Chrysler 300M

bmadden1 · May 2002

sirharper-
I agree with you that the owner plays the biggest part in the durability of a vehicle. Without proper maintenance and care no vehicle will last. But like fastdriver said there has to be some reliability built into the vehicle from the start.

Currently, parked under my carport or in the barn are:

1985 Dodge 1/2 ton 4x4 pickup with 166k-still going.

1989 Dodge Daytona with 235k- this is still my daily driver.

1997 Dodge Dakota with 103k- wifes truck.

1999 300M with 43k- this is my baby!

And honorable mention has to go to wifes 1989 Dodge Shadow whos life was prematurely ended at 130k, by her girlfriend rear ending a gravel truck.

So, have I been lucky? Maybe. But I would like to think that these vehicles have treated me as well as I've treated them.

jona57 · May 2002

Atuoweek is doing their annual reader's survey. It will be interesting to see if the 300M makes the top-10 again this year with the intro of the Special.

http://www.autoweek.com/survey

Jon

sdmike2 · May 2002

I'm a firm believer in instinct. In fact, I think I've gotten so far in my professional career because I listen to those little nagging doubts the majority of the time. However, you need to keep in mind that there are a zillion parts in a car and any number of them can bring the car to it's knees if it fails. Nobody is perfect. No machine is perfect. It's all about probabilities. One in X number of BCMs will be bad. One in X number of rotors will have hard spots. One in X number of Ms will be possessed by the devil. Now, having said all this I think if I were in your shoes I'd ask myself some important questions about this car and how I feel about it..

Do you think you got a good deal?

If you didn't accept this car, would it be a hassle because you signed papers already?

If you didn't accept this car, would you be able to get a similar or better deal?

Do you want to really wait for a new one?

Is the "gray cloud" of having a potential possessed car going to bother you forever?

Do you trust the service department at the dealer that did the work?

Is a 7 year 100k warranty give you enough comfort to ignore the gray cloud?

I'm one of the most practical, objective and unemotional people I know when it comes to buying a car. In fact, I walked away from a deal on Big Red over a $250 gap between what I wanted to pay and the deal they offered. But even I felt some very strong vibes when I sat down in *MY* Big Red when she was finally mine. It would have been hard for me to "send her away" and order another over something that may be as small as the failure of a transistor. So...look into your heart and do what is best for you..not the dealer. If it's going to bother you, order another. If you take it, there's probably a minimal risk of future problems, and even if they DO occur there is the warranty.

Hope that helps, but it probably didn't. lol!

Mike

http://www.ritchiefamily.com/300m.htm

sdmike2 · May 2002

the M is listed as a "sedan", not as a "sport sedan" with the Lincoln LS. However, nothing wrong with a write-in vote. lol

km99cobra · May 2002

The basic problem is that I'm snakebit. When I came into the Edmunds forum in 1999 I was a happy owner of a 1999 Mustang Cobra (i.e. km99cobra ;-)). That was for six months, during which period I had to have Ford buy it back because it was a lemon; one that was clunking, vibrating, and 30HP short of advertised, in fact. It was a painful experience. I'm not saying this will be the same, but it seems to have started out that way.

The question on the deal I have negotiated is a good one. Yes I feel this is the best deal I could have negotiated. On the other hand, because I lease, there are many other lease deals out there that are better mainly due to the poor residual values that are present on the 300M's. I could buy, but because of our financial situation leasing is preferred. In this case, I wanted to do the deal and move on. If I walk from this deal the likelihood of getting another 300M Special with this dealer or any other at these terms is probably not going to happen. Part of the problem is locating another one. This one was the only one showing up in Ohio and fortunately was at a nearby dealer. They won't go to another state to locate and deliver another one for me I'm sure (unless I pay, which I won't). This has turned out to be a lot harder than I thought it would.

Don't worry though, I'm not desperate enough to get an Avalanche :-).

sdmike2 · May 2002

Mind me asking what you are paying for the Special? When I run numbers through carsdirect.com they come up with $30,392 on a fully loaded special (sunroof and side air bags) with a MSRP of $33,980 and an invoice of $32,067. If you consider the 3% holdback and the $1,500 rebate, the dealer's true cost on this car is about $29,600. The $30,392 gives the dealer a more than fair (IMHO) profit of around $800. If your "deal" isn't as good, you might want to go through carsdirect.com. It will be a "no hassle" deal, but they'd likely have to order what you want. In fact, if there aren't many dealers near you the carsdirect.com dealer representative for your area may be, in fact, the dealer you've been working with. That would be an interesting situation for sure. But remember, it's your money!

Just FYI, I got "Big Red" for $500 under the carsdirect.com price. I think the dealer was hoping to make his money off me on the trade-in, extras, financing or service. Didn't get me THERE either.

fastdriver · May 2002

This IS news! It's about time-

http://www.detnews.com/2002/insiders/0205/13/insider-486681.htm

This is even more interesting despite "sludge problems".
http://www.detnews.com/2002/autosinsider/0205/13/autos-488467.htm
fastdriver

sirharper · May 2002

Thanks, glad somebody agrees. Yes, in EVERY circumstance the operator and their treatment of the vehicle will impact overall satisfaction including durability. I drive my 00 M hard but I drive it fair as a result not a hint of trouble in 2 full years. Nor a problem with my 96 Sebring, nor my 95 Neon, nor my 87 Horizon, nor the wifes 96 Breeze, and if the same holds true (and it will) nor her new 02 Sebring. Somehow I think that if there were wide spread quality issues as many would like to believe I certainly would have seen them by now!

Fastdriver, perception is both everything and nothing. Toyota is not the quality god their followers would like to believe. They sell based on perception alone. Why else would they be able to charge more and give less? I won't even go into performance, interior, and ride quality. I believe Car and Driver Television said it best when they compared the Sebring, Camry, and Accord head to head. Sebring beat the others of course in performance and value but the word they attached to the Camry summed everything up...they actually called it "MINDLESS"...I couldn't agree more.

toms99 · May 2002

Just some additional thoughts:

The PCM is an easy, no hassle repair. If the car runs fine after they replace it, the car should be fine, and is certainly not predictive of any future troubles.

If you got a good deal and they fix the problem, I would go ahead and take delivery. Hey, you could order another Special, but there could always be problems with the new one that are either worse or only show up later. (PS: That's why they call it a "warranty", not a "guarantee"!!)

If you are leasing, so much the better. Drive it for 3 years at Chrysler's risk. If there are no problems after 3 years just buy it at the low residual value. If further problems *do* develop turn it in at lease end and walk away. You really can't lose.

easyrider300m · May 2002

careful about using that product---be sure it wont crack with time

I believe that stuff is almost like a paint as it is surface coloring only--with time it will wear and crack expecially on a seating surface--I would think its ok for door covering and seatbacks but not the seating surface itself--I had a body shop put something like that on my door panels on another vehicle and within 3 years it was all crazed and wearining.

I think you're better leaving well enough alone---or put in seats from the Special as I think they are already 2 toned.

Scotian: also had trouble opening your picture site this afternoon--and I have high speed cable--it would not open at all....tonight I tried it again and it worked very smoothly and quickly...their servers may be overtaxed at certain times of day--hopefully they will correct the overloading problem.. otherwise it may be time for a new host site.

Easyrider300M

achance · May 2002

I grew up a GM/Chevrolet type - born and raised in The South, after all. Got a bit of an education and went foreign -Fiat, Toyoto, Toyoto Land Cruiser (back to the earth period), Porsche 911 (please God, just one more Trans-Alaska Pipeline), an Olds Delta to haul customers around in when I was building. Then I sorta grew up, well I did buy a VW Jetta because I was poor after a divorce. Three Chryslers in the last several years. A 74 P/U that I never could break even at 140K+ miles but it finally just rusted away. An 88 LeBaron Coupe that I drove about 70K then turned over to kids for another 20k. The 16 year old girl blew the engine at 120 mph on the way to town one afternoon. Put another one in it and it went another 8-10K. Its still around town being driven every day. And then I bought the M in Dec 99. Driven every day, half the year in really rotten weather and the only thing that has ever broken was the passenger side window switch through 28K miles.

300michael · May 2002

I will take pictures of a lowered (1.8) 300M tomorrow. Cann't wait. I will do the spacers myself, after I redo the hood scoop duct to allow for the extra half inch rise in the engine height.

300michael · May 2002

I guess I am now longer the only one (center console light) with that option. Nice job.

sdmike2 · May 2002

Now back to your normal programming.

easyrider300m · May 2002

maybe the Kings will end up playing the Celtics, but I think it will be Lakers vs Celtics in the finals.

ER

sdmike2 · May 2002

If the kings play the celtics, don't expect to win any games where you score only 66 points. Do that against the kings and you'll likely be losing by 40.

Sorry ER, I lived in Philly when Bird, Doc and Magic were all battling all those years. As a result I still don't like the Celtics, and I DOUBLY hate the lakers.

Best of luck though. Seems everything Boston does this year turns to gold.

wire2 · May 2002

I just today grabbed a standard chrome 17" and a Special 18" and took them to the shipping dept. scale on a golf cart.
The chromie is 44 lb., the special 49½ lb. both with proper tires on and balanced.
The extra resonator is about 8lb., the front sway bar is 2-3 lb. more, and the main exhaust system is 4 lb. more. The difference in the side cladding, wood/carbon fiber trim, and front and rear fascias is negligible.
So assuming donut spare in both, Special is +- 37lb. more. I drove a Special onto the 4 scales in the audit area and they added up to 3630 lb. but they haven't been calibrated for a while, dunno if that's accurate.

ski1001 · May 2002

Driving home yesterday afternoon in the rain, I had a really vivid light show on my 2000 300m. Lights continued to blink for about 30 seconds. Went back to normal and then blinked again for about 10 seconds. Has anyone come up with a "fix" for this problem? Is there a TSB about blinking lights? I know other 300m owners have had this problem but if I take it to 5* dealer and he can't duplicate this, then what? I'm at 26K, still have another 10k left on warranty.

toms99 · May 2002

OK, now you've heard from Nooo Jurseeeee.....!

sdmike2 · May 2002

They need to replace your body control module

wire2 · May 2002

I believe there's a breaker built in to the light switch to protect the circuit from overcurrent. Since headlights tripping off and staying off would be dangerous, they use a self resetting type.
Are both headlights at proper illumination when they're on? Does the headlight switch get slightly warm after 15-20 min? (that's normal because there's a resistive sensing element in it).
I see 2 possibilities here, there's an intermittent short increasing current, or the headlight switch is defective.

ski1001 · May 2002

Sdmike2, is the body control module the very expense part that controls many "things"?

Wire2, I really don't know if the headlights are actually blinking. When it has occurred has been in daylight and most time the windshield wipers are running. All the interior lights flash high and low. I also hear clicking sound like a relay.

easyrider300m · May 2002

I have had that light show happen to my M a few times---usually when its daytime and the wipers are on... the overhead lights come on briefly and then go out...only happened a few time times...but i wonder if it will get worse..I only have 2k left on warranty so I plan on reporting it to the 5* soon...anyone know if there is a tsb for this prob

ER

blonda · May 2002

I have had the interior lights slowley come on then off again a couple times in 3 years. I think the interior light switch had gotten in a position where it was "almost" on.

I still have that weird blinking fog light thing going on with my 99. Haven't bothered to have it looked at. Only blink on and off if I turn them on without the headlights first. If I turn them on with the headlights first for a little while, then turn the headlights off -- no problems.

scotian · May 2002

300michael - Actually, that was one of my first mods. I think you gave me the idea.

sdmike2 · May 2002

Yep..that's it! The few people here that have had the interior "light show" problem and have had it fixed reported that the repair was to replace the BCM...which apparently isn't cheap! Hopefully one or two of those guys will chime in. One is Dr Pixel, but I don't remember who the others were.

Mike

sdmike2 · May 2002

I know this is completely off topic, but those of you that are into building your own computers should check out this link. If I was working this would be cool.

http://www.northwardgraphics.com/

laurasdada · May 2002

fastdriver & easyrider300m, that is: I wrote of my travel plans before I heard the story of the "gentleman with the gambling problem." At least now his gambling problem is not his main problem...tis a shame to be so consumed by something like gambling (or cigarettes, alcohol, expensive cars...).

Anywho, I'm purely a small time player, strictly for occasional recreation. MS has grown considerably. Then new casino is more Vegas-like, much brighter with a nice little no smoking area. A beautiful arena for sports/concerts and many overpriced restaraunts and shops in a connecting hall between the old and new casinos(use your player points...). And a glacier/waterfall. Just a lovely way to fritter away some of the hard earned 300M gas money!

I've always enjoyed this board, good people and conversation. And, of course, a good car. For the majority, at least? Glad to hear the CL is a winner, I had an '88 Integra. Loved it. Fun and probably the best screwed together car I've owned.

20 miles past warranty, no problems to report.

300michael · May 2002

300michael · May 2002

struts and lowering springs put on. I drop off the car and tell the service rep that I want the PHP struts put on and while they were at it to put on the springs. I get a call after an The front struts are off) hour and he says they only have the front struts, that if I want the rear ones it would cost (for a total of $550) extra. He said the price he quoted was for just the front. After going through the roof, I basicly told him to put the car back together and forget the whole thing. He called me back about 10 minutes later I asked him, do you normally put on lowering springs with PHP struts in the front and leave the rear with stock springs and struts? He agreed that it should not be done because it would through the whole car off, not to mention almost making it undriveable due to the the scraping the front would do on any road imperfection. So the end result is I will be keeping my stock struts, and they will mount the springs for me. My five star is in a nose dive, I am hopeing he will pull out before he hits bottom. Will inform you all later how it turns out. I guess next time I do the work myself.

beach15 · May 2002

Nice comment...really funny!

fastdriver- Interesting news actually. What's weird to me is that if you look at many recent DC cars, Chrysler vehicles seem to be getting more "Germanic" in style, build quality, features, character, etc. And, on the other hand, Mercedes-Benz vehicles seem to be getting a little more "Chrysler-ized" with softer & rounder shapes, more flowing and simpler interiors, etc. It's weird, but am I the only one noticing it?

I think Deiter has a good idea with the quality. Make the cars the best in terms of quality among both domestics and at least equal to many imports (percepted or real). But also, work on the dealers, weeding out more supposed 5*'s, and actually reinventing or at least changing the typical experience a Chrysler buyer has, both before and after the sale. There's some really intelligent and resourceful people working at DC nowadays, and while it may take a while, soon it should really show. Who knows, maybe I'll even start liking their products again...or maybe not?!

beach15 · May 2002

See, that's exactly what I mean about the dealers! Your car may be great, but the whole dealer experience leaves you with a bitter taste. There are many times I wonder what we might still be driving if someone at the one of the dealers had brains enough to fix the seemingly minor issues we had with the M. Sure, there seemed to be a never ending list of crap going wrong with it, but nothing a few techs who knew what they were doing couldn't figure out in a single visit. Or, at least, treat us well.

It was both the car and the incompetent dealers that turned us against the M. The Av is still great (knock on wood!), but I really do hope if there ever is a problem, the dealer knows what they're doing.

beach15 · May 2002

Hmm...16 years old and hope to have a car by this winter/fall. Rather interested in a sporty mid-size sedan. Wonder what would be best...

Ahh, but first, I have to work a little!

300michael · May 2002

It looks veeerrrrryyy goooooood. Later I will buy the strut tool and change them out. The ride is kind of weird. it still has the stock ride to a certian extent, until the springs get more compressed. I would say I lost about 1/3 the ride quality, because of the springs. I will see if I can reproduce the dredded vibration with somemore testing tomorrow.
I also have to decide if I want to remove the front air dam to gain more clearance. What I am thinking of is romoving the fasterers and cutting them about half way to weaken them incase I ever hit something it will just break off without damageing the front end.

easyrider300m · May 2002

Youre lookin for a midsize sports sedan...ahh, maybe you should look at a 300M--;-)--used ones can be got for a fair price--we know you really do like the car--its your mother that hated it... or if not the M, I can see you in an SUV....with your taste in vehicles, I think an Aztek would fill the bill...happy hunting!

300Michael--save yourself some aggravation and just cut the damn air dam right off----I did and dont have any problems with cooling or any other noticeable probs---I almost ruined my bumper cover cause of that damned air dam!

sdmike2 · May 2002

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1823996509&r=0&t=0

videoman1 · May 2002

Well, the guy doesn't use Paypal so I'm out.

kosh_2258 · May 2002

That guy has his mileage bassackwards...
That speedo's primary calibration is in MPH so the mileage is 5500mi, not kilometers. He's got about 8850KM on the vehicle.

Not a big difference, but I'm surprised someone who owns a car like that would make such a mistake.

splatt · May 2002

Kosh - if you look above the mileage you'll see it says KM. So he is correct. However, I really don't see ebay as the forum to sell something like this. If I had the money and interest to purchase something like that I sure as heck wouldn't waste my time browsing the web

pjyoung · May 2002

Mark Cuban (owner of the Dallas Mavericks) bought a Gulfstream jet off of e-bay....several MILLION bucks. In fact, the $165,000 the guy wanted for this car wouldn't even have paid for recarpeting the interior. Must be painful to have that much money.

easyrider300m · May 2002

and I was just getting ready to make my bid. Maybe I'll give him a buzz and see if he would take my M in trade! If that aint a cop magnet, I dont know what is. They would pull you over just to check out the car. YOu could either buy a condo or that car. A condo would at least go UP in value.

ER

300michael · May 2002

I is a real shame to have a car that goes that fast and only drive it at 1/3 it's capable speed.

kosh_2258 · May 2002

Yeah, I see that. Didn't notice the kmH at the bottom. 5500KM it is.

fuzzywuzzy · May 2002

300M is #6, LHS is #10

http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/05/15/stolen.cars/index.html

mikeyjohn · May 2002

I really feel bad because I want to be #1!!!!!!!!! LOL

fastdriver · May 2002

sdmike2-

Nah....there's several TSB's on it
: LAMBORGHINI
Model: DIABLO
Year: 1998
Service Bulletin Number: 9802
Bulletin Sequence Number: 440
Date of Bulletin: 10/98
NHTSA Item Number: SB604388
Component: POWER TRAIN:DRIVELINE:DIFFERENTIAL:OTHER PARTS (8/82)
Summary:

INFORMATION ON REPLACING THE REAR DIFFERENTIAL PINION & CROWN.

fastdriver

300michael · May 2002

Aparently the thieves are enjoying the 300M's too. This is one case I wouldn't mind being last.

Put and sign on your M that says steal me, and leave the keys in the car. You will soon be No.1. lol

300michael · May 2002

It is a shame there are slime balls out there that want to steal your cars. Sometimes it is hard to have a cool looking car, because someone else always wants it for free.

300michael · May 2002

Recieved the clock face today, thanks so very much. It does add a touch of "Class and Sophistication" to the car. Egads, I starting to sound like a MB owner.

300michael · May 2002

It is with the Alpine stereo. Everything but the radio works. So I have to see what can be done to fix it.

Chrysler 300M

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