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Mercedes-Benz E-Class Sedans
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Comments
My MB lease is not up until September. Should I expect any similar treatment or will Santa Claus together with the Tooth Fairy arrive at my house first?
Friends of mine who also have the E-class have not been happy with the seats. The most consistent praise of seat design comes from Volvo and Lexus LS drivers.
If you like Cadillacs seats, chances are you won't like a Mercedes' seats. They, especially back during the years of the models you're looking at, were as different in design and theory as possible.
M
I'd like to ask a few questions -- especially for those of you who have experience with both cars.
First, tell me your views on the sport suspension which is only available as part of the appearance package. I've never found it necessary to get the sport package on my BMW sedans. One issue that I have with these packages (both the BMW and Mercedes) is that they include high performance tires that are most certainly not intended for winter driving. If I go with the Mercedes sport package in order to improve the handling to something that gets closer to what I am used to, have I just assured myself of the need to change my tires to handle the winter in Chicago?
The BMW has a near 50-50 weight distribution and it has been easy for me to handle in all but the worst winter weather in Chicago. I've never bothered with snow tires. My neighbor, with a 1999 or 2000 E320 complains about how his car handles in the snow. Maybe this difference is attributable to different expectations or driving style and not the cars. How is the RWD E320 in the snow? What is the weight distribution? Can you compare the snow handling of the E320 to the 530i?
I am intrigued by the availability of 4Matic on the E320. Years ago, when I lived in the northeast, I had an Audi 4000 Quattro. The all wheel drive was great and the car handled like a champ year-round. What effect should I expect the 4Matic to have on acceleration, braking and fair weather handling. I have no doubt that it will make the car much easier to handle in foul weather. Because the 4Matic is in limited supply, I may not have an opportunity to drive one in the near future. If the RWD and 4Matic versions of the car have a similar feel but for the ability of the 4Matic to handle foul weather better, I might consider ordering it without driving first (although I'd really need to be confident).
The timing of my lease is really complicating matters for me!
Thanks,
-- Rich
Rich-- My E430 has the sport suspension and I wouldn't buy it again. The car has a tight/rough ride. Of course, you can probably go a around a corner at 60 MPH and not lose control because the car hugs the ground. I like the look of the trim work around the car but the ride is rough.
Mark156
Hey rerobbins, was in your boat if you have been reading posts. E320 with sport really gets you the air matic suspension which is why I went E500(standard). It's really nice.Comfort setting is Lexus plush and tight setting is close to BMW. $ for $ you may get more MB now. By the way 4 matic feels the same.
I'm a bit concerned that in order to get the airmatic suspension in the E320 I will need to order the appearance package, which includes some sort of high performance tire that is designed primarily for dry pavement. My fear is that I'll end up with a car that's not as reliable on wet or snowy pavement and that I'd need to invest in another set of tires for the winter -- even if I go with the 4Matic. What do you think?
-- Rich
-- Rich
I thought that the E320 sport package included the airmatic suspension and high performance tires and that both of these are standard on the E500.
Are you saying that the E500 includes the airmatic suspension but tires more suitable for all season driving?
-- Rich
Is there a strong reason why I should avoid that approach?
-- Rich
Can you just replace them with 245/45R17 95H rated tires?
I assume that the W rated tires are lower profile tires as compared to the H rated tires.
Is there enough room in the wheel well once you mount the H rated tires on the 17 inch wheels?
-- Rich
Some German taxi drivers run them year around.
I've assumed that I'll want to switch tires for winter driving. Would I also need to change wheels in order to get a smaller wheel that will properly accomodate the snow tires? Put another way, can you just switch out low profile tires and replace them with tires that are not low profile tires? Wouldn't that increase the total diameter of the wheel + tire combination? Shouldn't total diameter be held constant in order for the car to function properly?
-- Rich
What tires can I put on those wheels without messing up the car?
Good Luck
My dealer charged me $1340 and had it done in just under 2 full days. But I also had to spring for a water pump and they gave me a 30% discount on that work.
I bought a set of alloys and four snows 4 years ago (from TireRack) and the best part is I mounted the summer tires on the new alloys, which have a very sporting look and get to enjoy driving my E that looks just a little different and more sporting than most of the E's on the road. Plus I figure the MB wheels will hold up better with all the road salt, etc. used around here. I swap them out myself in my own garage for a total annual cost of maybe $1 for the cost of the electricity to run my compressor.
BTW, my wife has an 04 E-320 with the standard suspension and 225/55R16H Continentals. It feel great - responsive, confident and tied to the road. I've never driven an E with the uprated suspension, but I have driven several BMW's with and without it. And my daily driver is a 2001 Corvette. I've very impressed with the E's standard suspension. Didn't want the road noise of an extra 20mm on the ground either.
I'm hoping that it will prove to be suitable without the need for the suspension upgrade.
I've been driving a 530i for the last three years and before that a 528i for three years -- in each case with BMW's standard suspension and tires. I don't expect the E320 to match what I'm used to but am hopeful that it will be good enough.
If I'm not satisfied with the handling then I'll need to go to the upgraded E320 suspension -- which is why I've been fretting about the low profile tires.
Thanks for your thoughts.
Any comments on how standard setup 04 E320 compares with the BMWs you've driven would be greatly appreciated.
-- Rich
Incidentally, the owner's manual states that the new wheel/tire size needs to be entered into the computer so the speedo and odometer remain accurate.
Ideally, I'd like to combine the virtues of both into one car and eliminate the quirks of each. But I find very little difference in their drivability, handling and ride comfort. Actually, I have what I consider to be an ideal situation!
I'm hoping that the E320 will handle well enough for me. I suspect that the standard setup will be fine. On the other hand, I've been spoiled. If the E320 is too soft, then I'll look for the airmatic suspension.
It's really irritating to discover that the E500 is delivered with the airmatic and all-season tires whereas the E320 with the airmatic is delivered with low profile tires. I don't really want the low profile tires because then I'll end up switching wheels/tires twice a year.
I like the idea of the 4matic as well, but I'm not wed to it. I suspect that I'll end up with an E320 4matic either with or without the airmatic suspension. On the other hand, if the E320 isn't peppy enough for my taste, I'd consider the E500. The E500 w/ 4matic will likely prove to be too expensive for me though. Decisions, decisions.
I wonder if I'd even like the E500. I always enjoyed the BMW 530i more than the BMW 540i. The BMW with the six cylinder engine just seemed like a more balanced car than the eight cylinder variant. Perhaps I'll find that the same thing is true of the E320 and E500. Anyone care to comment on that?
If you can swing it, get the E500 over the E320, I don't think that you need a 4Matic, my car does fine in the snow. The power is great, the airmatic suspension is very good, the settings for the Sport mode don't make a big difference on the newer cars, but it is nice. Overall the car is great. Good luck with your choice.
I also agree with your comments on the 745i and the new 5.
I'll give serious consideration to the E500 -- as you suggest. If you don't mind me asking, where do you live? I'm trying to get a sense as to how your winter compares to what I experience in Chicago.
-- Rich
I spent a few years in the northwest suburbs of Chicago, I bought the 528 at Anderson BMW in Crystal Lake. Your weather is not fun in the winter but the amount of snowfall is not enough to justify the 4Matic in my mind, I hope that I didn't jinx your upcoming weather patterns.
It sounds as if BMW is losing you as a customer as it did with me due to the terrible design direction that they've chosen. I hope that they get their act back together soon, I was thinking of replacing my 330cic with a 645 convertible but I don't think I can do it due to the strange look of the car(although it seems better than the 5 & 7).
Jim
I spent ten years in Boston and agree with your comments re foul weather road conditions there. I had a Camaro back in the mid-80s when I lived in Marlborough and had to do a fair amount of driving at night in the winter to get to skating rinks. That experience motivated me to get an Audi 4000 Quattro.
As for the 4matic on the E320, I don't really mind the added weight in view of the considerable weight of the car to begin with. As for the additional cost, that's another matter. I've not yet made up my mind on this topic. It will be fun to ponder over the next few weeks.
How do you like your E500? I've read that some think the V8 is a bit too much for the car and that the V6 in the E320 is a better match. I understand that view as I always preferred the BMW 530 to the 540 for that very reason.
I rather like the look of the new 645 (other than the trunk) but that car is clearly priced out of my range.
Thanks for your thoughts.
-- Rich
Your point about the 6cyl vs. the 8cyl is valid for the BMW's, they make the best 6-cylinder engines in the world. But my experience with the E500 is that it is perfect with the 8cyl. It is not overpowered, it has the proper blend of torque, horsepower, and fuel efficiency (22mpg). The E320 is a great car, it has plenty of power but the 500 adds just enough more to justify the expense in my mind. The car that I have now is actually my second E500. the first car was replaced by MBUSA because they couldn't retrofit a NAV system in the car. Both cars have been flawless, I've read stories about declining quality scores for MB lately but these two cars over the past 14 months have been great.
If you were able to get through Rt 495 in an old Camaro, you'll do great in an E. Use the holiday break to do a few test drives, enjoy the choice that you have to make.
Do you have winter wheels and tires for your E500? I just realized today that the E500 ships with low profile tires standard.
I drove the E320 and E500 today. Very nice. I'm sure I'd be happy with either. I will spend more time testing each in the weeks ahead.
The E320 is sedate compared to the 530i. The E500 is anything but sedate. Both cars handle well. I like the idea of AWD even if it's not a necessity. If I get the E320 I'll probably go with the 4Matic. If I get the E500 I won't be able to get the 4Matic (too expensive).
-- Rich
The Logic 7 audio system is great, I can't remember how much it cost but it's worth it, so is the in-dash 6-CD changer. The heated wheel and seats are a must, I also have the wood wheel, it looks good. The special seats are not worth the price in my opinion. My first car had the Stone interior, it was very light and got dirty very easily, I ordered Charcoal(black)in my current car, it looks good.
If you can swing the cost, you should check out the new Audi A8L, it has the best interior of any car on the market today. Good luck shopping.
http://www.germancarfans.com/news.cfm/newsid/2031217.001/mercedes- -benz/1.html
The new 3.5L V6 is a big improvement over the current 3.2L V6, at 272hp, which will translate to 265hp from DIN to SAE figures. Now the question is when does the E320 change over, 2005, 2006? I would also guess again, that this will happen after Mercedes unveils the new V8s, so the new E350 won't be too close to the current E500 (302hp).
I suspect some info will be released at Detroit and the rest at Geneva (March 04').
M
brownshoe@aol.com
One might think that for a $50K+ car
a) they might design a gas cap that is just about impossible to screw on incorrectly
b) design a gas cap, that screwed itself into lock position (sort of like trunks do these days)
c) put a light on the dash that lit it to indicate that it was the gas cap that was actually loose instead of something in the engine
No. Instead the brand manager won. You get to go back to the dealership service department to have something fixed that isn't broken, just poorly designed. Makes one feel good about that 'free warranty' that is built in to the price of the cars.
footie, just about all cars have that gas cap anomoly these days. I know my Corvette has it and my wife's previous car, a Catera, had it. Somebody can help here, but I think it has to do with the fuel tank evap system. We all just need to ensure we get the caps on tightly.
... this is an opportunity to differentiate a luxury car from standard iron from GM like a Vette and Catera (was that Opel or Cavalier based?).
The point is that the problem could be solved for a luxury car like Mercedes.
Imagine the effort they went to detect that there was a problem and then dump the indication in the check engine light instead of 'check gas cap light'. How much genius would it have taken to do that right?
And since they know its wrong, they print, in English, the real solution.
Must not be a problem in Germany. So we get a half-a...d solution here in the U.S.
Cheap Bozos.
For heaven's sake! Do we want so much luxury there's nothing left to figure out about owning / maintaining a car? I agree it is annoying and there should be an elegant (non-electronic) way to deal with the problem. Still, my 99 E320 Wagon, with it's idiosyncrasies is so much more fun than the 69 Plymouth Valiant from my youth.
The Catera was based on the Opel President. We've leased 3 and bought 1 since 97. Only 1 of the 4 had major problems. 2 of them were virtually trouble free. But that's past. The low interest rates, high dealer inventory and declining value of our Catera prompted us to trade.
Vicv--which Catera did your wife have? We just traded my wife's 01 Catera for an 02 C230K coupe. The car is Starmarked with 15K miles and all the options except for Telematic and Command (was that available in 02?). I'm hoping this car will hold it's value better than the Catera on which we took a 4.5K loss. I had picked out a C320 sedan, an E320 and, an 02 Audi A4 with absolutely everything that were my preferences but, my wife found the styling, perfomance, handling and amenities of the Kompressor superior to my choices.
When I described the E320 as sedate, I meant that the car doesn't jump when you begin to move from a standing start. The 530i really hustles when you touch the gas pedal. The E320 has sufficient power it just doesn't seem as peppy at the lower speeds. Mind you, I'm not complaining about the E320 -- in fact I suspect that it will be my next car. That being said, I'd be misleading you if I didn't note the low end power difference that I noticed immediately.
-- Rich
Best Regards,
Shipo
Speaking of power, are the MB horsepower/torque ratings realistic or are they under-rated much like the Mercury outboards were some 40 or so years ago? I've owned other cars with almost exactly the same HP ratings and none can compare to this straight 6 3.2L engine for "oomph"....
Philosophically, (sorry for a word over 10 letters..!) I can't see the NEED for an engine any more powerful than the MB 3.2L... Note the emphasis on NEED !! Sure, I'd like to drive an E55 for a few weeks, but it would just be for cheap thrills. I don't think I could put up with a harsher ride and more frequent trips to the gas pump for the few times you could really use that much power. I think the E320 is about the best balanced car on the market for comfort, ride, power, and economy. Now if only they couild sell it for 20K less I might buy one every 3 years....
-- Rich