Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!
Subaru Forester vs Toyota RAV4
This discussion has been closed.
Popular New Cars
Popular Used Sedans
Popular Used SUVs
Popular Used Pickup Trucks
Popular Used Hatchbacks
Popular Used Minivans
Popular Used Coupes
Popular Used Wagons
Comments
That site also lists Toyota as a gay friendly brand btw.
Steve, Host
Which part of the country are you from? FWIW you have put down deposit on a chick car Just to be safe, you might want to consider GM/Ford v8, 4x4 truck so that gays don't hit on you.
Just my $.02.
Kyle
Who cares what other people think? Is that really your primary criteria for vehicle selection?
Martina did a commercial for the Forester, so it has been associated with Lesbians. Who cares?
Perhaps you should join the Dodge boys that sponsor the neanderthal Lingerie Bowl. :sick:
-juice
Actually it's not the Forester but Subarus in general that have a reputation for being popular with the gay & lesbian community. Possibly because if this, Subaru used Martina Navratilova as their spokesperson for a time. Subaru has also been known to advertise in gay oriented publications (not sure about Toyota).
In addition to the above, the following are also commonly held beliefs about Subaru owners:
a. Subaru owners are generally well educated with their demographics skewed towards the technical professions (I.e. engineers, teachers, etc.)
b. Subaru owners like to be different (no not that way) and value function over form.
c. Subaru owners also value performance, reliability and utility.
d. Subaru owners appreciate the active safety benefits provided by full-time AWD and the best-in-class (Forester) crash test scores.
e. Subaru owners are more physically active than the general population and enjoy outdoor pursuits.
f. Subaru owners are more likely to be dog owners.
As for me, while admittedly I’m an out-loving dog-owning computer geek who enjoys the power, utility and reliability of my Forester XT I’m also secure enough that I don’t worry that someone might presume my sexual preference based solely on the vehicle I drive :P
-Frank
*roll eyes*
Being a hetero Outback and Legacy owner, I can say my Subaru ownership has never brought me any same-sex advances in 15 years of ownership. Of course, maybe I just ain't so pretty. :P
Any hetero Forester owners here noticed any increased same-sex flirting?
a. Subaru owners are generally well educated with their demographics skewed towards the technical professions (I.e. engineers, teachers, etc.)
b. Subaru owners like to be different (no not that way) and value function over form.
c. Subaru owners also value performance, reliability and utility.
d. Subaru owners appreciate the active safety benefits provided by full-time AWD and the best-in-class (Forester) crash test scores.
e. Subaru owners are more physically active than the general population and enjoy outdoor pursuits.
f. Subaru owners are more likely to be dog owners.
Note, however, that (a) and (e) also tend to be associated with gays and lesbians. What we might have is a chicken-and-egg situation. In other words, it's not that gay people like Subarus per se, but rather that a high percentage of gay people have certain characteristics that are associated with Subaru ownership, be one gay or straight.
I know a gay man that drives a Porsche. I certainly wouldn't drive a Porsche.
Up in this neck of the woods, there does seem to be a lot of middle-aged women driving Foresters that look like they just might be lesbian.
It certainly makes one think.
p.s. I would have gone with the Subaru.
Cheers,
A middle aged happily married Caucasian male heterosexual
As for stereotypes, he drives a 4x4 Nissan Frontier; the old, ugly body style. Ick. If we're playing stereotypes, I don't think it gets any less gay than that.
I'm not naive enough to believe that what you drive doesn't make a statement about your personality, because in most cases it does. That said, I'd never drive a Mustang, a Charger, or really anything flashy that will garner unwanted attention. Nor will I drive an Expedition, Yukon, or any other big sport ute that drives like a tank and gets high numbers in the gallons per mile category.
I drive a Subaru based on performance, safety, reliability, utility, with style coming in somewhere at the bottom of my concerns. Foresters have a quirky look to them, but maybe I do too. I much prefer my 06 FXT to the bulkiness of the new RAV4. If we're being honest I often catch myself calling my car "sexy" when I walk outside and spot it in a parking lot.
(judge for yourself)
As it happens, I am a college grad, work in research, enjoy the outdoors, and own a dog.
Doug
From what I've noted (and now I'm noticing Subaru cars and drivers because I just bought one), the Subaru drivers are very into organic, healthy foods (evidenced by the number of them in the Whole Foods Markets parking lot) and outdoor activities and dogs. Kinda like ME!! My neighborhood (which is populated by yuppie families and singles - almost everyone has a graduate degree) has quite a few Subaru's that I never noticed 'til I bought one - and also a lot of Volvo station wagons. You can't find an American car for miles (which I don't think is a "good thing"). My 77 year old mother and 88 year old uncle both drive American cars.
Samantha :shades:
P.S. whomever said the RAV-4 is a "chick-car" was absolutely right. I don't know one guy who drives it!! The RAV-4 is like the Volkswagon Golf Cabiolet - such a CHICK car!! The only guys I knew who drove them were gay! Maybe that'll change with the V-6 version. But, what do I know? LOl I only live in California - the state with two of the largest gay populatons in the world!
The new one has 3 rows of seats and room in the center console that fits a purse, so if it says anything about its owner, it says "Soccer Mom".
Not that there is anything wrong with that. Better than a gas-guzzling behemoth.
Did you guys hear that song that was on the CNN front page a few days ago? It was hysterical. These girls from Tennessee recorded a song:
http://www.90poundsuv.com/
Listen to the sample, it had me ROTFLMAO.
-juice
I think the one myth that I've witnessed is that some Subie's appeal to the "granola" or "tree hugger" crowd. Not entirely fair or true but some truth to it. One thing I'm learning is that it also appeals to the crowd that likes to tinker with cars.
I picked the Forester over the RAV4 and there are a few things I miss on the RAV4 but the Forester gets more fun every day (and that's not even with the turbo).
I am a gay man living in California who happens to have owned two Subarus (an Outback and a WRX). Both cars were chosen because of the inherent qualities they possess -- efficient, AWD, sporty wagons are not terribly common at the price point that Subaru plays in. That being said, I absolutely DO appreciate Subaru's progressive ad campaigns that actively support the GLBT community and the unusual level of corporate sponsorship that Subaru provides to our causes. Subaru was the first major car manufacturer to create distinct ads targeted at the GLBT community in 1990, and continues to this day to be at the forefront in terms of direct marketing to our community. (FWIW, not one of my gay friends, however, drives a Subaru...Not here, not in San Francisco, not anywhere.)
Are we really THAT insecure with ourselves that we would overlook an entire brand because of their perceived popularity with a group of people you don't like (for whatever absurd reason)? Is it the same for you if a brand is linked to the African-American community or the Jewish community? This country still has a long, long way to go towards providing tolerance and acceptance for ALL people, not just the white (WASP), male demographic.
Brian
Gosh, I hope not! I suggest that we avoid extrapolating to the extreme. Let's focus on what people are driving and not on what's driving them.
tidester, host
-juice
I'm just (finally) buying a new Outback. What do guys think about the pros and cons of getting an extended warranty? How about a pre-paid maintenance plan?
- hutch
Steve, Host
While the original post shocked me I thought the responses were very open minded and tried to make light of how silly the notion is. I can see you being upset with the original post but to disparage all the responses and lump them under the same umbrella seems a bit insecure on your part.
Are we really THAT insecure with ourselves that we would overlook an entire brand because of their perceived popularity with a group of people you don't like (for whatever absurd reason)?
The short answer is yes.
The long answer is that it's not about insecurity. You appear to be a very rational person but lots of people buy cars for irrational or emotional reasons. People will overlook entire brands for lots of absurd reasons. For example:
What country made the car (US, Japan ..)?
What did my parents drive?
Was my last experience with that brand?
Who does that brand market to?
I was seriously looking at the Honda Element but it always nagged me that it was geared to a younger crowd and made me think I wasn't being practical. Same goes for the Scion line of cars that is clearly marketed to younger people. My gal just hates Honda. I have a bad feeling about Mazda. My last car was a Ford and I'm kind of fuzzy about all US cars now. For some reason Toyota always seems like quality to me. I always think of Honda as being safer than anything else. Every time I see a Mini I see a woman driving it but my brother owns one and it is fun to drive.
Cars can be very emotional to people. Some love muscle cars but do they really serve a purpose? While it's a shame that something like this was brought up I don't think it's fair to say that brand perception is something that shows the intolerance of the country. Should we seek to enlighten those who only want to buy American? Or how about those who only buy Chevy? Aren't they showing the same level of intolerance? Or is it that some people treat a car emotionally and don't always use rational thought in their purchases?
I have a Subaru Gold, nice thing about it is you get free roadside assistance during the duration. The warranty give you OE replacement parts, and on top of all that you could sell the vehicle with a few miles left on the warranty and give the buyer peice of mind, potentially increasing your resale value.
Any how, note that Subaru give you 3/36 worth of free roadside assistance, while Toyota offers none. The bumper to bumper warranty and powertrain warranty are the same for both, 3/36 and 5/60, respectively.
-juice
Took you a while, eh? You're like me, you spend years shopping for the next new car.
-juice
I wish the Fitzmall/Carmax business model weren't so narrowly available in this country...
She wants an elevated drive position, and the new RAV-4 is pretty impressive. Its the only vehicle we've tried in that size range that feels peppy with an I4 as an engine. My only real complaint is that the lack of a 5 speed AT is probably going to compromise highway mileage, but of course its impossible to know that from the EPA estimates...
Legacy/Outback has side curtains, though. Ironically the 2005 model did not do as well. They tweaked the 2006s and now they're an IIHS Gold award winner, basically top 10 safest cars they've tested.
OB has heated seats as standard, pretty cool. Heated mirrors, too. Even wiper de-icers.
Basically Subaru tends to offer comprehensive packages, while Toyots is more a-la-carte with their options.
-juice
The only thing I would add is after looking at the RAV4 I concluded it had more options for *more* money,for the options I wanted. The base 4 will get better mileage than the turbo, but in the real world the non-turbo is about the same as the RAV4.
Right. Comparing 4-cylinders, the Forester is rated 1 MPG higher than the RAV4 in the city, equal MPG on the highway. Plus, the Forester produces more horsepower and torque in a lighter vehicle, which should give it the performance edge.
More room yes, definitely.
Better gas mileage, not really, that's only because the RAV4 comes in FWD. The AWD automatic models, the best sellers, have an identical 23/28 EPA mpg.
When you consider that the Forester's 4 cylinder has both more power and torque, it's unfair to call it less efficient, in fact I'd argue the opposite.
More options, yes, things like stability control and a 3rd row, plus a DVD player.
Less money, no, folks have been cross shopping and find prices a couple of grand higher for the RAV4. In the threads here on Edmunds you typically see RAV4 prices from $22-28k, while Forester prices are closer to $19-25k.
-juice
Personally, if the 2K rebate on the Forester goes away then I feel the RAV has is beat all around.
Forester does have a wide, deep cargo floor, and a nice square shape so you can cram in a pretty big box. Consumer Reports has a biggest box test and the volume they crammed in to the Forester beat the old Pathfinder and the current Grand Cherokee.
So cargo space is very usable. Passenger space is a bit tight, RAV4 kills the Subaru there.
-juice
I agree, but that is one of the trade-offs between the vehicles.
-juice
No argument here. I clearly understood the pros and cons when I made my choice. I wasn't complaining just making an observation. The other side of that coin is that the V6 is quite peppy.
I don't think there is a car made that can do it all. One of my customers took me for a ride in his new Lamborgini (sp ?). That was the most uncomfortable thing I've ever been in. Cool .. but uncomfortable. Plus I don't think there is room enough in it to carry a loaf of bread.
-juice
Any positive surprises, now that you've had it for a while? Any regrets?
Bob
As for regrets, I would have to say no. It suits my needs/wants quite nicely.
- hutch
Bob
Any ideas what this would cost on a Forestor including the tow hitch. Also the people who own either - Can you comment on the towing capacity (engine specific would be appreciated)
Well I got my answers for the 2006 FORESTER 2.5 X
Trailer Hitch - $230
Heavy-duty-rated at 200 lbs. tongue weight, 2,000 lbs. towing capacity for A/T, and 2,400 lbs. for M/T (ball not included: trailer brakes may be needed) - what the hell does this mean - I have to go really slow down hill if I have heavy loads &/or no trailer brakes? AND is the ball something you just buy and hook it up to the hitch;
the hitch would cover the wiring for the trailer as well right?
sorry about so many q's
I recently had a Class II hitch (3500 max load) installed by Jiffy Hitch for a just over $300.00 on my Forester. That included everything: frame mounted hitch, wiring, hitch ball, and labor.
Here's the deal: Your Forester can "pull" a 2400 pound trailer. It just can't "stop" a 2400 pound trailer safely without the aid of trailer brakes. Having said that, I've had well over the limit (2 yards of shredded hardwood mulch) on my trailer (load and trailer ~ 2500 pounds), and I don't have trailer brakes. I also only had about 3.5 miles to drive on a rural 2-lane country road with little traffic. Yes, the brakes were taxed beyond their limit, but I drove very slowly and used lower gears when going down a long 1/2 mile hill. If I had to drive on a major road with heavy traffic for a long distance, would I have done that with that load? No.
Today I carted off an old refrigerator to the county landfill. Max load ~ 1200 pounds. Again, maybe a 4 mile trip. The brakes seem okay, but I drove slowly and didn't do any hard braking.
Bob
The automatic Foresters already include an oil cooler as standard, that's why it's not listed in the upgrades when you get the tow package.
The manual tranny models do not have that, but that's what I have and I've towed plenty, and never had a problem. Plus, back then mine was rated for 2000 lbs, so it's been upgraded since.
-juice
getting close to makin a decision so getting more anxious
By and large, you won't find trailer brakes on any trailer under whatever the state requires. You will also notice that there is often a gap between what the state requires and what the vehicle manufacturer requires. Case in point MD: As I mentioned the state requires 3000, and Subaru requires 1000. Therefore there is a 2000 pound gap here. You will find this to be the case in virtually every state.
The reason you won't likely find trailers rated under the state requirement with trailer brakes is most likely due to costs. You can upgrade a non-braked trailer by adding brakes, but it's probably better and maybe (?) cheaper just to buy a larger trailer that already comes equipped with brakes.
As to your question about wiring for trailer brakes: No. Trailer brake wiring require a separate 6- or 7-pin plug, whereas trailers without trailer brakes come with a 4-pin plug. My Class II hitch came with 4-pin wiring because I don't have brakes on my 2990-rated (official rating of my trailer is just under the 3K limit) trailer.
Bob