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I am replacing the muffler assembly on a 99 Civic EX with the V-TECH engine. When taking the muffler off, I tried unbolting the hardware from the muffler side of the flange (where the small coil springs are on the special bolts). Well, both of the "bolts" broke off just where the threading starts on the. Yes, the muffler is off, but the remainder of the hardware is still in the nuts that are on the flange coming from the resonator. My question is this. Are the nuts on the resonator side of the flange welded on to the flange itself or are there supposed to come off? I got onto them pretty well with a 15mm wrench and they didn't want to budge. If these are welded onto the flange, how do I go about removing the rest of the bolt? There is about 3/4" of the bolt sticking out the back of the nut and I tried, with no luck, to spin them out with a pair of vise-grips. Any help will be graetly appreciated.
Thanks in advance,
Todd
on Honda's US website
http://www.hondaautomotiveparts.com
I replaced the exhaust pipe and muffler on my 88 Civic over two years ago. If I remember correctly, the nuts are part of the long exhaust pipe (even though the dealer charged me for the nuts separately).
It's one of the annoying aspects of my Accord, because I frequently shift around 3500-4000 rpm, and you get that little surge which makes smooth driving difficult.
Just looking for impressions from current Civic EX owners....
Thanks!
In Japan since 2000 the Corolla has outsold the Civic probably by a margin of 8 to 1, and in the US it looks like the Corolla/Matrix will replace the Civic/Coupe as the best selling compact car this year.
I used to be a big Honda fan, still own a Honda, but over the last few years it's become clear that Honda is more interested in catering to an older customer. Every redesigned vehicle has the same formula: slightly longer, wider, roomier, more powerful engine, less emissions, boring styling, boring colors, and for the Civic the same old boring 4 door and coupe body styles.
You may not like the looks of the Civic, as you don't like the Accord, but as I stated before the Civic is aging quite well. It's into it's 4th model year already and it still looks fresh compared to other cars introduced after it.
The Si is going to be my last Honda. As much as I love driving it, the quality is not there. I can get the same driving dinamics from a VW and same frequency of dealership visits. I called Honda and asked for 7 year/100,000 miles extended warranty since they did not live up to my previous experience with Honda, they refused. I have an appointment with Honda in two weeks to fix the leaky trunk for the third time on top of other things failing. If that does not work, I have legitimate lemon case against Honda. I was trying to be nice and keep the car, provided they offered extended bumper to bumper warranty, but they did not want to do that -- Lawyer time
And so what if the current coupe resembles the 1993 Civic. The 93 Civic coupe was, and still is, one of the best looking cars on the road. Look at it compared to a 93 Corolla, Protege, Cavalier, or Sentra.
The difference a few years ago was that the Civic not only provided reliability but was easily the most stylish among its competition. Even Honda now admits that the current Civic has a significantly higher age of customer than previous generations.
Regarding the civic, seriously, can Honda add some excitement to the design. Like a previous poster said, it's based on the same formula: bigger, a bit more power, little changes to the head & tail lights......
For the 2004 model, I also wonder if they copy the headlight design from Mazda 6, Protege and the Camry.
Just test drove a Vibe base model, with same engine and suspension as the corolla. Not expecting any power and speed from the little engine. Although I hate my civic, I actually think the civic engine is better, more quiet and smoother. But the ride of the Vibe is WAY better and smoother than my 2001 civic even the Vibe/Corolla has a rear axle. I really wonder how many people care if it's a rear axle or independent suspension when they go buy a car. I think most of them won't even notice any differences.
Yes, the Corolla has a beam suspension, but the Civic has been critized since it was redesigned for its front suspension setup and harsh ride as well. Espeically the 2001 and 2002 models.
The interior of the Corolla is also more refined than the Civic (Which has looked the same for years, with its single din radio)
I also think the Corolla has a better engine.
But the Civic is a close second, especially the updated 2004 Civic EX.
As for the interiors, the Corolla has a nice design but the materials are no better than the Civic. Sat in a 03 Civic coupe Thursday and was impressed with the interior fabrics and nice looking gauges. As for the Civic looking the same inside for a while you can same the same thing about BMW's, Porsche, Mercedes, etc. Why fix what isn't broken. I know that any time I get in a Civic it's an instant home.
The 2004 headlights are more 1998-2002 Accord than anything.
http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com/media/road- tests/comparison/2000/family_car/honda/00.honda.accord.f34.jpg
Looks very 04 Civic-ish right down to the wheels.
2004 civic doesn't look like a 1998-2002 Accord. It's a Mazda 6 that they copied the design from.
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2003/mazda/6/100195194/photogallery.ht- ml?pg_type=Sedan&imgsrc=%2Fpictures%2FVEHICLE%2F2003%2FMazda%- 2F100195194%2F006951-T.jpg
Not even the headlight, they even copied the design of the front hood for crying out loud........
Just looking at legroom numbers won't tell you the whole story. The design of the dash, steering wheel, seats, and pedals all come into play. Now don't get me wrong, the Civic isn't the most comfortable car on the planet for him, but it's a very driveable car for him. He has had problems with MT Mustangs, the Corolla, the S2000, the WRX, even a pre-2000 Land Cruiser. Those are just the ones that immediately come to mind. But he did fit fine in a Toyota MR2, 89 Civic wagon, 87 Toyota Corolla, and yes the assorted Civics/Integras we have owned.
We saw a 2004 Civic Hybrid tonight while purchasing our new car. IMHO the car definitely has class. Besides, it's better to look "generic" in the opinion of some people who probably have no intention of buying a new Civic anyways than to actually BE generic ala the Cavalier, Sentra, Elantra, etc.
"...new Civic headlights scream Accord"
well, that's just your opinion.
I thought this board was for all people interested in Civics, not just current owners. FWIW, I've owned two Civics, almost bought a '01 EX 4-door three years ago (but couldn't justify the price vs. my other choice), and almost leased a '03 EX coupe last winter (until I found out the dealer's lease offer wasn't quite as good as ads would lead me to believe). I continue to keep up with it because it's one of the best small cars out there.
As for generic styling, the Sentra is right up there with the Civic for winning the Generic Japanese Car Styling award, except I noticed today that the '04 Sentras have a Maxima-esque front end that is way more interesting than the Civic's. The Cavalier 4-door is pretty generic (also OLD) but I've always thought the 2-door was good looking for a low-end car. As for the Elantra, have you seen the '04 model? Anyway, I'll take the Elantra's styling any day over the Civic's. It's at least an attempt at some uniqueness, especially in the rear.
It depends on the seatback rake, and if the person's height is more in their legs or their torso. That seems to be a factor between myself and a friend of mine, who is the same height as I am. His legs are longer though, so he fits fine in his 94 Cougar, where my head touches the roof when I drive it.
I actually have to revise my earlier statement about the 04 update upon seeing a sedan today. It's actually quite an improvement, but then, anything would have been. The LX's 15' wheels and Bridgestones are a vast improvement over the skinny 14" rubber. But still no ABS on the LX. Why. Honda still wants you to buy a car under Honda's take-it-or-leave-it policy - no options. At least you can get ABS as a $300 stand alone option on the Corolla.
As for VW reliability "VW has major reliability issues up the yingyang" as someone said, I think that's a little bit exaggerated. VW's reliability is comparable to the domestics, which is pretty good today, but not quite as good as Honda, true. Actually, the best 4cyl engine is often cited as VW's 1.8T. Honda makes good engines, but the 1.8T is smoother and more advanced (5 valve/cyl, etc).
Where is a good link to see the '04 Civic changes? I have an '03 which I love. I could have gotten a great deal on a new '02 in November '02 when I bought mine but liked the changes to the interior (full sized rear headrests like my Corolla) and the nice jade green colour enough to pay the extra C$1200 for the newer model.
A few posts ago people talked about generic styling. I think conservative is a better term because each of these small cars do look quite different (Sentra, Protege, Corolla, Civic, Lancer all look totally different). Frankly the unambitious styling of Japanese vehicles is what makes them endure as good used vehicle choices. I would not want to drive 1988 US-brand anything from a styling perspective but an 1988 Accord, Camry or Stanza still has nice proportions and a well designed interior. Meanwhile the US stuff, while flashy and exciting when new, aged badly. Digital dash anyone?
Honda's take it or leave it policy is better and more cost-effect than having alot of stand alone option packages or misc. options. Someone who wants a Civic LX knows exactly what they are getting if he/she orders a green Civic LX automatic. Probably part of the Civic's excellent resale value.
dunworth: You can now go to www.hondacars.com and view the 04 Civic coupe and sedan. It will even let you build your own with accessories.
I can understand not having, say, a sunroof avaialable on the LX, but no ABS on a 2004 model even as an option? Shame.
Don't care for power anything nor A/c get DX.
Want power everything and A/C but coud care less for sunroof, cruise and ABS - get LX
Want power everything and A/C but also want better fuel economy get HX (only available as coupe)
Wand power everything and A/C and really good fuel economy get Hybrid
Want power everything, sunroof, cruise and ABS - get EX
Want power everything, sunroof, cruise, ABS and peppiness get the Si. (only available as hatchback)
I have never understood what the big deal is with ABS. I live in the Toronto area of Canada and often travel north and I have never found the need for it. In Canada, a high quality, well maintained FWD compact with a 5 speed gearbox and a careful driver is more than adequate. Ofcourse if you going into the bush or driving on ice maybe a Subaru or SUV would be a better choice.
Unlike you I am a firm believer in dealer service and always had my vehicles looked after where I bought the car. I usually buy locally as. Perhaps I could have saved a couple hundred here and there but dealers do look after their own sales.
I've never needed my seat belt either - but I still wear it!
Same with airbags
Same with laminated windshields
and on and on...
ABS is one of those devices you may never need, except that one time you're going to crash head on into a tree when ABS might come in "handy".
If Honda has found such an efficient way of packaging options in their cars, why hasn't everyone else adopted it? This only helps Honda's bottom line, not the customer's choices. Honda has fooled many into believing that having just two options (LX or EX, you won't find the DX anywhere) is beneficial to the consumer. Why is having fewer choices a good thing? It's only good for Honda.
I LIKE Honda's "trim line" approach to marketing. It simplifies the choice process and really cuts down the room dealers have to manipulate the prices. Go shopping for a 'Yoda if you wanna see what a dealer can do with the option package game. To be fair, you can probably make the option package thing work for you if you have time to wait on a special order. Anybody compare the costs of cars optioned out to equal Civic LX, EX, Si, etc?
Gee, you could have fooled me. From my experience, Honda dealers (along with Toyota dealers) wrote the Book on "ADM". It sure didn't stop Honda dealers from "manipulating the prices" during the early years of the current-gen Odyssey--and the Ody has only two trim lines! I'm also still trying to figure out why "simplifying the choice process" is a good thing, for buyers. I always thought freedom of choice was a good thing, not lack of choice.
Anybody compare the costs of cars optioned out to equal Civic LX, EX, Si, etc?
Yes, I have. And then I chose not to buy a Civic. I couldn't get a Civic with the features I wanted without going to the EX model, and it was much pricier than some competitors. Comparing costs of cars optioned out to equal the LX, EX etc. is not the point. The point is, what is the cost of the car optioned the way the buyer wants it equipped? For example, if I want an engine with decent power, I need to get an EX. If I wanted (in '00) a height-adjustable seat, I needed to get an EX (LX has it now). If I wanted ABS or a moonroof, I needed to get an EX. With other cars, I could get a lower-priced trim line to get those features.
Sure, if you choose a car line with option packages AND have the time to special order you can probably get exactly what you want and nothing more.
(I thought I said that.)
ABS is not like a seat belt. ABS is there for people who can't or won't pump their brakes, but rather use the technique known as "Stomp and steer" A good driver, who is concentrated on the road rather than something else, will be able to pump brakes in an emergency situation rather than freeze in fear and stomp on the brakes hoping the car stops. It is a learnt habit. I learnt how to drive without ABS, so ABS is not an issue for me. ABS does not shorten the stop distance and may, in fact, lengthen it.
Price comparo using carsdirect for zip 06902
2003 Civic EX is optioness, so it is a standard: $15,252 (no rebate, only 1.9% financing)
2003 Corolla LE+$600 for sunroof+$258 for ABS+$200 for cruise: $15,270 ($600 rebate available in lew of finance options)
2003 Protege ES+$566 for sonroof and 6CD (the only way to add sunroof)+$402 for ABS and side air bags (the only way to add ABS): $16,776 ($2500 rebate available in lew of finance options)
2003 Ford Focus SE Zetec+$530 for sunroof+$356 for ABS: $16,129 ($3000 rebate available in lew of finance options)
If I am financing a car and have decent credit (Tier 1 and 2) Civic EX make smost sence. Although Si made more sence to me at the time I bought it. If you are in the market for new car and have cash to pay for it, then Ford Focus is the better option. It is available here in North east with 2.3 liter engine for the same price as 2.0
"up" the customer into a higher-priced
model to get the item they want, along with
some they don't want. Increases dealer and
corporate bottom line.
As long as people believe they have to have
the honda because of the image the customer has of durability, value, etc., rather than another brand that does offer the choices that individual wants, the marketing
system works...
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
The ABS helps the driver keep the car under control, which means steerable.
E.g.,if the right side is onto the berm or grass or gravel, the brake effect is going to be unequal and the car will swerve. The driver pumping the brakes will not do as well. IF the car is one where the rear tends to lift and start sideways under heavy braking, the ABS will keep the rear wheels holding a straight line rather than trying to pass the front end.
Most emergency stops I incur are where ability to steer if necessary is more important than being able to stop 10 feet shorter in 1 out of 10 cases because ideal traction occurred at all wheels and I could do better than the ABS.
I would rather be able to steer and miss the car or the culvert or the sign support!!!
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
However, if I ever buy another expensive compact sedan like a C-Class Benz (I had a Volvo previously), I think ABS coupled with some kind of traction and/or stability control would be a useful package. This kind of stuff on a Civic (we have to pay for the Acura EL version here in Canada) boosts the price of the car to C$30 K out the door versus low $20s K for the mid grade version of the Civic. Still a great car but getting pricey for an econobox.
I think you hit the nail on the head, too, about ABS. Personally, I like it as an add; but if one regularly drives such that ABS is the dif 'tween life and death then it's 'dead man driving'. The guy for whom ABS is a deal breaker just ain't safe. All that said, the Si package is great - with ABS and EBD.
As for me, i'll always consider long term benefits a higher priority than short term benefits. I hate the relatively high(er) prices too, but if that's the cost for quality, then so be it; of course, if honda increases the price any more, i'll definitely consider my options.
For a Honda basher, nothing bites the biscuit bigger than 'R' words - like 'R' esale, eliability, eputation.