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Comments
Thanks so much for your input on torque steer and related handling issues. Sounds like something that would bother me, but I'll reserve final judgement until I drive it.
Perplexing to me that Nissan engineers, as good as they are, let this get by them. I know torque steer is not unique to the 2004 Maxima, but it does seem to be more pronounced. I remember noticing this a little with a 96 Buick Regal I had, but not at all with my current '02 v6 Camry.
36K on an 02 Max, and time to finally get rid of the stock tires. Since we all know the size is limited to only a couple of options for tires, has anyone gone Plus 0 to 235/50/17? Current size is 215/55/17. I've checked the differences in size and it is almost a perfect match. Anyone here upsized? I'm planning to get Michelin Pilot Sport A/S tires, which is a HUGE improvement from stock. Just curious if anyone else has.
Thanks
For comparison, the original Toyo Proxess tires on my 98 Maxima SE (size P215-55HR16 )lasted almost 60K miles. Because of low speed limits in this country I believe that V and Z rated tires are a waste of money. H rating is good for sustained 130 MPH driving. How many of us do that?
I do not know where the noise issue comes from with the Pilots because I don't hear it. I read of a harsher ride as well but, man - the ride is soooo much smoother and comfortable than ever with the Potenzas. These tires look real serious as well. As I mentioned above I just bought them yesterday so I do not have much more feedback than that but they do seem more "responsive" to even a simple lane change on the highway than the OEMs. I can't wait till it rains as these are supposed to be about the best,(THE best in 225 50 17) that you're going to find.
Expensive, yes but if rotated every 5,000 miles, 30,000 should not be a problem. They have a much higher treadwear rating than the Potenzas, something like 400 to 140.
I have 36 psi in the front and 34 in the rear - I'll see how that goes for awhile.
My total cost - $892.52 including 4 tires, ballance, valves, alignment, tax and a 5% discount for AAA membership. I negotiated $199.99 per tire.
Yeah - hopefully they'll last.
BTW - there is no warranty for the treadwear as these are "ultra high performance" tires.
I agree that they are expensive and don't have the typical warranty, but the quality is worth it.
Take a look at the HUGE difference between the Pilot Sport's A/S and the stock Touranza's.
You get what you pay for. I agree, V and Z rated tires are useless in this country, but these tires are for exceptional handling in all weather.
As you can see...the Pilots beat stock across the board. WELL worth the money. Think I'll probably buy them from Tire rack, and get them drop shipped. I checked with the local stores for stock and price, and the lowest price I found was $269 for the Pilots, WITHOUT mounting. Talk about gouging the customer. It's much cheaper to have them drop shipped to a local place.
Even though V and Z rated tires are expensive, they dissipate heat very well and are least likely to fail from excessive heat buildup.
What about you?
Z rated tires, for example will wear the fastest because the rubber compounds are a lot softer in those tires than in regular S,T, or H rated tires. They are also thinner in cross section to dissipate the heat better. V rated tires are somewhere inbetween.
It is not unusual to wear out a set of Z rated tires in 18K miles or less. I have talked about this to a foreign car repair shop owner who does a lot of work on very expensive German cars. He has seen these car owners go through expensive tires very frequently. Some of these tires are over $ 300 a piece.
I have not been impressed with wear on Michelin Pilots. I had these installed on my Mazda 626 V6 and never spun the tires once. They have high tread wear rating but they are essentially worn out after 30K miles. I just talked to somebody who claims to have over 58K miles on a set of Michelin energy MXV tires on their Honda Accord V6. Go figure.
First, in general, the higher the performance rating of a tire, the lower the treadlife. Exacerbating that is that in many cases, high performace cars have staggered front and rear wheels that prohibit tire rotation.
Second, while I appreciate the desire to get the most performance out of a FWD Maxima, the wheels and tires can only do so much. And a good quality "H" rated tire, IMO, is about the most anyone really needs.
I feel somewhat fortunate in having a 1995 Maxima SE that used "dimunitive" 215 15HR60 tires as the original equipment. In 143k miles, I've replaced the original Eagle RSA's twice and still have 20,000 miles left on the current set (average 55k per set). That's a grand total of about $900 in tires, balancing, etc. over 9 years. I do not rotate any more frequently than the normal 15,000 mile service intervals.
Over the last 9 years, the Maxima (SE's) has bumped wheel size to 16", 17" and now 18" wheels and higher and higher performance spec tires. I attribute this to 20% performance objectives and 80% to marketing and aesthetic objectives. A FWD Maxima with 20" wheels and tires is not going to handle as good as a RWD BMW 530i non-sport package car, let alone a sport package one. Yet the tire replacement cost over 9 years and 143k miles would be about $4,000-$5,000 instead of my $900. And, although I am sure some would debate this, the 1995 SE riding on 15" wheels does not give up much, if anything to the handling of a 2003/4 riding on 17" or 18" wheels. They are both about 60/40 front end heavy.
Differences in wet weather traction and other characteristics are indeed important considerations. And I would never advocate going cheap on the connection between a car, the road and your safety. But ultra high performance tires for a FWD sedan is an inherant contradiction, don't you think?
As a general rule of thumb, I agree with you that
UHP tires for a car such as the Max are seemingly
an inherent contradiction. However, these tires do
"bring to the table" characteristics, by design,
that enhance a car's "stick" to the road under just
about all driving conditions. Accordingly, if you
have the extra $$$ to spend, buying them is, IMHO,
certainly worth it. Otherwise, it's kinda "overkill"
berbel
I bought a Maxima in 1995 because it did indeed have the best performance of any of it's FWD competitors AND had a history of durability and low maintenance costs. At the time I bought, I intended to keep the car at least 7-8 years and 120k miles, both of which have now been exceeded. Would I have bought something else in 1995 if I knew that replacement tires would run me $4,000 for the Maxima instead of $1,000 for an Accord or Camry or Passat or...? Perhaps not, but I'm glad I didn't face that choice.
For the rest of the gang: I just hope that nobody that's in favor of $800-1,000 per set replacement tires with a 25-30k tread life for the Maxima also thinks it's O.K. to use regular octane rather than the recommended premium gas. Over 120,000 miles of driving, that penny pinching will only save about $750 in gas. Barely enough for one set of tires.
P.S. I would love to see a slalom test, skidpad test and/or any other handling test between a 1995 Maxima SE with OEM 15" wheels and tires against the 2003 SE (17"?). I would hope the 2004, with independent rear suspension would do better. Dry and wet, it would be interesting to see the results.
P.P.S. Come to think of it, I did rule out the Volvo 850 Turbo pretty early back in 1995 because of an assessment that a potential $3,000 turbo replacement at 70,000 to 100,000 miles was unacceptable just to match the naturally aspirited performance of the Maxima.
Pinging on Acceleration: I have a '02 Max that just had the rear Oxygen Sensor replaced (39k miles). Prior to the replacement I ran regular unleaded and never had any pinging or performance issues. Any ideas why this started after having the O2 sensor replaced? If I run mid grade 89 octane it seems better--only slight pinging every now and then.
Large diameter, low profile tires are harder to balance, they come out of balance quicker as they wear (= more frequent rebalancing required), increase the turning radius of the car because clearances between the wheel and the inner fenders decrease with increasing tire size. And the cost of large diameter low profile tires is much higher. So are the choices, because not that many tires are offered in large sizes. Performance gains are insignificant considering all of the negatives. Besides, if one wants to take an 18 inch V or Z rated tires mounted on 7.5 inch wide rims to their true maximum potential, why buy a Maxima? Get a 400 HP sports car. For normal driving and even spirited driving in a Maxima, 18 inch or larger rims are a waste of money.
As far as engine pinging goes, suggest you use premium fuel in your car as recommended by the manufacturer. Penny pinching on fuel quality will backfire in time. I have been using nothing but brand name premium fuel in my 98 Maxima SE. The car has 69 K miles and absolutely nothing went wrong with it to date. I replaced the original tires at 58K miles and installed new spark plugs at 68k miles. No pinging, no hesitation, and the engine light never came on.
I know of a case where somebody bought a mint BMW 750iL (12 cylinder flagship) and used the cheapest fuel available even though premium was recommended. They had problems with the car within several months. The penalty was about $ 3000 worth of repairs, including replacing two fuel pumps and several sensors.
I am pleased with my purchase of Pilot Sport A/S tires and feel a great difference from the previous OEMs, even from when they were new, in dry and especialy wet. Hopefuly, you get what you pay for. Just do your homework and educate yourself on what you intend to buy. I read about 'em, I bought 'em and I am glad I did.
Drive safe.
Has anyone messed with snow tires on this car? IT seems like a bit of a waste on a FWD sedan. The Potenzas aren't great tires, but they're not slicks or anything. I only have 6000 miles on the car, but when I replace I plan to use Goodyear RSAs. I had those OEM on my Olds Alero, and they were much better than the Potenzas in snow. I'm sure the Michelins are nice, but I feel they're gonzo overkill for a Maxima.
You can talk all day long about how you saved $500 or whatever on a set of tires.
May I remind you that at any speed, the only thing making contact with the ground is that little itty bitty, tiny tire contact patch.
I hated the Potenza'a on both of my Maxima's (95 & 00) and replaced them when they wore out with much better tires. (The stock Potenza's did go 90,000 miles on each car.)
Just one "avoided accident" on the road will pay for your $500 in tire savings many, many times.
Last summer in my 00 Max SE (with the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S), I had a driver pull right out in front of me at a 90 degree angle from my left at 45-50 mph. She simply didn't see me or was drunk or whatever. She was sitting in the median waiting to cross and just went, almost into the drivers's side of my Max.
I had no time to think at all, I just cranked the wheel literally as hard as I could to the right and immediately back to the left to get back into my lane. Fortunatly, there wasn't anyone next to me on the right.
Absolutely no drama, no squealing tires, nothing but rock solid performance. IMO, that one single accident avoidance performance is worth the extra $500 per set of tires. (Especially when I have a $1000 deductible.)
My front seat passenger at the time (when I occasionally see him) still talks about how I (the Maxima) saved our lives that day.
Could the Potenza's have made the same manuever?
Who knows................
Over the past nine years, knock on wood, I've never had an accident with my 95 SE on Eagle RSA's. I have had at least 3-4 occassions in which I have had to pull accident avoidance maneuvers as well.
I cannot fault anyone for spending more on tires if they believe it will improve safety. Back when I bought my Maxima in 1994, I had a choice beteen an SE 5-speed with no options other than a sunroof ($900) and another with no options other than ABS brakes ($1,000). I went the ABS route, and it has paid dividends at least 3-4 more times.
I admit that I haven't had the opportunity to drive a Maxima equiped with Michilin Pilots to compare to mine with the Eagle RSA's. Maybe I too would notice a difference and upgrade the next time around, if I still have the car. But I have driven the later Maxima's with OEM 16" and 17" wheels and did not feel any difference in handling due solely to the larger wheels. On the other hand, driving a 2003 BMW330i vs. a 1995 328i with the same 15" to 17" wheel upgrade produced noticible improvements, at least to me.
I respect you for making the choice you did. I may very well have done the same in your shoes with your experience.
When I was there, I asked the parts dept. whether it is ok to put 16" tires on my 03 Max, which comes with 17" Turanza all season tires. The reason I asked (not that I need to change tires now) is that the OEM tires are ok, but not great, and there are few tires from other brands that have the same specs (I checked Tirerack). I was told it is perfectly ok to go with 16" tires. When I asked if the smaller tires may affect the speedometer accuracy, the answer is "NO". Is that right?
I also asked about putting 01 headlights on so that I may put away my 03 HIDs (for fear of theft), I was told that the 01 headlights fit, but leave a substantial gap. Is that right?
This is a great website for determining the differences.
http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
However, I agree that having the best tires money can buy does help in an emergency situation. I just bought a set of Michelin Energy MXVs for my 99 Mazda 626. And they are rather pricey.
Just moved into a new neighborhood a couple of months ago, and out of about 35 households, three own 02 or 03 Maxes, and two are white. Shows they have taste, I guess, but it's kind of a bummer since I'm thinking about getting one like that myself. No 04s, but there's a guy down the block who has a vintage '92 SE like mine. Guess he's got high house payments, too! :<(
Kyleknicks, don't get me wrong, I love my bright HIDs, but hate losing them to theft. I was told the HIDs alone cost $1,500 a pair, and when you add labor and other costs to fix damages to your car fender and hood due to the theft, you are looking at well over $3k. With HID thefts running rampant in NY and NJ, I thought it might be better to store the HIDs in the garage and use the 01 halogens until the theft wave subsides. What a pity!! Nissan should be shamed of its shoddy theft prone design and must take some responsibility if it wishes for repeat customers.
Just kidding, I have a slight but consistent left drift on my 1995 Maxima SE, but it hasn't caused uneven tire wear that I am aware of (rotate every 7,500 miles). I had an alignment at the dealers suggestion a couple of years ago and it didn't change the drift characteristics. I wonder if this is endemic of all FWD Maximas. My S2000 tracks straight as an arrow.
I assume you've had the tires balanced and rotated regularly? The only other thing I can think of that would result in uneven tire wear might be a suspension problem. My old Acura had worn struts that led to strange tire wear patterns.
How much $$$ over invoice is common for a new Maxima?
You can use various online calculators to check for alternative sizes, but they generally don't take into account the tire flex which is bigger with higher profile tires. So this is what you can do:
Check your current tire size. Let's say it is 245/45/18 (for a 2004 Maxima SE). Then go to www.michelin.com and find a comparable tire. Let's take the Michelin Pilot MXM4 245/45/18. This is conceivably a tire you can use as a replacement. Look up under the specs to see the revolutions per mile (at 45 MPH). This is a real world figure, so it is very useful. In this case you'll see that this tire makes 775 revolutions per mile under the above conditions. Then look up the Winter tires - select Michelin Arctic Alpin and look up various sizes. You'll see that the size that fits best is 215/70/15 - this makes 779 revolutions per miles. Perfect!
You can now go to www.tirerack.com and purchase the Michelin Arctic Alpin at a cost of $80 per tire. Other quality choices will be Bridgestone Blizzak WS-50 and Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice. They are all around $80 per tire. You can actually find this size at a price as low as $40 per tire for lower quality winter tires. Now all you need is a set of 15 inch steel wheels, and someone who can install everything for you. Everything, including the tires, tire shipping, wheels and installation should cost between $300 and $450 depending on the tires you purchase.
Your better off checking with a reputable dealer (like tirerack) to ensure clearance. I don't think they offer a 15" or 16" solution for the 2004 Maxima.
The rest of sqrd's comments are accurate.
LET'S GET DOWN AND DIRTY. IS NISSAN DOING ANYTHING ABOUT THE XEON HEADLIGHT CATASTROPHY THAT IS GOING ON USA WIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! MINE HAVE BEEN STOLEN OUT OF MY DRIVEWAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Sorry to be rude but I think that it is in the best interest of Nissan to address this mess--otherwise the 03 and on Maxima's are worthless!
If there is a rep out therr or better yet a stockholder who cares-- with any suggestion other than replace the lights with halogens that please speak up! Wow. I can't be;lieve that this site is so dead about this issue unless there wer many posts that I missed--and I'll be the first one to tell u that I did not look back! Host--please enter now. Thanks . If this were the Trailblazer site it would have been rockin! Then again--I went back to american so maybe that's why?