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Comments
;o)
I've noticed the clicking seat also. I figure it's the material, leather in my case, that puckers down underneath the plastic shroud for the seat controls as I lean over to get out. When I move off the seat, the material pops out, snapping the plastic.
It's a theory. I'm going to try applying clear shipping tape or something to both the seat and the shroud, hoping to force the two different materials to slide past each other when I get out.
I just know that as the plastic ages, either through work failure or crystallization from the heat, it's going to break.
Good luck.
It may just be best to ignore him.
Tbcreative, I am not trying to start anything, but we heard you the first time. I hope that you are happy with your decision and that your 4runner is flawless. I am sure you would hope that for all of us triplet owners.
JAW
the engine roar stops and the transmission shifts, with no further problem.
Dealer is unable to replicate.
Anyone know what this is about?
Please let me know how your "fix" goes. The click is definitely something that I can live with, I just want to know that I am not damaging anything in the meantime.
Anthony
-mike
I'm talking about the ALL-NEW 4Runner coming this fall that's based on the same new platform as the GX 470. It's going to be VERY DIFFERENT, and make up for and surpass everything the '02 lacks. I don't even know if I'm going to buy one yet as I haven't even seen a picture of one, because Toyota is being so secretive, and I really won't know until I've been able to drive one.
I've been frustrated and disappointed with GM for not offering some version of the Trailblazer or Envoy for those of us who actually go off-roading on rough stuff. So I came to this forum to see what people were saying about them, or to see if anyone was talking about putting an inexpensive lift on their truck. Then I read about all the problems with the electrical systems, which my dad and uncle have experienced with their Envoy and Trailblazer. For those reasons, combined with my experience with being a GM owner since I got my driver's license 18 years ago, and the problems I've had with my Jimmy, I've decided to look elsewhere.
Racoonlodge, I'm not sure what you mean by "cry wolf," because that would imply I'm teasing about something, so that makes no sense. If you mean I'm giving up the good fight before the battle is won, then you'd be right. I've been a GM loyalist and owner, scoffing at foreign cars for as long as I can remember, so I think I've earned that right. But the older I get, the less I want to deal with service on my automobile. And while they still have problems, there's a good reason Toyota is still #1 in quality. I've had it with my GMC, so I've decided to keep an open mind for my next SUV.
Jwinky, I only came to this forum to see if there was anything here to change my mind about the Trailblazer/Envoy. I wasn't "trolling." When I read all the stuff here, it gave me more reason to shy away from the GMT 360s, which has been a struggle for me because I do think they're really great-looking SUVs.
I'm sorry I used this platform to vent, but I was also hoping someone would challenge me enough to reconsider the TB or Envoy. I didn't want to make people defensive or ignore me, I wanted to be challenged in an intelligent discussion. I didn't plan on attacking anyone, because I'm a GM guy myself, not some jerk looking for a foreign vs. domestic debate. If these trucks aren't worth a decent discussion, and people are using poor grammar like "I wouldn't trade my Bravada in for NOTHING," then I should look elsewhere.
Sorry for the disruption. I sincerely hope you enjoy your trucks, and they give you little or no problems.
I want to be sure to test drive both before I make a decision. With the V8 rated at 235hp and 320 lbs/ft of torque, but the new V6 making 245hp and 283 lbs/ft, it will be interesting to see how each drives. I will be holding both engines up to the standards set by the awesome Vortec in-line 6 in the GMT 360s, of course. If they don't compare to GM, then forget Toyota altogether!
Welcome to the fan roar club! I believe what you are describing is the jet engine a lot of us have experienced. For a lot of us, it is very sporadic and I can see no other way except sheer luck that the dealer would be able to duplicate. Depending on the build date of your your TB, there is a TSB for the reprogram of some of the software to reduce this problem. My Envoy was built in April of 02 and I have this happen about every two weeks. A nuisance, yes, but I can live with it for now. Check Tim Lauro's website for the TSB (timlauro.com)
TBCreative,
I wasn't sure why you were here, and I may have been a bit harsh with the 'troll' comment. Please accept my apology. I absolutely LOVE my Envoy. As you can see, it is a fairly recent build, and I have only had the fan engagement on startup. A nuisance, but I can live with it for now. I have faith in GM to fix it (did I just doom myself and everyone else with that comment?). Other than that, the vehicle has been a gem.
I had a 98 Honda Civic Coupe and an 86 Toyota Corolla, that was handed down to me by my mom, before the Envoy. The Toyota was bullet proof. It had 180k miles when I get rid of her, with the only problems being the tape player no longer worked and I believe a crack in the distributor housing (never verified, but the symptoms led me to that). Comparing quality between my old Civic and my Envoy, they are about the same. I think that says a lot about GM.
One other thing to watch for with Toyota is a sludge problem. I have seen a discussion on TH about this but did not investigate. Not sure if it is a real problem, but may be worth looking into.
Unfortunately, a lot of times these forums, like many other things in life, only relay the bad, when there may be many times more good stories that go untold.
Hope this has helped, and again, I apologize for my earlier post. I look forward to any input you may have, and that you get a problem-free vehicle, whatever you decide to buy.
JAW
Live and learn
Thanks for the heads-up on the sludge thing. That's something I've been reading about on numerous Toyota forums, and seems to be something Toyota is addressing and concerned about with their new models coming out. Supposedly they have a handle on it and it won't be a factor with the 2 new engines for the 4Runner, but you can bet I'll be watching that issue very closely.
I'm glad you like your Envoy and that the quality has measured up to your past experiences with Toyota and Honda. That's encouraging to hear! My dad sure loves his SLT. Whenever I see a black Envoy with custom wheels and tires, gleaming in the Arizona sun at my GMC dealer, the thought runs through my mind that maybe I should give up all the crazy off-roading and get that beautiful truck. Then I glance over at my black Jimmy with the off-road package and 30"x9.50" BFG All-Terrains, and I'm back to my same conundrum...(Big sigh)
Mr. Carter, thanks for your insight, but if you read my rather lengthy posts about the next generation 4Runner, you'll see it's well worth the wait, and will be around in that form for at least 6 years after it comes out. Of course there will be improvements along the way, but the difference between the current model and the '03 coming in September is so HUGE, that changes during the next year or so won't be as significant. I'll just be happy to have an option with everything I'm looking for.
Beside, I'm not ready to buy a new SUV until after the first of the year anyway. Who knows, I may wait until the following fall if I'm not satisfied, which is when I may have even more choices, like the re-designed Pathfinder. I appreciate your concern, but I know all about jumping too soon. Computers are a great example of that. I do extensive research before I make any major purchases, and find out as much inside scoop as I can about what the future holds, and I'm confident I'll make the right choice with my next SUV.
This poster said his'95 truck does the same thing.
Anyone care to confirm?
I "kind of" made an amazing discovery this past week about the triplets that I wanted to share with you.
This past Friday, I helped envoy2002's mother with the purchase of her new 2002 Oldsmobile Bravada. While on a test drive with the vehicle that she wanted to purchase, I noticed that when I placed the vehicle into reverse, the DIC displayed "Curbside Assist Mirrors Engaged." Well, of course that freaked me out because mine is a 2002 GMC Envoy and doesn't display that in the DIC screen when in reverse?? Also, I noticed that the build date stamped on her Bravada was 5/02. I touched base with several other triplet owners and they also stated that their triplets display "Curbside Assist Mirrors Engaged" as well. Additionally, they too have build dates of 4/02 & 5/02??
Does anyone have any idea on when this modification was added to the DIC? Actually, I find it quite impressive myself and would like to get ahold of the programming bulletin number so that I can have my local dealer program mine to display this as well. I would think that in order to gain this function, they would simply have to erase the current program in memory and replace it with the new one correct? Similar to how they are currently handling other programming items.
Anyone have any additional information that they would like to share concerning this? Of course a service program or calibration code would be wonderful!
Thanks!
IExplore2000@aol.com
You mentioned in your post # 6272 that there was a TSB out that addressed the "Rear End Chatter" problem on the triplets? Would you be so kind as to mention where you found this TSB or possibly e-mail a copy to me? I am experiencing the same issue with my 2002 GMC Envoy SLT & would like to have the appropriate TSB in hand when I do decide to take it in for service.
Thanks!
IExplore2000@aol.com
I have a friend that works with the GMT360 program, Tim, and he has given me some pretty good info here. The problem is indeed the viscous clutch for the cooling fan. On occasion, when the fan is in use when you shut the vehicle down, it shuts down engaged. On most occasions, the fluid will drain overnight. However, sometimes the fan stops in an orientation that prevents drainage, leaving the clutch engaged. When you start up the next morning, the fan starts up at full speed--just when your vehicle speed is low and you hear it best. Once the fan spins out the fluid, it stops. They are working on fixes to control it, but he's not sure when they'll be implemented.
Iexplore:
Looks like GM is reading these posts and listening to the customer. Sounds like a software change to me.
tbcreative:
As someone who's read every one of these 6300 posts, I can't blame jwinky for thinking you were a troll in your first posts--it's happened before. That's too bad because this forum is very well focused (try reading the CTS forum or the Explorer forum!) with helpful comments. It's good to hear you're not one of them. Also, I'm not sure I'd want to take my $35,000+ vehicle off-roading. However, Motor Trend magazine had an article in last September's magazine that found the Envoy did pretty well in their Death Valley Torture Test. If that's not tough enough, the Hummer H2 is less than a month away!
I obtained the TSB for "Locking Rear Drive Axle Chatter in Turns" (Document ID # 761625) off the GM site when we all could gain access.
It states:
Checks:
"The lubricant is contaminated"
Action:
"Drain and flush the axle housing thoroughly. Refill with the correct lubricant. Refer to Lubricant Change in Rear Drive Axle."
Checks:
"The clutch plates are deteriorated."
Action:
"Replace the clutch plates. Refer to Locking Differential Cam Unit Disassemble and Locking Differential Cam Unit Assemble."
My dealership replaced the lubricant in the axle housing (synthetic gear oil according to the Tech) under warranty. This morning the rear end did not chatter at the spot it normally would. I am keeping my fingers crossed.
I believe a member of this forum has a website which lists all the GM Triplet TSBs.
Originally, GMs fix was to replace the shaft. Now, they just lubricate it and hope the problem won't show up again until the warranty period expires.
I took it directly back to the service dept and left it with them to fix. The service mgr called me later and informed me that he was able to get the temp up to 235 and that the fan engaged at 220. That didn't make a lot of sense to me. If the fan came on at 220, why did the temp continue to rise? The two things that immediately came to mind were, something is stopped up or a bad water pump.
Well, here it is Monday, 5 days later and the service dept still hasn't found the problem. I still think that the fan is not coming on, even though they told me it comes on at 220. They informed me Friday that they now have the GM regional service rep involved. Evidently, they have never seen this problem and they have never worked on one of the new viscous damped electronically engaged clutches before.
Will let you know how it turns out. Anyone else having a problem with overheating?
Im not a pack rat by nature ... i normally like to just "wing it" most of the time. but i just like to get stuff to put in my truck. =P
Can you describe the rattle in more detail? When it occurs, what it sounds like, etc.
Funits and Iexplore2000,
Can you describe the chatter in more detail? Or is it another one of those 'You will know when you have it' kind fo problems?
Thanks,
JAW
I took it directly back to the service dept and left it with them to fix. The service mgr called me later and informed me that he was able to get the temp up to 235 and that the fan engaged at 220. That didn't make a lot of sense to me. If the fan came on at 220, why did the temp continue to rise? The two things that immediately came to mind were, something is stopped up or a bad water pump.
Well, here it is Monday, 5 days later and the service dept still hasn't found the problem. I still think that the fan is not coming on, even though they told me it comes on at 220. They informed me Friday that they now have the GM regional service rep involved. Evidently, they have never seen this problem and they have never worked on one of the new viscous damped electronically engaged clutches before.
Will let you know how it turns out. Anyone else having a problem with overheating?
Here are the Metra part numbers (Metraonline.com)
T-Harness 70-2003T
Door Chime SP-2003
On Star Extension 70-2005
Good luck, its not the most fun install in the world. BestKits also make something but I have no experience with it
Has anyone installed an XM or Sirius Satellite radio in one of the triplets? I'm thinking of installing the Jensen Sirius Radio and was wondering how much hassle it would. I'm thinking of placing the antenna at the rear, running the wiring to the rear seat, placing the radio electronics under the rear seat near the Onstar unit (and getting the power from the rear fuse block) and the controller unit attached to the center console.
A while back someone stated that they had a pdf file of the rear of the Envoy's in dash radio. If I can get a copy it would be greatly appreciated.
This happened to me earlier this year. All the instruments were dead, but the car was running fine. Was about to go to boston, but wasn't going to take a chance. Played around with the car and somehow got the instruments to work, but they did it on their own initiative. Turned the engine on a off several times and nothing happened, until it wanted to turn on the instruments itself. Another poster way back said it happened to him when he left his gate ajar and hit an bump or something. Who knows, seems like they've got a mind of their own. But wanted to let you know that it happened to me as well.
Do you happen to know if your service visit invoice states a recalibration code for the wandering mirrors? I am wondering if your dealer may have applied some update to the system that now displays "curbside assist mirrors engaged?" I swear that I am dying to have this update applied to my Envoy.. it kind of gives it a "super high-tech" edge if you know what I mean.
Thanks!
IExplore2000@aol.com
A while back I checked into this, but I was told that driver 1 & 2 settings do not work in the LT. Your post indicates they do. I have a build date of 8/01.
Do you know what was done to get these settings active, including the seat positions.
Thanks
http://www.alldata.com/TSB/11/0211AWJ2.html
The only one about instruments doesn't apply since it concerns erratic operation not no operation. My TB was built in March 2002 and already has that fix included.
Kimodo, thanks for your comments, that's exactly what happened to mine.
Of course it hasn't rained here forever...
-mike