Ford Explorer Mercury Mountaineer 2005 and earlier

02mnt6sux · February 2005

I am writing this post to make potential buyers aware of the numerous of problems I had experienced not only with the vehicle but the dealership. First off I have been taking my SUV to Delray Mercury in Florida which is by far the worst service center I have ever been to. I own a 02 Mountaineer which I had gotten through the A Plan thinking I got a great deal(boy was I wrong). One of the biggest problems I had experienced was when I filled the gas tank the fuel gauge would not go up. and I know what some of you are gonna say is did you give it about 10-15 minutes? Not only did I give it 10 minutes but the following morning to the dealership my needle was still pointing at almost empty. 2nd problem was the front air conditioning vents would turn on and off. A problem I had experienced twice already. The guy told me that something had melted due to heat in the engine. Don't they fire guard these things so they stop melting? Problem number 3 rear left window would not work. Problem 4 Oil pressure in vehicle dropped causing the vehicle to resemble a UFO with all the lights and noise that were coming from the message center on the dash. Needless to say I reported all these problems to my service advisor and get this. They had my car for 3 weeks diagnosing the problems with my vehicle. Well I got my vehicle back last week and guess what??? The High Temp Low Oil came on in the vehicle while I was driving. So I pulled over and did the system check on the dash and checked the gauges. After I went and checked the oil dipstick & the radiator to make sure the car wasn't overheating. Now it's back to the dealership again for another 3 weeks. Now I have complained to Mercury Corporation and am actually seeking arbitration because this is enough. I can't file lemon law since most of the problems have only occurred twice. So to all you potential buyers beware of this vehicle. This is my 1st new vehicle I have ever bought and regret making it a Mercury. I love the look and the feel of my vehicle, but do not need all these problems being practically brand new. So to you potential buyers save yourself the headache and get a Toyota or a Nissan(I know I will once this headache is gone).

chuck1 · February 2005

I am sorry you are having problems. Of all the things you stated, the only thing I know of that is a common problem is the power window motor on the left rear. This also happened to my '02 Explorer XLT V6 2wd. The part was on "national backorder". I now have 35,000 miles on my Explorer with out any mechanical issues. I do have a slight hum coming from the rear end. I purchased an extended warranty from www. fordwarrantys.com so I am covered there. Most of my issues have been "rattles" coming from different places. I would talk with Mercury to see if they can help. Again, I am sorry.

idntnvu · February 2005

Hate to hear about all your problems. Sounds like you have a reason to be fed up with this one, but a few alarms and lights are minor compared to, for example, the new '05 Pathfinder's transmission going out in less than 1000 miles, or any number of problems that the new ones are having. The Toyotas seem to be okay, but every dog has it's day. If I were you, I'd try taking it elsewhere.

However, if you take the route of a Nissan, which I myself have also considered, stick with a previous generation Pathfinder ('01-'04). Your Merc is in the same boat as the new Pathy, first year models. I don't care what anyone says, the first year a particular version of a vehicle is made, you should always expect problems to arise. They haven't been around long enough for those problems to have been made public for you to know about them in advance.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

benderofbows · February 2005

I agree, trying a different service department could make all the difference.

02mnt6sux · February 2005

I have looked at the option of taking my vehicle to another dealership, but the problem is the only one near me is that one. The others are way out of my way. Oh just a so you guys know my left rear window stopped working again(2nd time). This is a problem I took it into the dealership in December. They practically had my SUV there for almost 2 months and they still can't get a simple window fixed. I tell you guys I am sorry to say but I will not be purchasing anymore American vehicles. This Mercury has given me a bad impression of American products and the quality and worksmanship that goes into the vehicle let alone the service from the dealership. Also the dealership has offered to give me a free ESP warranty with a $50 deductible. But I see it as they can't fix it during the warranty period and now want me to pay for items they can't fix. Right now I am working on a letter that I am going to send to Ford/Mercury and the AG of the state and contact the BBB. I will keep you guys posted on how it goes and any helpful info would be great so I can get out of this car and into something more reliable.

02xls · February 2005

I am just curious, what made you want to buy the 02MM in the first place? What else did you consider at that time?

svofan2 · February 2005

Nice to see you back ANT,any word on the Explorer 2006?...what is your opinion of the Expy 2005..I am still undecided if I should wait for the 2006 Explorer or go for 2005 Expy....depends on how long for the 2006 explorer...your opnion is appreciated,,

ANT14 · February 2005

Yes, I'm glad you reminded me. Production will begin on the middle of July, you'll see them arriving around the end of August. I believe Dearborn receives this product to manufacture, not confirmed yet.

SOME of the changes will include the new 4.6L 3V V8 which debuted in the new for '05 Mustang, detuned for truck duty, but more useable torque (since it's a heavier vehicle) and 6 speed automatic. Front and rear fascias will be styled much like the Sport Trac concept that was released in the last round of auto shows, and the interior is similar to that concepts as well. Rear liftgate will be redesigned a bit.

Extra toys of course, such as standard Stability System with Roll Control, Sirius radio availability... Improved radios, improved interior materials, more attention to NVH, stronger structure and improved fuel efficiency as well.

Sport Trac will follow after.

keeferb · February 2005

Are they leaving the V6 as is? Seems like of the 2 current engines, this is the one that needs refinement.

02mnt6sux · February 2005

I bought the 02MM because my wife worked at ford Credit and she got an A Plan. We were considering the Explorer EB and decided with the MM because it had all the same functions as the EB and the price was less. I loved the look and fell of the truck and also needed the space for cargo and my family. Now since it spends its time in the dealership for weeks I get stuck with a Mercury Sable and its real difficult trying to get stuff done with that car.

ANT14 · February 2005

"Are they leaving the V6 as is?"

Minor refinements.

benderofbows · February 2005

"I tell you guys I am sorry to say but I will not be purchasing anymore American vehicles. This Mercury has given me a bad impression of American products and the quality and worksmanship that goes into the vehicle let alone the service from the dealership."

You shouldn't get a bad impression of all American vehicles from one experience. The worst car I have ever had, as far as breakdowns and repairs, was (surprisingly) a Honda Accord, but that doesn't mean that all Japanese cars have poor quality and workmanship.

02xls · February 2005

"You shouldn't get a bad impression of all American vehicles from one experience" This is true 02mnt6sux, so go ahead and read thru the pages on this Explorer board and you will find many more experiences to prove that your impression is correct.

explorerx4 · February 2005

02mnt6sux and 02xls; guess you would have been happier if you had an 02eb, like me. look at it this way, how many '02-05 explorers did ford sell? oh, add mountaneers to that. how many different people are complaining here?

02xls · February 2005

02eb WOW I'm impressed! With Ford's A-Z plans, number of dealerships, fleet and government programs, low rate financing/rebate offers, Explorer, MM and Aviator offerings along with a dollar amount well into the millions spent in advertising dollars, Ford should be able to sell a lot of vehicles. Who knows how many are complaining, more than a few.

svofan2 · February 2005

Thanks ANT for your quick reply. I think I will wait for the 06 Explorer in August....one final question, is the 06 being displayed at the current Auto shows?....maybe the one in NYC?....it sounds good..very good....I have an 02 Limited and it has been terrific after 31,000 miles...have looked at other SUVs (even more Luxury ones)and they do not even match the value vs price that the Explorers (and Expdetions) offer....

ANT14 · February 2005

In the current shows (and the one's that just finished) the Sport Trac concept was shown, moreso because that vehicle needs more exposure. In Chicago, you will see Mercury Mountaineer version. You might see the Explorer in other shows mainly because the Mountaineer and Sport Trac need more exposure. Everyone knows the Explorer and it's no issue selling, so there's a bit more concentration earlier on ST and Mountaineer's.

bond001 · February 2005

Hi 02. I am sorry to hear about your problems. I have two EB Explorers 1997 & 98 and they have served me well. Sounds like you got one being built maybe on shift change or defective parts. It unexcuseable for a dealership to have your car for the length of time you have mentioned. I would go directly to the service manager and go over your concerns again. Tell him that you want their best mechanic to work on your car and get these problems resolved within a day or so. Ask about a car upgrade, another Mountaineer. Parts shouldn't be a problem even if they have to replace the entire window regulator or track system. I would ask the Service mgr that if he can't get this car fixed who should you contact at Ford? Service manager want to get you problem resolved and not have you go to Ford about your problem. Hopefully the service Mgr will do his all for you. Also are they a Blue Oval dealership? You could also take this car to a Ford Dealer in your area if you feel you will get the service you deserve. They might baulk, but tell them what you have gone thru. Maybe they can do better. As to the extended Warranty. If they offer it to you free take it,just make sure it is the Ford warranty and nothing else. But here is what you want. You want a 100,000. Zero deductible extended warranty. The $50.00 is good but try for the zero and see. The extended warranty will add resale value to your car if you decide to get rid of the car, plus anyone who inherits your problems will have some comfort in knowing that the warranty will cover it and you will have peace of mind about Ford fixing it right hopefully. Every MFG has some problems or other whether foreign or US. I would call to speak with the service manager ahead of time so he knows to expect your car and can attend to your problems properly.Also their is usually a Ford service rep who visits dealership on a monthly basis as to deal with concerns like yours. Ask to know when he is coming to the dealership and make an appointment. Double check this as sometimes their schedules can change on the expected day they are to show up. Most of the time they will be at a dealership for ½ or most of the day to go over any problems with other cars or people issues. Parts shouldn't be an issue as most dealers now a days get parts everyday or next day if they are not in stock. I know this for a fact so don't let them fool you. Again check to see if this is a blue oval dealership. Blue oval dealerships must meet certain standards to carry that kind of quality service. Another idea would be to go too your sales person or dealership owner and explain your problem to them. I would write all this out and go paper in hand to whomever you are speaking too. Make several copies and keep a file so everything is together,names dates, times etc. Let me know how you fair. I hope it works out.

al330i · February 2005

I have a 2005 XLT with Michelin Cross Terrain Tires. Here is my question. When driving in the snow in 4x4 Auto the truck does not feel very stable. It feels almost like I am sliding. I then proceed to put it in 4x4 High. I don't hear any clunking or feel anything different. The 4x4 High light illuminates on the dash, but the truck still feels like it is sliding. Is it possible that even though the 4x4 light on the dash is on, that the truck is still in 2WD mode? I had a 92 XLT a few years back. I seem to recall that when I locked that thing in 4x4, it went straight as an arrow. It felt as if I was driving on a dry road. Can the Cross Terrains be that bad? Any input would be appreciated.

svofan2 · February 2005

...makes sense..again thanks for your insights...I can't help but wonder how "close" you really are to Ford...

benderofbows · February 2005

Well spoken, explorerx4.

02xls, I beleive his point is similiar to one I have made before; yes, more Explorers are sold than any other SUV, but the important point is to look at how few complaints there are in comparison.

Complaints are reported to the media, to the NHTSA and BBB, and in forums such as this. However, there aren't a disproportionate number of Explorer complaints anywhere. Every major production vehicle has a "[vehicle]: Problems and Solutions" board on these forums filled with defects and other complaints, and since Ford does sell so many Explorers you would expect to see alot more complaints than other makes/models. However, this is not the case.

dani24 · February 2005

My boyfriend bought a 2004 Ford Explorer last year, WITH the 3rd row seat. He wanted to get a cargo shade for it (and I was going to purchase it for him as a gift). However, I'm beginning to think I'm wasting my time.

Is it possible to use a rear cargo shade if the vehicle also has the 3rd row seats? I found someplace that has a very good deal on them, but don't want to buy it and find out it won't work.

marsha7 · February 2005

from those of you in the know...I just read (Motor Trend?) about the 2006 Sport Trac, and what I noticed was one of my favorite features, a new shifter on the floor/console instead of the column, just like the new F150 Lariat...if the Sport Trac will have the floor shifter, will it also be available on the Explorer/Mountaineer??? If yes, it could give me serious competetion for the Jeep Grand Cherokee, especially if the Ex/Moun also offers a 4WD option with hi and lo range...further, will the 4.6L 3 valve engine put out more than the current 239 HP and 220(??) ft lbs of torque...while the 2004 Mount that I test drove was peppy with 239 HP, having 275 or 300 can't hurt...:):):):):)...then it might compete with my Ram Hemi at 340 HP...

ANT14 · February 2005

Yes, it'll have a floor mounted shifter.

explorerx4 · February 2005

i think the 2v 4.6 has around 280 ft lbs of torque. the 2v mustang went from 260 hp to 300 with the 3v. i am only trying to recall the published numbers.

ANT14 · February 2005

Yes, although the Explorer will not have the exact 300HP and 320TQ that they Mustang sports. That's accomplished through special tuning which makes the best use of it's much ligher body, and higher revving nature.

The Explorer will have a detuned version of that version, making more torque at lower RPM's for hauling/towing capacity.

02xls · February 2005

BOB, look I agree with you that Ford has built and sold more than any other SUV, I listed the reasons and ways that they have done this in my last post. With this said disregard for a moment the actual number of complaints pertaining to the Explorer,MM, and Aviator and look closer at the content of these posts. Rear Ends replaced on the same vehicle multiple times, power windows not working, faulty fuel gauges, loss of oil pressure, rear hatch falling and glass breakage, multiple transmission problems, seats not functioning properly, having to replace brake pads @ 13,500 miles, blown speakers, A/C vent problems..... this is just to name a few. Not to mention the noted multiple trips to the dealer to address the same problems again and again, many times with no resolution, that many have mentioned. I know that you are going to say many of these problems are minor. But how many people out there want to spend $25,000.00 plus on a vehicle and have to deal with trips to the service dept. to have the brake pads replaced after 13,500 miles because the manufacturer used a low priced supplier or installed them incorrectly?

benderofbows · February 2005

Sure, we can look at the content of these posted complaints. But since we all know that you like to make a claim and greatly exaggerate it, we need to look at the whole picture. There are also many owners who have posted on here that they have not had any troubles, right? That is why you cannot exclude the actual number of complaints. As I have said before, for every one person on here complaining there are a dozen out there who are happy.

But let's go beyond these forums. Let's get to the bottom of this issue once and for all.

We should consult some industry experts, people who research automotive reliability for a living, who know much more about this topic than you, I, or anyone on these forums. Experts like the people of Automotive Information Systems.

Wait, MSN Autos has already done that! "Determining vehicle reliability is an exacting task requiring professional skills, knowledge, and a wealth of information. Thats why MSN Autos partners with industry-leading Automotive Information Systems (AIS) for top-notch reliability data on all listed automobiles. the nation's largest and most comprehensive source of automotive repair knowledge regarding vehicle parts that break, model lines affected, and how best to make repairs. How does MSN Autos rate the Explorer as far as reliability? Four out of five, not bad for any mid-sized SUV!

OK, but what about information available to consumers also? Well, that would have to be Consumer Reports! "Expert testing of thousands of products." For automotive, they anonymously buy vehicles and drive them thousands of miles. Oh, and they also survey 675,000 consumers annually, the most comprehensive automotive reliability market research project in the world. So, what does CR think of the current-generation Explorer? They rate it "average" in reliability, stating that it is improving over past model years. You yourself admit the old ones were solid trucks. The new ones are better still! And, CR now recommends the Explorer based on performance, RELIABILITY, and safety.

Still not enough? Alrighty, lets check out the Office of Defects Investigation. They accept complaints direct from consumers and then investigate. This government office, a branch of the NHTSA, is the one who makes manufacturers issue recalls. Surely if, as you say, there are a lot of people out there in hiding who are having problems with their vehicles, that have somehow been overlooked by all the other research, we'd find them here right? You're unlucky again. They only conducted 3 investigations on the Explorer in 2002, all closed with no recalls issued. 2003, 2004, 2005? NONE!

Now what about the good old US legal system? The last recourse of a frustrated consumer who isn't getting help on his problems would be to try and get the car labeled as a lemon. By definition, a "lemon" means, as you yourself state, "noted multiple trips to the dealer to address the same problems again and again, many times with no resolution." So are there a disproportionate number of lemon law cases for the Explorer? You know the answer!

OK, so even though the Explorer is the best selling mid-size SUV, if your claims are correct than people would never buy another one, would they? Wrong again buddy! The Explorer has been highest in owner loyalty for 14 years. That's right, people love them so much, they buy another!

Oh yea, I forgot to illustrate, again, how you take some little piece of information and blow it all out of proportion. Those brake pads you were talking about? That was my post. I had written that I thought they needed to be changed, and the rotors turned, probabaly because I have been really hard on them. Well, it turned out that the slight vibration I felt when braking was just a tire that was out of balance. Oh, but you were quick to jump to all kinds of conclusions: "Low priced [break pad] supplier"? [pads] "installed incorrectly"? You need to either get your facts straight and stop making all of these ridiculous claims, or just shut up altogether.

chuck1 · February 2005

"this is just to name a few. Not to mention the noted multiple trips to the dealer to address the same problems again and again, many times with no resolution, that many have mentioned."

This is a sore point with me. It took THREE TRIPS TO THE DEALER before they finally ordered a new door handle for the driver's side that was rattling. This is inexcusable! IT'S A DOOR HANDLE...... NOT A TRANNY OR SOMETHING!! Give me a BREAK!!

jcat707 · February 2005

Will the refreshened 06 Explorers have an availble factory navigation system? It seems like most of it's competition already have them availble.

benderofbows · February 2005

I am sorry that your dealer either had trouble diagnosing the problem and/or was reluctant to make it right. I would suggest that, for any future concerns, you find a service department who is concerned with customer satisfaction. Unfortunately, many major car dealers seem to be having trouble in these areas.

benderofbows · February 2005

I get so tired of these "slippery slopes"!

There are complaints on every vehicle board on this site, be it a Chevy Trailblazer, Honda Pilot, Jeep Grand Cherokee, VW Touareg, Kia Sportage, and on and on... It's pretty much the same each time, an individual has a problem and unfortunately has a dealer who can't diagnose it, doesn't know how to fix it, or just doesn't care about customer service and is unwilling to make it right. So he vents his frustrations.

But then for some reason you people, who seem to have it out for Ford, blow it all out of proportion and make all sorts of slippery arguments. "Yeah, Ford made a really bad product this time. Don't buy one of these, or you will have problems, too. They are bad. If you have to buy one for whatever reason, get a big warranty, you'll definately need it." And all of this is based on a personal experience and/or some negative posts, with nothing to support all of the claims made.

In fact, all of the evidence (and industry leaders, and experts' opinions, and market research and studies, and independent secondary researchers, and investigational organizations, etc. etc!) show just the opposite. They all show that the Explorer is an overall reliable choice, and if you buy one you don't have any greater chance of having some kind of problem than the average car.

So, you people keep it up. Keep making your unsupported and incomplete arguments. And I'll keep citing facts and research (from people who actually know what they are talking about) that show you are wrong.

nvbanker · February 2005

It'll work fine, unless the seat is up. Then you'll have a problem. Keep the seat down, and it's fine, otherwise, you need to take it out.

nvbanker · February 2005

I have to wonder though - these problems I have never experienced on any of my Explorers, so...... blown speakers? 13,000 mile brakes? I can get somewhere between 30,000 to 60,000 miles out of a set of brakes on every Explorer I've owned, if they can only get 13,500 out of theirs, and the speakers are blown too, I am starting to understand what's wrong with their truck.

chuck1 · February 2005

My wife's Explorer got 32,000 miles on the original brakes. She probably could have gone 35K, but she is a teacher and we took advantage of a vacation period and had the brakes changed. As far as the speakers are concerned, the only way I know to blow speakers is to turn them up all the way with the wrong kind of song playing. A song heavy in bass will blow speakers if you turn them up all the way.... Overall it's been an OK SUV. I purchased a extended warranty to cover the rear end. It's almost out of warranty with 35,500 miles on it!

ANT14 · February 2005

New Mountaineer...

http://media.ford.com/article_display.cfm?article_id=20183

ottav · February 2005

I was just on the media.ford.com website looking at the 2006 Mountaineer. It looks great, and they've addressed a lot of the complaints of my 2002. My question to you: my lease is up on September 10. Will the 2006's be in the showroom by then? If not, do you think there is a way to extend my Red Carpet Lease a few months so I can wait for one?

ANT14 · February 2005

It should be entering in the market just around when your lease is up. I would call RedCarpet Lease and ask if you could extend it pending the purchase of a vehicle that has not yet been released. Moreso, I don't see why they wouldn't be able to do so.

jcat707 · February 2005

That new Mountaineer interior is looks really nice and finally there will be a DVD Navigation system.

ottav · February 2005

Thanks. I'll give it a try.

I'm really impressed on the number of improvements they've made to the 2006. From the interior to the stiffer frame and new IRS. From earlier reports I had read, this was only going to be a minor update. It's changed my mind to not get a leftover 2005 and wait for a 2006.

nvbanker · February 2005

Your dealer can get you a lease extension month to month until the new model is in, or until a car you order comes in. You just keep making your monthly payment, and keep your car, Ford Credit is happy. See your participating Lincoln-Mercury dealer. No problem.

02xls · February 2005

Chevy Trailblazer 5 out of 5

Jeep Grand Cherokee 5 out of 5

Nissan Pathfinder 5 out of 5

Dodge Durango 5 out of 5

Mitsubishi Montero 5 out of 5

Buick Rendezvous 5 out of 5

Hyundai Santa Fe 5 out of 5

This is what RELIABILITY RANKINGS the so called industry leading EXPERTS at MSN Autos (AIS) gave these makes and models. These are the same ones who as you pointed out earlier gave the Explorer 4 out of 5. You are right,"not bad for any mid-sized SUV!" Did you read the list of trucks that the EXPERTS ranked higher than the Explorer? The Trailblazer? Rendezvous? Santa Fe? Are you serious???

CR-- "Expert testing" "survey 675,000 consumers annually" Please refer to the 2004 Annual Auto Issue, there on page 81 you will find the Ford Explorer on a list titled USED CARS TO AVOID. Also in a section referring to reliability the Explorer falls below average for predicted reliability landing behind the Highlander,4-Runner,Pathfinder,Montero,Rendezvous,Murano and Pilot. There is a bright spot from CR that you also pointed out, because the Explorers reliability has risen to AVERAGE, CR can now RECOMMEND this truck. I personally am not one to accept AVERAGE! I guess for all those who want to live with mediocrity, this is the SUV for you.

Recalls-- BOB You do not have to quote any of your so called EXPERTS or Gov't Offices, just look on Edmunds and you will easily find at least one Recall on the Explorer. It's not a big deal, but I wanted to point this out because you so boldly stated "NONE!" were issued. Is that fluid for the Tranny any kind of Recall? Maybe that's just a letter to owners pointing out some sort of screw-up.

Recent Press Release-- Ford sales dropped 5.4% in January. Ford to cut production this quarter after posting weak sales month in January. Ford to offer Interest-Free loans in an effort to boost sales. This does include the Explorer. (Maybe alot of people out there want better than AVERAGE!)

Post #2223---"I have worn out my brake pads at 13,500 miles(not used to driving something so heavy!)my dealer is going to replace them(and turn the rotors if necessary, they feel a bit warped) FOC." Now BOB, first of all what did you drive before that made the tank of an Explorer feel so heavy? A Focus? The rotors felt like they needed to be turned after 13,500 miles? I don't know BOB, I'm not sure what to make of this. You say these things then change your story and blame it on some tire situation. I know what I think of this but I will keep those thoughts to myself.

I can't thank you enough for pointing out all of this Gov't and Expert info., I have learned quite a bit. Mainly, that if I had known then, what I know now, I never would have purchased an Explorer and I am certainly not foolish enough to ever do it again.

svofan2 · February 2005

ANT you would be really a NICE guy if you could find something about the 2006 EXPLORER...I know...I know...IT will be similar....but Mountanier has always been 2 notches above in looks....thanks anyways....

ANT14 · February 2005

Under the skin, you know it'll be the same. What differs will be interior 2-tone color senario, and rear LED tail-lights on white background as the Mountaineer sports.

Out of the 2, I prefer the Explorer front fascia. Looks a bit more sportier, over the Mountaineers which looks a bit more car-like and sophisticated. Which is perfectly fine, according to the persons taste. Currently, I liked the Mountaineer because of it's sharp crease/angles in it's front fascia. Made it different. I feel the new one was softened up a bit, but again... All personal taste.

The Explorer Sport Trac concept's front fascia, is very similar to what the Explorer will sport. The top grill, and bottom fascia are evidently bisected by the solid bumper area. It has a "hint" of new Audi's front fascia. It has that horse collar form as you saw, with the bi-secting bumper area. And the bumper area is (in my taste/opnion) a bit better integrated into the top grill, and bottom fascia.

Obviously in the higher trims like Limited, you'll have more touch of chrome in the front fascia over the base version. And the usual round of tech toys, from the DVD based Navigation system, to the power folding 3rd row seats.

benderofbows · February 2005

Thank you for bringing some of your own research to the table, now we should be able to have discussions which are more interesting. It is frustrating to try and debate someone who doesn't support their claims. Good work by the way.

I never tried to make the argument that the Explorer is among the best in reliability. I was countering your claims that is was un-reliable, to be avoided, definately will have problems, etc. I am happy to come to an agreement with you that it is "average." What model year did CR list as to be avoided? I just find it interesting that everyone on this forum agrees that the 1991-2001 Explorers were really reliable, durable long-lasting trucks; and now even though CR indicates improving reliability and other indicators are showing average or above, you still try to say they aren't as good as they were.

Of course Ford and GM still have a way to go to match the quality of the imports. Don't snub Hyundai, they are making dramatic improvements in quality, spending very large sums of money and implementing impressive new technologies and processes. Interesting you should mention the Trailblazer and Rendezvous, their sibling the GMC Envoy was actually rated 4/5 by AIS also. I still consider 4/5 to be above average, on a 5-point scale. I'd say three was average.

I stated that the NHTSA ODI had not issued any recalls for the Explorer based on consumer complaints, even though they had conducted three investigations. That was to show that either there are not as many people out there complaining as you lead on, or that their complaints are the individual dealers' (service departments') fault and not Fords. There are no recalls '04 and above, I'm not sure if the letter for the tranny additive counts. It's not showing up yet if it does. For '02 models there are 4 recalls, concerning the liftgate and running board lights. For a good comparison, take a look at the '02 Chevy Trailblazer, they are pretty scary: "front lower control arm brackets may fracture... result in separation of the front lower control arm from the frame- loss of vehicle control, resulting in a crash; vehicle can roll when the transmission is in "park" and a crash could result without warning; air bag inflator could fracture at a weld during a deployment, pieces of the inflator could strike and injure vehicle occupants and the air bag cushion would not inflate fully, reducing the capability of the bag to protect the driver; In a crash missing welds could degrade performance of the third row seat and safety belt anchorage and occupants could receive greater injuries; windshield wipers can cease operation while in use, causing reduced visibility resulting in a crash." Way more serious that the X.

Here's the whole story behind post #2223, which I had abbreviated for use as an example of how a good relationship with your service department can make a big difference. I noticed during a very high-speed run on the freeway that I was getting a very slight vibration in the steering wheel upon light brake application. I consulted some friends who know more about vehicle mechanics than I do and they said it was most likely warped brake rotors. This made sense to me because I know I have been very hard on the brakes. If you read my profile you will see that before this I drove a Mazda 626 which weighed about 2,850 lbs. The Explorer is about 4,475 lbs. That's a big difference! I had to adjust my driving style big-time. Anyways, when I told my service advisor about the vibration she thought it would be warped rotors as well. I told her not to fix those that day as I wanted to wait until it got worse before I shelled out the dough (I assumed that, as normal wear items, pads and rotors would be excluded from my warranty, as stated by the papers at time of purchase). However, she suprised me by saying she'd get them taken care of under warranty. However it turned out a tire was out of balance and causing the vibration under certain conditions. Even if it had been the rotors, why would that mean that Ford had definately used a cheap supplier or installed them incorrectly? Those are the kinds of slippery slope arguments which irritate me. Doesn't driving style play a big part in brake life?

The main thing I don't understand is how everyone can agree (even you yourself have said) that the older Explorers last a very long time relatively trouble-free, and we have both done research showing that the newer models are rated as good or better as their predecessors, but yet you still try to put them down and call them unreliable. It doesn't make sense.

explorerx4 · February 2005

i think my '02 explorer has pretty good brakes. just over 40k, still on originals, no pedal vibration. although i try not to use the brakes, i have to drive in an urban setting when commuting and take lots of trips with a heavy load(not towing though). they still have good 'feel', although i'm pretty sure i will have to get them serviced before i hit 50k, but you never know.

the transmission issue may be what is termed a 'customer satisfaction program', or something like that.

ottav · February 2005

Ant:

Do you think the 2006 will be significantly more expensive than a 2005?

ANT14 · February 2005

Hardly, prices will increase by a few hundreds, but mainly to reflect the changes. Otherwise they will level off at what you currently see now.

marsha7 · February 2005

and the floor shifter, the Mountaineer is now competing (in my mind, that is) with Jeep Grand Cherokee Hemi...

ottav · February 2005

Ant:

Are any of the '06 going to be two-tone, or are they all going to be monochromatic? Also, in the literature, it seems that they are not going to have the cladding that the current models have. Is the bottom part going to be steel?

Ford Explorer Mercury Mountaineer 2005 and earlier

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