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A lady in my office is having a similar situation with her Mazda 626 which has been in the shop several times with the same transmission problems they can never seem to fix. She was given a 5 year old Mazda van to drive and has had the van for over a week this time. Dealer has returned the car to them several times claiming it's fixed when it clearly is not. Amazing. I'm glad the Chev-Olds dealer here is good. Almost makes me want to stay with GM for that reason alone.
Dindak, the sad thing is this dealer sells all five GM brands(Chevrolet, Pontiac, Olds, Buick, and GMC). Despite a very good sales experience, this dealer has lost any future business from me(sales or service) unless I am positively amazed with how they handle the body damage.
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav
I'm thinking about letting my 2 remaining issues wait until I can get back to North Carolina (where I bought the car) in a few months. My expectations are so low of dealership assistance, that I think only the place I bought it might give a hoot.
I can live with the headlight flicker... I knew about it before I bought the car. But I thought the steering problems were addressed by the 2000 build, and I want mine fixed! I swear, I can not only feel it, but *hear* it sometimes.
GM, is this the way you expect to make "conquest sales" from people who used to drive foreign cars???
Have not seen the "flicker" since a cold night in February and I doubt I will again until December/ January. Luckily my warranty runs out in March so I will have it addressed this year. Car is otherwise still trouble free.
When I explained the problem for the umteenth time, the serv. rep. unbelievably asked "Do you really rev the car up to 3500 RPM?" and I answered, "Are you kidding? It redlines around 5500." So, I scheduled a test drive with me in the car.
I went out this morning with the service manager who said he drove the car yesterday and found nothing wrong and who was very dismissive of the TSB. (He also tried to give the line the giving enough gas for the car to shift between 3000 and 4000 was unusually hard driving.) When I finally got him to work the throttle so that it shifted between 3000 & 4000 the car shuddered every time, and he had no choice to agree that it was there. Now they tell me they'll have to put the pressure guage in the trans which is the diagnostic set forth in the TSB. So, We'll see what happens next.
I know it is no fun going through what you are going through. I truly hope it works out in your favor. I hope I am dead wrong in my assumptions about this dealer. It will probably come down to how much energy you are willing to put into it to attempt to get justice. Most people just walk away after some irate complaining and, in the end, no resolution and dealers not being held accountable - which just gives them more reason to treat the next guy the same way.
swagled - ditto your comment to GM on "conquest sales"
Took a couple hours, make sure you get the rear in one piece. One part that turns out pretty crummy is the top of the rear window. On my 99, its all dotted, and tint does not like sticking well to this stuff.
After its done, you have to leave your windows up for a week+ for the glue to dry.
I would then think about getting rid of the car after it was painted. Repainted cars will bring a lower resale.
I know the feeling. Been their done that with the gm hot line.
My first couple of calls were greeted with enthuiasism, but then they slowly started to change their tune and the attitude was if you do not like it, then sell.
I do not understand how stupid they think people are.
Do they not think that if gm can not resolve a flickering headlight and shaky tranny while it is under warranty and I have to unload it, that I would actually consider a gm product ever again.
Well from my experience that is actually what they believe. I think, that they think, that there is just as many people walking out of fords doors in a huff and walking into theirs as there is people coming out of gm doors in a huff and going to ford. I. e. it all comes out in the wash.
Ironically, what they have yet to figure out is that a good number of them are going foreign.
Good luck with gm hot line but remember that you are just a drop in the bucket. They are like the dealer but more polished.
Watch and wait for the four D's.
1. Deny (no problem found)
2. Dismiss ( they all do that, thats normal)
3. delay ( come back tomorrow , next week, next year, we need to talk to another guy/girl etc. etc.)
4. degrade (your not being reasonable, you are too emotional, you are overreacting)
After my experience the wife and I are ready to dump the 2001 and go buy something five to seven years old. That way the problems that occur will be expected and we won't have the massive depreciation and rip-offs when you buy new and the 20000 can. saved should easily pay for upkeep.
Your problems are bringing back bad memories and getting three can not duplicates and we are still waiting on 14 months from gm on your tranny and headlights, that I went through just yesterday, has re kindled my blood boiling on the arrogance of big corporations not taking responsibility for their products.
Thats my rant
But for ~$100 total Canadian, I'm very happy with the increase in steering response and overall chasis rigidity.
If I do anymore suspension upgrades, it will be a rear Next Level sway bar. Expensive by the time you get it to Canada and installed though.
GM still could get another sale with me. Lutz is waking up the divisions and what's coming after 2003 looks interesting. (And it's possible my next vehicle would be a pickup. GM has always made pretty good trucks.)
When I compare to my last car, a 4 door Mazda Protege, I notice lots of little things about the Intrigue. Details which give me the feeling that "it needed more thought" and the next generation could have improved.
For example, the rear seat won't lie flat. The Mazda was a smaller 4 door car, but it had more usable cargo space, because the rear seat would lie flat. I moved tables, and a small refrigerator in it!
The front driver's seat won't recline as far as the one in the Mazda. (Sometimes I'm tired and will pull over and rest. It's nice to be able to "lie down" in your car.)
There is some kind of obstruction underneath the seat, so that if I pull my left leg towards me while driving, the back of my heel hits it. The passenger side seat won't recline *forward* very far. (If you put a big thing in the back seat, you might want to do this.)
I suppose someone could say "if you cared so much about interior space, buy a small wagon instead of a performance sedan". But my response is "I wasn't thinking about cargo space when I bought the Mazda. I just bought an affordable car with a comfortable driving postion, and the little interior amenities were a bonus."
The Intrigue didn't have these bonuses, which I "wasn't" shopping for... The fact that I noticed these things shows that there were designers at Mazda who really thought about every possible use of the vehicle. But GM didn't "pour over the design" quite so much.
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav
2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav
I've been lurking here for a couple days now - decided to jump on an '02 Intrigue GL, took delivery six hours ago. The lease on my Alero is up in mid-February, just barely before the cutoff. I've had such good luck with GM vehicles lately (wife's now-sold '98 Cavalier was econo-perfect, Alero was almost flawless) I decided to bite and use the massive discounts available. Why throw money away on a lease, when I can use it toward a vehicle I own. The person who coined the term "Generous Motors" a few thousand posts back was right on!
Despite a small scratch on the driver's rear door that everyone missed before the car left the lot (going to the dealer's body shop the first opportunity I get, my salesperson was very apologetic and cool about it - she took full responsibility for missing the scratch, which is refreshing nowadays, even though it was more my fault than hers for not seeing it), the experience at the dealer was great.
The car is EXCELLENT. I did like the Alero, even though it was a bit cramped. The v6 had some guts, and was generally fun to drive. I was truly sad on it's final drive to the dealership from whence it came, it is still a very nice car, and someone I'm sure will get a screaming deal on it.
However, the Intrigue stomps all over the Alero -it still kills me that OTD, the Intrigue was cheaper. It's really unbelieveable. Until I test drove one this past Monday, I had my heart set on a Nissan Maxima. Why go Japanese when the General has a made-in-the-USA version that is $10k less and just as good?
I rented an '02 Maxima SE this past December for a few days while attending my brother's wedding on the other side of the country. While it's hard to tell on the Intrigue's engine yet (I wasn't about to really let'er rip - I don't want to completely kack a seal with 30 miles on the odo!), I think the Intrigue actually handles a bit better. That is, there is definately a better tradeoff in stiffness vs. ride comfort; the Max's rear axle is a definate weak point on that car. The thing hopped all over the freeway. And the Intrigue's seats are LEAGUES better; as with most Japanese cars, the seats are designed for people of a smaller stature. Not being racist, it's just the way we're built. My large Norwegian frame just didn't fit all that well - I'm a big dumb Viking! They were really lacking leg support - and NO DEAD PEDAL! Otherwise, the Max was a blast to drive, I would have been proud to own one.
I drove my new Intrigue all over West Michigan tonight, and even though I'm taking it easy (with 28 miles on the odo at delivery), it was a blast. LOVE the car. If it holds up half as well as the two recent GM vehicles we've owned, I'll be completely delighted.
So now, I've been reading this board and am getting disheartened. The tranny problems are especially shocking, since auto transmissions are probably the STRONGEST attribute on GM vehicles. I'm also not sure what the strange obsession with PCS is on this board. Nobody seems to realize that in day-to-day driving, you'll never notice. I certainly didn't on back-to-back test drives on a non-PCS GX and PCS GLS. For the horrendous price difference (the only PCS equipped vehicles in the area were pimped-to-the-gills MSRP $30k+ GLSs), I'll stick with a "everything I need, nothing I don't" GL, thanks. I hate leather, moonroofs annoy me, but gotta have keyless entry and a decent stereo. The only reason I didn't get the GX was that for some idiot reason GM opted to make it impossible to get fogs on that trim level. Where I live, fogs often make the difference between a quick snap of the steering wheel and continuing on and having Bambi innards dripping off your radiator. That climate-control gizmo is VERY slick, though. Unexpected, and a potential marriage saver.
Driving around, I was kind of saddened by the realization that this would be the last new Olds I would ever own. I did test drive a Bravada, but holy floaty-boat. My wife's Escape is a comparative speed merchant and F1 handler by comparison. Also, I think I would miss tearing up the roads like I did in my Alero.
So, I will continue to lurk and contribute - in a more eloquent manner, I promise. Thought everyone might enjoy the ramblings of a new (and completely delighted) Intrigue owner; I'm definately one of the last of that breed, that's for sure.
Rich
Until the 2004 GM cars are available, the Intrigue is one of the best driving cars the General makes.
The CTS sounds interesting, but I haven't been able to get past it's looks. The Intrigue, while a 1997-era skin, still looks current and proportionate. The CTS looks like a car influenced by SUV styling! I don't mind the angular lines, cars in the 1960's and 1970's certainly were linear and boxy. But the CTS just looks too chunky and ungainly to be a fast car.
Still, at least it's RWD with a powerful engine and a manual. GM is finally listening to what "drivers" want. Who knows, maybe I'll pick one up used someday anyhow.
P.S. - Perna, if you like your car now, wait till you start driving it above 3500 RPM. You'll discover soon afterward that your right foot has become heavier, and that the road is just filled with SLOW people!
Look forward to hearing from your experiences with an 02.
I had a body shop give me an estimate yesterday and $530 is what it will cost to get her looking new again. He said the spots should be able to be buffed out. The sratch, however, did cut the paint to the metal. I haven't even called the dealer to tell them that I discovered the spotting, I simply included that in the letter I sent to the owner.
Mazda, sorry but Mazdas seem half baked. If I wanted utility, I would have bought a truck or an SUV. Olds may not have "poured over" the design of how far back the seat reclines, but at least they put a mill under the hood. Besides, you can't drive a car lying down. The Intrigue is best driven sitting upright with both hands firmly affixed to the wheel. Cell phone preferably turned off and radio on(or else off and windowns down so the engine's music can be heard).
Despite all my troubles, I am glad I finally have my car back. I had actually gotten used to that Buick I had as a loaner(thats sad!) and my Intrigue feels like it is literally on rails. I had also forgotten how good it was to actually hear the engine on this car, unlike the Buick with it's clattering series I 3800 V6.
Most of us here are not the paranoid, super-safety conscience people that Camry owners tend to be. The PCS hype, as oldsman01 pointed out, is because of the 3.29 axle vs. the 3.05 in non-PCS equipped Intrigues. To use a quote from an ever-so-popular TV character: "More power". Well, not exactly, but it is snappier off the line. That's why you read us talking about it so much.
Have fun (as if I had to tell you that)! Don't get pulled over :-)
It has about the same amount of road noise as a Maxima; that is, just enough to keep you aware of the goings on around you. It's much better than wife's Escape, which at times can be very noisy.
The freeway is 3-4 lanes in the area I was driving, and was clogged with traffic. Or so I thought. I was tailgating a BMW, getting righteously PO'ed at his sloth, when I looked down at the speedometer. 90 in a 55. Oops. I was horrified at a poster long ago who mentioned hitting the limiter at 129; now, 129 doesn't seem that outrageous.
The gas tank must be CAVERNOUS. I haven't looked at the user manual yet to see what the actual capacity is, but I'm barely off full and I've driven 100 miles in it. This car is going to be a spectacular road-trip vehicle! Or my gas gauge is broken.
I agree with Nissan's horrible Maxima packaging. The GXE is an absolute stripper; while it is still decently equipped, you can get many more options on the Intrigue GX. And to get pretty much any additional options on the SE or the GLE, you have to get a stinking sunroof. Hello Nissan, I live in Michigan. The sun shines MAYBE a quarter of the year, and even if it does shine, I'd rather have the extra headroom than a hole in the roof. I'll roll my windows down if I ever need the "wind through my hair" feeling. Geesh. No offense to sunroof owners, of course, your boat floats to a different beat than mine is all. :-)
On the Caddy CTS, I was actually thinking about one, but am REALLY leery on 1st year GM anything(Plus, like the Intrigue, they are putting in a different/better? engine in the following year's model). That's one of the reasons I went with a 5th-year model Intrigue than waiting for an '04 Grand Prix. I'm sure it will be an interesting car and have much more tasteful styling inside and out than the current GP, but can anyone remember the last GM new model intro that wasn't totally botched? The Vibe is close, so far, but it's still too new to tell. The Avalanche isn't bad either, but IMHO that thing is a rolling monument to bad taste. Lose the cladding for '03, and it will be better.
oldsman01: Glad to hear you're still happy with your car. There are some truly awful GM service shops around; what I would do, personally, is bring it to another GM dealer, regardless of make. Preferably Pontiac or Buick, since they sell Intrigue twins(they're more likely to have parts in-stock), but it shouldn't matter. I know a lot of Pontiac owners of various models who take their cars to the local Buick dealer, because our local Pontiac dealer has deplorable service. In the meantime, hopefully they make things right for you. A sit-down with the GM goes a long way, I had to do that when my new Volkswagen (back in '96, the car before the Alero) left me stranded for the 4th time.
I think I'm going to take a drive tonight.
Rich
However, noone who has ever driven the Miata MX-5 SE with a 6-speed down a twisty coastal road with the top down would ever describe the experience as "utilitarian"! No, you really can't compare the Intrigue with a Miata (I wouldn't want to be broadsided in one) but you can't call the Miata a utility. Even our friends here at Edmunds call the Miata "the best driving experience under $25,000".
The tank volume must be 17 gallons or so, but the current GM cars need about 2 gallons for fuel pump to work properly. The "empty" lamp illuminates at about 4 gallons left, so usually I am filling up 10 to 12 gallons.