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Mercedes-Benz E-Class Sedans
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Comments
I have driven the 2003 E320 and E500 and yes, they are somewhat better handling, tighter cars than the previous model. But not by a huge margin, IMO. I still think as "driver's" cars, the E-class is a few rungs down from the 5-series. And considering it's lofty price fully loaded, the E500 comes dangerously close to approaching the price I paid for an M5 last March. With all due respect, if you simply want a "drivers" car, you can do better than the E-class.
On the other hand, I think the E430 4-matic with a V-8 at $50k is a great deal that delivers what Mercedes does best - solid build quality, luxury, and all-season practicality. If I lived in the snow belt, I would be hard pressed to think of a better alternative.
value - It's very, very subjective. If you go to the RL board, they'll give you a whole page of justifications why the RL is a better value than the E. No doubt you'll get a long list here too. You could also ask whether a RL is worth the money over an Accord. The Accord gets better and better every year. There is no reason why anyone wanting great transportation to go from point A to point B should need to pay more than $25K for a car. The unspoken answer of many on why they'd get an E320 over the RL is because they can afford it.
I'd say for 10K extra you'll get a more solid car, thicker sheet metal, a car more technolgically advanced, and a German ride vs. a Japanese ride.
I realized on one sunny, beautiful morning on Main Street in Manayunk, PA that I would buy a MB not totally for myself but for others (!); for myself I would do with an Accord or the Civic (77k miles and no problems yet). Check w/ Jeff Bezos as he is a living example of a bill're who drove an Accord (or still is?); Warren Buffet who switched from an old VW to a Cadillac after he was 55+ only because of the safety that is offered...
MBs are bought for a variety of reasons apart from the great, keen Engineering, Quality of construction, raw Automotive prowess, safety-first motto (and not so outstanding japanese-like-reliability); it is also to cherish childhood (rather mortal) dreams among others; take advantage of the statement a 3-pronged star makes in a not-so-fair-to-modesty world; where impression matters a great deal and clinches the deal.
Not that nobody here didn't know, but there are subtler reasons to buying a MB...
If there are 50% votes to remove this post - if it is indeed deemed rambling, I will gladly delete the post..
BTW, I am taking possession my '03 E320 today. We have come up with a list of name for the plates. Will post about my experience with the car soon..Baby, I can't wait.
". . .My friends all drive Porches, I must make AMENDS."
Bubba
Why not ask the other person(s) for whom you are buying the car, which he/she/they would prefer. Anyone who can afford a MB should have enough self confidence to make their own decision on what car they want without concern for what others think.
I can't figure out why you would consider removing your posting. Do you really think your posting is of such importance that we should take a survey to determine if a majority of respondents want it removed or not?
Your opinions are as welcome here as anyone else's. Happy New Year!
I don't work for Herb Chambers and never have.
I haven't bought a car there either. I shopped there back in June when I was looking at Minis.
I put their inventory info out here from time to time for several reasons.
One to make sure everyone North of the Delaware Memorial Bridge knows that they have a large (and growing) of EVERY major MB car type, C, E, S. It's very easy to access online. They don't do such a good job telling you what the options are on each car. You have to contact their ISD's to find that out or reverse engineer them from likely option mixes.
Two, as Merc1 points out, it helps folks negotiate. There's between $4k and $7K of profit on the standard E Class cars. There's absolutely no reason to believe that you have to pay MSRP. You just have to be discrete about where you shop. Some people like to pay high prices for stuff and that's their right. The point is you don't have to.
Finally there was this frenzy attitude when the new E was released that they were going like hot cakes everywhere. They didn't seem to be moving fast here (except for on-order cars) and still don't seem to be.
Chambers E-class inventory has crept up steadily since introduction and they have 100 right now. The Director of Internet Sales said that this week is usually a very active week for them in the luxury car stores. Unless they were selling them out back for cash, none of their E's left inventory this week, so they ought to be pretty hungry.
Current Chambers inventory offers a staggering selection in every MB category
100 E's
157 C's
32 S's (including 10 leftover 02's)
4 SL's (!)
11 CL's
some odds and ends CLK/SLK cars
If you don't live up this way, try Topeka, Kansas. Scholfield Auto Plaza sells MB, Lexus, Jaguar, Acura and Porsche. They are friendly and usually very negotiable. They had a NEW C320 Wagon on ebay in April for about $4.5K UNDER MSRP (no reserve). They have 4 E320's, 4 E500's and a leftover 02 E430 out there where Toto's from.
Good luck shopping and Happy New Year
I said that?
______________
Anyway, on this inventory thing. Can you tell me about this dealer and the number of cars they sell a year? I have a hard time believing that any dealer would have 100 E-Classes on their lot. That more than some Nissan dealers stock in Altimas. Dealers here (Chicagoland) keep about 3-5 E's on hand, and about the same in S-Classes. My local dealer (Mercedes-Benz of Naperville) has about 4 Es, 6 S-Classes, 3 CLs (1 is a 2002) and probably the last 2002 SL600 left in the U.S. Now they do have about 15-20 C-Classes, but they have no CLK coupes and only one SL, a SL55. I just can't picture 100 E-Classes on any dealers lot. If that is the case they HAVE to cut you a deal, and thus it wouldn't be too smart on their part to stock that many cars.
M
Try the website Herbchambers.com. Home page has "Entire New Inventory button", click it, select Mercedes, select E-Class
They even list the VIN numbers.... They have 7 (Seven!) left over 2002 E's.
You can also take a look at Mercedes of Westwood ( at clair.com ), which is a part of the Clair Motors group. They just built a huge new facility in Westwood, MA just off Route 128. They are smaller than Chambers. They have 42 E's in stock this morning, including 1 E320, 2 E430's and 2 E55's from 02.
Clair's site is nicer than Chambers because they actually list the option code list by MB number on most vehicles.
The only other nearby dealership if Foreign Motors West in Natick MA and they don't keep their inventory on line.
Good luck
Other names we came up with but are letting go are (these can be used by anybody except for commercial purposes if not already used)
- BLU BLEU
- XCUSE ME (my son blurted out this one when I and my wife were listing; and he thought this was a choice also)
- O BABE
- I CAN
- S ICAN
- O YEAH
By the way, my wife drove the car from the dealership; she felt great; When I drove it later I could feel the engine was very quiet all along; in city the car is very quiet - I drive my Honda Civic to work - you can guess I feel the difference, but on the expressway you will hear the road noise a bit more than I expected. The braking while coming to a stop - as is discussed on the forum - is a bit 'waving' - the sensotronic brake control kicks in more than you may want it, but I didn't feel it to be too distracting. The car is a gizmobile - as my 8 yr old son called it; the ambient or soft lighting features reminds you that you are indeed in a lux. car. Today it was raining a lot and I didn't want to take it out. The interior sides are fabric and are easily prone to shoe smears; I found the head lamps brighter than my expectations but shorter coverage distance perhaps; these are my first impressions; anyway as my wife was driving it back to home from the dealership, a few heads did turn around in our community, some smiles and that felt good.
Will post more of the experience as I get used to it more.
The salesman recommended an option to keep the brake lining or the wheel wells from getting dirty; does anybody know of this option and its cost; and its worthiness?
Wouldn't the universal sound in yoga be more like OMMMMMM?
The option to keep brake lining or the wheel wells from getting dirty is also known as mud guards. I've had them in some cars and not in others. Haven't really noticed any difference. It might add a few bucks to the salesman's pockets and probably wouldn't look good in this car.
BTW, I've found the Xenons to be quite disconcerting. They might be brighter, but there's definitely a sharp demarcation in the area of the light horizontally. I prefer the old yellow headlights.
Take a close look at the rear part of both the front and rear tires and the wheel wells. On my 2000 E320, the bottom part of the front tires protrude outside or beyond the wheel well and lower rocker panels; if I didn't have mud guards installed, the front tires would kick up moisture and dirt onto the lower panels. Similarly, the rear tires would splash the grime onto the lower rear part of the rear fenders.
As for appearance, my mud guards are OEM, black and molded to follow the lines of the rear part of the fender housing. They aren't readily noticeable but, if anything, I think they enhance the looks of the car.
Just my 2 cents worth!
Your salesman may have been referring to brake dust shields that get installed between the wheel and the wheel hub. They are supposed to reduce the amount of brake dust that ends up on the alloy wheels. They have been discussed many times here and there are widely varying opinions on their effectiveness. I have no opinion: I have not used them..
mbdriver - thanks, I wanted the mud flaps, the salesman wasn't aware of its use. In a country such as India (where I come from) where the roads are not as good (urghhhhhhh!), these were always necessary. I will get them soon.
microrepair - I guess you are mentioning the same what the salesman talked about; will explore the archives.. thanks....
Bubba
". . .my friends all drive Porches, I must make AMENDS. . ." J. Joplin
My service advisor is Andy Guida, the best of the best. Feel free to e-mail me with questions.
have heard good thing about Euromotorcars. guess i didn't want to fight the beltway traffic :-).
That's more of a wish than fact. It has not been the experience of most of the posters here. Many have paid MSRP.
Regarding brake dust shields, posters across many boards have all recommended against it for the reason 20endicott said - overheating.
But how many posters on this board have gotten their E's for $5-800 over invoice?
-rb
I tried to pre-buy the navigation Comand, but was told that the special offer expired and is no longer available.
Love the car.
Thanks!
And consider the salesmen. If you can get a car for $5-700 over invoice who's going to pay them? And from what I hear, a sales job a MB is the pinnacle of carsales jobs - they must make over 100K there.
That is not to say you can't get deals. My friend got about 1K off his 2003E320 which was on the lot, and I got about the same for my old C-class even though it was a special order. However, all new style cars coming in, the S-classes in 2000(?), the new E in 2002, the new CLs, etc. are pretty much all MSRP.
Several days later the dealer received the correct E-Class mud flaps and they were installed in minutes.
Hope this helps -- your dealer's parts department should be able to confirm that they will fit your E-430 Sport.
houstonmerc -- I bought my 2000 E320 in late April 2000 (D.C. area) and paid around $1,000 over invoice. I guess the going price depends on where you shop.
The dealer wants to move his product, perform service functions, make a reasonable profit, and keep the system running. Then how do you get a 'good' deal? Notice I didn't say the best deal! (If you know what it takes to make you happy then go for it.) First you determine specifically the car you want and what deviations you will accept. You determine what the exact cost to the dealer is for the car you want including 'dealer holdback'(which is about 3% for most cars). You determine what amount over dealer cost you are willing to pay. (Personally, $500-800 is my limit for a Mercedes) This gives you your 'offer amount' for the car you want.
Get on the phone and call all dealer's Sales Manager's for your brand within a reasonable mileage radius of your residence and tell them specifically what you want and give them your offer. Speaking to the Sales Manager eliminates one person from the commission chain saving you money. About 1/3 will tell you to stick it you-know-where, 1/3 will give you a ridiculous response, but 1/3 will meet your price or very close to it. (At least this is my experience in buying cars over the years).
Armed with this information go to your local dealer who you probably would like to deal with since he is close and makes the deal much more pleasant if you can get together. Based upon the info from the other dealers make your offer maybe adding $100 or $200 to buy close to home. Don't be worried by that "we never cut prices like that", or, if you give him your phone number and say "call me if you can come down" and he says "we never call back" (that's my dealers favorite line). When I got home the phone was ringing off the hook to get my business. My dealer is EuroMotorcars in Bethesda, MD
I'm convinced the main reason most people don't get good deals on cars is their 'emotional' need to get the car fast, their inability to 'walk away' from the showroom, their lack of preparation, and backbone. These same people will drive all over town to save 50 cents on a box of Wheaties. Think about it, buying a Mercedes is a lot of money. You owe it to yourself to get the best deal for you family and you'll feel great when you DO THE DEED!!!
The only thing I would add is that once you get a given dealership to say yes to a given car and price point, be prepared to confirmt the outthe door price on the phone.
Add the car price, taxes and what you expect the license and registration fee to get your 'OTD' price.
That way you don't show up and find out that your car has 'oh by the way': VIN etching, Lojack, paint shield, armor plating, tinted windows and a tow hitch for only $3200 more.
Also you need to insure that the registration and license fee are reasonable - they vary somewhat by state. Here in the Boston area, it's as low as $75 and as high as $300. What do we think they pay the person that runs these over to the registry every day?..
Good luck and shop hard!
There's a place on Edmund's where they explain how the TMV is done.
http://www.edmunds.com/products/tmv/learn.html
It sounds good, but stretches my credulity a bit in terms of how often they update so many cars - so it's probably an approximation at best. They also have a 'proprietar' algorithm that takes lots of factors into account, such as brand.
In that case, they might just peg the MB pricing to MSRP.
Who knows, maybe they have a deal with MB that says they do that anyway.
I once made the mistake of helping my son buy a Nissan Maxima and the best deal was in Tysons Corner. I specified over the phone the total deal including ALL taxes, surcharges, etc. The sales rep agreed and promised no additional charges. When we got there he added a $250 prep charge. He said all dealers in Virginia added that same charge (the Federal Trade Commission would be interested in this). I told him to stick it where the sun don't shine and we left. Happily he had already prepared a lot of paperwork which was in vain. GREAT!!
1. Pick the dealer as well as the car. I am prepared to pay a little more to a dealer with an excellent service department. When I later go back to the dealer for warranty repairs, they will see that I bought there and hopefully treat me like family.
2. Try to do your shopping during less busy times at the dealership. 90 minutes before closing time on a weeknight worked for me. I've shopped for cars before on rainy days - salesmen are dying to do a deal.
3. With leases, do your homework in advance. Find out what residual rates and money rates are being offered. (There's lots of information on the internet.) Do the math in advance and be prepared to stick to your guns. Most of the time, the dealers can manipulate the numbers to make lots of profit on a lease, all the while telling the customer that he's getting a great deal.
While I was at the dealership this week, they got a call from a guy who bought a new car elsewhere but didn't get the walk through on the car and asked if they would do it. The dealer was happy to do it.
MB is different from other brands in this regard. Other marques may not give you a loaner car if you didn't buy it from them, but MB dealers will give you one no matter where you got it. I think some other marque's dealers may refuse to even service your car if you got it elsewhere.
Who knows, maybe they have a deal with MB that says they do that anyway. <<
Heh, usually Edmunds gets accused of that sort of collaboration with BMW, not Mercedes-Benz.
I assure you, the staff who produces the site is not collaborating with any manufacturer in that sort of way. If you really want to ask about this, check out the "Help" link at the top of the page (also the bottom) to find ways to talk to the site content producers.
:-)
Most manufacturers are FOB point of US shipment to dealer. Here in New England, Lexus is FOB New Jersey and Honda FOB Westboro, MA. This is where their 'ports' are.
Same would be true for MB unless they operate under different rules.
So, the point I was making earlier is that making several hundred dollars for a few days interest is a good return. And whether it's a Mercedes or a Kia makes very little difference in terms of the cost to the dealer.