Subaru Legacy/Outback Wagons Maintenance & Repair

bkaiser1 · December 2005

I had an 01 Outback that had a similar rattle -- turned out to be the striker/latch from the folding rear seat. The dealer, of course, could never hear it, but I solved the rattle by lubing the seat latch with a parafin-type bicycle chain lube (White Lightning, in this case)...it dries "waxy" and not oily, so it doesn't collect dust and grime. You might try that and see if it helps.

B

ateixeira · December 2005

That price sounds high, I know that list prices are marked up about 40%.

One guy here on Edmunds said you should ask to see their cost book and offer $100 over their cost. It's worth it for both parties.

We got one, you get roadside assistance too, remember. AAA would have cost us $497 over the 7 years of our term. Plus the peice of mine, plus better resale (we plan to sell with 5k miles or so left on the warranty).

-juice

10kken · December 2005

I'm new here and I've got a problem with my 2000 Outback. I've been hearing this creaking noise when going over bumps, took it to the dealer thinking I needed shocks. The dealer said that the rear control arm bushing needed replacing and they had to replace the whole arm - $180 for the part, $325 for the labor (4 hours!). WTF?

Anybody know about this? Can I just replace the bushing or do I need the whole arm? And why would the book rate on labor be so high?

TIA

moendm · December 2005

I did tape the striker/latch area and it still rattles...I believe it is in the area where the seat belt extends from...I did fasten the seat belt and that didn't make a difference...is there some way I could take the casing off the seatbelt area to see it something inside is loose...or any other ideas...it sometimes sounds like metal clicking together and sometimes sounds like styrofoam or plastic rubbing together....thanks

moendm · December 2005

I taped the striker/latch and it still rattles...I am wondering if it isn't in the seat belt area...I did fasten the seat belt and still rattled. Is there an easy way that I could take off the casing of the seat belt and see if anything inside is loose or do I need to have the Dealer do this? It sounds like two pieces of metal rubbing together or sometimes like either styrofoam or plastic rubbing...

ateixeira · December 2005

Call 800-SUBARU3 and ask what the normal rate would be for that type of work, i.e. number of hours.

-juice

bkaiser1 · December 2005

I just had a front control arm replaced on my old 626...the bushing was really worn (140,000 miles) but it was actually cheaper to replace the whole control arm than it was to replace just the bushing, due to the amount of labor involved with replacing the bushing. With the control arm replacement, I paid about $175 for the arm and another hour of labor to remove and reinstall the part. Sounds like your Subaru dealer is charging a *lot* of labor on this one...

xwesx · December 2005

"Sounds like your dealer is charging a *lot* of labor"

No kidding..... 4 hours?! That's just plain rubbery! :P

I've found that several of the undercarriage parts are built such that replacement of far more than what seems necessary is "required" when parts like bushings fail. I had a bad bushing on the driveshaft bearing when I purchased my '96 in August 2000. I diagnosed it the day I went to look at and purchase the car, but I decided not to let it factor in on how much I paid for the vehicle or have it fixed ahead of time because it was a "quick fix." Well, I should have researched it a bit.... I had to replace the whole front half of the driveshaft! New, close to $500, from a junk yard, almost $250 (I went with the junker). Still, it was another 3 hours or so of work to remove all the heat shielding, work around the exhaust and get that bugger jimmied out and back in. Ah.... young and dumb.

Oh, it turns out that the only reason that it was necessary to replace the driveshaft along with the bearing and bushing was that the bearing had a flange that was "dinged" to attach it to the driveshaft. A quick tap with a chisel and it was un-dinged and slipped right off. Oy.... the absurdity!

The control arm is an easy repair, but it does require a lot of part removal because the whole wheel assembly mounts to it in some way. But, if it took me four hours to fix, I would find myself a new hobby...... so, for a professional to take that long..... L-A-Z-Y! Of course, you'd think that a "quote" would be just an estimate, but somehow they always manage to charge you that much at a minimum..... :sick:

subaruguru · December 2005

Price sounds good. poss trans code could be duty solenoid "c" (rear transfer clutch control solenoid)just a guess. let me know how it turns out.

garandman · December 2005

I have a '95 Subaru legacy wagon, 175K klm. (109 K miles )
My head gskt. failed last week. I bought a SoA rebuilt engine $6K Cndn. I suspected something wrong a month ago- poor gas mileage - hard starting - black coolant coming out of exhaust.
i asked Subaru dealer to check it out-he found nothing wrong.
Same reply at local NAPA dealer - he replaced the starter.
I'll replace the car soon, but it won't be a Subaru

This is a very well known problem with Phase I 2.5l engines. Too bad you had inept mechanics. Here's the "Disclaimer" that I posted on several Subaru forums, where head gasket problems are discussed in infinite detail (like 300 threads).

WARNING: If you own a 1996-99 2.5l Subaru with the Phase I engine, the head gaskets are known to fail with little or no warning at 80,000 to 150,000 miles. When they fail, at a minimum you need new head gaskets - $1,200. If you have ignored the warning signs or are unlucky, the engine will require rebuilding at a cost of at least $3,000.

So, you can 1. sell the car right now and buy another economical AWD station wagon (oops - there aren't any others...). 2. replace the head gaskets pre-emptively (that's what I did on one of mine) 3. keep driving it but pay attention to signs of failure or 4. drive it until failure - which may also damage the engine.

Rebuilt engines cost at least $3,000. Used engines are almost impossible to find.

I wonder how many head gasket failures will have to be reported how many times on how many forums before owners of these cars understand they need to treat head gaskets as a maintenance item?

Warning signs include: no warning; intermittent overheating ; coolant smell in exhaust; rough starting and white smoke on start; bubbling in coolant overflow bottle after hard driving; presence of coolant by products in engine oil.

garandman · December 2005

I'm new here and I've got a problem with my 2000 Outback. I've been hearing this creaking noise when going over bumps, took it to the dealer thinking I needed shocks. The dealer said that the rear control arm bushing needed replacing and they had to replace the whole arm - $180 for the part, $325 for the labor (4 hours!).

Try an independent shop. They probably only charge $65 per hour so you'll save $75 or so.

Pop your head under the car and take a look at the rear suspension. You'll see why it's not instant. and it will have to be realigned, which is usually about $50-75.

Don't know why they do or do not need to replace the whole arm.

billj3 · December 2005

Yes that's what the mechanic thought. Clutches are always locked in, thus in AWD drive all the time. So the question is did an electrical/computer problem cause the mechanical problem by locking in the clutches when they should not be engaged OR did the solenoid valve go bad and create the error code? I'm not totally clear on this but as I understand it: the computer tells the solenoid to bypass fluid and disengage the clutches when drive is not required or necessary to the rear wheels. The reading the mechanic took off the computer indicated the rear end was at 10%, which means 90% power is always going to the rear wheels. Thus the bypass valve is not operating to allow fluid to bleed through and disengage the clutches. Not sure what else goes on in the transfer case, but am I understanding this correctly otherwise?
Thanks, Bill

harvpt · December 2005

I have a '98 Legacy Outback Wagon. In February '04 the clutch went at 51,000. In June '05 I had a bad rattle and the dealer (who replaced the clutch) said the throw out bearing had gone and I needed a new clutch. When I pointed out that they replaced the clutch 16 months and 12,000 miles earlier, they said it wasn't the clutch after all but a loose exhaust hanger. Fast forward to the present and my mechanic, not the dealer, says the clutch is going. It's now been 22 months and 17,000 miles.

The dealer won't take responsibility because it's been more than 12 months (even though they identified the problem at 16 months) and Subaru USA says it's a dealer issue.

I should add that this is my third standard drive car so I know how to drive a clutch. I will concede that I do mostly city driving.

Any recourse?

krzyss · December 2005

wait for green light?
transmission engaged, left foot firmly pressing the clutch

or

transmission in neutral, left leg unoccupied?

Krzys

kavalla · December 2005

Am considering a 2006 Outback 2.5XT Ltd w/auto.trans. and would like comments on overall brand reliability and turbo experiences as to same. Kavalla, Pacific NorthWest

kens · December 2005

You may want to ask your question over in the 2005+ Legacy/Outback thread. There are a few OBXT owners there.

Although I own a 2005 Legacy GT, many of the internals are identical to the OBXT. So far, reliability has been excellent. No major problems with the car -- I'm currently at 25K miles.

The turbo is intoxicating. While not quite the same blast as with the manual tranny, it still pulls very hard and is tons of fun to drive. As for the turbo reliability, I have no concerns since Subaru has quite a bit of experience with forced induction. Also, the engine block used in the OBXT has already been used in the Baja, STi, Forester XT and now the 2006+ WRX.

Ken

zman3 · December 2005

Also, the engine block used in the OBXT has already been used in the Baja....

Yeah, but since there has been what, maybe 2 Baja's sold, that doesn't make it statistically significant.

kens · December 2005

Now, now.

You know, I actually went back and added the Baja after posting. ;-)

Ken

garandman · December 2005

Am considering a 2006 Outback 2.5XT Ltd w/auto.trans. and would like comments on overall brand reliability and turbo experiences as to same. Kavalla, Pacific NorthWest They're reliable, but I bpught an H6 (Putback 3.0R) because the dealer says the XT's average 20-24mpg. And the Boy Racer hood scoop isn't appealing to me. But Suvbaru has delivered many turbo AWD vehicles and they're generally quite robust.

There's even a website called Legacy GT devoted to them.

tkanic · December 2005

As for brand reliablity, I would say very good. I have had a 98 OB and now a 05 OB, both w/ the base engine. The engine and drive system seem to be very good. But I must admit it is the 'fluff' that leaves much to be desired. Like the gas door lever under the drive's seat broke - still usable, but you have to pull the metal instead of the plastic. A piece of the cup holder broke 3 days after getting the car, and a 'running board' came apart by standing on it.

Again nothing major, or will cause you to be stranded, just little things which could/should have been made better.

Also another little annoyance is the placement of things, quite unintutive, or inconvienent. (the multiple defroster buttons is a prime example along with the placement of the cup holder on earlier models)

gmk1 · December 2005

My son just replaced the batery in his (my old ) legacy. Now when he goes to start it the alarm sounds for about 20 seconds and nothing else happens,It won't turn over at all any sugestions? It has an aftermarket remote starter, could that have something to do with it? Any info is greatly apreciated, G.

95clubwagon · December 2005

My '91 Subaru has been very reliable. Only major repair when the tranny locked up at less than 40k which the dealer covered. I recently found that my harmonic balancer was loose,,,the car was shuddering at start up,,,and by luck I found that the bolt holding the balancer in place was stripped out. I had the shop replace/repair that, and replaced the timing belt at the same time, since I had 190,000 miles on it, and it was due for the 3rd timing belt. (every 60K). They replaced the belt and 2 days after they did the belt, the car would not start. They checked it out, and said that the belt had "slipped?", and they fixed it and it has been fine since then. The only problem is that I am hearing a light tapping noise lately,,,,sounds like stuck valves? This noise did not start right after the timing belt was replaced,,but started a week or two later. I also have never changed the Oxygen sensor,,,but probably should. Any Suggestions? Subaru fan in Tennessee

zman3 · December 2005

Do you have an owners manual, and I am not saying that to be a self righteous snot. I think you need to reset the alarm after changing the battery, but I don't recall how to do it. I thought it was something simple like using the remote to lock and unlock the car.

Maybe others will know for certain. I think it is a common question.

kavalla · December 2005

Kens--Thanks for response. The day you sent your comments, I found and purchased a new 2005 xt and am happy to have found the color (champagne gold opal). Now to learn how to navigate these forums for the new year. Happy New Year to you, Kavalla

kavalla · December 2005

Thank you for your input--have now bought a 2005 OBXTltd and will monitor these forums. My spouse shares opinion of scoop altho she didn't say Boy Racer. Nice touch! Obviously an active brain at work; I'll try to stay on my toes.

tkanic · December 2005

The hood scoop is for the intercooler, which aids the turbo's performance (turbo compresses air, compressed air heats up (PV=nRT), heated air takes up more volumn, which is the opposite of what you want, so the intercooler cools it back down to cram more into the engine), so it is a functional thing, not a 'boy racer' thing.

bustleback · December 2005

Recommend that you replace both plugs and wires (although may only be necessary on #3).

We had similar problem. I ran the OBDII and got similar codes. I found a carbon trail on #3 plug. I scraped the trail on the plug and corrected the problem, for a bit. It returned (and so did the trail) so I replaced the plugs and the wires. So far so good.

gbrainard5575 · December 2005

Have 2001 Out-Back. Going on 3rd Automatic Transmission. 1st one under 60-000 Warranty, 2nd one was re-build from Hell, lasted 13-000 miles, covered under 2 year Warranty from Dealer. Rumor has it there is an engineering failure as discussed on The Gordon Liddy Radio Program. Thought I should have gotten a new Transmission. Appreciate if someone could help me out. Thank-You

garandman · December 2005

The hood scoop is for the intercooler, which aids the turbo's performance (turbo compresses air, compressed air heats up (PV=nRT), heated air takes up more volumn, which is the opposite of what you want, so the intercooler cools it back down to cram more into the engine), so it is a functional thing, not a 'boy racer' thing.
...In which case, it would be located in a high pressure area - like the front of the good or base of the windshield.

Now, the hoodscoops on the 96-99 Outbacks were even more silly. Someone at Subaru just loves hood scoops.

tkanic · December 2005

...In which case, it would be located in a high pressure area - like the front of the good or base of the windshield.

The Turbo engine of the 05/06 OB is known to have very little turbo lag, which is the time it takes for the turbo to build up pressure (this is a very good thing), making a as short as possiable run from the turbine into the engine is most certainly a factor. Extending the run to the intercooler should increase this turbo lag and negitavly effect performance.

mgk2005 · December 2005

My 99 outback has 2.5 year old BridgeStone Turanza tires with about 27k miles on them.

One of the tires got cut from the side and cannot be repaired. Every tire dealer I speak with tells me that all tires should be changed since it is an AWD. But the 3 remaining tires are all at about 7/32 - 8/32 tread. It seems a big waste to throw all of them and get new ones just to replace one.

My driving is largely on the US west coast.

Could someone guide me with my options?

Is shaving a new tire to match the current tread an option? I hear that tirerack.com does that when you buy new tire from them.

denvrdav · December 2005

Altho you could probably have a new tire shaved, I would suggest going with a new set---AWD cars are pretty sensitive to differences in tire size---the question is how much tire size difference will cause a problem. Maybe you could get the dealer to buy the three good tires.

garandman · December 2005

Most new tires are 11/32nd tread. As long as you pick the same brand and construction, and check that they're the same rolling diameter (most manufacturers have this information on their webistes) you will be well within the .25" diameter spec that Subaru calls for.

You could have them shaved, but what I would do in your shoes is buy a pair and mount them in the front, where they will wear a little faster anyway.

kens · December 2005

That's great! Congrats!

Ken

kens · December 2005

I agree. Subaru overdid it with the non-functional hood scoops with the 96-99 model year. I think they thought it would be an easy way to make the car look more "exciting" by using the hood design from their non-USDM brethren.

I think some Impreza RS owners from at the time actually removed the plastic blocking the hood opening to allow it to cool the engine block!

Ken

ateixeira · December 2005

Yep, saw that in person a few times. With a hot engine at a red light, you'd actually see the heat coming up out of the engine bay, it would distort the view directly in front of you slightly.

Meh, the hood scoops worked for marketing. Outback outsold the Legacy 3 to 1.

-juice

reblack_jr · December 2005

My original battery is starting to "worry" me. No problems except for age (bought car in July 2000).
Any suggested replacements?
Thanks!
Bob

ateixeira · December 2005

Have you kept the water level up the whole time?

I let mine drop too low, and killed the battery prematurely. I think it still lasted 6 years or so.

-juice

reblack_jr · December 2005

I have not done anything to the battery water level... It is a Johnson Ctrls I think it is sealed Org equipment.

reblack_jr · December 2005

What mfg did you buy?

ateixeira · December 2005

The brand from Wal Mart, I think it was just $40-50 or so.

The OE battery is not that strong, I think mine had 260 CCAs and my new battery has something like 500+. It's not hard to find a stronger one.

Starting does seem easier since the swap.

-juice

xwesx · December 2005

A little late on my reply, but just for a story relating to yours:

I had a similar situation, where a sidewall failed on one of my tires about 11 months after original purchase - they had about 20K on them. I replaced the one tire with a matching tire and did not have it shaved. All the other tires were at ~9/32. I ran these tires on the car until about a month ago, and the three originals were at 4/32 w/ 73K on them; the newer one was still at just under 7/32. I had no problems other than the fact that I could tell there was very slight "binding" in the spring time when the roads were extremely slick due to melt water on top of the ice pack. When this would happen, I could feel the wheels slipping very slightly to relieve the pressure. As soon as I changed the tires and we had a warm spell, I was happy to note that this slippage was gone.

So, it will cause a slight bit of friction w/ the AWD, but probably not enough to cause a problem. If you can get a new one shaved, do it. I think a full set would be a waste of resources, but 8/32 is greater than my 9/32, so I'd consider it "real world" borderline as far as potential for binding in the AWD without the shave.

xwesx · December 2005

'96 included? Must have been late model builds. I thought such silliness was limited to the '97 - '99.

shelleyt · December 2005

I have a 1996 Subaru Legacy Outback, 2.2 L engine. My car has been just fine and I love it to death. Until I took it 2 weeks ago to a service center in MT for snow tires. I planned on an oil change and tune-up to prepare for a trip to Colorado for Christmas. They talked me into a fuel system flush and coolant flush as well. We drove it around town for the week, then took off for Colorado.

We had been on the road for about 4 hours when I decided to pull over to see Little Big Horn. Lucky that I did so, since my engine was "ticking" and smoke began billowing from under the hood! It appears that all of the oil had blown out of the engine and all over the undercarriage. My sons and I put in 3 quarts of oil to get us down to Sheridan, WY, about 30 miles away. We stopped at a tire store and they put in more oil since much of the previous oil had blown out as well. That got us down the street to another of the same service center. The car was not ticking anymore, but oil was being burned off of the engine and smoking.

The mechanics saw that it was overfilled (from the last stop), drained it, cleaned it up and re-filled with oil. You could not see where it was leaking from until I drove it on the freeway (under pressure)for a couple of miles, then could see that it was leaking from the camshaft cover. Apparently the timing belt and everything inside there was fouled, so I had to leave the car and rent one to Colorado. Once they got inside the area they found that the O-ring that connects the oil pump to the engine had blown out. Possibly this is the inception of the problem? Mechanics said they thought it was as a result of being overfilled before I left.

Bottom line here is that once they finished putting the car back together, they have not been able to get it to run properly. Mechanics spent several hours trying to fix the timing, etc. and it's just popping and farting and will not run.

I had to have it towed back home where a Subaru dealer has been looking at it. The have tried everything, including switching out the computer, and it still will not run properly. Now they are saying something about the crankshaft?

Any ideas? I guess everyone is just stumped and I'm up a creek and still have a rental car. All I know is that the care was running perfectly well with no problems at all until I had it serviced. HELP!

lfdal · December 2005

I really hope it was an authorized Subaru dealer that did the original work, otherwise you're trapped in the hell of "authorized" vs "non-authorized" service.

It's going to be tough to prove the original place overfilled it.

I never leave the service area, dealer or otherwise, w/o checking the fluid levels except for one time recently...and I'm afraid that's going to get expensive as I let the dealer leave an extra 42oz of auto tranny fluid after a drain and fill in my FXT 2k miles ago. Another story for another day. But the ATF dipstick in that car is a royal pain to check.

There's an excellent article on the endwrench site that explains how a loosening oil pump rear sealing plate can cause an over pressure condition that will blow out the crankshaft oil seal.

I'd wonder about how well they replaced the timing belt (sounds like they had to have it off?) A badly timed car will exhibit the symptoms you're experiencing.

HTH

Larry

texsubaru · December 2005

Hi! We just bought a "pre-owned" (formerly known as "used") 2005 Outback 2.5i to join our '98 Forester. We noticed that the Outback has two plastic splash guards on the front underside on the left and right. But there's not a splash guard in the center, even though it looks like there logically should be one there to help keep water from being splashed up into the engine compartment. I've looked under a couple of other 2005 Outbacks and they also didn't have a center splash guard, but I've also looked under a couple of 2006 Outbacks, and they do have one. Anybody have any idea what's up with that? Did Subaru not put center splash guards on 2005s? Or did they only put them on certain trim levels (and, if so, would it be real easy to add one to ours?) Or -- the conspiracy theory here -- should every 2005 Outback have a center splash guard and lazy maintenance people have secretly removed them from every single one I've looked at so far?

kens · December 2005

Are you refering to the plastic brush cover that spans the underside of the engine? My 2005 Legacy GT wagon has one.

Ken

subaruguru · December 2005

when the service center replaced the front crank seal/oil pump seal. They would have to remove the crank sprocket some times this can be hard to remove. The sprocket gets stuck/ rusted on and could have been damaged during removal. There are taps on the sprocket there is a possibility that one got broken off (the tabs are a pickup reference for the crank sensor) and would make your car run like this even if the cam belt was installed right (mechanical timing )The crank sensor would be for the ignition timing (when the spark plug fires )

tkanic · December 2005

my (early) 05 OB i does nto have a center splashgard either, and I really don't see more then 1 possiable attachment point, though I didn't really look. I think the XL and the bean edition may have included it.

texsubaru · December 2005

Yep, that's the thing I mean. My 2005 Outback 2.5i has two small, sorta wing-like ones on the left and right side of the underside of the engine compartment, but a rather large yawning gap in between them. It seems like an odd arrangement to me.

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