- thanks for the welcome!

I noticed that www.nhtsa.dot.gov finally got their front crash test ratings up for the Echo (4-dr). 4 stars for both driver and passenger, which seems to be pretty typical for cars of this class (including the heavier ones). So much for being turned into Spam -- it's no worse than any of the others. Civic, Jetta, and Saturn SL got 5 stars for front crashes, but Saturn also got lower side crash test scores. I was kind of waiting for the results before making my decision, but now that everything's OK, I hope to soon have an Echo in my driveway!

Anyone have any thoughts on snow tires vs. studs?

mravery · March 2001

I have a sporty little slugger, but I want to set it out from the rest of this american crowd, any one live in new zealand that would want to do some swapping? I find stuff in america you want, you get me some fo those ac trims,

any one in the us been able to find the toyota luggage rack for the echo? thinking about putting in a sun roof, and the luggage rack, but i want the one designed for the roof tracks on the echo

mpgman · March 2001

Thanks. MPG seems to be all over the map..no doubt based on how people drive. I drove an Echo and was impressed with the visibilty. Thought they could have made a longer driver seat track. What kind of armrest does Whitney have for it? Other than the mpg, seems hard to turn down the 01 Elantra...even CR gives it a thumbs up and it comes loaded for a lot less than a fully optioned Echo.

kneisl1 · March 2001

In post 1273 I didn't mean to say I had gotten 60-70 miles per gallons, only that the distance from the two towns was that far!

vitaminj · March 2001

Amaranth- It's been a week and 2 days since I picked up my 2 door silver Echo. I
found myself driving in the snow the 2nd day I had it, and I was a nervous wreck. Since that day, I've only been in one situation where I was driving in very wet snow. Slush, if you will. I was fine. Of course, I haven't checked the air pressure like I said I was. But I will, and I'll keep you posted as well. Oh, I also drove it in high winds to and from Toronto this past weekend. It was a bit hard to handle,at times. But no more than my Tercel, in my opinion. As far as the price of my car, here's the run down; It comes with automatic transmission, the 3 in one (cassette, radio, CD player)and six speakers, power steering, AC, split rear seats, all weather package and floor mats. It Does have intermitent wipers (I didn't think it did, very happy to discover that). Anyway, I paid $12,540 which included the destination charge. Minus my trade-in, it came down to $12,1000. (This is all before taxes) And I got 6.99%APR. So, I guess that was a fair deal, based on what Edmund's was saying about TMV. Of course they tried to sell it to me at sticker. I got better at "dealing" after several attempts. I basically went to every Toyota dealer in the area and decided to work with someone that had the exact car I wanted on the lot and who wasn't pushy. That doesn't mean you shouldn't know everything possible. Car salesman seem to be very similar to eachother. My only regret is that I didn't make a lower initial offer...but that's in the past. I love my car. It's so fun to drive! It really is!

amaranth · March 2001

Can anyone tell me what "quarter stone protector" and "sports body cladding" are? I've seen some Echos with black trim along the bottom, and some without. Is this one of those options, or is it something entirely different?

amaranth · March 2001

Thanks for the response! I'm looking for a 4-dr. 5 speed, so the prices may not be exactly comparable. Right now my best offer is about $13000 with Upgrade Package #1, A/C, 3-in-1 stereo, floor mats, and the All-Weather package. Does that sound like too much? it seems like manuals are hard to find around here which may be why I'm having a tough time getting under $13000. When I showed the CarsDirect.com prices ($12778 for the same options) to the dealer, he said that he couuldn't do it because his invoice was $200 more than what CarsDirect had their invoice at (which is incidentally the same number I've seen on Edmunds and other online sites). Is that for real?

cwo4 · March 2001

I paid $12.9K for the same car, 2000 model, but mine had an automatic.

danny28 · March 2001

koyotee

To go from liters/100km to MPG (Imperial) or vise versa divide 282.48 by the one value to get the other one.

1 Imperial gallon = 4.546090 liters
1 US gallon = 3.7854118 liters

Thus it takes 1.2009499 US gallons to equal on Canadian (Imperial) gallon, or about 6/5 for easy recollection.

P.S.
44 MPG (Imperial) for mixed winter driving is as good as I'm getting.
My mileage varies widely depending on the temperature, length of the trips, avge speed etc. I've measured everything from about 25 MPG in the City on short trips at -20 to -30C, right up to the 59 MPG test above. Note that this was a very carefully controlled test, with no, wind, no hills, hard tires, and only one stop. No one can expect to do this well in any kind of "normal" driving. that's why I called it a "test".

babyboomer · March 2001

Four vehicles live in my yard when not beening used.
This month all were filled at same time.
Yesterday, three had empty tanks.
Betcha can't guess which one did not need feeding?

majorthomecho · March 2001

I had my daughters over the weekend. I filled up before I went and got them and just filled up last night. Given how I drove to their house and back, I was sure that my mpg were going to be among the lowest I have gotten with the Major, but I was wrong. Way wrong.

I do not normally speed. In fact, I pride myself on obeying the speed limit, but something was different this weekend. On the way down, I was going 75 to 80 mph and the speed limit was 70. On the way back, I was going 85 to 90 mph on the same stretch of highway. Major felt rock solid and sure footed.

At one point with other traffic in the distance, a guy in an Grand Am or Grand Prix pulled up along side me and rode next to me for a little while. He looked like he was getting ready to sprint on past when I beat him to the punch. I dropped the Major into fourth and left the guy with his mouth hanging open before shifting back up to fifth. I guess he could not believe that such a small car could accelerate so quickly.

To finish up my story, my mpg measured at 42.5 (US).

Sad news yesterday though. It was around 60 degrees and I washed the Major. Some idiot has put a slight, slight dent in the front driver's side passenger door. Looks like some Neanderthal opened his door and hit the Major. I have no idea where it happened or who did it, but if I ever found out, it would not be pretty.

Well got to go. Happy motoring.

kneisl1 · March 2001

Yes it gives me the willies to park my new ECHO at a place like Home depot! When you come out - WHAMMO - your new car has a smash in it. Gives me an idea for a business though. You could roam the parking lots of Malls and look for people denting into cars and then photograph the plates and wait for the owner to come out. I wonder if you could make any money doing that?

Paul

vitaminj · March 2001

Amaranth, let me preface this response by saying that this was the first time I've ever purchased a new car, any car for that matter. In the past I sort of inherited family cars (I got nice parents). Actually, before buying this car, the most expensive thing I ever bought was a futon. ha ha. Anyway, to me, the price sounds a little high, but maybe I didn't include all the options properly on the Edmund's True MArket thing. From the way I did it, the invoice price came out to be $12,383 and the TMV was $12,830. I think the dealer is miss leading you when he/she said that their invoice price is different. Stick to the numbers Edmund's gives you. Originally, my dealer said the same thing to me, but I used some of the suggestions from the Edmund's site and felt I got a better deal than if I had gone in there totally uneducated. For instance, I learned from Edmund's that even if the dealer sold the car at invoice, they'd still make a 2-3% profit. When I repeated that to the dealer, it sent a message that I did a little homework. Really explore this entire site. You will learn alot. At least I did. OK, I'll stop babbling...

amaranth · March 2001

12,383 is the invoice price that I got, too, which shows the TMV being close to $500 over invoice. Two different dealers claimed independently that their invoice price was $12,619, which, if true, would put the $13,000 offer less than $400 over invoice. Well, anyway, I'll do the best I can, and thanks for the tips!

Regarding dents & dings, has anyone had any luck with door mouldings or anything to help protect against parking lot accidents?

kneisl1 · March 2001

I don't have the body cladding, whatever that is, on my ECHO and it does seem to be vulnerable to door dings as there is no moulding whatsoever on it. I'm looking into aftermarket moulding because on previous cars I've owned without that type of protection, the cars took a beating over time.

koyoteee · March 2001

My new Echo develops a vibration at 115 km/hr which I can feel through the steering wheel. Last night the dealer balanced all 4 wheels, but it's still there. It seems to come and go - it's not a constant thing. It also shudders slightly sometimes when I pull away in 1st gear (manual
transmission). Anyone have any ideas what this could be? Could the 2 be related? I have a terrible feeling this is going to be the kind of thing that will never be fixed. Thank you.

koyoteee · March 2001

Danny, thanks for the mileage info. I will look forward to getting more km/l once the warmer weather, and more highway driving comes.

babyboomer · March 2001

I think we are all being flagged.

sonatafan · March 2001

A flag for the country listed in your profile. Cool. My Echo is still going strong, 27,300+ miles!

kneisl1 · March 2001

It could be that you have a dammaged belt in one of the front tires. Did the dealer rotate the tires? Did he inspect for a separated belt? If the tires were rotated that should pretty much eliminate a dammaged tire. I'd jack the car up and remove the wheels myself and check the rims very carefully for dents (you didn't hit any holes or curbs, did you?) and the surface of the tire itself for a "squirm" in the tread pattern which would indicate a separated belt. If the tires were not rotated definately have that done and see if you lose the vibe.

kaz6 · March 2001

as far as vibration when pulling in 1st...it's fairly normal, at least what I've experienced. It's just the torque of the motor...something that only happens under part-throttle acceleration for me.
I agree with Kneisl1 re:tires. I've had silky smooth ride cruising at 85 on asphalt.

amaranth · March 2001

Well, this is turning into more of an adventure than I thought. The dealer that had my car (which my dealer was trading for) decided to sell it, after telling us that they'd hold it for my dealer to pick it up today. (stay away from the toyota dealer in saratoga springs!) So now I'm looking at a factory order (since I don't want to go automatic or red) because there's nothing coming in or in the extended area. They claim 4-6 weeks for delivery. So I'm trying to decide if I want to wait on it (and see about getting side airbags thrown in as well), or try the Autobytel/CarsDirect.com angle. Or buy a Sentra or a Civic instead! *sigh*

bluediva · March 2001

I just got my new echo last night. This is my first car! But the dealer excepted my offer a little too quickly, I kind of feel like I might have paid too much. I paid 70 dollars less than the TMV price so I guess thats all right I just hope I got a good deal. Also you guys have me worried about the dent thing, is the body cladding supposed to help with that?? I'd hate to see my new pretty blue car with dents. It already has snow on it. But I still love it!

kneisl1 · March 2001

You are experienceing a form of buyers remorse. Even if you paid 500 under TMV you'd still be thinking "Could I have gotten it for less?" Everyone does that its human nature. The important thing is you bought a good reliable car that will serve you well for years to come. But definately park your car AWAY from the other idiots at the supermarket and walk the extra distance! Thats what I do!

majorthomecho · March 2001

The body cladding will not protect against dents because it is so low on the body and there is no strip molding. Just try to give people on either side of you plenty of room.

majorthomecho · March 2001

About the idea of taking pictures of people denting cars and providing proof to the car owners. It would be a good idea, but you might end up an accessory to murder. If I had pictures of who dented my Major, I might have killed the guy. ; )

FYI, for those who cannot tell, I am saying the above in jest.

FWIW, this is post 1300. Anyone want to try for 1400?

About 3600 miles on the Major and he is not yet four months old. Actually like three and a half months old.

Toyota Echo

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