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Also, would you be a car with manual transmission if you could only test drive an automatic?
"would you buy a car with....."
That said, the usual short test drive isn't long enough to find out if you like most manual trannies. Try to take a decent long test drive to really get used to the clutch and gears to make sure you like it. Even autos, especially today's auto-adjusting electronic models, take some getting used to. Some buyers go so far as to rent a similar car for a weekend but with new cars like the 2003 Matrix and Corolla you can't do that.
Acura TL & TLS - The TLS was semi-fun to drive. Has a lot of features for the price. I found the rear seat room better than the Edmunds review. Some interior looked cheap - especially in beige w/wood. The black and gray looked much better. It keeps getting to the top of my list, but the styling is sooo boring that it keeps falling back off.
BMW 330i - Great car, few cars drive like a BMW. Rear seat to small. After all the options pushes over $40k and drops way out of the price range.
Infiniti I30 - A nice luxury car for a dull person who doesn't care about sportyness at all.
Infiniti G35 - Can't wait to try this one!
Lexus IS300 - I thought this car handled better than the BMW. I like the styling inside and out except for the back seat and trunk are too small, the rear end looks like it was chopped off, and I hate clear lenses.
Nissan Altima SE 3.5 - I didn't drive it, but the interior plastic looked so bad and the cloth was fuzzy. I looked like a skinned Chihuahua.
Nissan Maxima - Interior was the same as the Altima. Go head for the nearest Infiniti dealer.
Volvo S60 T5 - What an amazing disappointment. I think the turbo was broken. The car was so slow and felt so spongy I couldn't wait to get back to the dealer. The rear seat was the smallest of the bunch.
These are just my opinions. I hope they help someone.
We're also looking for people who recently switched one way or the other and what they like/dislike about what they're driving now.
If you are interested in participating, please provide your city/state of residence and your daytime phone number to jfallon@edmunds.com no later than March 20, 2002.
Thanks as always,
Jeannine Fallon
PR Director
Edmunds.com
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR
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ANYWAYS...
I have some very similar needs, but my choices are quite different.
We're down to 2 vehicles. One contributing factor is that I get the GM employee discount, so I will buy a new GM, in all probability.
So - the choices: A Pontiac Grand Prix GT, and a Jimmy/Blazer.
The factors:
-We live in a northern part of the world, lots of snow, and the inlaws live on a beef farm. Gotta negotiate some rough terrain getting up their drive after a good dump of the white stuff, but I believe the GP's traction control + snow tires would suffice.
-Both of us love driving, and have always like the GP - in fact its one of the only cars we both do like...!
-But, of course, the wife wants to drive a "cool" SUV, which sits high on the road. What's up with that? She would possibly relunctantly settle for the GP, but I'd prefer a more symbiotic decision, so would appreciate any input.
-other criteria:
-Size, we're both tall and presently cram ourselves into an old Saturn SC.
-Power: want enough oomph to keep up with our highway driving .
-Cargo - planning a family, don't want to limit the room for baby, kid paraphanelia, etc..
I really believe the GP suits our needs, but must admit I do not want to find us limited in a year or 2. But I just don't want to buy a lot more than I need, which the Jimmy/Blazer would be, IMO.
Points? Opinions? Tips?
Thanks!
Of course, I've never understood their popularity: expensive, gas hogs, not the easiest thing to drive. IMO, there are far too many on the roads and they adversely impact the safety of others due to their size....
The blazer/jimmy are horrible vehicles. Rattle traps, doors fall off, tranny good for maybe 130K if lucky. The new Trailblazer seems to be a better built vehicle and a better option in your case. It drives alot like a car, pretty low center-of-gravity, good power, lots of room. Not going to get you anywhere off-road, but certainly won't have trouble with snow-covered roads.
The GP is a pretty nice car. I think some of the "plastic" packages are bit much, and the interior has enough buttons to control a 747, but alot of people must like that. If your Saturn can make it up your in-laws driveway, then I'm sure the GP can. If the saturn doesn't make it, I doubt the GP would. Traction control doesn't get you that far. My in-laws have a killer driveway, and the last time they were SUV shopping, a couple of them couldn't make it up during the test-drive. It takes a real 4X4 with real tires to make it up their drive when it's snowy and you don't want to walk 300 yards with the groceries.
And I agree, if you really have no need for 4X4 or an SUV, please don't buy one. You're really making life miserable for the folks like me that actually need a vehicle that can cross muddy fields, tow trailers, and get out snowy roads that haven't been plowed/salted. The SUV's/trucks are turning into wimped out minivans with 4-doors and suspensions that can barely get over a curb.
Well, we don't need one but we are about to buy a Toyota Highlander. Why? Because I'd like to see around me for a change. I'm tired of waiting at a stop sign for a right turn because a SUV wanting to make a left turn at the same sign completely blocks my vision to the left. And, I'd like a decent chance of survival if one of these monsters piloted by a cell phone happy person happens to hit me. These things are self perpetuating. Scary.
Wouldn't you just love for everyone that currently can get what they need out of a Cherokee, Blazer, or 4runner, to buy Tahoe's, Expeditions, Excursions, or 1-ton trucks? The RX300 won't make it up my in-laws driveway when its snowy, and the last test Car and Driver did on small SUV's, the only ones that could make it through their snow course was the Cherokee and Xterra. That was two out of 11 vehicles that could perform as designed.
I drive my wifes car alot, and we're looking at getting an A6 for traveling. I'm not going to sit around popping Paxil all day worrying about an SUV plowing into me. There's always vehicles bigger than you regardless of what you're driving. If I'm not in a situation that requires a utility vehice, I'd much rather get down the road at warp speed in an A6 rather than a Jeep or 7000# pickup.
A couple seconds at an intersection isn't that big of deal when you can drive a superior performing vehicle 99% of the time. I'm not sure how I could ever get along without a truck or SUV with my lifestyle, but if I lived in town and had no need for 4X4, I'd be in a sports car of some sort. It's not like you can't get a helluva car for what I spent on a diesel pickup.
I just hope you bought a FWD model since you didn't need it.
I wanted a V6, and it is extremely hard to find a V6 without AWD. Also, I am very impressed with my A4's AWD. How good is Toyota's system compared to my Audi's, remains to be seen of course.
There's always vehicles bigger than you regardless of what you're driving
True. But, if I am in a small car(like my A4), chances are that in a relatively affluent suburban neighborhood, 4 out of 6 cars will have a much larger mass than my car. On the other hand, if I am in a SUV, that number will probably drop to about every 1 in 6 vehicles.
A couple seconds at an intersection isn't that big of deal ...
That was just an example. And, it is far more than a couple of seconds because as soon as a SUV makes a turn, another moves in to fill its place. The real problem here is that it is very hard to see in general when you are driving in a sea of SUVs around you. That is a real safety hazard in my opinion.
FWIW, I have been comparing sedans and SUVs for 2 years now. My wife and I differ in opinion as to what suits our needs. I thought a site that seems to have a wide range of experience and opinion might be a place to turn for help.
So, for those who find it neccessary to question my motivation: I am looking for a perspective from sedan owners as to whether their needs that were similar to mine are being met by sedans or if they feel wanting for a higher capacity vehicle. Also, if they experience conditions warranting 4wd and ground clearance similar to mine, and might find a need for an SUV or the like.
Anyone who has a constructive opinion would be appreciated.
I had a GM credit card discount I couldn't walk away from. I can't get exicted about either vehicle you mentioned,but how about this...
Similar,but far better than the Grand Prix is the Olds Intrigue. With all the discounts,you could probably get one for a song. I think it is the best US vehicle GM makes. I have zero interest in SUVs,and it sounds like one would be a poor choice for you. I agree the Blazer is a particularly poor one,though. The Trailblazer seems better...Also,the Tahoe would probably be satisfying. How about a Buick Park Avenue? I bet your Buick dealer is dying to sell one of these.If you want something more youthful,how about a Cadillac CTS? I love my Catera.
Good luck.
I have three friends who all bought new hyundais n the last few years. 2 traded theirs already(Excel and Accent)\, the third (elantra) will very soon. None of the three will buy Hyundai again. Part of that is due to their income (they bought the hyundais just out of college)but they all were dissatisfied.
As far as the Accents went, nothing major ever went wrong, other than an electrical problem that left one friend stranded for awhile. Most of the problems were of the annoying variety...turn signal switch failure, service lights, oil consumption.
For all of them, they bought due to the low price, but it really didn't pay off due to how quickly they traded up, and the low resale value. Personally, resale value is not a big deal to me since I like to keep my cars for awhile. But I can't imagine wanting to drive a Hyundai for a long time.
It may be best to spend a bit more for something nicer and with more resale. Maybe a focus, sentra, civic. Do you prefer a hatch or sedan?
Do you prefer 2 doors? Something occurred to me as I checked the price of the Civic LX. I just bought a 2002 Alero GX for about the same price.
I never would have thought of an Alero being in the same price range as the Civic, but the GX with 5 Speed/sport package has an invoice price of about 16,000, minus the current $2002 rebate. That puts it about dead even with the Civic LX. It has the new 2.2 Ecotec engine which is world class smooth.
Of course, the Alero is more of a sport sedan and will be discontinued after 2004.
It just depends on what you like best.
Pros:
Roomy interior
Excellent handling
Styling (IMO)
Built in Japan
Cons:
Ride (might be a little too stiff for some, but thats a tradeoff I will happily make for the handling)
Gas Mileage (25-27 city, 28-33 highway. Not bad, but not the best in the class)
Some would say that they would like more than 130 hp, but I find it more than adequate. The engine has a nice flat torque curve, and it works well when you have a full car. Check out the Mazda Protege forum here at edmunds. The Protege owners here in Edmunds are freaks about their cars. I am too. In fact, the Protege board is consistantly one of the top 10 busiest. I would say that the Protege is definately the "drivers car" of it's class. Car and Driver says: "BMW verve for less than half the price" I would say that's a helluva compliment.
I have considered the Buick Century, Mercury Grand Marquis (I've read some alarming reports about the engine), the Chevy Lumina, etc., but I'm open to all suggestions. I am most interested in reliability (I'm dumping the money trap Pontiac TransSport I've fought with for 7 years) and safety. I do need something that will comfortably seat five (three adults and two growing boys).
Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
The only reason I haven't bought yet is because we were also trying to buy a Celica and can't find one with the options we want. I'm using both sales as an incentive for them to find the Celica we want. The way Toyota builds and options their cars just gets me soooooo mad. I like their vehicles, but they are just so hard to buy sometimes. If they aren't going to make the options available everywhere, they should just not even offer it. Usually it takes a few weeks to get what I want, but this Celica thing has been the worst.
frustratedmom: The Grand Marquis and Lumina are both pretty reliable vehicles. The Lumina probably a bit more IMHO. They are pretty bland, boring, and rattle-traps though. You can't do much worse than the old Pontiac Transports, so you have no where to go but up! The Chevy Impala is a by far a better vehicle than either choice though. Larger than the Lumina and built much better. Should be able to find one for $12,000 with low miles, or within your price range with 50K or so miles. The Grand Marquis is also rear-wheel drive, which may or may not matter to you. The Century isn't near as big. Go look at in Impala and let us know what you think, it's like night and day compared to the Lumina.
My dad retired a 1984 Grand Marquis a couple years ago that had 221,000 miles with hardly any repairs, ever! The engine (5.0 L) still wanted to go, but the body rusted out. That was the best car our family has ever owned.
Camry - Nice car. Liked the lines. Hated the steering wheel. Its built for people below 6' My arms were tired just from the test drive reaching for it. Ran good, rode good. 4cyl was not what I thought it would be.
Altima - Great Looks. New styling. Steering wheel adjustable up/down and in/out Big win for bigger people. Interior is not as nice as Camry or Accord. 4cyl ran like a champ. Nice in cornering.
Accord - Nice looking car. Drove great. Smooth 4 cyl. Steering wheel was better than camry but not as good as altima. Exterior is somewhat dated. Interior was nicely dressed.
My choice was the Altima.
The Maxima has a proven V6 engine that has won awards. It comes standard with Xenon headlights which *really* improve visibility, (seems my 42 year old eyes don't see as well at night as they used to). We also like the auto dim rearview mirror. The car has twice as much HP (255) as our old 93 Accord (125). We were also pleasantly surprised to get 28-29 mpg on a long road trip so we didn't lose anything in gas mileage. We liked the softer ride of the GXE over the SE even though I was able to get quotes for the SE within a $100 of the GXE. The GXE has 16" tires which are cheaper to replace and have a more narrow turning radius (U-turn.) I don't care if the Maxima will be "dated" when it is redesigned next year because I like the Maxima "old" design much better than the new design look of the Altima front grill. There was a $1000 rebate on the Max because the Altima is being pushed by Nissan right now. I found that the GXE was not easy to find. It comes standard with options that you have to really look for to find on an Altima... esp the ABS. This car is great, I wish we could buy two. We paid $22,333 in Atlanta, plus $489 advertising fee, plus 6% sales tax, plus tag & title. After the rebate and a $500 factory to dealer incentive the drive out price was $23,212 which was pretty close to the loaded V6 Altima.
Still a great car and I love mine....